Whitney will never be healthy again. I would do the deal, at least we get back a healthy soft D man.
I really like Whitney, I just don't see him staying healthy.
He's got one kick at the can if/when the season starts. From what I've heard in interviews, he's feeling the best he has in a long time. Whitney is an honest & straight shooter, before he always sounded down in regards to his injuries limiting what he can do. So the surgeries and extended rest period may have paid off. We'll see though.
It doesn't matter about that, that is 30 mil for 5 players, to have a legit defensive core you won't have enough money. Good try it won't happen.
I'd rather have another forward making 6 mil whose worth every penny than a Dman making 6.68 (and nowhere near worth it) just for the sake of spreading salary evenly to different positions
That said, I don't see why Dallas would want to deal him, nor do I see them failing to match an offersheet short of gross overpayment. If we were to make a legit offer without giving up one of the big 4, it would probably be Gagner, Klefbom and 2 1sts. I still doubt they take it.
The Oilers would be taking back salary in the deal. The Oilers would need a mechanism (and again, this is if the CBA issue gets settled and we are up and playing by, say, December 1). The Oilers would be 63 million on the cap, but in reality, be at 52 million because of the bonus structures for the likes of Hall, Eberle, RNH, Yakupov and Schultz, which would allow them to take on an additional contract. Based on the way the last NHL deal went, there would be a 70 million dollar cap transition year. This would allow the Oilers to take on a little bit of money. The next year, the cap would likely go down to 63-65 million, so the Oilers would need a mechanism that would allow them to clear some cap space, possibly an NBA-style amnesty clause that extended beyond the end of this season into June of next year. The "fab four" (Hall, Eberle, Yakupov, RNH), I don't see getting moved. A secondary player would end up getting moved, maybe a secondary young forward or a secondary young defenceman (specifically not Petry or Smid, more of a developmental guy) and certainly not Justin Schultz. They would be eating some money because they have the flexibility and space to do it.
SO here are some reasonable names that could be dealt (PS, Bob sounded like Luongo is NOT the player we are going for by mentioning he believes the Leafs will get that deal done)
Sam Gagner
Curtis Hamilton
Teemu Hartikainen
Anton Lander
Ryan Martindale
Magnus Paajarvi
Tyler Pitlick
Toni Rajala
Tobias Rieder
Martin Gernat
Martin Marincin
David Musil
Colten Teubert
Last edited by Paralyzer008: 11-08-2012 at 04:17 AM.
Have you been reading the thread/ know Stauffers hints?
I think we need a sticky at the top of each page We are not trading an A player (RNH, Schultz, Hall, ect) or a B player (Gagner, Hemsky, Marincin, ect)
He said it would be a secondary forward or defenseman. I wouldn't even want to give up Paajarvi for JayBo.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rockinghockey
What do you think it would take to get JBo.
Calgary would probably ask for a young forward like Paajarvi or Hartikainen. I wouldn't want to give them a single piece that could be useful for our future. Plus other teams like Detroit might be able to put together better offers than what I atleast would want to give up.
He said it would be a secondary forward or defenseman. I wouldn't even want to give up Paajarvi for JayBo.
Calgary would probably ask for a young forward like Paajarvi or Hartikainen. I wouldn't want to give them a single piece that could be useful for our future. Plus other teams like Detroit might be able to put together better offers than what I atleast would want to give up.
Benn is not going to be traded to EDM, explain to me how EDM can afford to pay 6mil a year to Hall, Eberle, RNH, Yak and Benn. That would be 30 mil on 5 players, there is no way that is going to happen.
As for JBo I would love to get him here for the next 2 yrs to see how he does. That is the type of wow factor Stauffer was talking about. It is either going to be a dman or a 2C as that is what we need on this team.
Not that I think that Benn is coming to Edmonton but Pittsburgh will be paying there top 5 forwards $28M next year. They have a dman making $5M and a $5M goalie. They also have a fair bit of cpa space. Moreover, Yakupov would not be making $6M until 2015-2016 at the earliest. At that point you probably have a cap in the low $70M's
They Oilers could make this work by filling slots with players on ELC's and inexpensive vets. Of course names can change but it is really just to give you the idea of how money could be distributed.
Here is a sample of a possible line-up for 2015-2016 with the cap at $72M.
CAPGEEK.COM USER GENERATED ROSTER
My Custom Lineup
FORWARDS
Teemu Hartikainen ($1.300m) / Ryan N.-Hopkins ($6.000m) / Nail Yakupov ($6.000m)
Taylor Hall ($6.000m) / Jamie Benn ($6.000m) / Jordan Eberle ($6.000m)
Magnus Paajarvi ($1.600m) / Eric Belanger ($1.750m) / Tobias Rieder ($1.000m)
Ryan Jones ($1.500m) / Anton Lander ($0.900m) / Tyler Pitlick ($0.900m)
Antti Tyrvainen ($0.570m) / Darcy Hordichuk ($0.850m) /
DEFENSEMEN
Alex Edler ($6.000m) / Justin Schultz ($5.000m)
Ladislav Smid ($4.500m) / Jeff Perty ($3.000m)
Oscar Klefbom ($1.275m) / David Musil ($0.925m)
Martin Marincin ($0.870m) /
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled with the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $72,000,000; CAP PAYROLL: $70,123,333; BONUSES: $620,000
CAP SPACE (23-man roster): $2,596,667
Not that I think that Benn is coming to Edmonton but Pittsburgh will be paying there top 5 forwards $28M next year. They have a dman making $5M and a $5M goalie. They also have a fair bit of cpa space. Moreover, Yakupov would not be making $6M until 2015-2016 at the earliest. At that point you probably have a cap in the low $70M's
They Oilers could make this work by filling slots with players on ELC's and inexpensive vets. Of course names can change but it is really just to give you the idea of how money could be distributed.
Here is a sample of a possible line-up for 2015-2016 with the cap at $72M.
CAPGEEK.COM USER GENERATED ROSTER
My Custom Lineup
FORWARDS
Teemu Hartikainen ($1.300m) / Ryan N.-Hopkins ($6.000m) / Nail Yakupov ($6.000m)
Taylor Hall ($6.000m) / Jamie Benn ($6.000m) / Jordan Eberle ($6.000m)
Magnus Paajarvi ($1.600m) / Eric Belanger ($1.750m) / Justin Schultz ($5.000m)
Ryan Jones ($1.500m) / Anton Lander ($0.900m) / Tyler Pitlick ($0.900m)
Antti Tyrvainen ($0.570m) / Darcy Hordichuk ($0.850m) /
DEFENSEMEN
Alex Edler ($6.000m) / Justin Schultz ($5.000m)
Ladislav Smid ($4.500m) / Justin Schultz ($5.000m)
Oscar Klefbom ($1.275m) / David Musil ($0.925m)
Martin Marincin ($0.870m) /
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled with the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $72,000,000; CAP PAYROLL: $70,123,333; BONUSES: $620,000
CAP SPACE (23-man roster): $2,596,667
you have real high hopes for Justin Schultz. First pairing D AND 3rd line RW?!
Nevermind, after reading it I think you meant to do that. The kid is impressive.
FORWARDS
Teemu Hartikainen ($1.300m) / Ryan N.-Hopkins ($6.000m) / Nail Yakupov ($6.000m)
Taylor Hall ($6.000m) / Jamie Benn ($6.000m) / Jordan Eberle ($6.000m)
Magnus Paajarvi ($1.600m) / Eric Belanger ($1.750m) / Justin Schultz ($5.000m)
Ryan Jones ($1.500m) / Anton Lander ($0.900m) / Tyler Pitlick ($0.900m)
Antti Tyrvainen ($0.570m) / Darcy Hordichuk ($0.850m) /
DEFENSEMEN
Alex Edler ($6.000m) / Justin Schultz ($5.000m)
Ladislav Smid ($4.500m) / Justin Schultz ($5.000m)
Oscar Klefbom ($1.275m) / David Musil ($0.925m)
Martin Marincin ($0.870m) /
SO here are some reasonable names that could be dealt (PS, Bob sounded like Luongo is NOT the player we are going for by mentioning he believes the Leafs will get that deal done)
Sam Gagner
Curtis Hamilton
Teemu Hartikainen
Anton Lander
Ryan Martindale
Magnus Paajarvi
Tyler Pitlick
Toni Rajala
Tobias Rieder
Martin Gernat
Martin Marincin
David Musil
Colten Teubert
I could've sworn that in one of the more recent NHL proposals that they said there would be no bonus relief like their currently is, so wouldn't that screw Bob's comments up?
Not suprised. When you see that quote that Paralyzer008 put up it's pretty clear that Stauffer isnt acting on inside information more on guesswork. He's going off of what happened after the last lockout, maybe a hint that management will be looking for opportunities, and a whole bunch of guesses on how the CBA will turn out and what it will allow. At this point it's pretty clear that things have to turn out just the right way with the CBA for us to have cap space to make any deals. It's not like 2004 where we are way under the cap and have tons of room to stock up. Most likely we'll be pretty tight with the cap and unless we buy someone out we wont be picking anyone significant up.
Not that I think that Benn is coming to Edmonton but Pittsburgh will be paying there top 5 forwards $28M next year. They have a dman making $5M and a $5M goalie. They also have a fair bit of cpa space. Moreover, Yakupov would not be making $6M until 2015-2016 at the earliest. At that point you probably have a cap in the low $70M's
They Oilers could make this work by filling slots with players on ELC's and inexpensive vets. Of course names can change but it is really just to give you the idea of how money could be distributed.
Here is a sample of a possible line-up for 2015-2016 with the cap at $72M.
CAPGEEK.COM USER GENERATED ROSTER
My Custom Lineup
FORWARDS
Teemu Hartikainen ($1.300m) / Ryan N.-Hopkins ($6.000m) / Nail Yakupov ($6.000m)
Taylor Hall ($6.000m) / Jamie Benn ($6.000m) / Jordan Eberle ($6.000m)
Magnus Paajarvi ($1.600m) / Eric Belanger ($1.750m) / Justin Schultz ($5.000m)
Ryan Jones ($1.500m) / Anton Lander ($0.900m) / Tyler Pitlick ($0.900m)
Antti Tyrvainen ($0.570m) / Darcy Hordichuk ($0.850m) /
DEFENSEMEN
Alex Edler ($6.000m) / Justin Schultz ($5.000m)
Ladislav Smid ($4.500m) / Justin Schultz ($5.000m)
Oscar Klefbom ($1.275m) / David Musil ($0.925m)
Martin Marincin ($0.870m) /
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled with the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $72,000,000; CAP PAYROLL: $70,123,333; BONUSES: $620,000
CAP SPACE (23-man roster): $2,596,667
do you know what we need in this line up!!!!
more Justin Schultz !!!!
hemsky and horcoff make 5 mill each....they are starting to play supporting roles not leading rolls.
they are the 2 players that unless they start producing better will have to be replaced
salary wise you switch benn type for horcoff type. pay your third line center third line center money and your good to go
hemsky salary for a 5 mil. d-man that can play the 1 - 2 spot and your good to go
i think this year we still dont have to worry about it. but next year we will need to make some moves. if a deal is there this year that improves the team and we can shed the salarys of some of the high priced players not pulling their weight then you do it.
Trading Whitney for J-Bow makes no sense unless the former is actually finished. We're trying to add D here, not run in place.
It does if Calgary is trying to clear cap space.
JBo is signed for two more seasons, while Whitney's deal ends after this season. And to say that we'd be running in place suggests that you think Ryan Whitney and Jay Bouwmeester are similar quality defenseman.
JBo is signed for two more seasons, while Whitney's deal ends after this season. And to say that we'd be running in place suggests that you think Ryan Whitney and Jay Bouwmeester are similar quality defenseman.
If Whitney is healthy, I'd put them in about the same class. But he never is, so it's academic.
I seem to remember one of the reporters saying 4-6 months ago that there might be amnesty buy-outs. Teams that spent to the cap were warned that the cap may be lowered in the cba and they would have to get themselves out of the mess by buyouts or trades.
It looks like this is comming to pass. The make whole debate will be settled with the owners paying most or all of it. One way to accomplish that is to have amnesty buyoouts that don't count against the cap (like the last cba deal).
This fits in exactly with Stauffer's rumour / hint. The obvious target is Jbo as the Flames are close to the cap and have surplus dmen. Very few teams will be lining up to take on that cap hit so the price would be very low. Feaster will have to accept a small return or be forced to buy him out.
Before the summer, Flames broadcasters hinted the askling price was a 2nd round pick and a B grade prospect. Now, the price may be one or the other.
I seem to remember one of the reporters saying 4-6 months ago that there might be amnesty buy-outs. Teams that spent to the cap were warned that the cap may be lowered in the cba and they would have to get themselves out of the mess by buyouts or trades.
It looks like this is comming to pass. The make whole debate will be settled with the owners paying most or all of it. One way to accomplish that is to have amnesty buyoouts that don't count against the cap (like the last cba deal).
This fits in exactly with Stauffer's rumour / hint. The obvious target is Jbo as the Flames are close to the cap and have surplus dmen. Very few teams will be lining up to take on that cap hit so the price would be very low. Feaster will have to accept a small return or be forced to buy him out.
Before the summer, Flames broadcasters hinted the askling price was a 2nd round pick and a B grade prospect. Now, the price may be one or the other.
I'd prefer moving a guy like Hamilton than a 2nd this year.
__________________ Treat Others As You Would Like To Be Treated
The Flames want Bouwmeester. The team isn't looking to give him away. He's a valuable asset.
Feaster didn't go out this summer and spend money in free agency just to trade the team's best defenceman for Hamilton.
That doesn't mean the team isn't fielding offers, but the Flames are in no rush to move a valuable asset.
I think you're confusing valuable asset with good Dman.
Bouwmeester is a good Dman. I'd agree with you that he is likely the flames best Dman. A big guy that can skate and play positionally sound D is great to have.
Bouwmeester's contract is what limits his ability to be a valuable asset. If he didn't carry a cap hit north of 6.5M his name would never come up in trade discussions.
I guess I can say it this way: If given the choice of any Dman from the Flames, I'd choose to have Gio on my team. What he lacks in skill (as compared to JBo), he makes up in contract. He'd be the more valuable asset.
(please do not assume that Gio will be traded or anything like that)
The Flames want Bouwmeester. The team isn't looking to give him away. He's a valuable asset.
Feaster didn't go out this summer and spend money in free agency just to trade the team's best defenceman for Hamilton.
That doesn't mean the team isn't fielding offers, but the Flames are in no rush to move a valuable asset.
Exactly. Feaster thinks that he can compete with his current core, so why would he trade his top defenceman to a provincial rival? Especially when, according to Stauffer, the Oilers wouldn't be parting with anything of significance.
Benn is a pipe dream. He means as much to the Stars as Hall/RNH mean to the Oilers.
So that leaves Luongo.
Last edited by The Bored Man: 11-08-2012 at 01:12 PM.
stuff happens
