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Lockout thread #2: mediation done - no progress

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Old
11-13-2012, 11:42 PM
  #26
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Originally Posted by devils4cup View Post
I disagree. I am 100% not on the players side however I don't think someone who is in business with an NHL owner holds any weight in my eyes. If Shanahan made the same comments i would feel the same way since he is close with the upper management of the league.

I just feel that Recchi should just keep his big yap shut and let the process play out rather than give his opinions on a negotiation he has absolutely no stake in.
He is a former player and has numerous friends who are still in the game. That holds as much or more weight than being a partner in a junior franchise with an nhl owner.

What does he say that isnt truthful?

Both sides are losing money going forward.

That's a fact.

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11-14-2012, 12:09 AM
  #27
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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
He is a former player and has numerous friends who are still in the game. That holds as much or more weight than being a partner in a junior franchise with an nhl owner.

What does he say that isnt truthful?

Both sides are losing money going forward.

That's a fact.
ya, not to mention he owns a WHL team. that is a totally differnt ball game than the NHL. Clearly his comments are legit. If he was a actual NHL owner, then sure, you could say he is bias. I think his comments are just from some one who understands the game from both ends.

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11-14-2012, 12:15 AM
  #28
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A lot of former NHLers are pleading with the players to settle. After the last lockout Bill Guerin said something to the effect of, "It's an owners league and we may as well face it."

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11-14-2012, 12:27 AM
  #29
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ya, not to mention he owns a WHL team. that is a totally differnt ball game than the NHL. Clearly his comments are legit. If he was a actual NHL owner, then sure, you could say he is bias. I think his comments are just from some one who understands the game from both ends.
Yeah, I would imagine most Junior teams are more or less something to help out come tax time for most of the owners.

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11-14-2012, 03:22 AM
  #30
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@TSNBobMcKenzie: Don't think it's post-traumatic stress from losing money clip, but in all seriousness, never felt as discouraged about state of NHL as today

Frankly I really have disliked mckenzie's extreme pessimism since day one the guys been saying there would be no season we are now 60 days in and he's as pessimistic as ever granted hope is fading but come on lighten up

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11-14-2012, 05:38 AM
  #31
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I love how TSN keeps posting articles about Sidney Crosby's take on the lockout/negotiation process.

I know when I'm looking for information on CBA negotiations in a multibillion dollar business, my gut instinct is to ask a whiny 25 year old with no post-secondary education.

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Old
11-14-2012, 05:50 AM
  #32
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Originally Posted by The Human Torch View Post
I love how TSN keeps posting articles about Sidney Crosby's take on the lockout/negotiation process.

I know when I'm looking for information on CBA negotiations in a multibillion dollar business, my gut instinct is to ask a whiny 25 year old with no post-secondary education.
They should try to get Shawn Horcoff's input into the lockout/negotiation process.I do believe that he has his master's degree.



Field of study is Mathematics and Finance.


Last edited by oilersfan11: 11-14-2012 at 05:56 AM.
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Old
11-14-2012, 06:59 AM
  #33
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Originally Posted by 402 View Post
@TSNBobMcKenzie: Don't think it's post-traumatic stress from losing money clip, but in all seriousness, never felt as discouraged about state of NHL as today

Frankly I really have disliked mckenzie's extreme pessimism since day one the guys been saying there would be no season we are now 60 days in and he's as pessimistic as ever granted hope is fading but come on lighten up
He is the media, and he tells his followers how they feel. If he is pessimistic then the pessimism of his of his followers is justified. Not to get too political, but it's similar to FOX's pessimism over Obama, though things really aren't going to change. It's the illusion of a false reality that sells.

Also, if he were optimistic and things didn't turn out well, how ****** would that be for the fans who believed him? This way, if there is a season, people will be even more elated.

/conspiracy

/but not really

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Old
11-14-2012, 07:23 AM
  #34
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Originally Posted by 402 View Post
@TSNBobMcKenzie: Don't think it's post-traumatic stress from losing money clip, but in all seriousness, never felt as discouraged about state of NHL as today

Frankly I really have disliked mckenzie's extreme pessimism since day one the guys been saying there would be no season we are now 60 days in and he's as pessimistic as ever granted hope is fading but come on lighten up
What has he said that is untrue. Eternal optimists might not be fans of the pessimism coming from the likes of Bobby Mac, Dreger and Lebrun but they have been pretty spot on thus far. Why in the world should they be optimistic; to blow smoke up the fans rears?

Whether you like it or not, the NHL is headed down a very dark road and i don't see any indication that it will be prevented, we as fans might as well accept that this season is done and possibly next season as well.
Fehr seems intent to blow this league up to teach Bettman a lesson and there are some owners who would actually benefit from a season long lockout financially which is all that really matters to them so this is a dangerous time for the NHL especially if Fehr looks to aboilsh the cap which is a real possibility.


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Old
11-14-2012, 08:24 AM
  #35
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What has he said that is untrue. Eternal optimists might not be fans of the pessimism coming from the likes of Bobby Mac, Dreger and Lebrun but they have been pretty spot on thus far. Why in the world should they be optimistic; to blow smoke up the fans rears?

Whether you like it or not, the NHL is headed down a very dark road and i don't see any indication that it will be prevented, we as fans might as well accept that this season is done and possibly next season as well.
Fehr seems intent to blow this league up to teach Bettman a lesson and there are some owners who would actually benefit from a season long lockout financially which is all that really matters to them so this is a dangerous time for the NHL especially if Fehr looks to aboilsh the cap which is a real possibility.
If there's no salary cap,you can pretty much guarantee that there will be no more than 25 teams in the future.

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11-14-2012, 08:31 AM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 402 View Post
@TSNBobMcKenzie: Don't think it's post-traumatic stress from losing money clip, but in all seriousness, never felt as discouraged about state of NHL as today

Frankly I really have disliked mckenzie's extreme pessimism since day one the guys been saying there would be no season we are now 60 days in and he's as pessimistic as ever granted hope is fading but come on lighten up
He said from day one he really didn't care anymore. He said the last lockout it was a pain in the arse having to spend everyday covering something that there really wasn't there to cover.

If I was TSN I'd just allow him to step away from the lockout and cover more junior hockey, where his passion is. There are enough other guys at TSN who could give us a weather update.

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Old
11-14-2012, 09:09 AM
  #37
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I agree with Joe. It seems to me that Bob is legitimately upset by the lockout but in his position as one of the trusted voices out there, he doesn't really have a choice.

There's so much drama and tactical play here it's pretty difficult to get a real take on where we're at.

Fehr and Bettman are obviously the bad cops, and Daly and Fehr Jr are the good cops. That's about all I can figure out so far.

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Old
11-14-2012, 09:56 AM
  #38
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Originally Posted by oilersfan11 View Post
They should try to get Shawn Horcoff's input into the lockout/negotiation process.I do believe that he has his master's degree.



Field of study is Mathematics and Finance.
did not know that about Horcoff, makes a lot of sense actually because he is one of the brighter NHL players, IMO

I would like to get Ryan SMyth's view on this. I would imagine it would go soemthing like

Well obviously, we would like to be playing, but both sides are going to have to give 110%, obviously. Uhhh, great effort by Fehrsy on that last round and it is up to the rest of us to pick up the slack.

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Old
11-14-2012, 10:23 AM
  #39
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Originally Posted by The Human Torch View Post
I love how TSN keeps posting articles about Sidney Crosby's take on the lockout/negotiation process.

I know when I'm looking for information on CBA negotiations in a multibillion dollar business, my gut instinct is to ask a whiny 25 year old with no post-secondary education.
Yeah shame on him for becoming a multimillionaire at 18 years of age instead of going to college, I mean post-secondary education is the only way to measure intelligence. There's no such thing as a dumb college grad......

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11-14-2012, 11:02 AM
  #40
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Yeah shame on him for becoming a multimillionaire at 18 years of age instead of going to college, I mean post-secondary education is the only way to measure intelligence. There's no such thing as a dumb college grad......
Well ya just look how smart all NFL and NBA players are............

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Old
11-14-2012, 11:04 AM
  #41
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Originally Posted by Bryanbryoil View Post
Yeah shame on him for becoming a multimillionaire at 18 years of age instead of going to college, I mean post-secondary education is the only way to measure intelligence. There's no such thing as a dumb college grad......
Are you seriously equating getting rich from playing a game with having a broad, encyclopaedic level of knowledge in the world of high finance and negotiation? Or did I miss the part where Crosby obtained his MBA while hitting a piece of frozen rubber with a stick and taking multiple blows to the head?

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11-14-2012, 11:13 AM
  #42
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Originally Posted by okgooil View Post
ya, not to mention he owns a WHL team. that is a totally differnt ball game than the NHL. Clearly his comments are legit. If he was a actual NHL owner, then sure, you could say he is bias. I think his comments are just from some one who understands the game from both ends.
...not to mention they are coming from an ex-player who endured a few of the leagues lock-outs and shortened seasons.

He is spot on. Both sides are currently losing however, the palyers have more to lose by not playing than the owners that's a fact.

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Old
11-14-2012, 11:16 AM
  #43
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Originally Posted by The Human Torch View Post
I love how TSN keeps posting articles about Sidney Crosby's take on the lockout/negotiation process.

I know when I'm looking for information on CBA negotiations in a multibillion dollar business, my gut instinct is to ask a whiny 25 year old with no post-secondary education.
He's pretty much the face of the league in terms of the players.

However I do agree that his take is a joke becuase this lockout only exists for players like him Stamkos, Ovechkin and basically the top 10% paid players in the league. So of course Sid is gonna stand there and demand that they need more. He has millions to sit on while these two sides fight it out and he has many more millions coming to him when they decide to resume.

I suspect we will see a similar trend to the alst lockout where 4th liners who were regulars last season will not see a regular NHL job if at all when it does resume.

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Old
11-14-2012, 11:17 AM
  #44
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Are you seriously equating getting rich from playing a game with having a broad, encyclopaedic level of knowledge in the world of high finance and negotiation? Or did I miss the part where Crosby obtained his MBA while hitting a piece of frozen rubber with a stick and taking multiple blows to the head?
My point is this, why in the world would he go to college when he was faced with making more in one year than most college grads make in their lifetimes? Saying that Crosby shouldn't be speaking because he didn't go to school beyond HS is ridiculous. Why hire Fehr when you could have NHLPA NCAA grads doing his job? Also taking Horcoff for example, do you expect him to have an Encyclopedic knowledge of something that he graduated from, oh 12 years ago? Has he been taking night classes to keep sharp in the event that he gets bought out and ends up in the poor house when he's made $30+ million in his career or has he not given a crap about it since making many millions?

Crosby's face and voice means more than Horcoff's does, is there one person out there that's saying "man I'm jonesing to see Horcoff play right now!" or "man I wish I could get Horcoff's take on this"?

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11-14-2012, 11:17 AM
  #45
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you would think the vet players would have learned something last time there was a lockout. if they would have taken the original deal the owners offered they would have been way better off. they didnt and they lost bad. The same thing will happen again. The owners will hold out as long as they need to, i dont see them caving.

you would think the Horcoffs, Doans, Koivu, Iginla, Smyth etc etc would be pushing to get this deal done soon, their window is small for playing careers and they would be best served on the ice. If they dont then that is there choice but is sacrificing the last years of their careers to help the younger kids get a few more dollars then that is there choice.

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11-14-2012, 11:19 AM
  #46
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Originally Posted by CupofOil View Post
What has he said that is untrue. Eternal optimists might not be fans of the pessimism coming from the likes of Bobby Mac, Dreger and Lebrun but they have been pretty spot on thus far. Why in the world should they be optimistic; to blow smoke up the fans rears?

Whether you like it or not, the NHL is headed down a very dark road and i don't see any indication that it will be prevented, we as fans might as well accept that this season is done and possibly next season as well.
Fehr seems intent to blow this league up to teach Bettman a lesson and there are some owners who would actually benefit from a season long lockout financially which is all that really matters to them so this is a dangerous time for the NHL especially if Fehr looks to aboilsh the cap which is a real possibility.
Next season will not be lost. The players will can Fehr before that ever happens. Most these baffoons will have 90% of their money spent by the new year and will be crying to just take whatever and get going. From here on out the NHL's offers will keep on decreasing. The PA has absolutely no leverage and if Fehr and his union think they are somekind of freedom fighters they will only continue to hurt themselves.

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11-14-2012, 11:20 AM
  #47
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My point is this, why in the world would he go to college when he was faced with making more in one year than most college grads make in their lifetimes? Saying that Crosby shouldn't be speaking because he didn't go to school beyond HS is ridiculous. Why hire Fehr when you could have NHLPA NCAA grads doing his job? Also taking Horcoff for example, do you expect him to have an Encyclopedic knowledge of something that he graduated from, oh 12 years ago? Has he been taking night classes to keep sharp in the event that he gets bought out and ends up in the poor house when he's made $30+ million in his career or has he not given a crap about it since making many millions?

Crosby's face and voice means more than Horcoff's does, is there one person out there that's saying "man I'm jonesing to see Horcoff play right now!"?
i think the point is we dont want to hear crosby talk about economics and finance which he doesnt have an extensive background in.

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11-14-2012, 11:22 AM
  #48
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He's pretty much the face of the league in terms of the players.

However I do agree that his take is a joke becuase this lockout only exists for players like him Stamkos, Ovechkin and basically the top 10% paid players in the league. So of course Sid is gonna stand there and demand that they need more. He has millions to sit on while these two sides fight it out and he has many more millions coming to him when they decide to resume.

I suspect we will see a similar trend to the alst lockout where 4th liners who were regulars last season will not see a regular NHL job if at all when it does resume.
I agree that it'd be good to hear from guys that have more at stake (ie guys that may very well lose their careers due to this lockout). That said make sure that they are college educated, we don't need some idiot that had to fight and claw his way to that point from the WHL telling us what's what.....

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11-14-2012, 11:23 AM
  #49
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Are you seriously equating getting rich from playing a game with having a broad, encyclopaedic level of knowledge in the world of high finance and negotiation? Or did I miss the part where Crosby obtained his MBA while hitting a piece of frozen rubber with a stick and taking multiple blows to the head?
No he's saying you're sterotyping people for saying they are stupid because they don't have a post-secondary education when there are a lot of people who do have post-secondary educations in this world that are complete dumb-*****.

Do you by chance have a post-secondary education and weren't able to comprehend that?

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11-14-2012, 11:23 AM
  #50
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i think the point is we dont want to hear crosby talk about economics and finance which he doesnt have an extensive background in.
Without listening to the interviews, if you want a crash course in economics and finance I'm sure that there are some online courses somewhere. Like it or not, he is the face of the NHLPA and no player holds more clout than he does.

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