HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > Other Leagues > Canadian Junior Hockey > OHL

*OFFICIAL* Kitchener Rangers 2012-13 Season Thread

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
11-07-2012, 03:18 PM
  #776
Ward Cornell
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,190
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by CharlieGirl View Post
I really wish I knew why that was. Every game I've seen Young play, he's done well, worked hard, and not made any glaring errors. The kid has been handled very poorly from the get go, as far as I'm concerned.
Same here....one of my life's greatest mysteries! (I guess I'm lucky at that!)
Everytime JY been playing IMHO he's always earned more icetime instead of sitting in the stands!

Ward Cornell is offline  
Old
11-07-2012, 03:19 PM
  #777
ORYX
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,467
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by CharlieGirl View Post
I really wish I knew why that was. Every game I've seen Young play, he's done well, worked hard, and not made any glaring errors. The kid has been handled very poorly from the get go, as far as I'm concerned.
uh oh, not this conversation again

I think we all agree that he was mismanaged.

He is still available for call up in the event he is injured as far as I know, or was he waived through the entire league?

Im not sure how that works, whether the Rangers still have retained his services, or if they waived him and cut ties. Can anyone confirm?

ORYX is offline  
Old
11-07-2012, 03:21 PM
  #778
Ward Cornell
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,190
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ORYX View Post
uh oh, not this conversation again

I think we all agree that he was mismanaged.

He is still available for call up in the event he is injured as far as I know, or was he waived through the entire league?

Im not sure how that works, whether the Rangers still have retained his services, or if they waived him and cut ties. Can anyone confirm?

Rangers assigned him down to the Dutchies.

Ward Cornell is offline  
Old
11-07-2012, 04:12 PM
  #779
MetalheadPenguinsFan
Embrace The Hate!!!
 
MetalheadPenguinsFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Kitchener, Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 21,425
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by BenchedGuy View Post
the blue section does have more room and the elvstor. would be perfect for MPF. And there really isnt a bad seat in the house. Also in the blues, the beer vendor comes to you in the seats!
Yeah I am curious about seats in that new blue section even if just to try for 1 game. How good is the view though? My eyesight sucks.

Also, does the elevator take you up to the blue section??? And what would I do after the game if I'm sitting in blue seats??? Is there an elevator around there I can just hop into to go down to the exits??? Or would I need to go down any stairs/stairs without railings afterwards?

MetalheadPenguinsFan is offline  
Old
11-07-2012, 07:01 PM
  #780
CharlieGirl
Registered User
 
CharlieGirl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Kitchener, ON
Country: Canada
Posts: 29,710
vCash: 500
The elevator takes you to the blue section from the main concourse and then there is the elevator you took last night to take you to the street level. If you take the Rangers Express from city hall or one of the restaurants, I'm not sure where the bus drops you off/picks you up.

CharlieGirl is offline  
Old
11-07-2012, 11:27 PM
  #781
EvenSteven
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 786
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ORYX View Post
I'm not going to bash you for your comment, everyone is entitled to their own opinion, so please dont take my comments as such.

I was one who felt Fanelli deserved the C. Was it because he got injured and returned? If you wanted to write a one line novel about why, then yes you could go ahead and say that.

In reality, the reason I felt (and I believe I speak for the majority of those who also felt he deserved the C) is not simply because he was injured and came back, it is because he has a never quit attitude. This is a young man that was on NHL radar, and had his dream stripped from his hands, nearly died before our very eyes on the ice. What did he do about that? He could have walked away from hockey, like his parents and doctors wanted, he could have used the woe me card, he could have blamed it all on Mike Liambas.

Instead you have at the time, a 16 year old kid who when faced with adversity, accepted his fate and fought. He didnt give up the dream he was chasing, not when he was down on the ice, and not for the year + recovery, which he was being told the entire time hockey was no longer an option. What else did he do? He started a foundation to promote the effects of head trauma, to help OTHERS who experience similar situations, to give back to the very hockey community that supported him through he fight.

He returned to hockey, knowing he didnt have a free pass and worked his way back into the line-up.

He possesses an experience and drive for the game of hockey which no other on this team possesses. He had his dream taken away, and he stood up and reclaimed it.

He is an excellent teammate by all accounts, an excellent community ambassador for the Kitchener Rangers, and I've never met a person with a bad thing to say of him. His teammates look up to him, and have shed tears with and for him.

He may not be the best player on the ice, but he certainly has the biggest heart. A captain in my eyes shouldnt be picked on skill, but on merit. If youre a 3rd pairing defender but you lead by example, teammates look up to you, you fight every shift you're on the ice, and have stared adversity in the eyes, then yes you're captain material.

Ben Fanelli was not considered because he simply got hurt and returned, he was considered because the of the fine qualities of a leader that he displays on a daily basis, over the past 3 years in a return to pursue the dream he shares with his teammates. He never gave up on his team.

I will not question Murphy's leadership abilities, I am not a member of the team, I do not see how he interacts in the room, the words he says on the bench. All I can see is his lacksidasical play on the ice, which as a fan, are less then inspiring. He is the offensive leader of this team. My worry is perhaps asking him to be the Captain in addition to this is too much for him.

ORYX, I stand by my post. We'll have to agree to disagree.

But as others have said on here, this was a very good post. Thanks for it.

EvenSteven is offline  
Old
11-07-2012, 11:49 PM
  #782
EvenSteven
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 786
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ORYX View Post
Well Palazzese is the 1b that can step in no problem and deliver quality minutes. He would also be the starter next season with Moylan as the backup.

IMO, keep Palazzese.
Unfortunately, Spott hasn't had much luck dealing veteran goalies during the season. He held onto Unice way too long and once his value went through the floor, got next to nothing for him. He got way below market value for Mavic Parks who was then dealt the following off season by Barrie to Saginaw for assets including one Mark Scheiffle.

Trying to deal a veteran goalie during the season is probably the hardest asset to get fair market value for. Most contending teams are set in goal and the rebuilding teams don't need him.

The best time to deal one is the off season (unless you are dealing a Steve Mason and you can demand the farm for him). Spott couldn't deal Frankie in the past off season until Gibson was 100% returned to Kitchener, and by then, most teams were set in net. Therefore, unless some contender loses their #1 guy to season ending injury, we won't get market value for him because anyone dealing for him will likely only want him as insurance - as Barrie did with Parks.

So I also say don't deal him. He's more valuable to us right here. If Spott decides to really go for it and deal the young assets he'd need to, to acquire a couple high end guys the way the Knights did last year (Watson/McKegg), and goes into next year as a rebuilding year, then I'd explore dealing Frankie next off season when his value would go back up again, as Parks' value did. Moylan would then be the #1 guy. Remember, it would be a rebuilding year and Moylan would be 18.

EvenSteven is offline  
Old
11-07-2012, 11:51 PM
  #783
EvenSteven
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 786
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tim Wallach View Post
Stewart played a shift early in the game, looked completely lost, got scored on and went off. He was back out just two minutes later with the same forward line as well (Schmalz-Meighan-Llewellyn) and fared better this time. But I believe that was his last shift for the night. I could be wrong, but I didn't see him after those two shifts in the first.
I'm pretty sure Stewart was on for a goal for on Tuesday night. Could have sworn I saw him on celebrating with the guys.

EvenSteven is offline  
Old
11-07-2012, 11:54 PM
  #784
EvenSteven
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 786
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ward Cornell View Post
You're correct, I remember saying to my friend when I saw Stewart out with two 16 year old forwards that it was a recipe for disaster.
IMHO if you want to give a rookie dman some limited minutes at least send him out with experienced forwards.

That would be nice but usually when our experienced forwards are on the ice, so are the opposition's which could lead to a rookie d-man like Stewart getting his jock strap handed to him.

Most often, when our 4th line is out there, so is the other team's.

EvenSteven is offline  
Old
11-08-2012, 12:12 AM
  #785
EvenSteven
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 786
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ORYX View Post
I see Gilbert being the first one asked for, but he has, for me anyways, played himself into a position as close to untouchable as you can get.

Genovese unfortunately is probably the d-man with the least trade value currently.

I agree, but if we are going to be trying to acquire high end players betwen now and the deadline the d-man they'll ask for 1st is Gilbert and the forward they'll want is Bailey.

If we get into a bidding war for, say, Trochek, Spott may offer a package of Sterk and/or Genovese and 2 or 3 picks between rounds 4 and 6. Because Spott can't sweeten that deal because our cupboard is almost empty of high picks, Saginaw may reply that to complete the deal, Spott has to turn Sterk into Bailey or Pederson and/or Genovese into Gilbert.

Other teams may be able to get away with sending their vertions of Genovese and/or Sterk because they can also send 2 or 3 second rounders.

Whatever happens, if Spott is going to really make noise leading up to the deadline, it's going to take one or more young, popular players leaving town. (Kadri/Varone/Tarasuk come to mind)

EvenSteven is offline  
Old
11-08-2012, 12:20 AM
  #786
EvenSteven
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 786
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ward Cornell View Post
Rangers assigned him down to the Dutchies.
Speaking of the Dutchies, I have a buddy who follows the JrB loop religiously and he says that Young has been the Dutchies best defensman and logs huge icetime. Also, Ty Learn is a player we'll love next year.

But the guy who opened his eyes the most was Grant. He is on a torrid goal scoring pace and (I even can't believe I'm going to say this) but I think Spott has to give him one last shot at a spot on this team. If he can come up here and keep putting up points, it would allow Spott more options come deadline time if a guy like Grant could fill a hole left by an outgoing young forward.

I know it's only JrB, but could he be a late bloomer?

EvenSteven is offline  
Old
11-08-2012, 07:14 AM
  #787
ORYX
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,467
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by EvenSteven View Post
I agree, but if we are going to be trying to acquire high end players betwen now and the deadline the d-man they'll ask for 1st is Gilbert and the forward they'll want is Bailey.

If we get into a bidding war for, say, Trochek, Spott may offer a package of Sterk and/or Genovese and 2 or 3 picks between rounds 4 and 6. Because Spott can't sweeten that deal because our cupboard is almost empty of high picks, Saginaw may reply that to complete the deal, Spott has to turn Sterk into Bailey or Pederson and/or Genovese into Gilbert.

Other teams may be able to get away with sending their vertions of Genovese and/or Sterk because they can also send 2 or 3 second rounders.

Whatever happens, if Spott is going to really make noise leading up to the deadline, it's going to take one or more young, popular players leaving town. (Kadri/Varone/Tarasuk come to mind)
I agree, though Im not going to be happy with Gilbert or Bailey getting traded. These will be two very dynamic players in this league as early as the deadline, let alone next season.

I understand you give to get, my current standing on what needs to be added may be different then others, personally I do not see the need for a Trocheck, particularly at the anticipated price. I see more value in a player like Cody Ross.

The Rangers already have 3 first line player, no sense going out getting another. They can afford to acquire a lesser player suited for the 2nd line, and at a fraction of the cost.

ORYX is offline  
Old
11-08-2012, 08:23 AM
  #788
Tim Wallach
Registered User
 
Tim Wallach's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Kitchener, Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,200
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by EvenSteven View Post
I'm pretty sure Stewart was on for a goal for on Tuesday night. Could have sworn I saw him on celebrating with the guys.
That may be the case. I didn't notice that, but it's quite possible. Either way, I think his impact was quite limited.

Tim Wallach is offline  
Old
11-08-2012, 05:38 PM
  #789
CharlieGirl
Registered User
 
CharlieGirl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Kitchener, ON
Country: Canada
Posts: 29,710
vCash: 500
Want. Badly.


CharlieGirl is offline  
Old
11-08-2012, 05:47 PM
  #790
Jack Daniels
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 194
vCash: 500
Do you have to be at the game to bid?

Jack Daniels is offline  
Old
11-08-2012, 07:18 PM
  #791
EvenSteven
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 786
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack Daniels View Post
Do you have to be at the game to bid?
They had on-line bidding in the past but I thought Steve B. said the other night on the Rogers telecast that the bidding would be brought back into the Aud outside the subscribers lounge only.


Last edited by EvenSteven: 11-08-2012 at 07:45 PM.
EvenSteven is offline  
Old
11-08-2012, 07:22 PM
  #792
EvenSteven
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 786
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tim Wallach View Post
That may be the case. I didn't notice that, but it's quite possible. Either way, I think his impact was quite limited.

That's right. Limited it was. It sucks when guys like this dress and get next to no icetime. Problem is though, that when the games are tight, guys like this tend to ride the pines almost exclusively. It would be nice to get a comfortable lead once in a while in games when these guys dress, so they'll see more ice.

Tough to get a read on them. You almost forget they're in the lineup.

EvenSteven is offline  
Old
11-08-2012, 07:26 PM
  #793
EvenSteven
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 786
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ORYX View Post
I agree, though Im not going to be happy with Gilbert or Bailey getting traded. These will be two very dynamic players in this league as early as the deadline, let alone next season.

I understand you give to get, my current standing on what needs to be added may be different then others, personally I do not see the need for a Trocheck, particularly at the anticipated price. I see more value in a player like Cody Ross.

The Rangers already have 3 first line player, no sense going out getting another. They can afford to acquire a lesser player suited for the 2nd line, and at a fraction of the cost.
I was just using Trochek as an example. He was the first guy that came to mind on a bottom feeding team.

Ideally, for the same cost of a Trochek, we may be able to acquire that genuine #2 d-man to play beside Murphy and a good veteran winger for the 3rd line who could return next year as an OA (Last year, I was asking for Shoenmakers or Brace from Missy).

EvenSteven is offline  
Old
11-08-2012, 07:30 PM
  #794
EvenSteven
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 786
vCash: 500
On Rangersrush under the Kit/Missy game thread, check out the link to the demolition of an opponant compliments of Jacob Trouba.

They said he got 5 and a game for the hit and therefore, would miss the next game under their rules. Not sure if there will be a review as I'm not sure of how it goes at that level. To me, this was a classic Scott Stevens type hit. Looked to be a upper arm/shoulder to the head.

But I know what would have happened here. That hit gets him 15 games minimum in Dave Branch's OHL. Could the severity of suspensions in the OHL be a reason Trouba didn't report to this league? He is a very physical player.


Last edited by EvenSteven: 11-08-2012 at 07:45 PM.
EvenSteven is offline  
Old
11-08-2012, 08:58 PM
  #795
Faidh ar Rud Eigin
Modhnóirí Claonta
 
Faidh ar Rud Eigin's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Transcendent
Country: Guernsey
Posts: 15,452
vCash: 500
The NCAA isn't exactly easy on discipline either. Can't see that being a reason.

Faidh ar Rud Eigin is offline  
Old
11-08-2012, 09:17 PM
  #796
Ward Cornell
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,190
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Faidh ar Rud Eigin View Post
The NCAA isn't exactly easy on discipline either. Can't see that being a reason.
With concussions at the forefront in every sport and especially hockey. Not only does Branch try to keep player safety in mind but with the NCAA trying to snatch kids away,
he also needs to show the parents that the OHL does have the players safety (and education) at mind as much as the NCAA.

Ward Cornell is offline  
Old
11-09-2012, 09:54 AM
  #797
ORYX
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,467
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by EvenSteven View Post
I was just using Trochek as an example. He was the first guy that came to mind on a bottom feeding team.

Ideally, for the same cost of a Trochek, we may be able to acquire that genuine #2 d-man to play beside Murphy and a good veteran winger for the 3rd line who could return next year as an OA (Last year, I was asking for Shoenmakers or Brace from Missy).
I understand. I too mentioned Trocheck not too long ago.

A player that I like the way he plays but am shy about is Graovac in Ottawa. Not sure if he'll keep his current torid pace, and you can bet the 67's will be looking to sell high.

Realistically the Rangers have 4 players who will/should return for an O/A year, Ming, Thomson, Fanelli, Palazzese. Also potentials (just by birth year alone) are Murphy, Reider, Puempel, Gibson).

The only player out of those 4 which I wouldnt wnt back is Ming (if I had to pick between them).

Any players brought in at this point, must either be younger then 93's or we have to be comfortable paying the price of a half season rental.

Im still holding out hope that AC will be returned, but I think that only happens if these current CBA negotiations falls flat on their face for the remainder of November. They'll have to find him ice time at that point, and whether they like it or not, he'd going to get it in Kitchener.

If he returns, then I'd be more willing to go for it (i dont think he comes back unless the NHL season is back) in the sense that I'd be willing to lose Gilbert and Bailey if it meant the likes of Hamilton and Strome/Ritchie made their way to town (or other top flight players)

Thomson - Strome - Reider
Puempel - Faksa - Ming
Pedersen - Sterk - Marcantuoni
Meighan - Alberga - Llewellyn
ex - Schmalz

Murphy - Hamilton
McEneny - Iafrate
Fanelli - Genovese

ORYX is offline  
Old
11-09-2012, 01:10 PM
  #798
EvenSteven
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 786
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ORYX View Post
Realistically the Rangers have 4 players who will/should return for an O/A year, Ming, Thomson, Fanelli, Palazzese. Also potentials (just by birth year alone) are Murphy, Reider, Puempel, Gibson).

The only player out of those 4 which I wouldnt wnt back is Ming (if I had to pick between them).

Any players brought in at this point, must either be younger then 93's or we have to be comfortable paying the price of a half season rental.
Yes, I agree those 4 are the realistic OA returnees. Who we keep will depend a lot on what kind of team we'll be next year. If Spott buys himself a couple high end guys, like the two you've mentioned, we'll have to send multiple high end young players/picks the other way. Remember, this is Marty Williamson we're talking about here. When running Barrie, he gave up multiple high end assets (including Strome) to get Alex Pietrangelo. He'd want double that return for both Hamilton and Strome - two of the elite players this year. Because we only have one 2nd rounder this side of 2018, I'd bet they would cost us the whole '95 line plus maybe Gilbert. If that deal gets done, I'd try and get another OA forward like Ross in Saginaw.


We'd look like this (with a return of AC):

Thomson / Strome / Rieder
Puempel / Faksa / Marcantuoni
Ross / Crescenzi / Alberga
Schmalz / Meighan / Ming
Llewellyn / Grant(experienced depth to add for the playoff run)

Murphy / Hamilton
Iafrate / McEneny
Fanelli / Genovese
Stewart / Young(see Grant)

Gibson
Palazzese

Looks like wins to me! Anyone who wants to complain about what we gave up, just direct their attention to the new banner(s) we'd have hanging in the rafters! IMO, league/Memorial Cup banners trump the loss of future assets!



If were to do the above, that would make us a rebuilding team next year. Therefore, Thomson and Frankie (unless he's dealt this year) would be prime OA's to deal for young players/high picks to restock the cupboard, so to speak. We'd then go with Moylan as the #1. As a drafted player though, it wouldn't surpise me to see Thomson go the way Randell and AC did (start the year in the pros)

Ming and Fanelli wouldn't bring much return but would be good guys to have as OA mentors on a rebuilding team. Then, during next season, if we are low in the standings, it would be time to see what the high end graduating '94's Faksa, Marcantuoni, McEneny, would bring at that deadline.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ORYX View Post
Im still holding out hope that AC will be returned, but I think that only happens if these current CBA negotiations falls flat on their face for the remainder of November. They'll have to find him ice time at that point, and whether they like it or not, he'd going to get it in Kitchener.

If he returns, then I'd be more willing to go for it (i dont think he comes back unless the NHL season is back) in the sense that I'd be willing to lose Gilbert and Bailey if it meant the likes of Hamilton and Strome/Ritchie made their way to town (or other top flight players)

Thomson - Strome - Reider
Puempel - Faksa - Ming
Pedersen - Sterk - Marcantuoni
Meighan - Alberga - Llewellyn
ex - Schmalz

Murphy - Hamilton
McEneny - Iafrate
Fanelli - Genovese
I agree. No NHL season = AC is returned.

But, even if there is an NHL season, AC still might come back. Currently there are 15 active forwards who have played games on the Marlies roster. That means 3 healthy scatches every night. That does not include Matt Frattin who was assigned to the Marlies but is out with injury. That makes AC the 17th ranked forward with the Marlies. Even if four of those guys make the Leafs, AC is still the odd man out.

Also, the fact the Leafs found work in the ECHL for Carrick and Brennan, the other forwards cut from the Marlies, ahead of AC makes me think they are ahead of him too. They'd be in game shape for any callup.

It's November 9th and, to my knowledge, AC is the only healthy player in the Leafs system who hasn't played a game of hockey yet. This makes no sense to me. If AC was a shoe in to play pro this year, you'd think they'd make some room for him somewhere.

But we are talking about the Leafs.

EvenSteven is offline  
Old
11-09-2012, 01:13 PM
  #799
Ward Cornell
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,190
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by EvenSteven View Post
It's November 9th and, to my knowledge, AC is the only healthy player in the Leafs system who hasn't played a game of hockey yet. This makes no sense to me. If AC was a shoe in to play pro this year, you'd think they'd make some room for him somewhere.

But we are talking about the Leafs.
Tonight both Colbourne and Kadri are scratched for the Marlies.
Lets see if AC is dressed or not.

* edited to add.....another improvement to the roster at no expense is a player some are pimping for the WJHC that
the Rangers hold his rights to and would be a possible OA next season....Matthew Peca!
http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/p...php?pid=142128


Last edited by Ward Cornell: 11-09-2012 at 04:32 PM.
Ward Cornell is offline  
Old
11-11-2012, 07:50 PM
  #800
Ward Cornell
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,190
vCash: 500
Well Crescenzi has been sent down to the ECHL with San Francisco. Let's see how much ictime he gets with another NHL teams ECHL franchise.
I assume they will take care of their own first before another teams.


Here's the latest via Josh Browns blog on the possible trading of Frankie
Quote:
"Teams have been calling about Palazzese, who owns a 2-2-1-1 record, 1.99 GAA and .932 save percentage.

"As I said to Frank, I’m not looking to trade Frank Palazzese. I don’t want to. I do want to help him out and have the opportunity to play in the National Hockey League," said Spott.

"Frank is going to be back in junior no matter what next year, as far as I can see. It gives us a nice tandem next year with Frank and Jack (Moylan).

"Should I ever elect to move Frank it’s going to have to make a lot of sense for the hockey club. If it ever were to happen it would be after the world juniors. At this point I don’t foresee that."
^^ It's not much different from what has been discussed.
It's also letting other teams know if they want one of the leagues best goalies for 1 1/2 season that they will need to really step up to the plate.

Ward Cornell is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:51 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.