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Winnipeg Jets Prospect Thread 2012-13

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Old
11-09-2012, 01:52 AM
  #651
Bob E
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Originally Posted by Grind View Post
Because the only thing better then having a young star forward is having someone who can destroy them.
And we have two - Bogo and Troubs.

I still can't believe Trouba was around at #9. He 'could' be a 6'5 230 lb punishing defensive minded dman, who is a great skater, and has offensive instincts with a bomb for a shot.

I honestly thought Anaheim was going to take him at #6 as a future pairing dman for Fowler. Maybe the fact he was heading to college scared them off a bit.

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11-09-2012, 02:07 AM
  #652
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Originally Posted by Bob E View Post
And we have two - Bogo and Troubs.

I still can't believe Trouba was around at #9. He 'could' be a 6'5 230 lb punishing defensive minded dman, who is a great skater, and has offensive instincts with a bomb for a shot.

I honestly thought Anaheim was going to take him at #6 as a future pairing dman for Fowler. Maybe the fact he was heading to college scared them off a bit.
Could be that he was going to Michigan? A lot of people are afraid of their coach destroying defensive prospects a la J Johnson style. Some Lombardi quotes:

Quote:
"This guy has never had any coaching [at the University of Michigan]," Lombardi said. "Jack just did what he wanted."

"Michigan is the worst." Lombardi added. "For hockey people, if you’ve got a choice between a kid—all things being equal—one’s going to Michigan and one’s going to Boston University, you all want your player [going to Boston University]. Michigan’s players—[head coach] Red [Berenson] doesn’t coach. It’s ‘do what you want.’ He gets the best players in the country."

During his two seasons at the University of Michigan, Johnson played as a rover, rather than as a defenseman, even though that was his official position.

"Jack was a thoroughbred out there," Lombardi explained. "But he was all over the place. He was awful as a hockey player. As an athlete, you’re going, wow! Look at the way he skates, shoots, he can pass. But he had no idea where he was going."

"At times, he was playing forward at Michigan," Lombardi elaborated. "You had no idea what position he was playing. But he had always been the star and he always got his numbers. Then he turns pro and for the first time, we’re telling him ‘whoa, just make the first pass and learn to play in your own end.’ How about making a read in your own end about the right guy to pick up? He was awful."
Personally I'm not scared because of two reasons:
1) Trouba was more defensive and positional than Johnson in the first place
2) Huddy has shown to be able to decrease the roverness in the worlds "biggest" rover

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11-09-2012, 02:44 AM
  #653
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Originally Posted by garret9 View Post
Could be that he was going to Michigan? A lot of people are afraid of their coach destroying defensive prospects a la J Johnson style. Some Lombardi quotes:



Personally I'm not scared because of two reasons:
1) Trouba was more defensive and positional than Johnson in the first place
2) Huddy has shown to be able to decrease the roverness in the worlds "biggest" rover
Johnson also has a low hockey IQ. He's got a lot of good tools, but as they say "lacks a tool box".

Trouba is a smart player to go along with his skills. The scouts biggest fear with him was his possible low offensive ceiling. He seems to be showcasing that his offensive skill set has improved.

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11-09-2012, 03:14 AM
  #654
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Johnson also has a low hockey IQ. He's got a lot of good tools, but as they say "lacks a tool box".

Trouba is a smart player to go along with his skills. The scouts biggest fear with him was his possible low offensive ceiling. He seems to be showcasing that his offensive skill set has improved.
If I recall, the general scouting reports on Trouba were that he was one of the "safer" picks in the draft -- everything I ever read indicated there was relatively little question in scouts' minds that he would turn out to be a solid pro.

It's definitely the offensive ceiling that had him at 9, if you look at how some teams above us drafted -- they were looking for more point-producing D-men.

And good luck to them in their picks, but from where I stand... even if Trouba doesn't end up with a huge offensive game at the pro level, as long as he keeps hitting, skating and defending the way he does, I'll be satisfied.

And if he DOES have significant offensive development... well then we're gonna have a gooooood time at games in a few years folks.

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11-09-2012, 03:47 AM
  #655
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If I recall, the general scouting reports on Trouba were that he was one of the "safer" picks in the draft -- everything I ever read indicated there was relatively little question in scouts' minds that he would turn out to be a solid pro.

It's definitely the offensive ceiling that had him at 9, if you look at how some teams above us drafted -- they were looking for more point-producing D-men.

And good luck to them in their picks, but from where I stand... even if Trouba doesn't end up with a huge offensive game at the pro level, as long as he keeps hitting, skating and defending the way he does, I'll be satisfied.

And if he DOES have significant offensive development... well then we're gonna have a gooooood time at games in a few years folks.
Definitely agree with this. I mean, with Buff and Enström on the team, we don't really have to worry about point producing. Even more so with Bogosians potential.

Not that I doubt that Trouba has good offensive potential, just saying that I won't be too sad if he doesn't reach it.

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11-09-2012, 09:24 AM
  #656
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offense from our defense is the least of our worries. Toby is tied up long term and is a top 10 type scorer, Bogo was in the top 30 in D scoring (PPG average) as a 21 year old last year playing in a shut down roll so one can assume his O numbers will improve over the next 5 years. both these players are long term assets and will provide us with plenty of D scoring


Buff is Buff and he is definatley an offensive mashine and will continue to be so as long as we have him in Winnipeg. Postma has always been very productive offensively and even in a bottom pairing roll he will get his shot on our 2 PP unit and will get his numbers.

Long term what we need from Trouba is for him to be a great shut down defender with a physical edge. What we really need in Winnipeg is a Willie Mitchell type defender (not saying that is what Trouba will be like). From what I have seen Trouba's offensive skill set will be the least of our worries and I really think he has more than enough tools in the box to put up around 25 to 30 points a year. What I am really hoping is that he becomes one of the more feared and efficient defenders in the league.


Last edited by ps241: 11-09-2012 at 10:36 AM.
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11-09-2012, 10:35 AM
  #657
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Might get ripped on for this but here it goes. Trouba reminds me a lot of a Pronger-lite. I'm really high on him. Between his skating, awareness, and bomb of a shot, the kid's gonna be a star.

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11-09-2012, 12:05 PM
  #658
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Might get ripped on for this but here it goes. Trouba reminds me a lot of a Pronger-lite. I'm really high on him. Between his skating, awareness, and bomb of a shot, the kid's gonna be a star.
Curious if you mean ripped on by pro-Pronger camp or anti-Pronger camp.
If he turns out like Pronger, play wise and results wise, I think we'd be verrrry happy. For us advance stat guys, Pronger's on ice results are some of the best in the league.

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11-09-2012, 12:33 PM
  #659
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I see Trouba more in the mold of a Rob Blake which would be nothing to be disappointed with if the lofty Pronger comparisons are never reached.

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11-09-2012, 01:48 PM
  #660
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I'm leaving town for a few days so if anyone wants to take over scoreboards for the weekend, that be sweet.

I'l still have access to internet so I'll still do it if I don't see someone.

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11-09-2012, 01:53 PM
  #661
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I see Trouba more in the mold of a Rob Blake which would be nothing to be disappointed with if the lofty Pronger comparisons are never reached.
An eventual Blake, Pronger (or any HOF caliber player) comparison would make me happier than a pig in poop, especially considering he was the 7th D man taken.

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11-09-2012, 02:19 PM
  #662
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I see Trouba as a combination of phaneuf and weber:

Phaneuf: his burning desire to make open-ice hits, but unlike dion, he doesn't put himself out of the play or position, running around to make a open-ice hit;

Weber: for his physical play down low in defensive zone, very similar;

So he's physical guy, that can skate and play physical in the defensive zone. The adam foote comparisons seems to be based on that, but Trouba looks to be more offensive than foote. That's also a bit Pronger-like

Offensively is where its hard to project with him. His shot may be Weber or Phaneuf like, but I don't think he'll be a 15-20 g guy. He might, but that's a bit of a stretch. If he develops into a weber-lite defensively and adds some punch offensively (10+g), that's a terrific pick.

I'm sure that's what the Wild hope Dumba turns into, but he's under-sized to play that game, imo. Trouba could be 6'5+ when he's done growing, with a natural mean streak. That's Chara like too.

I think being the 7th dman picked will have lots of teams wondering what if we took him:

Murray - solid all around dman, not overly physical. Nice pick though.

Reinhart - offensive, lots of size, not physical. Could be reincarnation of Dave Babych as a dman.

Reilly - one-way, offensive dman.

Lindholm - smart, size, finishes checks, but not Trouba mean but soild d prospect.

Dumba - offensive guy who tries to play very physical. At his size, that will likely be a problem in NHL. Trouba is a safer bet to get there.

Pouliot - Looks very much like Brian Campbell. Very much. Not a fan.


Trouba and Linholm, have the potential to be the best all-around dmen (size, physical, offensive, etc) in the draft. Love the pick. .

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Old
11-09-2012, 02:58 PM
  #663
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Originally Posted by garret9 View Post
I'm leaving town for a few days so if anyone wants to take over scoreboards for the weekend, that be sweet.

I'l still have access to internet so I'll still do it if I don't see someone.
I can try! Hopefully I remember haha.

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11-09-2012, 03:13 PM
  #664
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I see Trouba as a combination of phaneuf and weber:

Phaneuf: his burning desire to make open-ice hits, but unlike dion, he doesn't put himself out of the play or position, running around to make a open-ice hit;

Weber: for his physical play down low in defensive zone, very similar;

So he's physical guy, that can skate and play physical in the defensive zone. The adam foote comparisons seems to be based on that, but Trouba looks to be more offensive than foote. That's also a bit Pronger-like

Offensively is where its hard to project with him. His shot may be Weber or Phaneuf like, but I don't think he'll be a 15-20 g guy. He might, but that's a bit of a stretch. If he develops into a weber-lite defensively and adds some punch offensively (10+g), that's a terrific pick.

I'm sure that's what the Wild hope Dumba turns into, but he's under-sized to play that game, imo. Trouba could be 6'5+ when he's done growing, with a natural mean streak. That's Chara like too.

I think being the 7th dman picked will have lots of teams wondering what if we took him:

Murray - solid all around dman, not overly physical. Nice pick though.

Reinhart - offensive, lots of size, not physical. Could be reincarnation of Dave Babych as a dman.

Reilly - one-way, offensive dman.

Lindholm - smart, size, finishes checks, but not Trouba mean but soild d prospect.

Dumba - offensive guy who tries to play very physical. At his size, that will likely be a problem in NHL. Trouba is a safer bet to get there.

Pouliot - Looks very much like Brian Campbell. Very much. Not a fan.


Trouba and Linholm, have the potential to be the best all-around dmen (size, physical, offensive, etc) in the draft. Love the pick. .
It is very likely that a couple of these guys will never play 150 games in the NHL.

Previous years that featured a ton of D men drafted early.

1996:

1 Ottawa Senators Chris Phillips 1025 GP 256 P
2 San Jose Sharks Andrei Zyuzin 496 GP 120 P
5 Dallas Stars Ric Jackman 231 GP 77 P
6 Edmonton Oilers Boyd Devereaux 627 GP 179 P
8 Boston Bruins Johnathan Aitken 44 GP 1 P
9 Anaheim Ducks Ruslan Salei 917 GP 204 P
10 New Jersey Devils Lance Ward 209 GP 16 P
11 Phoenix Coyotes Dan Focht 82 GP 8 P
13 Calgary Flames Derek Morris 1005 GP 396 P

Also:
http://www.hockey-reference.com/draf...987_entry.html

http://www.hockey-reference.com/draf...989_entry.html

http://www.hockey-reference.com/draf...992_entry.html

http://www.hockey-reference.com/draf...995_entry.html

http://www.hockey-reference.com/draf...996_entry.html

http://www.hockey-reference.com/draf...002_entry.html

http://www.hockey-reference.com/draf...007_entry.html

http://www.hockey-reference.com/draf...008_entry.html

I guess what I am trying to say is... Lets see him make and play in the bigs before we compare him to All-stars.

Yes he has some desirable skill, but so do all of these kids, and a couple of them are going to be complete busts.


Also, Brian Campbell is dang good hockey player. I would be over the moon to get that kind of player 9th overall.


Last edited by truck: 11-09-2012 at 03:20 PM.
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Old
11-09-2012, 05:53 PM
  #665
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It is very likely that a couple of these guys will never play 150 games in the NHL.

Yes he has some desirable skill, but so do all of these kids, and a couple of them are going to be complete busts.

Also, Brian Campbell is dang good hockey player. I would be over the moon to get that kind of player 9th overall.
Wasn't trying to over-hype Trouba, but the thing I like about his game is, 'at worst' he's a big, physical defenceman that can skate. Barring an injury, he should play. If he's defensively sound, he should play many years. Those types of players are very valuable and hard to find. At times they bounce around, but seem to have long careers. If he puts up some offensive numbers, he could be in the same category as guys that currently all-star calibre.

Brian Campbell is a decent offensive defensemen but is hopelessly out of position a lot. I still remember Scotty Bowman screaming at Dale Talon during the playoffs, asking him why Campbell was down low in the offensive zone, in the corner, in OT - in a game where campbell being that much out-of-position cost them that game as the Hawks lost. Remember the look on Talon's face. "I have no idea".

Great skater, pretty good offensive instincts, lowsy defensive dman.

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11-09-2012, 06:05 PM
  #666
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I'm starting to get pretty revved up about the upcoming draft. With 6 picks in top 90, the Jets should add some quality prospects to the cupboard.

Right now, its pretty easy to get excited about scheifele and trouba, but it seems after those two the Jets don't have many prospects that could become impact NHL players. Adding 6 more picks will definitely make following the prospects even more fun.

Now, whether they work out or not, its fun to keep track. If I haven't said so before, Garret, your updates are fantastic and much appreciated.

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11-09-2012, 08:51 PM
  #667
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Originally Posted by truck View Post
It is very likely that a couple of these guys will never play 150 games in the NHL.

Previous years that featured a ton of D men drafted early.

1996:

1 Ottawa Senators Chris Phillips 1025 GP 256 P
2 San Jose Sharks Andrei Zyuzin 496 GP 120 P
5 Dallas Stars Ric Jackman 231 GP 77 P
6 Edmonton Oilers Boyd Devereaux 627 GP 179 P
8 Boston Bruins Johnathan Aitken 44 GP 1 P
9 Anaheim Ducks Ruslan Salei 917 GP 204 P
10 New Jersey Devils Lance Ward 209 GP 16 P
11 Phoenix Coyotes Dan Focht 82 GP 8 P
13 Calgary Flames Derek Morris 1005 GP 396 P

Also:
http://www.hockey-reference.com/draf...987_entry.html

http://www.hockey-reference.com/draf...989_entry.html

http://www.hockey-reference.com/draf...992_entry.html

http://www.hockey-reference.com/draf...995_entry.html

http://www.hockey-reference.com/draf...996_entry.html

http://www.hockey-reference.com/draf...002_entry.html

http://www.hockey-reference.com/draf...007_entry.html

http://www.hockey-reference.com/draf...008_entry.html

I guess what I am trying to say is... Lets see him make and play in the bigs before we compare him to All-stars.

Yes he has some desirable skill, but so do all of these kids, and a couple of them are going to be complete busts.


Also, Brian Campbell is dang good hockey player. I would be over the moon to get that kind of player 9th overall.
Wow that's not an attractive list......let's this crop of D men is somewhere between 1995 and 2009 as draft success

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11-09-2012, 09:05 PM
  #668
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I'm starting to get pretty revved up about the upcoming draft. With 6 picks in top 90, the Jets should add some quality prospects to the cupboard.

Right now, its pretty easy to get excited about scheifele and trouba, but it seems after those two the Jets don't have many prospects that could become impact NHL players. Adding 6 more picks will definitely make following the prospects even more fun.

Now, whether they work out or not, its fun to keep track.
Quite agree. I'm looking forward to it!

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If I haven't said so before, Garret, your updates are fantastic and much appreciated.
No problem! Glad you actually appreciate what I do. Although I think people like the info I bring but not the opinions/interpretations
You'll be on a delay though for today... I'm currently on BC Ferries and their wifi is terrrrrible. I can't get any of my streams working and so I'll have to go off of boxscores

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Wow that's not an attractive list......let's this crop of D men is somewhere between 1995 and 2009 as draft success
Ya... there's piles and piles and piles of evidence that it's poor idea to draft a defensmen when looking at the odds...
The problem with that is that everyone wants a Weber, or Doughty, or whomever so bad they take the risks because they don't want someone else with them.

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Old
11-09-2012, 09:53 PM
  #669
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An eventual Blake, Pronger (or any HOF caliber player) comparison would make me happier than a pig in poop, especially considering he was the 7th D man taken.
I was suprised he was the 7th D man taken Truck? For some reason this year after Murray everyone seemed to go for the high offensive upside D prospect despite their size (Reinhart aside) now they could all well be correct with their choices but I feel like we got away with one. Going into the draft this year the guy I was really hoping would fall to us was Trouba and I am still suprised it happened....time will tell if I was right

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11-09-2012, 10:17 PM
  #670
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Trouba got a goal tonight. He also hurt a guy and got a penalty for it. knee on knee. the Mich announcers said it was unintentional and the player is ok.

There is supposed to be a stream available for tomorrow nights game.

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11-09-2012, 10:21 PM
  #671
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Scheifele with 2 assists tonight.

Kosmo with 1 assist on the night.

Olsen just scored to open up a 1-0 lead for Kelowna.

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11-09-2012, 10:56 PM
  #672
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They just showed highlights of the Barrie game on Sportsnet Connected. One of Scheifele's assists was a nice little saucer pass to set up the goal. The kid has some super sweet hands and displayed good patience.

That was a pro-level dish.

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11-09-2012, 11:00 PM
  #673
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They just showed highlights of the Barrie game on Sportsnet Connected. One of Scheifele's assists was a nice little saucer pass to set up the goal. The kid has some super sweet hands and displayed good patience.

That was a pro-level dish.
Yeah I just saw that too, what a beauty of a pass. Also his skating looks like it has improved immensely, thats a great sign of his dedication. That kid is scary good and makes others around him better.

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11-09-2012, 11:21 PM
  #674
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They just showed highlights of the Barrie game on Sportsnet Connected. One of Scheifele's assists was a nice little saucer pass to set up the goal. The kid has some super sweet hands and displayed good patience.

That was a pro-level dish.
Bust

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11-09-2012, 11:22 PM
  #675
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Olsen just scored his second of the night!

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