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Luongo Thread: Still Haven't Found What I'm Looking For (Mod Warning in OP)

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Old
11-11-2012, 01:24 PM
  #451
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Originally Posted by kthsn View Post
For the most part players like to win but money talks. If Burke can make a pitch that emphasizes the Leafs are trending upwards (hell they can't get any worse) then Lupul can see himself as a "saviour" of that team.
That would be pretty difficult to do if the Leafs are headed for another year of no playoff hockey...

Lupul could potentially re-sign even if Toronto stinks it up yet again. Pretty big gamble to take for Burke though. Especially when you consider the potential ramifications with Kessel's pending free agency a year later.

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11-11-2012, 05:00 PM
  #452
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Originally Posted by Liferleafer View Post
Brodeur was offered 2years...i guess that qualifies as multi. And we also traded Seguin and Hamilton...as well as Niedermeyer, and even Luongo in the past.(all TO picks). So it can work both ways.

I guess it's time for me to bow out as well.
Too bad if you do bow out. I think you have been very fair and reasonable in your posts here. Some of the 'Nuck fans are anticipating way to much return on Lu, just as some Leaf fans underrate Lu's value. His contract stinks, yet the fans are not holding Gillis accountable. The trade that you reluctantly accepted (1st + Colbourne + Kadri) is fair to both teams. These players may not help the team now, but could be packaged for someone who could.

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11-11-2012, 05:23 PM
  #453
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Originally Posted by Drop the Sopel View Post
Lupul could potentially re-sign even if Toronto stinks it up yet again. Pretty big gamble to take for Burke though. Especially when you consider the potential ramifications with Kessel's pending free agency a year later.
Who knows what Burke's up to?

Leafs fans dream of a roster built upon:

Lupul - xxxx - Kessel
prospect - Grabo - prospect
prospect - prospect - prospect

Gardiner - Phaneuf
Rielly - Finn

The only way I see the vets sticking around is if Burke overpays them. Phaneuf for 6.5M might be the overpayment the Leafs make to keep their captain. Lupul for 6M? Sure why not.

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11-11-2012, 05:32 PM
  #454
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Originally Posted by blendini View Post
Too bad if you do bow out. I think you have been very fair and reasonable in your posts here. Some of the 'Nuck fans are anticipating way to much return on Lu, just as some Leaf fans underrate Lu's value. His contract stinks, yet the fans are not holding Gillis accountable. The trade that you reluctantly accepted (1st + Colbourne + Kadri) is fair to both teams. These players may not help the team now, but could be packaged for someone who could.
Agree.... Enjoy the rational debate
And agree that price is fair
I was just stating my wish moreso than expected return w jvr....

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11-11-2012, 05:47 PM
  #455
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Toronto isn't making the playoffs any time soon. Luongo doesn't want to go there.

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11-11-2012, 06:24 PM
  #456
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Agree.... Enjoy the rational debate
And agree that price is fair
I was just stating my wish moreso than expected return w jvr....
1st + Kadri + Colborne is fair?

Where am I?

2 prospects that won't crack the roster (cant even crack a lottery teams roster - that have hyped them beyond belief)likely for a few seasons and a 1st.

Why make that trade?

It's definitely not a trade you make during a season in which you're goal is cup or bust.

Kadri and Colborne are not blue chip prospects.

That package is terrible IMO.

I don't believe either prospect are desired by Gillis, nor do I think they come close to the value of a franchise goalie (33 is not old, and his contract circumvents the salary cap...only the misinformed/trolls call it an albatross).

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11-11-2012, 06:44 PM
  #457
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Originally Posted by ProspectProphet View Post
Toronto isn't making the playoffs any time soon. Luongo doesn't want to go there.
Sound a lot like what we heard in Lu's first year here, too. I'd say good to great goaltending could get them into the playoffs rather easily.

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11-11-2012, 07:00 PM
  #458
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Originally Posted by arsmaster View Post
1st + Kadri + Colborne is fair?

Where am I?

2 prospects that won't crack the roster (cant even crack a lottery teams roster - that have hyped them beyond belief)likely for a few seasons and a 1st.

Why make that trade?

It's definitely not a trade you make during a season in which you're goal is cup or bust.

Kadri and Colborne are not blue chip prospects.

That package is terrible IMO.

I don't believe either prospect are desired by Gillis, nor do I think they come close to the value of a franchise goalie (33 is not old, and his contract circumvents the salary cap...only the misinformed/trolls call it an albatross).
I think Kadri or Bozak, Kulemin and 1st is fair, though reasonable Leaf fans think its a bit much.

the fact that the market is poor is weighed in ...but I too am happy hanging onto him for now.

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11-11-2012, 07:08 PM
  #459
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Originally Posted by NYVanfan View Post
I think Kadri or Bozak, Kulemin and 1st is fair, though reasonable Leaf fans think its a bit much.

the fact that the market is poor is weighed in ...but I too am happy hanging onto him for now.
The HFboards market is poor...there's no rush.

At least with Kulemin you get an NHL quality piece....the prospects pick package from TO doesn't entice me in the slightest...not a fan of the prospects and don't trust our scouts with the pick.

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11-11-2012, 08:19 PM
  #460
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Originally Posted by arsmaster View Post
1st + Kadri + Colborne is fair?

Where am I?

2 prospects that won't crack the roster (cant even crack a lottery teams roster - that have hyped them beyond belief)likely for a few seasons and a 1st.

Why make that trade?

It's definitely not a trade you make during a season in which you're goal is cup or bust.

Kadri and Colborne are not blue chip prospects.

That package is terrible IMO.

I don't believe either prospect are desired by Gillis, nor do I think they come close to the value of a franchise goalie (33 is not old, and his contract circumvents the salary cap...only the misinformed/trolls call it an albatross).
I am not a troll and have followed the Canucks for many years. I didn't like that horrible contract when it was first signed and still don't. His cap hit may be ok, but the contract goes on and on (and maybe even after he retires). I obviously don't see the same value in Lu as you do.

I was suggesting that the young players acquired from TO could be packaged and traded for a player that the team needs. The 1st in itself will probably be an excellent prospect in a very good class. Both of the prospects were high draft picks and have solid potential.

I do not want to see the Canucks squander away a season with a 10m cap hit goalie tandem. Lu is ready to move on and I'm sure he doesn't want to squander away a season in Vancouver.

I guess we'll see which one of is right about Lu's value if/when the season gets going. Although I prefer your scenario to be right, I just don't have any faith in it.

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11-11-2012, 08:44 PM
  #461
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To TOR: Roberto Luongo
To MIN: Dion Phaneuf
To VAN: Dany Heatley

Now that's a blockbuster.

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11-11-2012, 08:44 PM
  #462
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Lupul, Bozak, and a conditional 1st on making the playoffs or it becomes a 2nd.

Fair deal, imo. Gives us a top-6 winger, a 3rd line C, and a very good chance at a solid prospect.

The Leafs make room for Colborne/Kadri to try out as their number 1 C, and sell high on a winger who likely wouldn't re-sign if the team decides to rebuild for a while. They are also guaranteed not to be burned Kessel style as the pick's conditional.

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11-11-2012, 08:44 PM
  #463
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Originally Posted by Tact View Post
To TOR: Roberto Luongo
To MIN: Dion Phaneuf
To VAN: Dany Heatley
I dont want Heatley at all

I love when the canucks face teams with him on the roster, hes so far from a threat, soft and even less of a threat when it matters

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11-11-2012, 08:48 PM
  #464
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I dont want Heatley at all

I love when the canucks face teams with him on the roster, hes so far from a threat, soft and even less of a threat when it matters
I don't know.

Sedin - Sedin - Burrows
Booth - Kesler - Heatley

Looks pretty badass.

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11-11-2012, 08:51 PM
  #465
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Originally Posted by Tact View Post
I don't know.

Sedin - Sedin - Burrows
Booth - Kesler - Heatley

Looks pretty badass.
Rather have Phaneuf than Heatley.

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11-11-2012, 08:53 PM
  #466
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Originally Posted by Tact View Post
I don't know.

Sedin - Sedin - Burrows
Booth - Kesler - Heatley

Looks pretty badass.
Yeah i think its the name that makes it appear more badass than it would be. Really watch him play these days and you'll be disappointed, definitely a shadow of his former self

Like MajorCanuck stated, Phaneuf brings a ton more

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11-11-2012, 08:54 PM
  #467
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Originally Posted by Tact View Post
I don't know.

Sedin - Sedin - Burrows
Booth - Kesler - Heatley

Looks pretty badass.
It's 2012, not 2006. Heatley is far from the player he used to be, and his cap hit is horrendous.

I'd much rather have Phaneuf over Heatley.
Phaneuf is still a top pairing d-man, I don't know if I can call Heatley a 1st liner anymore.

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Old
11-11-2012, 09:01 PM
  #468
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Last year, Heatley had 9 more points than Phaneuf. Cap hits are comparable and Heatley is 4 years older. I wouldn't mind a move for Phaneuf but than what would we do with Edler?

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11-11-2012, 09:02 PM
  #469
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Originally Posted by MajorCanuck View Post
Last year, Heatley had 9 more points than Phaneuf. Cap hits are comparable and Heatley is 4 years older. I wouldn't mind a move for Phaneuf but than what would we do with Edler?
Move up at the draft to select in the top 5?

Not saying i want any of this but just for the sake of answering your question

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11-11-2012, 09:04 PM
  #470
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Move up at the draft to select in the top 5?

Not saying i want any of this but just for the sake of answering your question
I actually wouldn't be against trading edler for a lottery pick or getting an amazing prospect or two. Imo Edler and Phaneuf are comparable, only dion has shown more consistency over his career.

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11-11-2012, 09:06 PM
  #471
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Last year, Heatley had 9 more points than Phaneuf. Cap hits are comparable and Heatley is 4 years older. I wouldn't mind a move for Phaneuf but than what would we do with Edler?
Re-sign Edler, flip Phaneuf for a forward.
We could do a 3-way trade like Tact suggested, but instead of getting Heatley, we get someone worth Phaneuf.

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11-11-2012, 09:07 PM
  #472
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It's 2012, not 2006. Heatley is far from the player he used to be, and his cap hit is horrendous.

I'd much rather have Phaneuf over Heatley.
Phaneuf is still a top pairing d-man, I don't know if I can call Heatley a 1st liner anymore.
Our need is a top 6 RW'er not another defencemen.

You make it seem like Roberto Luongo is on a sweetheart contract. I'd rather roll the dice on Heatley for 2 years than roll the dice with the Bozak's, Connolly's and Nazem Kadri's to be honest. And Heatley is more effective than Roberto Luongo sitting on the bench.

Where would Phaneuf fit with;

Hamhuis - Bieksa
Edler - Garrison
Ballard - Tanev

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11-11-2012, 09:09 PM
  #473
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Originally Posted by Tact View Post
Our need is a top 6 RW'er not another defencemen.

You make it seem like Roberto Luongo is on a sweetheart contract. I'd rather roll the dice on Heatley for 2 years than roll the dice with the Bozak's, Connolly's and Nazem Kadri's to be honest.

And Heatley is more effective than Roberto Luongo sitting on the bench.
You offered a deal where we give up Luongo and Toronto gives up Phaneuf. There is zero reason why Minny is in the trade, Phaneuf holds so much more value than Heatley.

Sure, we could still do a 3-way trade, but let's get a good player instead of a very overpaid 2nd liner past his prime.

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11-11-2012, 09:10 PM
  #474
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Originally Posted by Tact View Post
Our need is a top 6 RW'er not another defencemen.

You make it seem like Roberto Luongo is on a sweetheart contract. I'd rather roll the dice on Heatley for 2 years than roll the dice with the Bozak's, Connolly's and Nazem Kadri's to be honest.

And Heatley is more effective than Roberto Luongo sitting on the bench.
His cap hit is simply too high to take a risk on a declining player. He is still good, just not 7 mil good. I much rather role the dice on prospects/cheaper players temporarily and continue to find that RW fit, possibly using some of those same prospects/pieces to trade.

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11-11-2012, 09:11 PM
  #475
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tact View Post
Our need is a top 6 RW'er not another defencemen.

You make it seem like Roberto Luongo is on a sweetheart contract. I'd rather roll the dice on Heatley for 2 years than roll the dice with the Bozak's, Connolly's and Nazem Kadri's to be honest.

And Heatley is more effective than Roberto Luongo sitting on the bench.
Bozak is basically as valuable as Heatley in regards to what they bring to the ice these days. nevermind the difference in salary

And the suggested trades with Toronto included a package of prospects and a player like bozak.

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