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Old
11-06-2012, 01:59 PM
  #351
kihei
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Another Vancouver wet dream. Even more frenzied than recent offers.

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11-06-2012, 02:00 PM
  #352
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Originally Posted by kihei View Post
Another Vancouver wet dream.
Vancouver nightmare more like it!

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11-06-2012, 02:01 PM
  #353
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Another Vancouver wet dream.
Not much of a wet dream to be honest.

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Old
11-06-2012, 02:02 PM
  #354
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Originally Posted by Silverback91 View Post
yea the whole point is to fill the cupboards to be able to package out our 1st and Mason Raymond and some prospects for a good deadline pick up. We gain cap space to be able to do something like this as well which we can use to re-sign our own up-coming UFA's and/or re-signing our deadline pick-up
Well a Raymond and a 1st package is really only a 1st and a 2nd package when you break it down in real value. I don't see too many people lining up with a 2nd line forward to trade for Mason Raymond.

I like Finn as a prospect and think he adds to a needful area but the only real valuable piece we acquire us the 1st, which is more a promise than a trade since we don't see it at all if the Leafs are as bad as they have been the past 7 years.
Is it even possible to trade a conditional first from another team to a 3rd team in a separate trade?

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11-06-2012, 02:05 PM
  #355
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Originally Posted by mstad101 View Post
Well a Raymond and a 1st package is really only a 1st and a 2nd package when you break it down in real value. I don't see too many people lining up with a 2nd line forward to trade for Mason Raymond.

I like Finn as a prospect and think he adds to a needful area but the only real valuable piece we acquire us the 1st, which is more a promise than a trade since we don't see it at all if the Leafs are as bad as they have been the past 7 years.
Is it even possible to trade a conditional first from another team to a 3rd team in a separate trade?
We would trade our 1st and seeing how cheap Hossa/Kovalchuk etc top deadline players have gone in the past, I'm sure a 1st, Raymond, Schroeder, and Sauve (just an example package) would be on par with the value other deadline UFA's to be returned. We wouldn't get a Hossa/Kovie but we could get a pretty good pick up for that package

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11-06-2012, 02:05 PM
  #356
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Gee lets see the leafs trade a high first round pick, MATT FINN already being referred to as the steal of the 2012 draft and off to a tremendous start this year in the OHL so mid first round pick level player at least, plus Joe Coburne

Total salary going to Vancouver next to zero

Leafs get a billion dollar contract for infinity in a 33 yr old soon to 34 yr old goalie.

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm NO

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Old
11-06-2012, 02:06 PM
  #357
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Originally Posted by kihei View Post
Another Vancouver wet dream. Even more frenzied than recent offers.
You know when i feel lonely and nothing to do, i start reading these Luongo proposals and then i start dreaming about how our team (Vancouver) would be good with these players we get. And to my surprise, i realize that i am touching myself.

Just try it, close your eye, imagine Colborne in few year from now leading Vancouver to the cup. Man, I can tell you it feel good man, it feel soooooooo good!! Do you feel it too?

Please dont stop!! Continue these proposals! It procure me so much good time.

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Old
11-06-2012, 02:06 PM
  #358
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Originally Posted by CG14 View Post
Absolutely unequivocally no from a Leaf fan. Holy
Quote:
Originally Posted by kihei View Post
Another Vancouver wet dream. Even more frenzied than recent offers.
A couple of second tier prospects and a mid-round first for an elite, three-time Vezina nominee and Gold Medalist?

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Old
11-06-2012, 02:07 PM
  #359
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Originally Posted by palindrom View Post
You know when i feel lonely and nothing to do, i start reading these Luongo proposal and then i start dreaming about how our team (Vancouver) will be good with these players we get. And to my surprise, i realize that i am touching myself.

Just try it, close your eye, imagine Colborne in few year from now leading Vancouver to the cup. Man, it feel soooooooo good!! Please dont stop!! Continue these proposals!
Step away from the keyboard.

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Old
11-06-2012, 02:09 PM
  #360
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Matt Finn was a steal at top of 2nd round and is off to an amazing start this year and is being referred to as a steal by the Leafs, hardly a "third tier asset"

Plus a high first round pick, that makes 2 firsts + Coburne

For the Billion dollar contract i say pass no matter if you gave him to the Leafs that contract is a serious serious problem for a decade

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11-06-2012, 02:14 PM
  #361
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Leafs are going to get there top line centre this coming draft Barkov or Monahan and dont need to buy quick fixes anymore just let the huge prospect pool mature and add a key player or two

Not sell the farm for a 34 yr old goalie who will hurt the teams draft position and not make us good enough long term to challenge for a cup

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Old
11-06-2012, 02:15 PM
  #362
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Originally Posted by Hawaiinleaf View Post
Leafs are going to get there top line centre this coming draft Barkov or Monahan and dont need to buy quick fixes anymore just let the huge prospect pool mature and add a key player or two

Not sell the farm for a 34 yr old goalie who will hurt the teams draft position and not make us good enough long term to challenge for a cup
Do you think Burke would ever deliberately tank for a season?

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Old
11-06-2012, 02:16 PM
  #363
Ched Brosky
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Originally Posted by Hawaiinleaf View Post
Matt Finn was a steal at top of 2nd round and is off to an amazing start this year and is being referred to as a steal by the Leafs, hardly a "third tier asset"

Plus a high first round pick, that makes 2 firsts + Coburne

For the Billion dollar contract i say pass no matter if you gave him to the Leafs that contract is a serious serious problem for a decade
how is the 1st u guys give up a high 1st exactly? You guys get a goalie thats always been top 10 the past decade, his worst year as a Canuck he had 40 wins, his worst year career wise in the NHL, he still managed 35 wins on the Panthers and stayed above .910 sv% and below 3.00 gaa.

You don't think adding him to the Leafs team without taking any other player off from last season wouldn't get them in the playoffs at the least?

Also u can't say Matt Finn is worth a 1st. He was just drafted in the 2nd round. Does that make Frankie Corrado worth a 1st? Drafted in the 5th round and is only 2nd to Dougie Hamilton in scoring for d-men? On top of that he's been named player of the week/month numerous times in the OHL. Not to mention, offense isn't even Corrado's foray.

I guess Corrado was the steal of the 2011 draft since he went in the the 5th round and is only 2nd to Dougie Hamilton who went 9th overall.


Last edited by Ched Brosky: 11-06-2012 at 02:27 PM.
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Old
11-06-2012, 02:19 PM
  #364
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Originally Posted by nowhereman View Post
A couple of second tier prospects and a mid-round first for an elite, three-time Vezina nominee and Gold Medalist?
Teams dont trade for the past accomplishment of a player, they trade for the potential they see in him for the future.

Would you like Gomez for Luongo ? Gomez is a 2 time stanley cup champion, a calder winner, an all star-player.

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Old
11-06-2012, 02:20 PM
  #365
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Originally Posted by Silverback91 View Post
Yep another one of those

To Toronto:
Roberto Luongo
Kellan Tochkin (contract throw in)

To Vancouver:
Joe Colborne
Matt Finn
Conditional 1st round pick

Condition on Leafs making the playoffs. If they don't in the 1st season (or the lockout wipes the season) then the pick is referred to next year.

Reason Toronto does this: Burke has criticized his goalies a lot... Reimer is a question mark and Scrivens is an even bigger question mark now with how he has put on his best Vesa Toskala impersonation for the baby Leafs (albeit a small sample size). An elite (once again, albeit this one is aging) goalie is needed if this team ever wants to make the playoffs any time soon which Burke does or else he will lose his job.

Reason Vancouver does this: They get a center back who can battle Schroeder for 2nd line duties while Kes is out and then move down to the 3rd line. We either get a decent somewhat proven center to compete with Schroeder or another prospect (with a lot of size) who had a very good outing in his one stint in the NHL. We also get a good d-man prospect back which Vancouver needs most in the prospect pool. Also could get another mid 1st which never hurt. Package the pick with some prospects for a big trade deadline pick up, and we' still have a 1st that season to draft with
Not even in the ballpark.

Bozak and a 2nd is more than fair.

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Old
11-06-2012, 02:20 PM
  #366
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Originally Posted by Hawaiinleaf View Post
Matt Finn was a steal at top of 2nd round and is off to an amazing start this year and is being referred to as a steal by the Leafs, hardly a "third tier asset"

Plus a high first round pick, that makes 2 firsts + Coburne

For the Billion dollar contract i say pass no matter if you gave him to the Leafs that contract is a serious serious problem for a decade
Maybe yes maybe no. Burke also called Rielly the best player in the draft. Every team claims that hey got a 'steal'. The bottomline is that the other GM's in the league didn't pick Finn. I agree though that he's a good asset and not a third tier asset.

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Old
11-06-2012, 02:23 PM
  #367
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Originally Posted by palindrom View Post
Teams dont trade for the past accomplishment of a player, they trade for the potential they see in him for the future.

Would you like Gomez for Luongo ? Gomez is a 2 time stanley cup champion, a calder winner, an all star-player.
So trade for something abstract and ignore concrete facts?

That's an amazing strategy. Good luck in life.

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Old
11-06-2012, 02:23 PM
  #368
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Originally Posted by palindrom View Post
Teams dont trade for the past accomplishment of a player, they trade for the potential they see in him for the future.
This isn't NHL 13. I guess you would trade Shane Doan for a 2nd round pick just like in the game since a 2nd round pick has more potential in the future?
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Originally Posted by ACC1224 View Post
Not even in the ballpark.

Bozak and a 2nd is more than fair.
LOL so does that make Phaneuf worth a 2nd and Raymond?

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Old
11-06-2012, 02:25 PM
  #369
palindrom
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Originally Posted by Hawaiinleaf View Post
Matt Finn was a steal at top of 2nd round and is off to an amazing start this year and is being referred to as a steal by the Leafs, hardly a "third tier asset"

Plus a high first round pick, that makes 2 firsts + Coburne

For the Billion dollar contract i say pass no matter if you gave him to the Leafs that contract is a serious serious problem for a decade
We can notice that Vancouver didn't draft Finn with their 26th overall pick! (Finn was drafted 35th)

So how much of a steal he is in the opinion of Vancouver management?

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11-06-2012, 02:25 PM
  #370
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So trade for something abstract and ignore concrete facts?

That's an amazing strategy. Good luck in life.
Did you deliberately miss the point that he/she was trying to make? Because that is not what he said... at all.

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Old
11-06-2012, 02:26 PM
  #371
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Did you deliberately miss the point that he/she was trying to make? Because that is not what he said... at all.
No I think i fully understood it.

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Old
11-06-2012, 02:27 PM
  #372
palindrom
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So trade for something abstract and ignore concrete facts?

That's an amazing strategy. Good luck in life.
So do you want gomez ?

The concrete fact is: he is a 2 time stanley cup champion.

My point was, we dont care about the past of a player, we should care about the expectation we have for him in the future. I would rather have an unproven player i expect to perform better than a proven player i expect to do badly.

dont you agree with that?

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11-06-2012, 02:28 PM
  #373
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Originally Posted by Hawaiinleaf View Post
Gee lets see the leafs trade a high first round pick, MATT FINN already being referred to as the steal of the 2012 draft and off to a tremendous start this year in the OHL so mid first round pick level player at least, plus Joe Coburne

Total salary going to Vancouver next to zero

Leafs get a billion dollar contract for infinity in a 33 yr old soon to 34 yr old goalie.

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm NO
Gotta love when posters are overly exaggerating to the point of sounding moronic.

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Old
11-06-2012, 02:30 PM
  #374
Ched Brosky
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Originally Posted by Intense Rage View Post
Did you deliberately miss the point that he/she was trying to make? Because that is not what he said... at all.
If the point he/she was making was true, why do top aging players return a lot of futures when they are traded?

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11-06-2012, 02:34 PM
  #375
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Originally Posted by palindrom View Post
So do you want gomez ?

The concrete fact is: he is a 2 time stanley cup champion.

My point was, we dont care about the past of a player, we should care about the expectation we have for him in the future. I would rather have an unproven player i expect to perform better than a proven player i expect to do badly.

dont you agree with that?
LOL Gomez has been declining the past 2 years on top of being one of the highest cap hits in the entire league.

Luongo has yet to decline. His last season was better than his career average. Career average sv% was the same as his past season sv%, but his gaa this past season was better than his career avg.

Just because u think he will do badly, doesn't mean he will. I thought John Tavares was going to be at best a 2nd line player and one of the worst 1st overall picks in a long time because his main asset was his hockey iq and being in the right place at the right time. Did that mean Tavares automatically busts because I think that? No, infact he proved me quite wrong. So why exactly is it just because YOU think Luongo will decline, that he indeed will decline?

Your example is asinine, I could give u one back... would u trade Teemu Selanne for a 7th round pick?

Selanne is 42 and even though he has yet to decline much, i expect him to play badly!! On the other hand the 7th round pick could be a 17 year old Datsyuk!


Last edited by Ched Brosky: 11-06-2012 at 02:42 PM.
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