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C Mikhail Grigorenko - Quebec Remparts, QMJHL (2012 draft) III

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Old
11-07-2012, 11:36 PM
  #451
Ohashi_Jouzu
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Originally Posted by SergeConstantin74 View Post
To many people, when Grigorenko doesn't have points, he's invisible. At least it means he doesn't create turnovers because creating turnovers makes you visible!

The word invisible means you don't touch the puck and do nothing. We probably didn't see the same game because I saw him playing well defensively and create some things, it just didn't work out like Monday.
Totally agreed here. Grigs has looked just fine, and looks even closer to NHL level prepared than I expected coming into this season.

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11-07-2012, 11:58 PM
  #452
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dang i didnt even know grigs was out there tonight?

Could be a good thing especially in a loss, but he does have that effect

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11-08-2012, 05:56 AM
  #453
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Originally Posted by SergeConstantin74 View Post
Was MacKinnon bored last game? Because he sured looked like it.

Stop trying to find 892894978 reasons. QMJHL played well tonight and Russia didn't.

Just like Monday people over reacted on MacKinnon, tonight they putting too much thought into Grigorenko's game.

Russia didn't handle the forecheck well. They had a tough time moving the puck. Grigorenko got the the puck cleanly with a chance to do something , 3-4 times the whole game.

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11-08-2012, 09:17 AM
  #454
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Originally Posted by Grigorenko View Post
Grigo can dominate a game like nobody else can do, but he can decide to stay in his bed for the game and you won't even notice he played a game. That is what I'm afraid of.
I said this no earlier than yesterday, hours before the game.

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11-08-2012, 10:35 AM
  #455
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I can see why people worry about Grigorenko. He plays an extremely nonchalant game. IMO, the upside is similar to Kopitar, and the downside is Kovalev. The talent is extremely obvious, the compete level is not. He is too talented to ever be a complete bust, but I could see him being the type of player who drives fans crazy. He and Armia are similar that way. They could both be great, or both be the biggest headaches a fanbase could imagine.

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11-08-2012, 01:35 PM
  #456
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I can see why people worry about Grigorenko. He plays an extremely nonchalant game. IMO, the upside is similar to Kopitar, and the downside is Kovalev. The talent is extremely obvious, the compete level is not. He is too talented to ever be a complete bust, but I could see him being the type of player who drives fans crazy. He and Armia are similar that way. They could both be great, or both be the biggest headaches a fanbase could imagine.
Hey if you're downside is peaking at 94 points, you're doing alright!

I think the WJC being in Ufa (bigger ice surface) this year will lend itself agreeably to the style Grigorenko (and for that matter, Russia) wants to play. Because there's more space, it will be harder for their space to be taken away by opposition.

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11-08-2012, 02:02 PM
  #457
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Canada-Russia games will be AWESOME this year at WJC.

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11-08-2012, 02:48 PM
  #458
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Originally Posted by stokes84 View Post
IMO, the upside is similar to Kopitar, and the downside is Kovalev.
I think upside is Thornton, downside is Victor Kozlov

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11-08-2012, 05:27 PM
  #459
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Originally Posted by Flynn84 View Post
I think upside is Thornton, downside is Victor Kozlov
You're on it man! Couldn't have said any better. Same shape, same vision, same puck handling. (Talking about Thornton)
But he's not owning the Junior league like Thornton did.

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11-08-2012, 05:36 PM
  #460
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Originally Posted by Grigorenko View Post
You're on it man! Couldn't have said any better. Same shape, same vision, same puck handling. (Talking about Thornton)
But he's not owning the Junior league like Thornton did.
I think the game has changed so much over the last 10yrs(and continuing to change) that it's almost impossible to put up those kinda numbers... Defensemen are smarter/faster/stronger... Sports development is so advanced. Goalies are so technical/conditioned, systems are so advanced and methodical.

(this applies for all leagues.)

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11-08-2012, 05:49 PM
  #461
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Originally Posted by Grigorenko View Post
You're on it man! Couldn't have said any better. Same shape, same vision, same puck handling. (Talking about Thornton)
But he's not owning the Junior league like Thornton did.
How so? What kind of points did Thornton put up for 2ppg to not be considered "owning"? I'm just not familiar with his pre-NHL days.

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11-08-2012, 05:58 PM
  #462
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I think the game has changed so much over the last 10yrs(and continuing to change) that it's almost impossible to put up those kinda numbers... Defensemen are smarter/faster/stronger... Sports development is so advanced. Goalies are so technical/conditioned, systems are so advanced and methodical.

(this applies for all leagues.)
I agree with you on this point. Game changed a lot, but Grigorenko wouldn't have put almost 40 points more in the old system, or Thornton wouldn't put less than an 100 points in the OHL with the actual system. And the OHL level has always been a little bit better than the Q one, but that's my personal opinion right there.

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11-08-2012, 06:00 PM
  #463
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How so? What kind of points did Thornton put up for 2ppg to not be considered "owning"? I'm just not familiar with his pre-NHL days.
I'm not sure if you get my point right, or I'm not getting yours correctly, but I just said that Thornton WAS owning the league..?

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11-08-2012, 06:04 PM
  #464
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Originally Posted by wally31 View Post
I think the game has changed so much over the last 10yrs(and continuing to change) that it's almost impossible to put up those kinda numbers... Defensemen are smarter/faster/stronger... Sports development is so advanced. Goalies are so technical/conditioned, systems are so advanced and methodical.

(this applies for all leagues.)
But Patrick Kane put up even more points than Thornton

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11-08-2012, 06:28 PM
  #465
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But Patrick Kane put up even more points than Thornton
Can name others too. Tavares (2 PPG at 16), Gagner (2,2 PPG, lol?).

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11-08-2012, 06:54 PM
  #466
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http://www.journaldequebec.com/2012/...lle-impression

Grigorenko was disappointed because he didn't play much. 12 minutes in the first game and 8 minutes in the second. He preferred last year when he was used often.

It might explain why some people thought he was invisible. 8 minutes isn't enough for the best players. Usually, the more they play, the more they excel.

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11-08-2012, 07:02 PM
  #467
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SergeConstantin74 View Post
http://www.journaldequebec.com/2012/...lle-impression

Grigorenko was disappointed because he didn't play much. 12 minutes in the first game and 8 minutes in the second. He preferred last year when he was used often.

It might explain why some people thought he was invisible. 8 minutes isn't enough for the best players. Usually, the more they play, the more they excel.
8 minutes is not near enough time to find your groove out there. Especially when it takes a couple of shifts to get your feet under you.

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11-08-2012, 08:14 PM
  #468
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Originally Posted by SergeConstantin74 View Post
http://www.journaldequebec.com/2012/...lle-impression

Grigorenko was disappointed because he didn't play much. 12 minutes in the first game and 8 minutes in the second. He preferred last year when he was used often.

It might explain why some people thought he was invisible. 8 minutes isn't enough for the best players. Usually, the more they play, the more they excel.
I didn't know that though. Thanks for the feed

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11-08-2012, 09:32 PM
  #469
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Originally Posted by SergeConstantin74 View Post
http://www.journaldequebec.com/2012/...lle-impression

Grigorenko was disappointed because he didn't play much. 12 minutes in the first game and 8 minutes in the second. He preferred last year when he was used often.

It might explain why some people thought he was invisible. 8 minutes isn't enough for the best players. Usually, the more they play, the more they excel.
Russian coaches are real weirdos.

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11-08-2012, 09:58 PM
  #470
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Russian coaches are real weirdos.
Varnakov***

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11-09-2012, 03:59 AM
  #471
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Russian coaches are real weirdos.
He needs to get used to it, his NHL coach is just as useless.

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11-09-2012, 09:12 AM
  #472
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StrappingYoungChad View Post
Hey if you're downside is peaking at 94 points, you're doing alright!

I think the WJC being in Ufa (bigger ice surface) this year will lend itself agreeably to the style Grigorenko (and for that matter, Russia) wants to play. Because there's more space, it will be harder for their space to be taken away by opposition.
I meant that I have no doubt that he will put up big points, but he may be a player that people think they can't win with, similar to Kovalev, Semin, or even Yashin. Hopefully it won't turn out that way, but to me, this is his worst case scenario. Of course, he could just fall flat on his face, but I find that highly unlikely given his amazing skill set.

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11-09-2012, 09:30 AM
  #473
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He needs to get used to it, his NHL coach is just as useless.
Sad but true. At least Ruff gives his offensive players more than 8 minutes though. (Vanek usually gets 15-16 ES minutes + 1st PP time.)

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11-09-2012, 01:14 PM
  #474
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Man, if this is the Grigorenko we see in the NHL, in the future, I want to trade him.
I mean, if only players developed AFTER Juniors then maybe he might become something...

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11-09-2012, 02:51 PM
  #475
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Originally Posted by Grigorenko View Post
Can name others too. Tavares (2 PPG at 16), Gagner (2,2 PPG, lol?).
norm vs exception.

(I think you know that though...)

Of course there will be players now/future that put up huge numbers, but comparing top results 20yrs ago to the last few years we see quite a significant difference....

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