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Lockout discussion thread 2.0

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Old
11-11-2012, 11:18 AM
  #401
domdo345
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Originally Posted by ECWHSWI View Post
good on ya.

the players ? meh, they'll hire an accountant that will probably make more than you ever will to manage their money...
That has nothing to do with the fact that when you know nothing about something, don't act/say things like you know what you are talking about. I hate people like this.

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11-11-2012, 11:55 AM
  #402
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That has nothing to do with the fact that when you know nothing about something, don't act/say things like you know what you are talking about. I hate people like this.
Pretty much everyone think they know what they're talking about whenever they're talking. Most of them are wrong. Nothing we can do about it besides getting used to it.

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11-11-2012, 12:00 PM
  #403
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Originally Posted by ECWHSWI View Post
Pretty much everyone think they know what they're talking about whenever they're talking. Most of them are wrong. Nothing we can do about it besides getting used to it.
Not most of them but a good bunch, I agree. Society is more about what you can show than what you are, and it's a shame

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11-11-2012, 12:40 PM
  #404
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Originally Posted by ECWHSWI View Post
Pretty much everyone think they know what they're talking about whenever they're talking. Most of them are wrong. Nothing we can do about it besides getting used to it.
A good portion of talking heads in sports qualify !!
And a lot of them can be found right here in and around Montreal!!

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11-11-2012, 01:05 PM
  #405
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Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
Are you actually criticizing Ovie and Kovalchuk for the fact that they are in North America for the money?



Why else do you think they would leave their family and friends and home culture? To drink Coors Light and eat at McDonalds? No, they come here because the salaries are higher, of course.

If they resolve the issue on time, it is only because it is in their own financial interests. You really need to abandon this hypothesis that either the owners or the players are motivated by altruism or would ever be motivated by altruism in any conceivable world.

*****

Ultimately, the owners look after the owners, the NHLPA looks after the players, and the fans need to look after themselves. It's not the players' or the owners' jobs to look after the fans, to "care" (which you underlined, bolded, and italicized) about your pain. If you're suffering from the lockout, it is important that you find another hobby, and it is your responsibility to do so.

I'm sick of hearing "what about the fans". Here's the deal with the fans. We are collectively denied the opportunity this year to spend 3.8 billion dollars and maybe a billion man-hours or more into hockey this year, we are denied the opportunity to financially support players with salaries between ten and hundred times higher than ours, and owners with net worths a million times higher than ours. If we can't find anything better to do with that spectacular opportunity, then we are the ones at fault. I for one may be spending less time watching games, which means I'm spending more time watching other things.

We will certainly all go back craving more action when the game resumes.
Clearly you did not understand my post.

I don't care why they're doing this, I really don't. What I said was annoying is them pretending to care about the fans. Because we do hear them talk about the fans often during the year right, or did you forget this? ''We love the fans'', ''it's all about the fans'', blablabla...So enough of this BS of them actually caring for the fans.

Of course they're doing it for the money and they have every right to fight for it, but don't turn around to say you care about the fans after when you take weeks before scheduling meetings and possibly have yet another lost season.

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Old
11-11-2012, 03:08 PM
  #406
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Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
Clearly you did not understand my post.

I don't care why they're doing this, I really don't. What I said was annoying is them pretending to care about the fans. Because we do hear them talk about the fans often during the year right, or did you forget this? ''We love the fans'', ''it's all about the fans'', blablabla...So enough of this BS of them actually caring for the fans.

Of course they're doing it for the money and they have every right to fight for it, but don't turn around to say you care about the fans after when you take weeks before scheduling meetings and possibly have yet another lost season.
They say one thing, and do another...it's not about the fans, unfortunately, it's all about money...very sad, neither side will admit it...it's why guys like Fehr are hired, people like him have no emotional connection to the game...just business...

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11-11-2012, 03:59 PM
  #407
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Michael Grange ‏@michaelgrange
Fehr -- #nHL expects players to accept owners proposal 'to the comma'

Renaud Lavoie ‏@RenLavoieRDS
Bill Daly:"PA give us 17 issues on players contract last week. We have a deal, or made progress on 14 of them.
Unless Daly is completely lying, Fehr must love throwing tantrums.

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11-11-2012, 04:35 PM
  #408
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Unless Daly is completely lying, Fehr must love throwing tantrums.
Donnie is a troll...

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Old
11-11-2012, 05:38 PM
  #409
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http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=409277

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"There is no question the NHL has grown increasingly exasperated by Fehr, who takes passive aggressive to an art form. There is a notion within league headquarters that he has no interest in making a deal, that he's looking for this dispute to go nuclear so he can either challenge the NHL's entire salary cap system in a protracted battle that would likely carry over to next season or fight the owners for as long as it takes to, as Fehr is wont to say, break the cycle of owners putting a gun to players' heads in chronic takeaway negotiations."
Sigh. I think the players may regret the day they hired Fehr.

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11-11-2012, 05:48 PM
  #410
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Originally Posted by Andy View Post
http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=409277



Sigh. I think the players may regret the day they hired Fehr.
Solidarity to the end.....what's 3.3B X 0.00????

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11-11-2012, 06:01 PM
  #411
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Originally Posted by Andy View Post
http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=409277



Sigh. I think the players may regret the day they hired Fehr.
Not as much as I hate the league hiring Bettman!!!

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Old
11-11-2012, 06:06 PM
  #412
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Not as much as I hate the league hiring Bettman!!!
Bettman has nothing to do with Fehr intentionally acting like a dick since the negotiation process started. It has come to the point where even guys like McKenzie who has been pretty quiet so far and remained pretty much neutral to be ticked off by Fehr.

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11-11-2012, 06:08 PM
  #413
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy View Post
http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=409277



Sigh. I think the players may regret the day they hired Fehr.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy View Post
Bettman has nothing to do with Fehr intentionally acting like a dick since being hired.
Bettman has three lockouts under his belt.........Fehr one.

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Old
11-11-2012, 06:10 PM
  #414
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Originally Posted by charlie View Post
Bettman has three lockouts under his belt.........Fehr one.
That still has very little to do with Fehr acting like a dick right now.

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11-11-2012, 06:12 PM
  #415
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Originally Posted by Andy View Post
Bettman has nothing to do with Fehr intentionally acting like a dick since the negotiation process started. It has come to the point where even guys like McKenzie who has been pretty quiet so far and remained pretty much neutral to be ticked off by Fehr.
Bettman has everything to do with it. It's his third lockout, and everybody knew that Gary Bettman, Jeremy Jacobs, etc were planning another lockout.

It's only natural that the NHLPA would get someone good to do the job, as they were under threat.

The league could have just agreed to play this season under the old CBA. They could have also agreed to the players offer on day one, which made a generous concession of reducing player intake from 57% to 54%, equivalent to a whopping 114 million dollars a year in revenue. There was no need for Bettman to have his third work stoppage.

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11-11-2012, 06:12 PM
  #416
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Originally Posted by charlie View Post
Bettman has three lockouts under his belt.........Fehr one.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy View Post
That still has very little to do with Fehr acting like a dick right now.
They are both dicks.............just one is bigger than the other........

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Old
11-11-2012, 06:18 PM
  #417
Andy
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Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
Bettman has everything to do with it. It's his third lockout, and everybody knew that Gary Bettman, Jeremy Jacobs, etc were planning another lockout.

It's only natural that the NHLPA would get someone good to do the job, as they were under threat.

The league could have just agreed to play this season under the old CBA. They could have also agreed to the players offer on day one, which made a generous concession of reducing player intake from 57% to 54%, equivalent to a whopping 114 million dollars a year in revenue. There was no need for Bettman to have his third work stoppage.
Considering that NHL actually tried to start negotiating last year, but it was Fehr who didn't want to, I wouldn't put all the blame on the owners. Why should the NHL be the only side to make concessions? That's not how negotiations work. Perhaps had Fehr not acted like a dick early last year and negotiations would have started earlier maybe we would have a season or at least be ahead in the negotiations. To put this all on Bettman and the owners is extremely one-sided. Both are to blame, but seeing Fehr's tactics recently, he's really not giving much reason for people to like him and it really looks like he's the one who's stalling negotiations from advancing with the games he's playing.

Right now one side is making the majority of the concessions, while the other side keeps sticking their nose at the league and causing a stalemate in negotiations. Add to that what McKenzie has pointed out that Fehr has no interest in making a deal, I really don't see how you can sit there and put all the blame on Bettman.

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Old
11-11-2012, 06:24 PM
  #418
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Originally Posted by Andy View Post
Why should the NHL be the only side to make concessions?
Thus far, none of the deals on the table involve concessions from the NHL, and all of the deals involve concessions from the players.

The main shift is a transfer from 57% to 50% of revenue for the players. That's around 280 million dollars per year in concessions.

The owners are also demanding reduced free agency privileges, 5-year ELCs, and five-year (six-years?) contract limits.

What are the owners offering that the players were not getting before? NOTHING. Ergo, they are making zero concessions.

If you actually think the owners are the ones making all the concessions, then you need to dab your face in cold water, as you are an easy prey for propaganda.

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Old
11-11-2012, 06:37 PM
  #419
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Mini training camp until end of November....... 01 Dec, the season will begin..

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11-11-2012, 06:42 PM
  #420
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Mini training camp until end of November....... 01 Dec, the season will begin..
early christmas present?

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Old
11-11-2012, 06:45 PM
  #421
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early christmas present?
Call it what you want Charlie, but this is what i heard this evening.

They are alot closer to settling than some are letting on.

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Old
11-11-2012, 06:50 PM
  #422
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Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
Thus far, none of the deals on the table involve concessions from the NHL, and all of the deals involve concessions from the players.

The main shift is a transfer from 57% to 50% of revenue for the players. That's around 280 million dollars per year in concessions.

The owners are also demanding reduced free agency privileges, 5-year ELCs, and five-year (six-years?) contract limits.

What are the owners offering that the players were not getting before? NOTHING. Ergo, they are making zero concessions.

If you actually think the owners are the ones making all the concessions, then you need to dab your face in cold water, as you are an easy prey for propaganda.
Don't bother. People are still going to clamour and proselytize that the players make too much money.

Bob McKenzie is, has been and will always be the third arm of the NHL. He has Bettman and Daly on speed dial and I can't stand to see his ******** be taken as gospel. McKenzie has nothing to gain by actually fighting or criticizing the unfair attacks on Fehr because Bettman's hand is far, far up Bob's ass.

Pretty sad to see.

I want hockey back but owners/NHL really cemented what we all already knew: they're a 2nd-tier sports league with poor business practices. Bettman is a chump and we're all chumps if we don't get his ousted.

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Old
11-11-2012, 08:49 PM
  #423
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Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
Thus far, none of the deals on the table involve concessions from the NHL, and all of the deals involve concessions from the players.

The main shift is a transfer from 57% to 50% of revenue for the players. That's around 280 million dollars per year in concessions.

The owners are also demanding reduced free agency privileges, 5-year ELCs, and five-year (six-years?) contract limits.

What are the owners offering that the players were not getting before? NOTHING. Ergo, they are making zero concessions.

If you actually think the owners are the ones making all the concessions, then you need to dab your face in cold water, as you are an easy prey for propaganda.
Nothing, but it's still a well paid job for the players. They're the owners, they have the rights to do so, that's something peoples should understand. The players taking more than 50 % of the revenue is also something ridiculous especially in a professional sport. Even the players agrees to that, the only difference is that in their opinion getting to 50/50 after 5 years of a 6 years agreement is a true 50/50, when the owners want it to get to it the fastest possible.

At least right now there is negotiations and talks, they actually look like they're trying, it's less frustrating IMO.

What I did not like from the NHLPA, it's their refusal of discussing about the agreement during all last season when the NHL was willing to.


Last edited by Forsead: 11-11-2012 at 09:17 PM.
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Old
11-11-2012, 09:03 PM
  #424
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Call it what you want Charlie, but this is what i heard this evening.

They are alot closer to settling than some are letting on.
BS.

You lost all credibility on the matter in my opinion anyway.

At this point, I'd be surprised to see a season unless they hire a mediator. If not, I wouldn't be surprised if this even goes into next season.

Do no underestimate the power of greed and egos. They'll hold on to their end of the stick until they wake up and there is nothing left before they concede to anything.

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Old
11-11-2012, 10:02 PM
  #425
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What I did not like from the NHLPA, it's their refusal of discussing about the agreement during all last season when the NHL was willing to.
I think their strategy called for negotiations right after the season because during the season they would have much less leverage.

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