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Lockout thread #2: mediation done - no progress

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Old
11-14-2012, 12:25 PM
  #51
Reimer
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Originally Posted by CornKicker View Post
i think the point is we dont want to hear crosby talk about economics and finance which he doesnt have an extensive background in.
When it comes to the game of hockey and the NHL I guarantee he understands it better than most of us. Obviously he's going to be biased towards his side regardless.

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11-14-2012, 12:27 PM
  #52
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I agree that it'd be good to hear from guys that have more at stake (ie guys that may very well lose their careers due to this lockout). That said make sure that they are college educated, we don't need some idiot that had to fight and claw his way to that point from the WHL telling us what's what.....
Well so far to start the lockout Bisonette was pretty vocal about getting what's right. He has since been rather quiet on twitter in regards to what the players need.

Probably realizes that his years of making easy big money are coming to an end.

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11-14-2012, 12:28 PM
  #53
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Originally Posted by Reimer View Post
No he's saying you're sterotyping people for saying they are stupid because they don't have a post-secondary education when there are a lot of people who do have post-secondary educations in this world that are complete dumb-*****.

Do you by chnace have a post-secondary education and weren't able to comprehend that?
Bingo. If he said something like Crosby has no clue WTF is going on, perhaps they should find a player that has a better grasp on the subject/has a brain to give us their take" then I wouldn't have had an issue with the comment. As it stands at 18 years of age Crosby had a choice, make multi millions or go to college. Now seeing how many people go to college to try to increase their earning potential, I find it ridiculous to cut the guy because he made more in year at the age of 18 than many college grads will make between the ages of 22-62 and by year 2 or 3 more than all but the vast majority of college grads.

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Old
11-14-2012, 12:29 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
He is a former player and has numerous friends who are still in the game. That holds as much or more weight than being a partner in a junior franchise with an nhl owner.

What does he say that isnt truthful?

Both sides are losing money going forward.

That's a fact.

Maybe my dislike for Recchi is more the problem.

He has made some outrageous comments in the past so now whatever he says i take with a huge grain of salt.

I agree both sides are losing money. Did we need Recchi to point it out to us?

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11-14-2012, 12:31 PM
  #55
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Bingo. If he said something like Crosby has no clue WTF is going on, perhaps they should find a player that has a better grasp on the subject/has a brain to give us their take" then I wouldn't have had an issue with the comment. As it stands at 18 years of age Crosby had a choice, make multi millions or go to college. Now seeing how many people go to college to try to increase their earning potential, I find it ridiculous to cut the guy because he made more in year at the age of 18 than many college grads will make between the ages of 22-62 and by year 2 or 3 more than all but the vast majority of college grads.
That and it's pretty clear that the poster who made the initial comment just dislikes Crosby because well...he's Crosby. Sounds like all the typical Gretzky haters in the 80's. Hell I was only born in the mid-80's and I know how most of the leagues fans(that were't Oiler fans) treated Gretzky.

They basically complained and trash talked him openly while having a secret inside man crush on the dude.

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Old
11-14-2012, 12:32 PM
  #56
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Well so far to start the lockout Bisonette was pretty vocal about getting what's right. He has since been rather quiet on twitter in regards to what the players need.

Probably realizes that his years of making easy big money are coming to an end.
Yeah, and while it sucks for him, IMO it sucks way more for guys like Corey Potter. Yeah I'm not a fan of his as a player, but this 2 year deal that he signed with us was probably his retirement contract (in terms of putting a ton of money into a house/retirement funds/etc.). With the possibility of 1 way NHL deals in the AHL counting towards the cap, you will see a lot less money being thrown to guys like him IMO.

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11-14-2012, 12:32 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by devils4cup View Post
Maybe my dislike for Recchi is more the problem.

He has made some outrageous comments in the past so now whatever he says i take with a huge grain of salt.

I agree both sides are losing money. Did we need Recchi to point it out to us?
Likely didn't need Recchi to point it out but was Recchi trying to make his comments public or did the media just latch onto something and make it public like they usually do?

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11-14-2012, 12:34 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by Bryanbryoil View Post
My point is this, why in the world would he go to college when he was faced with making more in one year than most college grads make in their lifetimes? Saying that Crosby shouldn't be speaking because he didn't go to school beyond HS is ridiculous. Why hire Fehr when you could have NHLPA NCAA grads doing his job? Also taking Horcoff for example, do you expect him to have an Encyclopedic knowledge of something that he graduated from, oh 12 years ago? Has he been taking night classes to keep sharp in the event that he gets bought out and ends up in the poor house when he's made $30+ million in his career or has he not given a crap about it since making many millions?

Crosby's face and voice means more than Horcoff's does, is there one person out there that's saying "man I'm jonesing to see Horcoff play right now!" or "man I wish I could get Horcoff's take on this"?
Makes sense. Quit working on his game to keep his economics up to date.

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11-14-2012, 12:34 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by CupofOil View Post
What has he said that is untrue. Eternal optimists might not be fans of the pessimism coming from the likes of Bobby Mac, Dreger and Lebrun but they have been pretty spot on thus far. Why in the world should they be optimistic; to blow smoke up the fans rears?

Whether you like it or not, the NHL is headed down a very dark road and i don't see any indication that it will be prevented, we as fans might as well accept that this season is done and possibly next season as well.
Fehr seems intent to blow this league up to teach Bettman a lesson and there are some owners who would actually benefit from a season long lockout financially which is all that really matters to them so this is a dangerous time for the NHL especially if Fehr looks to aboilsh the cap which is a real possibility.
He hasn't said anything untrue but he hasn't been really stating much facts he's just giving his opinion which is fine, maybe its just me but bobby mac seem gloomier then the other guys i mean everyone gets that we are not in the best position and this lovkout isn't about to end dont get me wrong i've always liked the guy but maybe he needs to go on vacation til the end of the lockout
At this point i'm not really needing someone to tell me how bad a situation we're in

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Old
11-14-2012, 12:35 PM
  #60
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James Mirtle ‏@mirtle

Interesting NHL says players are asking for 65% in Year 1. NHLPA number was $1.91-billion; that would mean league revenues of $2.95-billion.

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Old
11-14-2012, 12:52 PM
  #61
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James Mirtle ‏@mirtle

Interesting NHL says players are asking for 65% in Year 1. NHLPA number was $1.91-billion; that would mean league revenues of $2.95-billion.
Wait....They are asking for more money now? I'm not sure I understand the PA's negotiations. You are supposed to get closer in numbers not further apart.

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11-14-2012, 12:55 PM
  #62
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James Mirtle ‏@mirtle
I don't think anyone actually believes the players are going to ask for 65% of HRR - the $1.91-billion figure would have to be prorated.

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11-14-2012, 01:09 PM
  #63
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Law Article

Here's a report done by the Denver Law Journal on Fehr I posted on the main board. The hockey stuff starts on page 44.

Delves into the history of the MLBPA, Fehr's role from the 80's until recently, and his role with the NHLPA.

Some interesting stuff about his using the NHL to get out of his predecessor's shadow and prove himself. You ask me, that kind of prideful display should not be welcome.

Also interesting how he didn't accept the job with the NHLPA until they changed the constitution allowing him more power.

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Old
11-14-2012, 01:14 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by Wretched Oil View Post
Law Article

Here's a report done by the Denver Law Journal on Fehr I posted on the main board. The hockey stuff starts on page 44.

Delves into the history of the MLBPA, Fehr's role from the 80's until recently, and his role with the NHLPA.

Some interesting stuff about his using the NHL to get out of his predecessor's shadow and prove himself. You ask me, that kind of prideful display should not be welcome.

Also interesting how he didn't accept the job with the NHLPA until they changed the constitution allowing him more power.
Not too bright on the NHLPA's side IMO.

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11-14-2012, 01:20 PM
  #65
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Originally Posted by BlueChip01 View Post
James Mirtle ‏@mirtle

Interesting NHL says players are asking for 65% in Year 1. NHLPA number was $1.91-billion; that would mean league revenues of $2.95-billion.
This is what I have been hearing as well. They aren't looking for any specific percentage, from what I understand, just their salaries to remain the same this season as last season, regardless of revenues. What does that mean? LOST SEASON

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11-14-2012, 01:27 PM
  #66
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Any of the players following Fehr are just sheep. They need to get this guy out sooner rather than later if they don't want to win big. I take back my earlier comments that next season won't be wiped out.

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11-14-2012, 01:30 PM
  #67
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Originally Posted by Reimer View Post
Any of the players following Fehr are just sheep. They need to get this guy out sooner rather than later if they don't want to win big. I take back my earlier comments that next season won't be wiped out.
There's no way Bettman will be able to keep his job if there's a two year lockout.

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11-14-2012, 01:32 PM
  #68
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There's no way Bettman will be able to keep his job if there's a two year lockout.
Who the heck was talking about what this is doing to his health? Was that Friedeman talking about the toll it must be taking. Guy might've lost 10 years of his life as a result of these lockouts.

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11-14-2012, 01:37 PM
  #69
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There will not be a 2 year lockout they will use replacement players. Basically you will be watching AHLers and Euros that come over.

I personally think some of the owners want to break the union and go back to paying the players nothing.

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11-14-2012, 01:41 PM
  #70
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There will not be a 2 year lockout they will use replacement players. Basically you will be watching AHLers and Euros that come over.
I personally think some of the owners want to break the union and go back to paying the players nothing.




So there will be a 2 year lockout.

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11-14-2012, 01:43 PM
  #71
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There's no way Bettman will be able to keep his job if there's a two year lockout.
And no way he keeps his job if he goes against the owners mandate.

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11-14-2012, 02:11 PM
  #72
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Last time Fehr was at the helm he won a court battle vs the MLB when they used replacement players

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Old
11-14-2012, 02:14 PM
  #73
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So if we play 2/3 of a season, and get 2/3 of the revenue from last year, the players still want the same as last year (57% of the total)?

Wouldn't that work out to like 80% of the 2/3 full season revenue? Yeah, not going to happen.


On the Crosby issue, I don't see him trying to make an esoteric economic point and sounding like an idiot. He's saying from the players' perspective, they have to give up everything, and the owners aren't giving up a single thing.

In some ways he's right, it's just that the economic reality is that the players need to have their salaries/share of revenue scaled back.

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11-14-2012, 02:20 PM
  #74
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So if we play 2/3 of a season, and get 2/3 of the revenue from last year, the players still want the same as last year (57% of the total)?

Wouldn't that work out to like 80% of the 2/3 full season revenue? Yeah, not going to happen.


On the Crosby issue, I don't see him trying to make an esoteric economic point and sounding like an idiot. He's saying from the players' perspective, they have to give up everything, and the owners aren't giving up a single thing.In some ways he's right, it's just that the economic reality is that the players need to have their salaries/share of revenue scaled back.
He sounds like an idiot, simply because its clear , with so many teams losing tons of $$, its the players, not the owners who have to be giving back. Its been a pretty 1 sided agreement now.
Its like saying back in the 50's & 60's & 70's, why were the owners & not the players always having to give. Its such a simple response it suprising he says anythiong that dumb.

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11-14-2012, 02:28 PM
  #75
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Bingo. If he said something like Crosby has no clue WTF is going on, perhaps they should find a player that has a better grasp on the subject/has a brain to give us their take" then I wouldn't have had an issue with the comment. As it stands at 18 years of age Crosby had a choice, make multi millions or go to college. Now seeing how many people go to college to try to increase their earning potential, I find it ridiculous to cut the guy because he made more in year at the age of 18 than many college grads will make between the ages of 22-62 and by year 2 or 3 more than all but the vast majority of college grads.
IA gree, I think the point is more that interviewers keep asking him. IT is like he has become the sole representative. would be nice if they just asked some one else. I don't know if it is becuase Crosby just makes himself avialable all the time or what.

Any way, I agree but I am also getting tired of listening to Crosby. Fact I am getting tired of listening to all hockey players talk about not playing hockey.

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