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Make Whole, Not War (CBA & Lockout Discussion) XIX

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Old
11-03-2012, 02:00 PM
  #376
JAX
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Freudian View Post
I think there is pressure from both owners and players to stop the posturing and explore what ways there are to move forward.

The media scrums are mostly posturing mixed with information/desinformation, so I could see why they decide to skip those for the time being.
I think the PA was thinking the WC was a big leverage point for them that's why the league had to can it when they did besides time restraints. I still believe Fehr will posture for at least another month until he thinks the gun is at his head and hand on the trigger.

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11-03-2012, 02:01 PM
  #377
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Reading the players and agents I swear nhlpa clan dont want a deal. It's unreal.

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Old
11-03-2012, 02:03 PM
  #378
Chazz Reinhold
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Originally Posted by Danny Zuko View Post
Dregger and Mike Rupp going at it a little on twitter now

Rupp sounds like an idiot there. I seriously don't get how these players can be so out to lunch...

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11-03-2012, 02:04 PM
  #379
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Originally Posted by Danny Zuko View Post
Serious question and I'm really not trying to be an ***, Are you a player or do you have a closer relative who is?

Being in the players side is fine but it seems you can't be objective at all.

For the record I'm pro owner but I really don't care who wins at this point.
A case can be made against the players and against the owners during these negotiations.

If you're being completely objective, you can admit that the NHL is not willing to negotiate the framework of the next CBA: It's 'Linkage or Lockout'. In addition, the only concessions the NHL has made besides a marginal increase in revenue sharing are items that they took away in their initial, scorched-earth proposal.

I'm pro-owner btw.

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Old
11-03-2012, 02:05 PM
  #380
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Quote:
Mike RuppVerified ‏@Rupper17
@DarrenDreger when outside sources continue to attempt to undermine the PA.... It's important to clear things up with the truth #dontuthink
Quote:
Darren DregerVerified ‏@DarrenDreger
@Rupper17. Undermine? Report indicated progress. As a player you should be encouraged. If NHL backs off on position we will report as well.
Its almost like some player truly don't want a deal.

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11-03-2012, 02:06 PM
  #381
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Originally Posted by Scoobs View Post
It seems as if Fehr is negotiating against the NHL, not with the NHL... Whereas the NHL is at least trying to "extend the olive branch" to the players by putting offers to them that at least have something in it for them. If Fehr and the NHLPA continue negotiating against the NHL, I think it's clear to be that the players are okay with losing money to push Bettman out.
Why would the players want Bettman out? If he just follows what his bosses tell him to do?

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11-03-2012, 02:10 PM
  #382
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I'm a tad confused.. was Dreger's report last night wrong or something


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11-03-2012, 02:11 PM
  #383
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Really hope there isn't more posturing from the PA side.

What's the difference in money between the two sides now with this addition of 200million from the owners?

wasn't it 500 million before? Now we're down to a measely 300 mil difference.

It's like the deal is just sitting there, but are the players willing to go to the next step and make a deal happen?

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11-03-2012, 02:13 PM
  #384
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The PA is making me mad, and making me glad I'm not missing hockey right now.

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Old
11-03-2012, 02:14 PM
  #385
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rdawg1234 View Post
Really hope there isn't more posturing from the PA side.

What's the difference in money between the two sides now with this addition of 200million from the owners?

wasn't it 500 million before? Now we're down to a measely 300 mil difference.

It's like the deal is just sitting there, but are the players willing to go to the next step and make a deal happen?
Its never been the $ as much as whether or not the players are willing to accept a linked proposal. That seems to be the one thing the NHL is unwilling to negotiate. Deal is done months ago had the PA agreed to a linked proposal.

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11-03-2012, 02:16 PM
  #386
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Originally Posted by mrquincy27 View Post
I'm a tad confused.. was Dreger's report last night wrong or something

No it was right. People got caught up in the timing of it(WC cancellation) and it being a PR stunt and basically forced him to release particulars of his report he probably didn't want to.

As for the particulars of it or why D.Fehr thinks it's a smokescreen...no clue.

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Old
11-03-2012, 02:16 PM
  #387
JAX
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rdawg1234 View Post
Really hope there isn't more posturing from the PA side.

What's the difference in money between the two sides now with this addition of 200million from the owners?

wasn't it 500 million before? Now we're down to a measely 300 mil difference.

It's like the deal is just sitting there, but are the players willing to go to the next step and make a deal happen?
The prob is I dont think Fehr has shown interest in working with the league proposal.....

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11-03-2012, 02:17 PM
  #388
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrquincy27 View Post
I'm a tad confused.. was Dreger's report last night wrong or something

It was a PR move by the league. Which by the way they're amazing at. They've schooled the PA up to now... They always follow up any bad new item quickly by pulling out other breaking news that replaces it. Most obvious examples: Luntz fiasco buried the next day by the Brooklyn Islanders announcement. Winter Classic cancellation followed by this non-offer that was spun as a "major concession".

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11-03-2012, 02:18 PM
  #389
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Originally Posted by Erik Estrada View Post
It was a PR move by the league. Which by the way they're amazing at. They've schooled the PA up to now... They always follow up any bad new item quickly by pulling out other breaking news that replaces it. Most obvious examples: Luntz fiasco buried the next day by the Brooklyn Islanders announcement. Winter Classic cancellation followed by this non-offer that was spun as a "major concession".
Dreger said it was leaked by a player source...

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Old
11-03-2012, 02:18 PM
  #390
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If Dregger wants to be an insider reporter, he should report and keep his conflict of interest opinions to himself. Stop becoming the news or is that the new business model for struggling sports journalists?

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11-03-2012, 02:18 PM
  #391
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Erik Estrada View Post
It was a PR move by the league. Which by the way they're amazing at. They've schooled the PA up to now... They always follow up any bad new item quickly by pulling out other breaking news that replaces it. Most obvious examples: Luntz fiasco buried the next day by the Brooklyn Islanders announcement. Winter Classic cancellation followed by this non-offer that was spun as a "major concession".
Dreger outed his source as someone involved with the PA.

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Old
11-03-2012, 02:19 PM
  #392
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Erik Estrada View Post
It was a PR move by the league. Which by the way they're amazing at. They've schooled the PA up to now... They always follow up any bad new item quickly by pulling out other breaking news that replaces it. Most obvious examples: Luntz fiasco buried the next day by the Brooklyn Islanders announcement. Winter Classic cancellation followed by this non-offer that was spun as a "major concession".
Yea, no.
Player source gave him the info.
NHL "reluctantly" confirmed it.

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Old
11-03-2012, 02:20 PM
  #393
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There is no surprise to see Dreger and Mckenzie furiously back the owners.. TSN has always been a bunch of Yes Men to the NHL always so afraid they might ruffle the wrong feathers and lose their NHL contract again.

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Old
11-03-2012, 02:21 PM
  #394
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FakeKidPoker View Post
There is no surprise to see Dreger and Mckenzie furiously back the owners.. TSN has always been a bunch of Yes Men to the NHL always so afraid they might ruffle the wrong feathers and lose their NHL contract again.
What? How are they backing the owners when they're just reporting news they get.

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Old
11-03-2012, 02:22 PM
  #395
Grasshopperking
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Originally Posted by thinkwild View Post
If Dregger wants to be an insider reporter, he should report and keep his conflict of interest opinions to himself. Stop becoming the news or is that the new business model for struggling sports journalists?
Why should he? His opinions are welcomed, especially when they're reasonable.

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11-03-2012, 02:22 PM
  #396
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Originally Posted by CBJBrassard16 View Post
What? How are they backing the owners when they're just reporting news they get.
This so much.

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Old
11-03-2012, 02:23 PM
  #397
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Originally Posted by driver3000 View Post
Dreger said it was leaked by a player source...
Just look going forward at any bad news day by the league. It'll be followed by some other positive news that they already have pre-packaged for these emergency situations. When the coincidence happens every single time, it's not a coincidence...It's an old political trick. Not saying it's particularly wrong to do that. It"s information management. It is what it is.

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Old
11-03-2012, 02:24 PM
  #398
Renbarg
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FakeKidPoker View Post
There is no surprise to see Dreger and Mckenzie furiously back the owners.. TSN has always been a bunch of Yes Men to the NHL always so afraid they might ruffle the wrong feathers and lose their NHL contract again.
Neither have furiously backed the owners. Yes Dreger has definitely appeared to lean towards the owners (especially the past few days), McKenzie I'm not so sure of. Having said that TSN is not going to lose their contract with the NHL for being critical. TSN will lose their contract if they are outbid.

On the other hand, if Dreger is too pro-owners you can bet he will lose some of his contacts among players.

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11-03-2012, 02:24 PM
  #399
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Originally Posted by Fugu View Post
One expects this to be the case as you get closer and closer to a deal. I think the only thing that potentially skews the NHL's approval is that only 8 team votes can still nix any proposal-- along with Bettman. Catering to the outliers may not be the best way to get quick resolution.
Lets just hope the players don't vote to make their acceptance rate 75%, otherwise the end of the next CBA could be heralded by a two year stoppage.

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Old
11-03-2012, 02:25 PM
  #400
Chazz Reinhold
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Erik Estrada View Post
Just look going forward at any bad news day by the league. It'll be followed by some other positive news that they already have pre-packaged for these emergency situations. When the coincidence happens every single time, it's not a coincidence...It's an old political trick. Not saying it's particularly wrong to do that. It"s information management. It is what it is.
You have zero proof whatsoever this was a league PR trick. The only tangible evidence out there is from a credible journalist who admitted it came from the PA's side when people like you tried pulling the "PR stunt" angle.

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