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Wheres Harry??

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Old
11-14-2012, 12:10 PM
  #26
DaBroons
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Originally Posted by Neely08 View Post
Had the B's drawn anyone but Edmonton in 1988 and 90. They likely win a couple of Cups. Edmonton was a machine of a team that hasn't been matched since, and probably never will be. Same can be said for the 91 pens.

They don't even get there w/o genius trade no one else in hockey saw, Cam Neely for Barry Pederson. Not sure if it's true, but I've heard Harry intervened at the draft table to insist on Ray Bourque.

Acquiring Dave Poulin wasn't an effort to better the team? That's coming from someone who absolutely loved "the Rat". Dave Christian? Adam Oates for Craig Janney?

After Neely was hurt, Harry did try to improve the team. Someday Bruins fans will realize 50 goal scorers are simply irreplaceable. Especially ones that make the opposition's nuts crawl up their insides and hide. Kevin Stevens, Iafrete deals both blew up in his face like a bomb. He even trades for a Vezina winning goalie, Jim Carey, and his career fizzles out before our eyes. No argument, those deals hurt more then they helped. We have something he didn't, hindsight. After that, the guy was damned if he did, damned if he didn't. He should have walked right there.

I have my beefs w/ Harry, and JJ for that matter, but to say Harry never gave us a chance to win is revisionist history.
So you are saying that if we didn't play the best team, we would have had a chance to win the cup. ROTFL.

How about if we didn't play Montreal in the 70s, we would have won more cups.

For the record, Sinden was going to draft Portland Dman Keith Brown in the first round of 1979. Chicago took him with the previous pick, so that was out. Maybe Sinden ONLY THEN insisted that Bourque was the next best player, but Bourque surely wasn't his first choice that day. The source also said on draft morning that the Bs would take Keith Crowder, which they did. My source was none other than the legendary Globe writer Fran Rosa.

Sinden made his reputation on several great trades, Park, Middleton, McNabb, and Neely among them. He also had several disastrous trades like Iafrate and Stevens.

Trading for often-injured players is extremely risky, as was drafting Kluzak instead of Brian Bellows. Kluzak had severly injured a knee his last season in juniors and Sinden drafted him anyway. Why? Because his agent was demanding too much money of course. There's a door in my old house in Framingham that probably still bears the scars of the beating it took when Sinden announced Kluzak was his choice. Overall, his draft record was not good. Any reasonable person would have drafted future 50-goal scorer Bellows.

The trades he failed to make were the big ones that could have put the team over the top. He seemed to not want to take the risk, despite the fact that the Espo trade was a huge risk and it paid off.

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11-14-2012, 02:31 PM
  #27
Neely08
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So you are saying that if we didn't play the best team, we would have had a chance to win the cup. ROTFL.
Name a team in hockey history who was BETTER than the 1980's to 90 Oilers.

How's this, 7 game series 72 Bruins vs. 88 Oilers?

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How about if we didn't play Montreal in the 70s, we would have won more cups.
Good point. The habs won the cup in 86, went to the finals 89, won again in 93. Good teams win cups, yes? Those same habs were beaten by the B's in 88, 90, 91, 92. They only won cups in that era b/c they didn't draw Edmonton or Pittsburgh. And, managed to get past the Bruins.

The B's had 2 cracks at it. Drew one of the most dominant teams in NHL history. Once Neely was hurt, that was it. You can hardly blame that on Harry.


Last edited by Neely08: 11-14-2012 at 06:25 PM.
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11-14-2012, 03:47 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by DaBroons View Post
So you are saying that if we didn't play the best team, we would have had a chance to win the cup. ROTFL.

How about if we didn't play Montreal in the 70s, we would have won more cups.

For the record, Sinden was going to draft Portland Dman Keith Brown in the first round of 1979. Chicago took him with the previous pick, so that was out. Maybe Sinden ONLY THEN insisted that Bourque was the next best player, but Bourque surely wasn't his first choice that day. The source also said on draft morning that the Bs would take Keith Crowder, which they did. My source was none other than the legendary Globe writer Fran Rosa.

Sinden made his reputation on several great trades, Park, Middleton, McNabb, and Neely among them. He also had several disastrous trades like Iafrate and Stevens.

Trading for often-injured players is extremely risky, as was drafting Kluzak instead of Brian Bellows. Kluzak had severly injured a knee his last season in juniors and Sinden drafted him anyway. Why? Because his agent was demanding too much money of course. There's a door in my old house in Framingham that probably still bears the scars of the beating it took when Sinden announced Kluzak was his choice. Overall, his draft record was not good. Any reasonable person would have drafted future 50-goal scorer Bellows.

The trades he failed to make were the big ones that could have put the team over the top. He seemed to not want to take the risk, despite the fact that the Espo trade was a huge risk and it paid off.
I'll always claim that Stephane Quintal over Joe Sakic was Sinden's biggest 1st round blunder at the draft table.

The Bruins had only 29 year old Linseman as a point-producing center on the roster in the summer of 1987 and they had already drafted a defenseman at #3 with their other first round pick (Glen Wesley). Janney was waiting in the wings as a senior at BC but they still needed another center anyway.

I will conceed that Quintal was a solid NHLer and a decent pick relative to everything else from #4 on other than Sakic. But I think that was a huge error as Sakic was seen as 1A for centers after Turgeon.

I think it's one of only two times where I may have been upset with a Bruins high draft choice as it was occuring. The other was Hamill over Couture. I was fine with the Kluzak risk as the 2nd injury is what seemed to do him in.
Otherwise he was a prototypical #2 (see 1988 playoffs).

Brad Palmer also helped sink that deal with his inability to reach his 1981 playoff form again.

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Old
11-14-2012, 04:32 PM
  #29
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yep, did Harry get results??? Depends on what your description of results is. Harry lost any slight bit of respect I had for him by repeatedly treating those in the organization like trash
And what, in the end, were the results? Very good teams that were always, without fail, at least one or three players away from becoming elite enough to win it all.

His perpetual, teeth-pulling tactics in paying his players & contempt for fans still make me angry. God, all of those years putting up with his crap.

I hate that jerk even more than I hate JJ, and that's saying something.

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11-14-2012, 04:56 PM
  #30
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And what, in the end, were the results? Very good teams that were always, without fail, at least one or three players away from becoming elite enough to win it all.

His perpetual, teeth-pulling tactics in paying his players & contempt for fans still make me angry. God, all of those years putting up with his crap.

I hate that jerk even more than I hate JJ, and that's saying something.
We have the same idea of what we would consider "results". Shocked as many still back him the way they do/have, maybe it's because I was 3 when Harry won the Cup and I was force fed scenarios you mentioned for far too long.

The guy treated people like trash, taught MOC to handle things in a similar fashion, and it took 2 men with respect/integrity to turn it around with Chia and Cam.

Boston was not a prized or sought after destination for many years, and Harry laid down the groundwork for reasons why not IMO, Chia and Cam and others have worked tirelessly to put their stamp on this organization, and I will suggest attracting solid FA's these days is not nearly as difficult, especially knowing there's a GM who treats players respectfully and fairly, and a Prez who's integrity and respect for others is unquestionable.

Same can't be said for Harry, consecutive playoff appearances or not, I'll take the current culture of this team 8 days a week over the one Harry put his grubby fingerprints all over previously

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11-14-2012, 05:39 PM
  #31
Dennis Bonvie
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We have the same idea of what we would consider "results". Shocked as many still back him the way they do/have, maybe it's because I was 3 when Harry won the Cup and I was force fed scenarios you mentioned for far too long.

The guy treated people like trash, taught MOC to handle things in a similar fashion, and it took 2 men with respect/integrity to turn it around with Chia and Cam.

Boston was not a prized or sought after destination for many years, and Harry laid down the groundwork for reasons why not IMO, Chia and Cam and others have worked tirelessly to put their stamp on this organization, and I will suggest attracting solid FA's these days is not nearly as difficult, especially knowing there's a GM who treats players respectfully and fairly, and a Prez who's integrity and respect for others is unquestionable.

Same can't be said for Harry, consecutive playoff appearances or not, I'll take the current culture of this team 8 days a week over the one Harry put his grubby fingerprints all over previously
Really?

Who's backing him? (other than me)

Every season there are multiple threads about what a disgrace Harry Sinden was, years after he's been a factor.

Anyone ever start a "let's here it for Harry" thread in the last decade or so?

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11-14-2012, 05:42 PM
  #32
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Really?

Who's backing him? (other than me)

Every season there are multiple threads about what a disgrace Harry Sinden was, years after he's been a factor.

Anyone ever start a "let's here it for Harry" thread in the last decade or so?
not nearly as many have contributed to this thread as one that was out.....think about a year ago where he snagged lots of support. Maybe many supporters have been won over by the other side???

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11-14-2012, 05:51 PM
  #33
Dennis Bonvie
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not nearly as many have contributed to this thread as one that was out.....think about a year ago where he snagged lots of support. Maybe many supporters have been won over by the other side???
Or the people that remember the pre-Sinden Bruins are fading out?

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11-14-2012, 05:53 PM
  #34
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Or the people that remember the pre-Sinden Bruins are fading out?
Could be, everyone has his/her side, I'm sure I won't forget his treatment of players for a long time. Thankfully, he's insignificant these days in this fans eyes.

I'm sure at the time, Harry had many supporters but.....

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11-14-2012, 10:27 PM
  #35
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Could be, everyone has his/her side, I'm sure I won't forget his treatment of players for a long time. Thankfully, he's insignificant these days in this fans eyes.

I'm sure at the time, Harry had many supporters but.....
No one can defend that. I haven't heard anyone try. Lemelin's goalie gear left out in the hallway? Com'on. My only contention is; early 90's could have been a bit different w/ a healthy Neely.

Ray Bourque to arbitration? Ouch. I'd love to know if it was Sinden, or JJ in the background, who made some of these decisions, it wasn't Harry's coin. But, we probably never will.

Glad that's the past.

Why it's hard to hear people today complain a/b Chiarelli or Neely. Or show a lack of appreciation for a regime that's retaining it's players, and absolutely changed the culture in Boston.

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11-15-2012, 07:13 AM
  #36
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No one can defend that. I haven't heard anyone try. Lemelin's goalie gear left out in the hallway? Com'on. My only contention is; early 90's could have been a bit different w/ a healthy Neely.

Ray Bourque to arbitration? Ouch. I'd love to know if it was Sinden, or JJ in the background, who made some of these decisions, it wasn't Harry's coin. But, we probably never will.

Glad that's the past.

Why it's hard to hear people today complain a/b Chiarelli or Neely. Or show a lack of appreciation for a regime that's retaining it's players, and absolutely changed the culture in Boston.
I "think" many who do complain about Chia and Cam are quite likely younger fans, those who may not have been around to have witnessed the dysfunction some of us were forced to witness. I`m sure Harry was carrying out many of the orders JJ gave him but truth is, he seemed to do so seemlessly, almost like he quite enjoyed that sort of thing, hardly something JJ had to teach him

Just glad those days are in the past

Chia`s moves aren`t perfect, and a Cup win does not equal free passes when it comes to criticism and I`ve had a few about his moves too, but the manner in which, based on reports, he treats players, is nothing short of fair and respectful.

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11-15-2012, 07:21 AM
  #37
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Harry's in some dark room at the Garden mumbling about how he knows who stole the strawberries while rolling ball bearings in his pocket.

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BOSTON STRONG !!!
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11-15-2012, 07:26 AM
  #38
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Harry's in some dark room at the Garden mumbling about how he knows who stole the strawberries while rolling ball bearings in his pocket.
classic, thanks for the laugh as always Wally

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11-15-2012, 07:43 AM
  #39
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I "think" many who do complain about Chia and Cam are quite likely younger fans, those who may not have been around to have witnessed the dysfunction some of us were forced to witness. I`m sure Harry was carrying out many of the orders JJ gave him but truth is, he seemed to do so seemlessly, almost like he quite enjoyed that sort of thing, hardly something JJ had to teach him

Just glad those days are in the past

Chia`s moves aren`t perfect, and a Cup win does not equal free passes when it comes to criticism and I`ve had a few about his moves too, but the manner in which, based on reports, he treats players, is nothing short of fair and respectful.
You can be critical of chia, and i've seen here. But i could only imagine what the thread would've looked like back in the 90's. I do agree though with your assumption of people who complain about chia not living through enough of the sinden years. I'm 28 so i didn't get a lot of the sinden years, but i have uncles that from when i was 9 or 10 when i started watching more hockey that always said "don't get to involved dave, harry sinden will **** it up". **** even my father who knows very little about sports and never watched hockey knew who sinden and jj were and said they we're no good.

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11-15-2012, 08:29 AM
  #40
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Harry's in some dark room at the Garden mumbling about how he knows who stole the strawberries while rolling ball bearings in his pocket.
LMAO

But seriously, Harry has moved on from screwing the Bruins over. I believe he's still one of those hacks with a secret Hall of Fame vote. So now he gets kicks out of keeping the late great Pat Burns out of the Hall.

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11-15-2012, 11:56 AM
  #41
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Sinden was and continues to be one of my favourite hockey men of all time.
Heart breakers in the 70's when they should have one 4 or 5 Cups.
Lost out to all-star teams in Edmonton and Pittsburg.

Always wanted him to bring in the one extra scorer in the early 90's - Seriously, why wasn't Lucky Luc ever a Bruin?
And he had bad luck in finding another #1 d-man to compliment Bourque although he tried with Kluzak and Iafrate and ...
but the Bruins were an awfully good team for a long time with Sinden at the helm.

He just didn't adjust as well when players salaries started going through the roof and I can't blame him for that - they get paid ridiculous money and it would be tough to sign a 3rd line winger for 10 times the money that Bobby Orr made.

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11-15-2012, 12:00 PM
  #42
Neely08
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Originally Posted by Gee Wally View Post
Harry's in some dark room at the Garden mumbling about how he knows who stole the strawberries while rolling ball bearings in his pocket.
LOL @ Captain Queeg.

Maybe substitute pucks for ball bearings. Or a couple of nips of scotch.

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