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[MIA / TOR] Big Blockbuster (Reyes, Johnson, Buerhle to TOR)

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Old
11-13-2012, 09:42 PM
  #201
Reality Check
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Marlins got what they wanted(new stadium) and their fans got the status quo.

Hard to blame any of them for not caring.

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Old
11-13-2012, 09:46 PM
  #202
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Old
11-13-2012, 09:51 PM
  #203
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Mark Buehrle's turf stats aren't that bad are they?

238 IP 274 H 116 ER 56 BB 149 K

I believe his K and BB ratio's work out to around his career averages. I believe he gives up slightly more hits. I don't see how one can say his stats on turf aren't good. They are similar to his career norms.

While Josh Johnson's injury history is a worry, If he can rebound, I do like this deal for the Jays. His injury in 2011 had no structural damage (IIRC) but just a reoccurring shoulder inflammation problem. Johnson's biggest worry is the lost velocity on his FB. It went' from being 94-95 consistently to around 93. It may not seem like much, but it has an effect. If he can regain that lost velocity, I think we could see the ace that we have in seasons past. I do think his velocity will come back as he'll go into next year after a full off season of workouts instead of rehabbing but who knows.

With regards to Reyes, I think he underperformed last year. I think he has the ability to better. How much? Who knows.

I think it's a great trade for the Jays. Is there risk? Of course, their 3 core pieces returning include 2 guys with past injury problems and 1 guy who is aging. With that said, I'm not too hot on the return the Marlins got. I like this for the Jays though.

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Old
11-13-2012, 09:52 PM
  #204
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What the Jays roster looks like right now after this trade (obviously this is just a guess but I'm confident on at least 23 of the 25 - Gose, D'Arnaud, and Sierra would fight for spots as well);

LINEUP
SS Jose Reyes
CF Colby Rasmus
RF Jose Bautista
DH/1B Edwin Encarnacion
1B/DH Adam Lind
3B Brett Lawrie
2B Emilio Bonifacio
C J.P. Arencibia
LF Rajai Davis

BENCH
OF Mosies Sierra
IF Maicer Izturis
1B David Cooper
C John Buck

STARTERS
SP Josh Johnson
SP Brandon Morrow
SP Mark Buerhle
SP Ricky Romero
SP J.A. Happ

BULLPEN
RP Esmil Rogers
RP Aaron Loup
RP Steve Delabar
RP Luis Perez
RP Sergio Santos
SU Darren Oliver
CP Casey Janssen

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Old
11-13-2012, 09:53 PM
  #205
Reality Check
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackhawkswincup View Post
Anyone who tries to defend this trade like Olney is as far as value goes is insane

Remember how blue chip prospects like Maybin/Miller worked out for Marlins in Cabrera trade?

Proven MLB talent >>> Prospects
True...but Andrew Miller was already showing signs in Detroit that he wasn't going to live up to the hype.

I don't actually think the value isn't that bad for Miami and they didn't trade anyone near the caliber of Cabrera here. But I'd be absolutely pissed if I were a fan of that team.

Just more proof that people shouldn't even bother to pay attention and that despite being an idiot, Ozzie Guillen was right about that franchise.

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Old
11-13-2012, 09:56 PM
  #206
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HawkeyeCB View Post
What the Jays roster looks like right now after this trade (obviously this is just a guess but I'm confident on at least 23 of the 25 - Gose, D'Arnaud, and Sierra would fight for spots as well);

LINEUP
SS Jose Reyes
CF Colby Rasmus
RF Jose Bautista
DH/1B Edwin Encarnacion
1B/DH Adam Lind
3B Brett Lawrie
2B Emilio Bonifacio
C J.P. Arencibia
LF Rajai Davis

BENCH
OF Mosies Sierra
IF Maicer Izturis
1B David Cooper
C John Buck

STARTERS
SP Josh Johnson
SP Brandon Morrow
SP Mark Buerhle
SP Ricky Romero
SP J.A. Happ

BULLPEN
RP Esmil Rogers
RP Aaron Loup
RP Steve Delabar
RP Luis Perez
RP Sergio Santos
SU Darren Oliver
CP Casey Janssen
Change Rasmus with Lawrie. Then I like our lineup even if Rajai is on LF but that is one scary offence.

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Old
11-13-2012, 09:57 PM
  #207
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Here's an article Jeff Passan wrote in July about Loria, Samson, and the Marlins conning Miami:

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/marlins...-stadium-.html

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Old
11-13-2012, 10:04 PM
  #208
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Wow I can honestly say I never saw this type of trade happening and hopefully it makes the Blue Jays a better team next season.

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Old
11-13-2012, 10:13 PM
  #209
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If you want to see reactions from Marlin fans:

http://forums.marlinsbaseball.com/to...io-to-toronto/

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Old
11-13-2012, 10:17 PM
  #210
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Better question is when will the Giancarlo Stanton sweepstakes begin? Sure, he's under team control for a while and will be arbitration eligible for several years before potentially hitting the open market, but I doubt he has any intentions of signing long-term in Miami.

Wow, what a deal for the Blue Jays. They have the pieces for a serious run next year.

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Old
11-13-2012, 10:27 PM
  #211
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Keith Law already predicting that Johnson is no more than a one-year rental.

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Old
11-13-2012, 10:38 PM
  #212
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PanthersPens62 View Post
Another Marlins fan checking in.......one who had a 20 game season ticket plan last season. Words cannot describe the disgust I am feeling right now. Rest assured I will not be renewing. I'll go to a Saturday night game here and there just because I love the game. Here is a link to a Marlins message board I visit so you can all see how disgusted the fanbase is:

http://forums.marlinsbaseball.com/to...io-to-toronto/

I have defended Loria over the years, mainly because of the 2003 championship and because he got us the ballpark we desperately needed (and its NOT local taxpayers paying for it.....its all tied to tourist taxes), but I'm done. Rest assured we will lose Stanton over this. I can't see any free agent with an IQ over 50 wanting to come here anymore.

Jays fans......what can you tell me about these prospects? I hear most are top line, but are they good enough to get us in contention in the next couple years?

Oh & IX......you officially have my permission to post pictures every night come April of what will certainly be a near empty Marlins Park. I can't believe how embarrassed I feel right now to be a Marlins fan
Tweeted Glenn Geffner last night and said I enjoyed his work on Marlins radio and looked forward to next season

And then he said back that 2013 will be here before you know it

Then today happened :|

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Old
11-13-2012, 10:39 PM
  #213
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reality Check View Post
Keith Law already predicting that Johnson is no more than a one-year rental.
Based on what?

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Old
11-13-2012, 10:52 PM
  #214
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Cliff Corcoran doing his best to piss me off...

Quote:
All of that to acquire five starting players from a team that won just 69 games in 2012, which begs the question: If a team that won just 73 games acquires one-fifth of the roster of a team that won just 69, did it really get any better?
Really Cliff? Really? Are you an idiot?

If you take the best fifth of the team, you undoubtedly get better.

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Old
11-13-2012, 10:52 PM
  #215
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He works for ESPN can't say anything nice about Toronto without saying something negative.

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Old
11-13-2012, 10:58 PM
  #216
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Originally Posted by LuckyLager View Post
Based on what?
Him having one year left on his contract.

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Old
11-13-2012, 11:08 PM
  #217
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Avs_19 View Post
Here's an article Jeff Passan wrote in July about Loria, Samson, and the Marlins conning Miami:

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/marlins...-stadium-.html
Sooo many stupid people.

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Old
11-13-2012, 11:13 PM
  #218
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Im done, absolutely DONE, with the Marlins. Ive been a fan since Hough's first pitch in 93, but enough is enough! We have been cheated, lied to, and stolen from too many times, and Im tired of it. How does MLB allow something like this to go on. Loria obviously cares about the his pockets only, and not about the people that are most important to a sports franchise, its fans! The organization is a joke, and anyone who spends a DIME on this team next year is an idiot. Nothing would make me happier than to see that stadium empty on Opening Day next year.

And to think, the City of Miami could have used the money Loria stole to get his stadium, on renovating the Orange Bowl for the Hurricanes, or SunLife for the Dolphins. The Marlins should be ashamed of themselves not only for this deal, but also for tarnishing the land that they play on. Unfortunately, since they have a new stadium, they cannot be contracted. Too bad, because the Marlins would be much more exciting if they were.

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Old
11-13-2012, 11:27 PM
  #219
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MurrayBannerman View Post
Him having one year left on his contract.
where does he get grounds on johnson not signing a new deal?

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Old
11-13-2012, 11:34 PM
  #220
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Originally Posted by TML g u n n e R s View Post
where does he get grounds on johnson not signing a new deal?
@keithlaw
That's all the Jays acquired. RT @ETod09: @keithlaw Does your view on the trade change if Johnson is 1 and done?

That's what I'm 90% sure what was being talked about.

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Old
11-13-2012, 11:42 PM
  #221
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Miami picked up a few good prospects. In last week's Baseball America Rankings Marisnick was ranked as the # 2 Blue Jays prospect, Nicolino was ranked as the # 5 prospect and Hechavarria was ranked # 8.

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Old
11-14-2012, 12:39 AM
  #222
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Wow can't believe they Jays Pulled this off. So excited!

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Old
11-14-2012, 12:40 AM
  #223
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Originally Posted by pb1300 View Post
Im done, absolutely DONE, with the Marlins. Ive been a fan since Hough's first pitch in 93, but enough is enough! We have been cheated, lied to, and stolen from too many times, and Im tired of it. How does MLB allow something like this to go on. Loria obviously cares about the his pockets only, and not about the people that are most important to a sports franchise, its fans! The organization is a joke, and anyone who spends a DIME on this team next year is an idiot. Nothing would make me happier than to see that stadium empty on Opening Day next year.

And to think, the City of Miami could have used the money Loria stole to get his stadium, on renovating the Orange Bowl for the Hurricanes, or SunLife for the Dolphins. The Marlins should be ashamed of themselves not only for this deal, but also for tarnishing the land that they play on. Unfortunately, since they have a new stadium, they cannot be contracted. Too bad, because the Marlins would be much more exciting if they were.
How would they upgrade SunLife without giving the Marlins a new stadium first?

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Old
11-14-2012, 12:51 AM
  #224
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Originally Posted by PanthersPens62 View Post
Looks like it was taken during one of the Marlins/Dodgers game. But yeah, there has been speculation even before this travesty occured tonight that Giancarlo's dream is to play for the Dodgers and that as soon as he is eligible for FA, he will sign there.
WOAH, WOAH, WOAH!!! Who speculated that?!? You mean the Dodgers could be looking at an outfield of Stanton, Kemp, and Eithier?!? Outfield wet dream....

Go Dodgers!!!

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Old
11-14-2012, 01:10 AM
  #225
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This trade isnt as bad for the Marlins as many think it is.

First off, they get rid of bad contracts. Reyes had a healthy season last year and that isnt the usual status quo. He will help the Jays when he is healthy, and now he doesnt have the burden of living up to that contract now in Toronto and will no doubt be back where he usually is on the DL. Good, not great player whose career year was when he was in a contract year. Better then what the Jays had, but thats not saying much.

Buehrle was the best piece in this deal. An inning eater who has a proven track record for being a winner. A WS champion who should be the guy to mentor the young guys in Toronto. He will give you 200 innings, but he is past his prime. That back loaded contract will be an albatross soon enough.

JJ is one year. I, imo, highly doubt he wants to stay in Toronto after this year. I question his health, but think he should be energized next year pitching for his payday.

The rest was fluff.

And the Marlins fleeced a bevy of the Jays farm system while getting rid of all those huge contracts and dropping their payroll down to 16 mil. Not bad. Loria is a huge piece of trash and doesnt deserve that team, but in reality, its his team to do as he pleases. In a business stand point, its a brilliant move.

How does this help the Jays? Well, theres still the Yankees and Rays in that division. This traded doesnt make them closer to that caliber of team, imo. A huge trade didnt help the Dodgers last year and this one, with even more question marks, doesnt magicly place the Jays into a position of being a contender.

The Jays got bigger names, but the Marlins get piece of mind and can restart the building by taking many pieces from one of the best prospect pools in baseball. The Jays put all of their eggs in one basket and are hoping next year is the year, it seems.

Right now, its a toss up. We shall see what happens in a few months.

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