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The Business of Hockey Discuss the financial and business aspects of the NHL. Topics may include the CBA, work stoppages, broadcast contracts, franchise sales, and NHL revenues.

KHL teams want to keep Ovechkin, Kovalchuk rather than return 'em to NHL?

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Old
11-10-2012, 10:16 PM
  #26
Afino
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Originally Posted by Fire Sather View Post
Isn't Alexander Ovechkin's heel turn amazing?
NHL =/= pro wrestling

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Old
11-10-2012, 10:36 PM
  #27
5 Minute Major
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If a player wants to go back to Russia (or any other league) and play, fine, let them.

However, once they go and NHL hockey is being played,they should never be able to return if they broke an NHL contract to do so.

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11-10-2012, 10:59 PM
  #28
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A. Let them stay. It'll only hurt them (financially).

B. They can't stay even if they wanted to, unless they Russia wants to cause an international scandal 1.5 years before Sochi (they don't).

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Old
11-10-2012, 11:00 PM
  #29
Kirk Muller
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But isnt the NHLPA all about honoring NHL contracts? At least thats what they keep telling us the owners should do.

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Old
11-10-2012, 11:01 PM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Afino View Post
NHL =/= pro wrestling
Not with that attitude.

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Old
11-10-2012, 11:04 PM
  #31
Renbarg
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Originally Posted by Czech Your Math View Post
As far as I'm concerned, when you cancel a whole season, and then may do so 8 years later... when you stop paying a player, why can't he sign another contract? Don't attorneys often require retainer? That's just for the possibility that you might need their services. Owners locked them out, owners stopped paying them, owners broke the contract. I don't see why the player should be penalized, except that he must honor the contract if he returns to the NHL (at which time the team should have the option as to whether to honor the remaining contract also).
Because of transfer agreements between Russia and the NHL.

And the contracts aren't "broken." Players agree to abide by the CBA when they signed their contracts, including allowing for their salaries to be modified. The question regarding the legality of lockouts have been asked many times before, this one certainly falls under within those parameters. Canadian law already affirmed as much. I'm sure American law would as well.

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11-10-2012, 11:05 PM
  #32
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Judging by the first few quotes in this thread you'd think that it was a player saying that he won't be returning to the NHL and is looking into staying in the NHL rather than what it is which is actually some non-player.

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Old
11-10-2012, 11:09 PM
  #33
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Originally Posted by QuietCompany View Post
Judging by the first few quotes in this thread you'd think that it was a player saying that he won't be returning to the NHL and is looking into staying in the NHL rather than what it is which is actually some non-player.
If I'm not mistaken, OV has made comments about doing just that in the not too distant past.

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11-10-2012, 11:13 PM
  #34
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There's not a single quote from any player in the article. It's not "selfishness" or whatever.

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11-10-2012, 11:19 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by Fordy View Post
There's not a single quote from any player in the article. It's not "selfishness" or whatever.
Yeah, that too. for all the people whining and complaining, Ovechkin(and Kovalchuk, but mostly Ovechkin) have been blamed for some things they haven't done or said. Ovechkin has said some things to indicate he has a beef with the way the cBA has been handled, and he is playing in Russia. Further comments attributed to him were passed along by a poster that saw a TV interview in Russian. So, I'm sure we got the complete gist of that.

This isn't even Ovechkin or Kovalchuk saying anything. This is the teams saying what they wish would happen.

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Old
11-10-2012, 11:36 PM
  #36
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I totally believe Ovie wants to come back. Why else would he tweet about wanting the NHL to get a deal done if he didn't? He also wants a Stanley Cup and he won't get that in the KHL.


Last edited by foundhockey: 11-10-2012 at 11:37 PM. Reason: clarity
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Old
11-10-2012, 11:47 PM
  #37
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These are owners of russian teams making comments about wanting to keep these guys... not Ovechkin and Kovalchuk saying they want russian owners to find a way to keep them. So why are some of you trying to vilify Ovechkin and Kovalchuk over it? Of course those teams want to keep them, but it's not their decision... and unless Ovechkin and Kovalchuk actually go for it, there's no blame to place on them.

I don't even like ANY of the players right now, and I still find it ridiculous that people are getting uppity towards these two players over it.

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Old
11-11-2012, 12:10 AM
  #38
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Probably more posturing from the union side. I would not read too much into it. The question is how upset would the Caps and Devils be getting out of those contracts?

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Old
11-11-2012, 12:13 AM
  #39
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Originally Posted by Nolanitis View Post
Probably more posturing from the union side. I would not read too much into it. The question is how upset would the Caps and Devils be getting out of those contracts?
Since they're both their franchise players and best players, pretty pissed.

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Old
11-11-2012, 12:14 AM
  #40
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Im positive Kovy will comeback .

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Old
11-11-2012, 12:40 AM
  #41
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Originally Posted by RANDOMH3RO View Post
I would be extremely disappointed if the NHL started back up and Kovalchuk wasn't there, but I wouldn't really blame him.
That would be a violation of the contract he agreed to hence subject to a lawsuit. I doubt any KHL can hand out the lengthy contract he's got.

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Old
11-11-2012, 12:49 AM
  #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fedfed View Post
Team president: "We have thoughts of keeping him".
HFB fans: "That player doesn't want to come back!"
Ridiculous. They'll all return, except for maybe lesser players, like S.Kostitsyn or Babchuk.
Exactly this. Unbelievable how anyone could interpret this as the players saying they want to stay

Of course the president of the league is going to try to keep superstar NHLers in his league as long as possible. It's highly unlikely he'll be able to do it, but you can't fault him for trying.

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Old
11-11-2012, 01:41 AM
  #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Renbarg View Post
Because of transfer agreements between Russia and the NHL.

And the contracts aren't "broken." Players agree to abide by the CBA when they signed their contracts, including allowing for their salaries to be modified. The question regarding the legality of lockouts have been asked many times before, this one certainly falls under within those parameters. Canadian law already affirmed as much. I'm sure American law would as well.
I understand there are transfer agreements and the law isn't on the side of the players. However, if this drags out for another year or so... at what point do the owners basically forfeit their right to retain the player's services?

If one of us had a contract with an employer, including a non-compete clause... and the employer basically said "you can't come to work for an indefinite period... we won't be paying you until we decide to go back into business." Doesn't that put the employee in a real bind? Shouldn't he be able to seek alternative employment given the circumstances? If so, wouldn't having to say to other employers, "I will work for you, but at any time, with minimal notice, I may have to leave and return to my old employer," hurt his alternative employment chances/offers? If the lockout is ongoing for a couple years, and inflation goes up 20% in that time... while the new CBA requires a substantial reduction of all existing contracts... why should the player have to abide by that? Didn't he sign the contract with the implicit understanding that the seasons would be consecutive?

It seems to me like an employer option for "whenever we decide to actually continue business"... whether in a couple months or a couple years. Again, I understand the contract is worded such that the player must abide by CBA, but it just seems wrong to me that employer has such power and can basically leave player in limbo.

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Old
11-11-2012, 01:50 AM
  #44
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I highly doubt suing the KHL or the respective KHL teams or players would do anything assuming they (the players) have no problem staying in Russia for the remainder of their lives.

An international civil lawsuit is a little tricky when it is international, especially with a country like Russia. The government would likely choose to ignore it and let the KHL/players do whatever they want. How can you make players pay anyone when all their assets are in a different country outside of the control of the US judicial system? Threaten the Russian government? Lol ok


Edit: this is from a strictly legal standpoint that ignores the Olympics. It would likely require the IIHF threatening to ban all russian competitors from any international competition (if they can even do that in this type of situation). Either that or the Olympic committee could possibly threaten to remove the Olympics from Sochi or ban the players/russian team but again I think that would be farfetched.

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Old
11-11-2012, 01:52 AM
  #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nolanitis View Post
Probably more posturing from the union side. I would not read too much into it. The question is how upset would the Caps and Devils be getting out of those contracts?
??? OP has information coming out of Russia. I find it hard to believe that statement.



In addition to the remedies available to NHL teams if a player does not fulfill his contract, the IIHF can suspend players (including from international play like the Olympics) for not honoring their valid NHL contracts.

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Old
11-11-2012, 04:13 AM
  #46
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Originally Posted by 1ntrovert View Post
What a stupid sterotype. What about Datty? And other Russians who are loyal! The NHL brought this upon themselves. Two lockouts in less then a decade. If they want to stay in Russia I can see why and I would never hold it against them.


Canadian and various other players care about the fans? I guess that is the reason we are playing games right now. That statement has to be the most uneducated one I have ever read on this board
Don't get your panties all in a bunch, If they want to stay in Russia good for them, I can understand that, I have no problem with that, but could they stop *****ing and moaning about the NHL.

I would take a good old Canadian boy over a Russian anytime. How many Russians have sit down at the bargaining table so far with Ferh?

Right now all the NHL's Russians playing in the KHL don't give a rat's ass if the lockout goes on and wipes the entire season. It's didn't take long after the lockout was in effect for all the Russians to jump ship and go back to the Motherland.

Look at Crosby he's trying to find a solution to end the lockout, he's getting involved, where's Ovechkin, Malkin, Datsyuk those guys are long gone, they don't care if the lockout continues or end.

And I'm pretty sure that as soon as the lockout is over they will be the first guys coming back, Russians are not stupid they know where the money is.

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Old
11-11-2012, 04:44 AM
  #47
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Originally Posted by Renbarg View Post
Because of transfer agreements between Russia and the NHL.
there is NOT transfer agreement between Russia and the NHL now. It was in past as I know

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Old
11-11-2012, 05:06 AM
  #48
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May I ask where in this article Ovechkin and Kovalchuk say that they want to break their contracts if the NHL is playing again and asking them to come over? If someone could point that out to me, I would be really thankful

And in general: They are locked out and play in their home country and enjoy it. Is this really that shocking? And maybe, just maybe, not for everyone the NHL is the only league to play in and/or a sacred institution. Why should it be? It is my favourite league in all of sports as well, but I can see why someone could think otherwise - and if there is a lockout every few years, I can understand that even more.

But to the people in this thread saying "they are Russians who don't care and can stay in Russia if they want to": keep the stereotypes alive, good work.

Edit: Actually I am shocked about the stereotypes in this thread: we discuss a sport we all enjoy, and at least since 1990 there have been so many players from all over the world in the NHL, and people are still riding the "Russians don't care"-attitude; not that is has to be proven that one nation is not better/worse than another - but even after 20 years of Russian players in this league with a lot of them being absolute role-models this sticks? That's just sad.


Last edited by Harry Waters: 11-11-2012 at 05:24 AM.
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Old
11-11-2012, 05:11 AM
  #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heaton View Post
A great way for these players to show if they really care about the fans and their teams. I suspect they don't.
Naw how cute. Wouldn't any president say something like this? This has nothing to do with what Ovy and Kovy thinks, if you read the article.

And what makes you suspect that? Them being Russian I assume.. sigh

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Old
11-11-2012, 05:18 AM
  #50
Holden Caulfield
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there is NOT transfer agreement between Russia and the NHL now. It was in past as I know
No transfer agreement BUT there is an agreement to respect the other league's contracts...which is clearly in violation if Malkin/Ovechkin stay over there once a CBA has been signed in the NHL...it is possible the KHL rips up that agreement for an OVechkin, but that's a risky move that might cost them big time in the future.

Czech Your Math, what part of this lockout are you not understanding? This lockout is on BOTH sides, the employer is not outright telling the employee he can't work, they are trying to get a deal done to get the players back, as the players are also trying to get a deal to play again. This is NOT unilateral situation. It is on BOTH sides they have agreed not to play.

Yes yes it's a "lockout", but the reality is there is NO OTHER CHOICE in pro sports these days, mostly due to Mr Fehr and his shenanigans in baseball, you cannot play with no CBA nowadays, it almost always ends in the players screwing the owners.

The players signed a valid contract knowing full well it was subject to the CBA, which very well may expire and cause this. The players want to end it, sign the owners last agreement. I am not pro owner here, it works vice a versa as well, but to make outrageous claims that the employer is unilaterally preventing the players from working is plain wrong.

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