HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Western Conference > Pacific Division > Arizona Coyotes
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Portland Pirates AHL - Phoenix Coyotes Minor League Affiliate II

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
11-04-2012, 02:55 AM
  #101
wildcat48
HFB Partner
 
wildcat48's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: South Portland, ME
Country: United States
Posts: 3,338
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheTrollhunter View Post
U guys got to be kidding. I guess we have to agree to disagree.
I would agree with the assessment by Ultra Swat and Bruins71 on Rundblad, however, I wouldn't say he's terrible. It's just how he plays the game. He's offense first and defense when he gets around to it. He's second among defensemen on the Pirates in scoring with seven assists, but he's been on the ice for four of the six shorthanded goals allowed by the Pirates and he's been on the ice for 12 of 29 goals.

The shorthanded goals, while not totally his fault, are an indicator of his style of play. Again, offensive first, defense second.

Being the ice for 12-of-29 goals wouldn't be such a concern, but if you look at his TOI I would say that its cause for alarm. He's fourth on the team in TOI, averaging just under 14 mins.

If you use Mike Stone as a control sample. He leads the team in TOI at nearly 23 minutes per game, has six points with a plus-6 rating. He's been on the ice for six opposition power-play goals and one shorthanded goal. He's been on the ice nine of 29 goals allowed by the Pirates this season.

I think there is a still time for Rundblad to turn it around and find his way. The Coyotes aren't going to give up on him, but I think it has to start with Rundblad wanting to play defense first and chip in with the offense at a more measured pace.

wildcat48 is online now  
Old
11-04-2012, 08:20 AM
  #102
Kaizen
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Prince George B.C.
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,165
vCash: 500
Where are you getting your TOI stats from?

Is it publicly accessible?

Kaizen is online now  
Old
11-04-2012, 10:55 AM
  #103
rt
Usually Incorrect
 
rt's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Rarely Sober
Country: United States
Posts: 43,683
vCash: 500
One thing that can't be disputed is that neither Rundblad nor Gormley have stepped right into the AHL like they own the place and immediately started dominating. Which means they likely aren't top four NHL defensemen AT THIS MOMENT. Maybe we can shut down the Keith Yandle trade talk for the next nine months, at least? Clearly we've got PROSPECT depth, but they aren't ready for prime time just yet.

__________________
This poster should not be taken seriously under any circumstances.
rt is online now  
Old
11-04-2012, 11:09 AM
  #104
rt
Usually Incorrect
 
rt's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Rarely Sober
Country: United States
Posts: 43,683
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by hbk View Post
I actually view Rundblad as a positive work in process.

He's a thoroughbred playing on a team that is largely devoid of skill. Name a forward on the Pirates that has upside beyond that of a 3rd liner at this point? We are a team of role players up front. What does that mean? How many breakaway passes go unfinished? How many tape to tape passes are juggled on the receiving end? How many rebounds are not put into a gaping cage? Hell, how many players outside of Andy Miele can actually carry the puck and make a play to gain the offensive zone? Our offensive schema is very predictable. How many goals against (the -18 last year) came because Rundblad was on the ice with an open net because the team needed him on the ice if they wanted a shot at even tieing the game.
I agree to a certain extent. He obviously has a ton of talent. What he did in the SEL is basically unheard of for a defenseman his age. Don Maloney has said that is the 2nd best league in the world and Rundblad was the best player in it a couple of years ago. Having said that, he does make me incredibly nervous from a pure asset management standpoint. He and Vermette are all we have to show for a 3rd overall pick. Tikhonov is what we have from a fifth overall pick. And the end of Roszival's NHL career will prove to be the end of the return we had on that eighth overall pick. It's horrifying, and enough to doom most organizations to a decade of futility. Rundblad is so goddamned risky. It makes me nervous as Hell. I can EASILY see him going to way of Bobby Sanguinetti. Only, he's much more likely to simply take off for sweden and never come back. I'd feel much more comfortable with a safer, more limited prospect, to be honest. If he spends an entire season racking up minuses while playing fifteen minutes a night, his trade value will be a third round pick. If he isn't showing huge signs of improvement by game 25, I'd honestly push the panic button, if his league wide trade value is still half decent.

rt is online now  
Old
11-04-2012, 11:36 AM
  #105
Sindiggy
Go Desert Dogs
 
Sindiggy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Chandler, AZ
Country: United States
Posts: 3,118
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by rt View Post
If he spends an entire season racking up minuses while playing fifteen minutes a night, his trade value will be a third round pick. If he isn't showing huge signs of improvement by game 25, I'd honestly push the panic button, if his league wide trade value is still half decent.
The good news is that we can always fall back on that he doesn't fit the style of play the Coyotes prefer, and with that much talent, he's bound to be wanted by some team in need of offense from the back end. You have to remember that most teams don't treat defense the way the Coyotes do. That said, I'm almost positive that he'd be a great 10min a night guy at the NHL level with 80% of his time on the PP.

Sindiggy is offline  
Old
11-04-2012, 12:26 PM
  #106
Blubba Jenkins
Staying Faithful
 
Blubba Jenkins's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: NE Florida
Country: United States
Posts: 3,267
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by rt View Post
One thing that can't be disputed is that neither Rundblad nor Gormley have stepped right into the AHL like they own the place and immediately started dominating. Which means they likely aren't top four NHL defensemen AT THIS MOMENT. Maybe we can shut down the Keith Yandle trade talk for the next nine months, at least? Clearly we've got PROSPECT depth, but they aren't ready for prime time just yet.
Gormley made some nice plays to break up a 2-on-1 a couple of times, but it still seems like he is a little overwhelmed at times. He'll get there, he's only dipped his toes into pro hockey.

Blubba Jenkins is offline  
Old
11-04-2012, 12:28 PM
  #107
hbk
Registered User
 
hbk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,996
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by rt View Post
I agree to a certain extent. He obviously has a ton of talent. What he did in the SEL is basically unheard of for a defenseman his age. Don Maloney has said that is the 2nd best league in the world and Rundblad was the best player in it a couple of years ago. Having said that, he does make me incredibly nervous from a pure asset management standpoint. He and Vermette are all we have to show for a 3rd overall pick. Tikhonov is what we have from a fifth overall pick. And the end of Roszival's NHL career will prove to be the end of the return we had on that eighth overall pick. It's horrifying, and enough to doom most organizations to a decade of futility. Rundblad is so goddamned risky. It makes me nervous as Hell. I can EASILY see him going to way of Bobby Sanguinetti. Only, he's much more likely to simply take off for sweden and never come back. I'd feel much more comfortable with a safer, more limited prospect, to be honest. If he spends an entire season racking up minuses while playing fifteen minutes a night, his trade value will be a third round pick. If he isn't showing huge signs of improvement by game 25, I'd honestly push the panic button, if his league wide trade value is still half decent.
I'd argue that Vermette forTurris alone has been a win for Maloney. Considering how instrumental Vermette was in this franchise winning its first playoff series win since 1987 at worst it's a wash right now. Rundblad was a long-term investment. I'm shocked at how little respect Maloney gets for turning the awful Turris situation into such a great return. Hell a year ago we were being laughed at the very notion we could get Vermette alone for Turris let alone Rundblad and Vermette.

hbk is offline  
Old
11-04-2012, 01:10 PM
  #108
rt
Usually Incorrect
 
rt's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Rarely Sober
Country: United States
Posts: 43,683
vCash: 500
Don't get me wrong, I was shocked at how much Maloney got for Turris and still am. I'm also thrilled to have Vermette on the team, and completely agree on the playoffs point.

rt is online now  
Old
11-04-2012, 02:01 PM
  #109
_Del_
Registered User
 
_Del_'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: SkullcrusherMountain
Posts: 3,549
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by hbk View Post
Rundblad is never going to be OEL defensively. I buy the Zubov comparison though. Rundblad is developing nicely. He has a higher level or two yet but he has time to get there. This is a player worth getting excited about.
People are hard on dmen. Yandle terrified me in his first pro-season. I generally hate every rookie defenseman that enters the league. No really. Almost every one of them scares me when they are on the ice. OEL was a very rare exception. I would be to dmen what Dave Tippett is to forwards. I would never play the rookies.
Noone remembers the angst over Yandle's growing pains.


http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...6&postcount=46

http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...9&postcount=36


And I won't embarrass anyone else by quoting anyone other than me, but there were lots of posts in a different thread about the 22 year old Yandle not looking like an NHL player.

Still time for Rundblad to turn it around. And he has elite upside. Doesn't mean he ever becomes more than Tverdovski/Ozolinsch, but the potential is definitely there.

_Del_ is offline  
Old
11-04-2012, 06:13 PM
  #110
PHX FireBirds18
Registered User
 
PHX FireBirds18's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Country: United States
Posts: 2,915
vCash: 500
Stone is another guy that you could add to the list of defensive prospects who looked lost in their own end when he first turned pro. He's come a long way in his own end since then and looks to be a legit top 4 dman in the near future. OEL would regularly get burned wide his rookie year, miss his assignments in front of the net, and wasn't providing any offense to boot. Rundblad doesn't have to be be the worlds best defensive player to play for a Tip team, Yandle is evidence of that. He just needs some more time.

PHX FireBirds18 is offline  
Old
11-04-2012, 06:49 PM
  #111
rt
Usually Incorrect
 
rt's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Rarely Sober
Country: United States
Posts: 43,683
vCash: 500
Fair enough. And, I suppose, Vermette is an excellent "short term" return who is almost certainly going to be a more valuable contributor than Turris for the next three years (the duration of his contract). Rundblad is more important long term.

rt is online now  
Old
11-04-2012, 07:15 PM
  #112
wildcat48
HFB Partner
 
wildcat48's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: South Portland, ME
Country: United States
Posts: 3,338
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaizen View Post
Where are you getting your TOI stats from?

Is it publicly accessible?
No, its not a public stat. It's given to us at the end of the game.

wildcat48 is online now  
Old
11-04-2012, 07:47 PM
  #113
hbk
Registered User
 
hbk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,996
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by PHX FireBirds18 View Post
Stone is another guy that you could add to the list of defensive prospects who looked lost in their own end when he first turned pro. He's come a long way in his own end since then and looks to be a legit top 4 dman in the near future. OEL would regularly get burned wide his rookie year, miss his assignments in front of the net, and wasn't providing any offense to boot. Rundblad doesn't have to be be the worlds best defensive player to play for a Tip team, Yandle is evidence of that. He just needs some more time.
I'd go so far as to say that Stone makes the NHL squad when we start up.

hbk is offline  
Old
11-04-2012, 08:00 PM
  #114
WJF
Registered User
 
WJF's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Los Angeles
Country: United States
Posts: 3,573
vCash: 50
What's going on with OEL? Anyone know the extent of his injury??

WJF is offline  
Old
11-04-2012, 08:14 PM
  #115
hbk
Registered User
 
hbk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,996
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by WJF View Post
What's going on with OEL? Anyone know the extent of his injury??
It's very minor apparently.

I'm actually starting to lean against playing OEL. Not to offend Portland fans but OEL can play 25-30 mins per night at the AHL level. The problem that creates is the effect in reduced minutes for our other prospects. We know what OEL can do already. We need to develop the next group.

hbk is offline  
Old
11-04-2012, 08:42 PM
  #116
HavlatMach9
Registered User
 
HavlatMach9's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Ottawa
Country: Canada
Posts: 8,170
vCash: 500
I felt confident when Rundblad had the puck in the games he played with Sens at the NHL level, he was so slick, but facepalm worthy at the other end. Seems like he's still a whiles away, but he'll get stronger/smarter over time.

HavlatMach9 is online now  
Old
11-04-2012, 09:00 PM
  #117
SniperHF
Global Moderator
 
SniperHF's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Phoenix, Arizona
Country: United States
Posts: 15,383
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by hbk View Post
It's very minor apparently.

I'm actually starting to lean against playing OEL. Not to offend Portland fans but OEL can play 25-30 mins per night at the AHL level. The problem that creates is the effect in reduced minutes for our other prospects. We know what OEL can do already. We need to develop the next group.
I'm also mildly concerned about him picking up a few bad habits. Could be unfounded concern, but being away from the tight system that Tippet runs I don't consider a good thing.

SniperHF is online now  
Old
11-04-2012, 10:36 PM
  #118
Blubba Jenkins
Staying Faithful
 
Blubba Jenkins's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: NE Florida
Country: United States
Posts: 3,267
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SniperHF View Post
I'm also mildly concerned about him picking up a few bad habits. Could be unfounded concern, but being away from the tight system that Tippet runs I don't consider a good thing.
That's true of every Coyote right now.

If I had to wager, I think Stone is #6 this year. It helps that he's a righty.

Blubba Jenkins is offline  
Old
11-04-2012, 10:48 PM
  #119
Swat Ultra
~Hockey!~
 
Swat Ultra's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Northern NH
Country: United States
Posts: 2,722
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by WJF View Post
What's going on with OEL? Anyone know the extent of his injury??
When I saw him on Friday, he had a splint and wrap one of his pinky fingers.

Swat Ultra is offline  
Old
11-05-2012, 02:50 AM
  #120
OOEEL
Registered User
 
OOEEL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Arizona
Country: United States
Posts: 413
vCash: 500
So I'll ask here since I'm sure more people will see it than if I post in the travel thread.

Is there anything interesting to do in Portland? I keep telling myself I'm gonna book a weekend trip to see the Pirates if the season is canceled, so I figure I should start getting an idea of what's in the area in the event I do make it out there.

OOEEL is offline  
Old
11-05-2012, 02:59 AM
  #121
wildcat48
HFB Partner
 
wildcat48's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: South Portland, ME
Country: United States
Posts: 3,338
vCash: 500
He was slashed and jammed his finger along the boards vs. Binghamton. From what I've been told he should only miss a couple of weeks.

wildcat48 is online now  
Old
11-05-2012, 11:52 AM
  #122
ssault
SW BROONS
 
ssault's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Central Maine
Country: United States
Posts: 2,470
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by OOEEL View Post
So I'll ask here since I'm sure more people will see it than if I post in the travel thread.

Is there anything interesting to do in Portland? I keep telling myself I'm gonna book a weekend trip to see the Pirates if the season is canceled, so I figure I should start getting an idea of what's in the area in the event I do make it out there.
What are you looking to do? Bunch of great places to eat/drink.

ssault is offline  
Old
11-06-2012, 01:20 AM
  #123
Alaska
40 Below
 
Alaska's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Fairbanks, AK
Posts: 50
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by WJF View Post
What's going on with OEL? Anyone know the extent of his injury??
http://video.coyotes.nhl.com/videoce...sole?id=186443

Was watching Eye on Pirates 10/29/12. Briefly talked about OEL. Said that injury is not that bad. Expected back in a couple of weeks.

Alaska is offline  
Old
11-07-2012, 05:15 PM
  #124
Vip
Rieder Support Team
 
Vip's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Country: Mexico
Posts: 14,045
vCash: 500
It's pretty apparent that Rundblad is gifted Offensively but seems to be struggling defensively (expected). Has the thought ever occurred to anyone that maybe he could be an effective forward? Kinda like what Biznasty did, except Rundblad could attempt to be an effective playmaker/sniper or whatever. Just a thought.

Vip is offline  
Old
11-07-2012, 06:32 PM
  #125
XX
Lots of Try
 
XX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Executionville
Country: United States
Posts: 28,817
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Saucey View Post
It's pretty apparent that Rundblad is gifted Offensively but seems to be struggling defensively (expected). Has the thought ever occurred to anyone that maybe he could be an effective forward? Kinda like what Biznasty did, except Rundblad could attempt to be an effective playmaker/sniper or whatever. Just a thought.
I guess in Sweden the 5th forward approach works better, what with the larger ice and all. That doesn't fly here in NA. Look at Mike Green. I think what complicates matters is that Rundblad is walking into a defensively minded team/coaching staff. He sticks out like a sore thumb. I have no doubt that he'd put up a crap load of points with someone like the Oilers or Senators. But for the Coyotes, he may never be as useful as his talent hints at.

I really hope he wakes up, or that they send Burke down there to ride him like a broken pony. He has the potential to lift our PP right out of mediocrity/hilarity. Plus, he's just fun to watch. Others have brought up that he is still young and the parallels with Yandle, but Yandle had at least an inkling of defense running through him.

XX is online now  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:33 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.