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2012-13 Lockout Discussion Part VI: The "What Comes Before Square One?" Edition

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Old
11-09-2012, 05:55 PM
  #526
Blackhawkswincup
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RangerBoy View Post
https://twitter.com/tpanotchCSN/stat...43684015550464

Its their fault. They broke the union last time. The PA changed leadership 3 times in how many years. The NHL ended up with Fehr. You get what you deserve. July 13 proposal galvanized the players.
The Union "Never play with cap" broke themselves ,, They ended up taking a deal that was worse then the one's NHL offered in 04

As for the leadership ,, NHL had a good working relationship with Kelly developing but Lindros/Hardliners coup got him removed because of it (Cant be on good terms with NHL as that is bad somehow)

Fehr is in place because the hardliners want revenge for 04-05 at all cost ,,, Not because they want a deal and to play hockey

NHL is lost for 12-13 and likely 13-14 as Fehr and hardliners have brainwashed the majority of NHLPA into actually thinking they will actually win this fight

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11-09-2012, 06:05 PM
  #527
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Russo: Owners are willing to pay all current contracts in full, in exchange for 50/50 in year 1.

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In exchange for going to 50/50 immediately, players would have the reduced part of their salaries (12.3 percent) deferred one or two years, “and the owners will pay them back, plus interest, and it would not go against their share and the league is guaranteeing it no matter where the revenue of the league goes,” said one of the sources.

In Year 1, players’ salaries would be reduced about $150 million. The players who have their salaries reduced would get every cent back in a lump payment in Year 2, the source says, plus interest. In Year 2, the players’ salaries would be reduced $61 million. Those players would get that money back plus interest in a lump payment in Year 3, the source says
.

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11-09-2012, 06:22 PM
  #528
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackhawkswincup View Post
NHL is lost for 12-13 and likely 13-14
Oh the drama

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11-09-2012, 06:24 PM
  #529
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How is that better for the owners than a steady drop to 50/50 starting at say 53, 52, 51, 50?

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11-09-2012, 06:28 PM
  #530
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Quote:
Originally Posted by -31- View Post
Oh the drama
^
Remember the White Sox vs Expos World Series in 1994?

Oh yeah it didn't happen because of Fehr and his idiotic union

Fehr wants the cap gone and he will go to war to get it ,, NHLPA has shown absolutely no willingness to actually come to an agreement and save this season

The offer will be much worse after this season is cancelled in a few months and the IQ of the NHLPA shows they aren't smart enough to stop this destruction before its too late. They are mindless sheep

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11-09-2012, 06:30 PM
  #531
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Fehr asking for 100% of salaries for a shortened season is the most stupid thing anyone has asked for so far.

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11-09-2012, 06:31 PM
  #532
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Originally Posted by kaneone View Post
Fehr asking for 100% of salaries for a shortened season is the most stupid thing anyone has asked for so far.
Where did you hear that?

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11-09-2012, 06:32 PM
  #533
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Originally Posted by kaneone View Post
Fehr asking for 100% of salaries for a shortened season is the most stupid thing anyone has asked for so far.
I'm not quite understanding.

He is asking for the rate of salary to stay the same. He is not asking for payment despite of time lost.

Those checks are gone, nothing he can do about that.

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11-09-2012, 06:37 PM
  #534
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Quote:
source: Jacobs missed last 2 meetings and rejoined today; tone of the discussions changed. coincidence?
https://twitter.com/tpanotchCSN/stat...61914947952640

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Can confirm @NHL has put $211 into make whole provision. Seems like a big step. Will see how @NHLPA feels
https://twitter.com/LouisJean_TVA/st...61777563516928

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11-09-2012, 06:39 PM
  #535
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Oh, that's what I thought they were asking for. If not, my bad.

adater ‏@adater
Talked to NHL management person who says Fehr wants 100% of 2012-13 salaries even in shortened season. If true, that's out of line. (1)

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11-09-2012, 06:43 PM
  #536
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackhawkswincup View Post
^
Remember the White Sox vs Expos World Series in 1994?

Oh yeah it didn't happen because of Fehr and his idiotic union

Fehr wants the cap gone and he will go to war to get it ,, NHLPA has shown absolutely no willingness to actually come to an agreement and save this season

The offer will be much worse after this season is cancelled in a few months and the IQ of the NHLPA shows they aren't smart enough to stop this destruction before its too late. They are mindless sheep
Well the White Sox were 2nd in the AL, and had two teams in their division within 4 games of them with 50 games left to play. A little presumptuous to declare them the AL champs.

Just like its presumptuous to declare two seasons lost on November 9th.

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11-09-2012, 06:46 PM
  #537
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@FriedgeHNIC: This is going to be a mess tonight. Accusation that Fehr withheld NHL's offer from PA is very serious. Would expect that to be addressed...

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11-09-2012, 06:48 PM
  #538
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Quote:
Originally Posted by -31- View Post
Well the White Sox were 2nd in the AL, and had two teams in their division within 4 games of them with 50 games left to play. A little presumptuous to declare them the AL champs.

Just like its presumptuous to declare two seasons lost on November 9th.
1993 ALCS loss was White Sox learning curve ,, They were primed for run to WS

Fehr nearly killed MLB ,, I expect far worse damange done to NHL before his reign ends

NHL wont have a cheaters duel to save them either like MLB

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Old
11-09-2012, 06:49 PM
  #539
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackhawkswincup View Post
The Union "Never play with cap" broke themselves ,, They ended up taking a deal that was worse then the one's NHL offered in 04

As for the leadership ,, NHL had a good working relationship with Kelly developing but Lindros/Hardliners coup got him removed because of it (Cant be on good terms with NHL as that is bad somehow)

Fehr is in place because the hardliners want revenge for 04-05 at all cost ,,, Not because they want a deal and to play hockey

NHL is lost for 12-13 and likely 13-14 as Fehr and hardliners have brainwashed the majority of NHLPA into actually thinking they will actually win this fight
Bettman is 3 for 3 in lockouts. Has any sport lost as many games as the NHL has with 3 lockouts?

The players ended up with younger free agency and they gained 1 year in salary arbitration in exchange for taking the cap. Now management wants to take away those gains on top of the players agreeing to go from 57% to 50%-50%.

Fehr negotiated 2 CBAs in 2002 and 2006 in MLB without any games being lost. You can't say the same about Gary and his NHL which is arrogant enough to believe the fans will continue returning after shutting down the sport for the 3rd time over labor issues. The stupid sheep will flock back. The NHL are killing themselves with this stupid lockout.

Quote:
Every day the lockout continues, the NHL dies a small death. Not a news flash, but even the most committed fans are fed up. Insanity.
https://twitter.com/NYP_Brooksie/sta...53016735850496

When dealing with Bettman,Batterman and Jacobs,the players were right in bringing in a hired gun. Fehr is driving the NHL crazy. Good. Bettman,Batterman and Jacobs deserve it. If the NHL wants to flush a $3.3B down the toilet,do it. The lousy hypocrites.

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11-09-2012, 06:49 PM
  #540
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My view:

Another week same story... Thoughts.

1)Everyone should stop looking for someone to blame.

2)The owners aren't cowering to Fehr. In truth they couldn't care less who is negotiating for the PA. The players don't fear Bettman

3)I still believe that Early November is too early to settle this lockout. Too little money is lost. Each side is looking for the other side to blink. November never did it for me.

4)If the sides really completely broke off talks they won't meet for weeks. They each will need to regroup and cool off.

5)I still believe that we are looking at a mid DEcember start to the preseason. If the next talks fail then the season really is toast. That's when each side will be staring into the abyss and looking to see if anyone is staring back at them.

6)I feel for the marginal players and the team's supporting personnel more than the fans.

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11-09-2012, 06:51 PM
  #541
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kaneone View Post
Oh, that's what I thought they were asking for. If not, my bad.

adater ‏@adater
Talked to NHL management person who says Fehr wants 100% of 2012-13 salaries even in shortened season. If true, that's out of line. (1)
Actually . . .

Quote:
Larry Brooks ‏@NYP_Brooksie

Told that PA proposed that players get last year's share plus 5 pct this yr regardless of schedule length/actual revenue...
Quote:
Larry Brooks ‏@NYP_Brooksie

Last year's share was 1.883B...plus 5 pct would be $1.977B...would likely eat 65-67 pct of revenue in 66-68 game season.
If Brooks is correct, and considering how pro-player he is, one has to believe he is, this is absolutely mind boggling. Donald Fehr is doing a hell of a job turning public sentiment against the players.

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11-09-2012, 06:52 PM
  #542
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The NHL is assuming the fans are just going to come back because "they always do". Honestly after the last lock out, I didnt' even care about hockey anymore. I didn't start watching again until last year. I won't lie I have missed watching the Rangers, but I absolutely can do with out with MLB, NFL and the NBA as well as college basketball.

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11-09-2012, 06:52 PM
  #543
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wait a minute Fehr wants more than what they originally asked for now?

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11-09-2012, 06:54 PM
  #544
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lundsanity30 View Post
The NHL is assuming the fans are just going to come back because "they always do". Honestly after the last lock out, I didnt' even care about hockey anymore. I didn't start watching again until last year. I won't lie I have missed watching the Rangers, but I absolutely can do with out with MLB, NFL and the NBA as well as college basketball.
I hate the NHL but love the Rangers. The Rangers will bring me back again.

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Old
11-09-2012, 06:55 PM
  #545
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Originally Posted by Tortorella View Post
I hate the NHL but love the Rangers. The Rangers will bring me back again.
I'm a bigger Yankee and Giants fan then the Rangers, but I will miss the Rangers, but as I said, I can do with out them. I'm fed up with Bettman and Fehr and going through this **** every so many years.

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11-09-2012, 06:56 PM
  #546
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Originally Posted by azrok22 View Post
Actually . . .





If Brooks is correct, and considering how pro-player he is, one has to believe he is, this is absolutely mind boggling. Donald Fehr is doing a hell of a job turning public sentiment against the players.
Fehrs position has always been that the league has has record revenues so why should the players give up a nickel. Absurd as it is. He doesn't differentiate between revenue and profits and has the players brainwashed.

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11-09-2012, 06:56 PM
  #547
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Originally Posted by Lundsanity30 View Post
wait a minute Fehr wants more than what they originally asked for now?
According to Brooks.

When Larry Brooks begins posting negatively about the NHLPA, things must have reached critical levels of insanity.

I was firmly in favor of the players' cause--especially after the asinine original offer the NHL proffered. But the NHLA has really come off as out of touch with reality as things have progressed.

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11-09-2012, 06:58 PM
  #548
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Still seems kinda hard to get a grip on. The NHLPA could be frustrating and angering the NHL but could also still be ready to budge on some issues rather than let talks go down in flames, and they're just waiting for the right time to budge

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Old
11-09-2012, 07:00 PM
  #549
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so the owners are willing to honor the contracts if the players would do 50/50 starting in year 1 and then being paid back over the next few years? What the hell is wrong with that?

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11-09-2012, 07:07 PM
  #550
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Elliotte Friedman ‏@FriedgeHNIC

NHL is very frustrated by Fehr...they are going after him. The gloves are off now.

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