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Post-2-Post Challenge: Dion Phaneuf

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Old
11-03-2012, 09:00 AM
  #51
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Originally Posted by Kessly Snipes View Post
My point was there is more to being a captain than just what the fans see.
Really, so you can be an effective captain and a fan of the team would not be able to recognize that based on what they see on the playing surface. Wow. That is unbelievable. You seriously can't believe what you are saying can you?

Many say that Mark Messier was the greatest NHL captain of all time. They even created a leadership award in his name. If you ever watched Mark Messier play hockey, you wouldn't have any doubt in your mind if he was captain material. NONE.

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11-03-2012, 10:00 AM
  #52
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Originally Posted by hockeyfanz View Post
Really, so you can be an effective captain and a fan of the team would not be able to recognize that based on what they see on the playing surface. Wow. That is unbelievable. You seriously can't believe what you are saying can you?

Many say that Mark Messier was the greatest NHL captain of all time. They even created a leadership award in his name. If you ever watched Mark Messier play hockey, you wouldn't have any doubt in your mind if he was captain material. NONE.
Fully agree about Messier, he was a very special player and Captain.

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11-03-2012, 10:02 AM
  #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hockeyfanz View Post
Really, so you can be an effective captain and a fan of the team would not be able to recognize that based on what they see on the playing surface. Wow. That is unbelievable. You seriously can't believe what you are saying can you?

Many say that Mark Messier was the greatest NHL captain of all time. They even created a leadership award in his name. If you ever watched Mark Messier play hockey, you wouldn't have any doubt in your mind if he was captain material. NONE.
Where did i say it has nothing to do with on ice play? I said theres more to it than what fans see. I don' see any issue with Dion as the captain, and there is no one else on the team that can replace him in that sense. Seems his coaches and team mates feel the same way, but what do thy know.

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11-03-2012, 10:02 AM
  #54
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Originally Posted by Grant View Post
Phaneuf can have accuracy. When his shot is on, it is on and very accurate and can be great shots leading to his higher shooting percentage.

What seems to be the problem though, when his shots aren't on, they are sometimes way over the net and wide. This often causes the play to be over.

Would be interesting to see if he more often just tried to get the puck through the lanes and at the net, if it would result in more goals on the plays due to tips and rebounds.
Dion should be shooting low, not sure if he thinks he can put it in the top hand corner from the point. It almost always ends plays when he does this.

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11-03-2012, 10:05 AM
  #55
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Originally Posted by Kessly Snipes View Post
Where did i say it has nothing to do with on ice play? I said theres more to it than what fans see. I don' see any issue with Dion as the captain, and there is no one else on the team that can replace him in that sense. Seems his coaches and team mates feel the same way, but what do thy know.
Captaincy by default doesn't make him a good captain. Just shows you how weak the team that the GM you constantly defend really is. Dion Phaneuf is not a good captain, IMO. The way the team performs under his captaincy in no way indicates that he is. Teams that have monumental collapses like the Leafs do every year lack leadership. I'm sure if this was a team that never said die, you would be building statues of Dion.

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11-03-2012, 10:10 AM
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hockeyfanz View Post
Captaincy by default doesn't make him a good captain. Just shows you how weak the team that the GM you constantly defend really is. Dion Phaneuf is not a good captain, IMO. The way the team performs under his captaincy in no way indicates that he is. Teams that have monumental collapses like the Leafs do every year lack leadership. I'm sure if this was a team that never said die, you would be building statues of Dion.
That just it, in your opinion. Unfortuntetly that does not make it fact.

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11-03-2012, 10:11 AM
  #57
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Originally Posted by theremedial View Post
Fully agree about Messier, he was a very special player and Captain.
Mark Messier was a piece of **** out on the ice. If he did what he used to do right now, he would be suspended for life within a season.

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11-03-2012, 10:14 AM
  #58
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Originally Posted by hockeyfanz View Post
Captaincy by default doesn't make him a good captain. Just shows you how weak the team that the GM you constantly defend really is. Dion Phaneuf is not a good captain, IMO. The way the team performs under his captaincy in no way indicates that he is. Teams that have monumental collapses like the Leafs do every year lack leadership. I'm sure if this was a team that never said die, you would be building statues of Dion.
One thread you go on about how basically everything Burke put together is awful. Here you say they collapse because they have no leadership.

Is it the Team or the Captain?

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11-03-2012, 10:21 AM
  #59
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Originally Posted by Kessly Snipes View Post
That just it, in your opinion. Unfortuntetly that does not make it fact.
Oh sorry unlike you. Right. You state only facts. I call BS. Thats a fact.

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11-03-2012, 10:24 AM
  #60
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Originally Posted by ACC1224 View Post
One thread you go on about how basically everything Burke put together is awful. Here you say they collapse because they have no leadership.

Is it the Team or the Captain?
Its both. The team sucks and the captain as a captain does too. Its painfully obvious and like some other posters on this board....I'm truly disgusted that I have to repeat the same obvious crap ad nauseum. Its like arguing if whether Mike and Molly are fat or not.

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11-03-2012, 10:31 AM
  #61
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Originally Posted by hockeyfanz View Post
Its both. The team sucks and the captain as a captain does too. Its painfully obvious and like some other posters on this board....I'm truly disgusted that I have to repeat the same obvious crap ad nauseum. Its like arguing if whether Mike and Molly are fat or not.
So you believe they still have a "monumental collapse" regardless of the Captain?
Or is it because of the Captain?

Not sure who Mike and Molly are, regardless I'm not arguing. You just seem confused.

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11-03-2012, 10:42 AM
  #62
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I didn't like the Phaneuf trade to begin with. That isn't saying that I hated the pieces we gave up for him, rather Phaneufs play had been in decline for so long and his salary was too high for what he brought to the table. If the guy had a little more hockey sense he would be awesome but there were quite a few hockey scribes who mentioned (on the west coast before the trade) that the guy isn't exactly the sharpest knife in the drawer. Million dollar body and 10 cent head. Shame really.

So when he was named captain I was a little surprised to say the least.

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11-03-2012, 11:24 AM
  #63
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Originally Posted by hockeyfanz View Post
Oh sorry unlike you. Right. You state only facts. I call BS. Thats a fact.
It is a well known fact to anyone who has played beyond house league that the captaincy goes beyond they ice.

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11-03-2012, 11:36 AM
  #64
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Love Phaneuf. My favorite right now.

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11-03-2012, 11:42 AM
  #65
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Love Phaneuf. My favorite right now.
same.. he brings so much to the ice. He is what id call a complete defenseman. We would need this guy to win a cup

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11-03-2012, 11:50 AM
  #66
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same.. he brings so much to the ice. He is what id call a complete defenseman. We would need this guy to win a cup
It's been a long time since we've had that. Unfortunately we don't have much of the rest of the team that is needed to win. If I could put one guy from this team with Sundin to push him over the top for a Cup, it'd be Dion. Slightly ahead of Phil.

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11-03-2012, 01:47 PM
  #67
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Originally Posted by Kessly Snipes View Post
It is a well known fact to anyone who has played beyond house league that the captaincy goes beyond they ice.
You sound like you are spewing out some cliche crap I would hear from the typical athlete. All this "great in the room" garbage. I'm not saying that a captains play on the ice is where his responsibility ends...but it is where it absolutely starts and is the most important factor.....

Firstly captains go way beyond hockey......Great captains lead on their respective playing surfaces. And a captain is a captain in any sport. Great captains always have certain attributes. Great captains are great leaders in their respective sports. Stop talking BS rhetoric. Its nauseating. Also stop interpreting this as Phaneuf bashing FFS. Not every player has the attributes to be a great captain...it has no bearing on his overall ability as a player. Phil Kessel is by far the Leafs most skilled and best player. Ever see him wearing the "C" ?

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11-03-2012, 01:50 PM
  #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hockeyfanz View Post
You sound like you are spewing out some cliche crap I would hear from the typical athlete. All this "great in the room" garbage. I'm not saying that a captains play on the ice is where his responsibility ends...but it is where it absolutely starts and is the most important factor.....

Firstly captains go way beyond hockey......Great captains lead on their respective playing surfaces. And a captain is a captain in any sport. Great captains always have certain attributes. Great captains are great leaders in their respective sports. Stop talking BS rhetoric. Its nauseating. Also stop interpreting this as Phaneuf bashing FFS. Not every player has the attributes to be a great captain...it has no bearing on his overall ability as a player. Phil Kessel is by far the Leafs most skilled and best player. Ever see him wearing the "C" ?
No, but Kessel has the "A". What is it that Dion lacks in being a great captain? Outside of being the best player on the ice, I just don't see it. You have no clue that he is saying to his team mates.

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11-03-2012, 02:13 PM
  #69
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Originally Posted by Kessly Snipes View Post
No, but Kessel has the "A". What is it that Dion lacks in being a great captain? Outside of being the best player on the ice, I just don't see it. You have no clue that he is saying to his team mates.
Really you think he inspires his team mates? You think he lights the fire under their *****? Do ya? Based on how you watched this team fold like a cheap tent each year he has led them? Awesome. And its been pretty rare for me to see him being the "best" player on the Leafs let alone "on the ice".

Man..you just need to be honest with yourself. Can you tell me how many times Dion was selected the first star of the hockey game last season? That would imply he was the best player on the ice. Next tell me how many times he was the top Leaf star in a hockey game. That would imply he was the best Leaf on the ice. When you come back with those stats which would be factual, I will start to listen, until then you are entitled to your opinion I guess, no matter how wrong it is.

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11-03-2012, 02:34 PM
  #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hockeyfanz View Post
Really you think he inspires his team mates? You think he lights the fire under their *****? Do ya? Based on how you watched this team fold like a cheap tent each year he has led them? Awesome. And its been pretty rare for me to see him being the "best" player on the Leafs let alone "on the ice".

Man..you just need to be honest with yourself. Can you tell me how many times Dion was selected the first star of the hockey game last season? That would imply he was the best player on the ice. Next tell me how many times he was the top Leaf star in a hockey game. That would imply he was the best Leaf on the ice. When you come back with those stats which would be factual, I will start to listen, until then you are entitled to your opinion I guess, no matter how wrong it is.
You seem to be confusing best player, first star, captain and team.

But hey, if that floats your boat fine, just know the majority of Leaf fans disagree.

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