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The Business of Hockey Discuss the financial and business aspects of the NHL. Topics may include the CBA, work stoppages, broadcast contracts, franchise sales, and NHL revenues.

Mark Recchi's advice to players is to sign CBA now

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Old
11-13-2012, 03:46 PM
  #51
catmanhabsfan
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Finally some thing sensible is said by a "player" Shocked it came from Dr Recchi's mouth though The hall of fame inductees said the right things too the other night. They showed a lot of class and professionalism, something missing in todays labour strife unfortunately.

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11-13-2012, 03:47 PM
  #52
Leafs87
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He's an MD and has a PHD in Labour Relations.

Impressive.
Add to that he is a doctor and a well respected human being

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11-13-2012, 03:50 PM
  #53
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Bill Gates Jimmy Pattison both highschool drop outs.Are they dumb or smart?One need not a university degree to be wealthy and powerful.Many of the rihest of rich never went to school but what they have is street smarts something you learn not by going to elitists schools?

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11-13-2012, 03:52 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by Mystlyfe View Post
And it took substantially less threat (or realization!) of a player strike to get that CBA approved than any of the CBA's the MLBPA negotiated with Donald Fehr at the helm.

And to suggest that the league's utilize lockouts any more readily than players utilize strikes is to completely ignore history. It was the NHL strike in 1992 and the MLB strike in 1994 that have forced the owner's current strategy. And in this specific case, it's been clear the obstructionist strategy pursued by the NHLPA for well over a year now.
What history is being ignored? Since 1994 and intervention of the courts, MLB has had no lockouts or strikes.

The NHL is on it's third lockout. One strike.

The NFL and NBA just had their own lockout.

Recent years--- more lockouts, no strikes.

If the common argument that the MLB strike led to all the lockouts were true, why hasn't MLB had any lockouts?

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11-13-2012, 03:55 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by Mystlyfe View Post
It doesn't take an MBA to look back at the three work stoppages you participated in during your career and say, "Man, I wish we did things differently."

Do you participate in a lockout as a player, or are you, you know, locked out?


Luntz deserves every penny he gets from Jacobs et al for finding a way to blame players for the actions of the owners.

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11-13-2012, 04:03 PM
  #56
Fred Brathwaite
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Originally Posted by Ernie View Post
That's pretty rich to accuse Fehr of playing hardball, but not Bettman.
Ok cool. They are both playing hardball. Happy?

Bettman and the NHL needs a season. Fehr does not. Fehr has nothing to lose. He could give two s***'s less if there is a season or not.

In my opinion this situation would be different if there was someone else representing the PA...which also would have lead to the two sides meeting back in January.

Bottom line- Fehrs approach to this whole thing has just been frustrating.


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Originally Posted by Soundwave View Post
The PA should've settled on 50-50 a long time ago, phased in gradually with the caveat that things like contract term and some level of front loading of deals be allowed to stay.

They could've avoided having the players to basically throw away 1/3-1/2 of their salary this season.

But noooooo. We had to lose a big chunk of the season, maybe even the entire season and the NHLPA is going to end up accepting 50-50 revenue split and a lot of what the owners want, everyone knows that.

couldnt agree more

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11-13-2012, 04:15 PM
  #57
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Great comments by Recchi.. a Player who has down this path and knows the money being lost is money lost forever. Now if only the majority of the players would start speaking out against the few wealthy players who are controlling the PA.

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11-13-2012, 04:20 PM
  #58
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Great comments by Recchi.. a Player who has down this path and knows the money being lost is money lost forever. Now if only the majority of the players would start speaking out against the few wealthy players who are controlling the PA.
Recchi is retired, easy for him to say now, he made his fair share in his career. No doubt a year lost is a bad idea, no question. I find it funny the amount of people here would would support and back up their management if they were to come to them tomorrow and be told, we're paying you too much, take a pay cut, work more hours and give up your injury rights etc... or you simply won't work again until you accept that.

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11-13-2012, 04:20 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by Fugu View Post
What history is being ignored? Since 1994 and intervention of the courts, MLB has had no lockouts or strikes.

The NHL is on it's third lockout. One strike.

The NFL and NBA just had their own lockout.

Recent years--- more lockouts, no strikes.

If the common argument that the MLB strike led to all the lockouts were true, why hasn't MLB had any lockouts?
MLB fans actually have the balls to stop their financial support of the league and players when it has work stoppages. Granted, I don't believe any MLB franchises have the season ticket waiting lists of certain NFL and NHL franchises.

Additionally, in 2006 and 2011, the MLB and MLBPA were able to work out a deal before the expiration of the previous CBA.

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11-13-2012, 04:22 PM
  #60
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Good for you Mark,bravo

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11-13-2012, 04:23 PM
  #61
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I never said that they should accept any of the NHL proposals. I am just saying if he actually wanted to get a deal done in time for a full season he would have met with the NHL sooner than a few months before training camp.
Where does this notion that simply talking leads to advances in collective bargaining ? The only leverage the players have is that if they dont sign then there will be no hockey. Right now its a stare down, the owners think that the players will crack and the players think that the monied owners ( who are losing the most money) will strongarm the weak sisters.

Remember that the NHL's inital offer was a complete reversal, the players going 57 to 43% of HRR. Having talks where donald Fehr looks across the table and asks " are you freaking crazy ?" would not advance anything.

The leverage only exists when games get cancelled or pay checks get missed. If the games are still getting played and the players are still getting paid there is no leverage to actually negotiate in good faith.

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11-13-2012, 04:24 PM
  #62
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And as for Crosby mouthing off,They should trade this kid to Phoenix and then ask him to pitch in to cover some of the operating losses. You want to be a partner? Go for it.

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11-13-2012, 04:25 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by Fugu View Post
Do you participate in a lockout as a player, or are you, you know, locked out?


Luntz deserves every penny he gets from Jacobs et al for finding a way to blame players for the actions of the owners.
Is this debate really so petty that we're going to jump on each other for semantic choices? The intent of that post wasn't to paint either party at fault, and I think that was pretty obvious.

But, to answer your question, the players/union (and the league) participated in the creation of the circumstances that led up to the lockout. Do we really need to rehash the series of events leading up to the lockout and argue over who's to blame for each of them?

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11-13-2012, 04:28 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by cashman rules View Post
And as for Crosby mouthing off,They should trade this kid to Phoenix and then ask him to pitch in to cover some of the operating losses. You want to be a partner? Go for it.

I think the ownership of the Yotes, future and current, would welcome that. It might actually help Gary find someone to buy the team.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mystlyfe View Post
Is this debate really so petty that we're going to jump on each other for semantic choices? The intent of that post wasn't to paint either party at fault, and I think that was pretty obvious.

But, to answer your question, the players/union (and the league) participated in the creation of the circumstances that led up to the lockout. Do we really need to rehash the series of events leading up to the lockout and argue over who's to blame for each of them?

There's nothing petty about a mischaracterization. A lockout is not a strike. They're polar opposites.

So, yes, we do need to re-hash an issue that is an industry trend.

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11-13-2012, 04:29 PM
  #65
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Originally Posted by Mystlyfe View Post
It doesn't take an MBA to look back at the three work stoppages you participated in during your career and say, "Man, I wish we did things differently."
Agreed with him on that point.

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Old
11-13-2012, 04:29 PM
  #66
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Originally Posted by Ernie View Post
I think it's funny how some people think the players should just roll over to the righteous demands of the owners.

Time to update your worldview, peeps.
Yes, because if you don't support people who make millions to play a game, clearly your worldview is completely messed up....

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11-13-2012, 04:30 PM
  #67
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Recchi is retired, easy for him to say now, he made his fair share in his career. No doubt a year lost is a bad idea, no question. I find it funny the amount of people here would would support and back up their management if they were to come to them tomorrow and be told, we're paying you too much, take a pay cut, work more hours and give up your injury rights etc... or you simply won't work again until you accept that.
You're missing the point of his comments entirely. he is simply telling the players that the money they are pissing away now is gone forever and that no better deal is in their future. At the end of it all the players are still going to be paid well beyond most people would ever dream so what exactly are they fighting for? I think Recchi's comments are the best we've heard the entire process.

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11-13-2012, 04:33 PM
  #68
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You're missing the point of his comments entirely. he is simply telling the players that the money they are pissing away now is gone forever and that no better deal is in their future. At the end of it all the players are still going to be paid well beyond most people would ever dream so what exactly are they fighting for? I think Recchi's comments are the best we've heard the entire process.

I think they know that, which comes back to why there is no deal yet.

The HRR is almost settled, Make Partial or Make Whole, choose your language.

The RS has been tweaked, and there's a growth fund.

The last CBA had a variance factor, so fix that..... that realistically should address every need the league has. At some point, the GMs and management need to be accountable for the rest of it.

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11-13-2012, 04:35 PM
  #69
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There's nothing petty about a mischaracterization. A lockout is not a strike. They're polar opposites.

So, yes, we do need to re-hash an issue that is an industry trend.
So, by that logic, the owners didn't participate in the 1992 strike? And the owners had no participation in the 1994 MLB strike?

BOTH SIDES participate in a work stoppage, whether it's a lockout or a strike. To paint it as a unilateral move completely ignores all context.

Let's re-hash those issues then. The NHLPA hired a man with a history of work stoppages and adversarial relations with owners as their head. The NHLPA blocked re-alignment. The NHLPA repeatedly delayed starting negotionations with the owners. That sure looks like the players participated in some of the circumstances leading up to the lockout. Are they solely to blame? No, obviously not. But they are most definitely active participants in this.

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11-13-2012, 04:36 PM
  #70
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Caved at the beginning of the lockout?
This is where you're fundamentally wrong. Nobody every said the players had to cave. But they had an offer of their own that was utterly ridiculous, designed for PR only, and not in good faith. Now, imagine that instead of doing that, they negotiated in good faith, met the NHL in the middle at the 50-50 everybody knew the owners were aiming for, and hammered out the details?

That gets us a season on time, or maybe slightly delayed at the worst, if the owners try to play hardball, though the NHL has never been the evil force in this NHLPA cheerleaders claim it's been.

Hiring Fehr ensured that there was never a good faith effort to negotiate at the beginning of the process, and not even an attempt to make a reasonable deal for both sides until there was significant pressure from players losing paychecks.

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11-13-2012, 04:36 PM
  #71
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Recchi is retired, easy for him to say now, he made his fair share in his career. No doubt a year lost is a bad idea, no question. I find it funny the amount of people here would would support and back up their management if they were to come to them tomorrow and be told, we're paying you too much, take a pay cut, work more hours and give up your injury rights etc... or you simply won't work again until you accept that.
Didn't know the players were being asked to work more hours and give up injury rights etc.

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11-13-2012, 04:37 PM
  #72
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Originally Posted by Fugu View Post
I think they know that, which comes back to why there is no deal yet.

The HRR is almost settled, Make Partial or Make Whole, choose your language.

The RS has been tweaked, and there's a growth fund.

The last CBA had a variance factor, so fix that..... that realistically should address every need the league has. At some point, the GMs and management need to be accountable for the rest of it.
It is not. Once the players agree to link the revenues to their share, they will be close.

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Old
11-13-2012, 04:38 PM
  #73
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Dr reechi sounds like hes getting kickbacks from the Pharmacutical companies

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11-13-2012, 04:43 PM
  #74
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Originally Posted by MikeK View Post
You're missing the point of his comments entirely. he is simply telling the players that the money they are pissing away now is gone forever and that no better deal is in their future. At the end of it all the players are still going to be paid well beyond most people would ever dream so what exactly are they fighting for? I think Recchi's comments are the best we've heard the entire process.
But it's not gone forever, the players are at 57% b/c they WON that part of the last negotiation. If they stayed at 54% (which they started at after the last lockout) they would probably be fighting off 48% and come the next lockout, they will be fighting off 45%. I don't believe they are "losing" money in the long term, definitely in the short term though.

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11-13-2012, 04:44 PM
  #75
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Didn't know the players were being asked to work more hours and give up injury rights etc.
you missed the point. I assumed that most people on here, don't file for arbitration, unrestricted free agency and restricted free agency. I used those as an example.

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