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Off-season Madness the 4th: and here we wait in trade-completion limbo

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Old
11-15-2012, 09:41 AM
  #26
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I don't think this Organization can trade JP just like that. From a Marketing point of view and a fan point of view hes not going anywhere or it's not so simple to just trade him for anybody.
So if we do trade a catcher one of the other catchers might go and not JP that's what i believe.

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11-15-2012, 09:42 AM
  #27
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Originally Posted by dredeye View Post
Apparently, Canada as whole has a much higher tax rate. Toronto is also said to be the highest cost of living market in all of the MLB including housing costs
Yeah I realize we're heavily taxed, but I didn't expect THAT big of a difference from some of the states. I guess I was wrong.

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Old
11-15-2012, 09:44 AM
  #28
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Originally Posted by Morgan Gardiner View Post
I'd like to see...

IN: Melky Cabrera, Lance Berkman
OUT: Adam Lind, JP Arencibia

Batting order:
1. Jose Reyes
2. Brett Lawrie
3. Jose Bautista
4. Edwin Encarnacion
5. Melky Cabrera
6. Colby Rasmus
7. Lance Berkman
8. Emilio Bonifacio
9. John Buck

C - John Buck - Bobby Wilson - Travis D'Arnaud (AAA)
1B - Edwin Encarnacion - Lance Berkman
2B - Emilio Bonifacio
SS - Jose Reyes
3B - Brett Lawrie
LF - Melky Cabrera
CF - Colby Rasmus
RF - Jose Bautista
DH - Lance Berkman - Edwin Encarnacion

Utility OF:
Rajai Davis
Anthony Gose
Emilio Bonifacio
Moises Sierra

Utility IF:
Maicer Izturis
Mike McCoy

SP - Brandon Morrow
SP - Josh Johnson
SP - Ricky Romero
SP - Mark Buehrle
SP - J.A Happ

Bullpen:
Sergio Santos (CL)
Casey Janssen (SU)
Darren Oliver (SU)
Steve Delabar
Brad Lincoln
Esmil Rogers
Brett Cecil
Aaron Loup
Jeremy Jeffress
Luis Perez
TBH, if we were gonna sign another player I'd want it to be Marcum, hes a solid pitcher thats already played here and would really round out our SP situation. That would be a dam solid starting 5, and we would have guys like Cecil and Happ that would be able to take over if players get injured, (likely to happen since Johnson and Morrow both have had their fair share of injuries).

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11-15-2012, 09:50 AM
  #29
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Originally Posted by calcal798 View Post
I'm sure AA factors that in when giving thema contract and would offer a higher contract to compensate for that.
I'm sure he doesn't

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11-15-2012, 09:52 AM
  #30
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Originally Posted by AndMat View Post
I don't think this Organization can trade JP just like that. From a Marketing point of view and a fan point of view hes not going anywhere or it's not so simple to just trade him for anybody.
So if we do trade a catcher one of the other catchers might go and not JP that's what i believe.
The Jays have traded bigger names throughout the years, why would it matter with JP?

It just makes no sense to retain JP when TDA is ready for the bigs.

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11-15-2012, 09:52 AM
  #31
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Originally Posted by Eyedea View Post
Yeah I realize we're heavily taxed, but I didn't expect THAT big of a difference from some of the states. I guess I was wrong.
It's my understanding, that is the reason Darvish signed in Texas because of the taxes, even though we had the best offer.

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11-15-2012, 09:53 AM
  #32
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Originally Posted by Eyedea View Post
Yeah I realize we're heavily taxed, but I didn't expect THAT big of a difference from some of the states. I guess I was wrong.
I think it was Zaun that said it during a game this year that Toronto was the most expensive place to play and it was a consideration for players. That housing was considerably higher here than even in NY. I have trouble believing that it's more expensive here than it is in NY or Bos. But maybe taking into account tax rates and interest rates being higher here and so on.

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11-15-2012, 09:53 AM
  #33
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i can see a bonifacio/davis platoon in lf for sure
but that opens up other questions

do we have a 2b?
izturis gets 9mil for 3 yrs to be a backup ? - seems alot

gose/rasmus
does one get traded ?
if not this yr then next ?

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11-15-2012, 09:54 AM
  #34
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Originally Posted by AndMat View Post
From a Marketing point of view and a fan point of view hes not going anywhere
what??

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11-15-2012, 09:54 AM
  #35
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Originally Posted by Budsfan View Post
It's my understanding, that is the reason Darvish signed in Texas because of the taxes, even though we had the best offer.
Your understanding is very wrong. Texas won a closed bid to have exclusive negotiation rights with Darvish.

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11-15-2012, 09:56 AM
  #36
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Originally Posted by Budsfan View Post
It's my understanding, that is the reason Darvish signed in Texas because of the taxes, even though we had the best offer.
No, that's not true. Texas won the polling bid, it wasn't a matter of Darvish picking anyone.


edit: dredeye beat me to it

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11-15-2012, 09:57 AM
  #37
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Originally Posted by calcal798 View Post
TBH, if we were gonna sign another player I'd want it to be Marcum, hes a solid pitcher thats already played here and would really round out our SP situation. That would be a dam solid starting 5, and we would have guys like Cecil and Happ that would be able to take over if players get injured, (likely to happen since Johnson and Morrow both have had their fair share of injuries).
We're told that Jays management does not like Marcum's off-field issues. Do not expect him back.

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11-15-2012, 09:57 AM
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by p.l.f. View Post
i can see a bonifacio/davis platoon in lf for sure
but that opens up other questions

do we have a 2b?
izturis gets 9mil for 3 yrs to be a backup ? - seems alot

gose/rasmus
does one get traded ?
if not this yr then next ?
Considering it's usually 5m per 2 WAR, and Izturis has put up 2 WAR a season consistently (aside from last year), it's not really an overpayment at all. He'll be the starting shortstop, but not for 130+ games. I'm guessing Boni will get a few games at 2B too.

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Old
11-15-2012, 10:00 AM
  #39
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Originally Posted by dredeye View Post
Your understanding is very wrong. Texas won a closed bid to have exclusive negotiation rights with Darvish.
Possibly your right but I read somewhere that taxation was a big factor and at the time.

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Old
11-15-2012, 10:02 AM
  #40
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if AA is sold on Bonifacio in LF...
he could trade gose or rasmus plus a catcher for.....

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11-15-2012, 10:03 AM
  #41
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Originally Posted by theaub View Post
They are definitely employees by all standards of the law. A good accountant can get rid of a decent sum of their taxes but there's certainly other items that no one can really deal with (ie provincial tax and some deductions)
Precisely. A good accountant can go a long way.

Aside from the increased tax rate as a whole, the main worry for any American citizen playing in Canada would be the double taxation, as they will be taxed federally by both the Canadian and American government. But then again, there are foreign tax credits that can be used to knock down income on both sides of the border. So...though it may seem to the naked eye that these increased taxes paid to the Canadian and Ontario government will be a hassle, they could actually aid in reducing the tax owed to the IRS as itemized deductions. With the right accountant, there actually could be a net decreased in the total amount of tax owed.

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Old
11-15-2012, 10:04 AM
  #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AndMat View Post
I don't think this Organization can trade JP just like that. From a Marketing point of view and a fan point of view hes not going anywhere or it's not so simple to just trade him for anybody.
So if we do trade a catcher one of the other catchers might go and not JP that's what i believe.
You're entitled to that belief. He's a "good guy" on the club, but the fans now have a winner to cheer for, so the marketing impact is inconsequential. He's being pressured by a better all-around player in d'Arnaud. He could stay and split time, but he'll bring a quality return, unlike Buck or Wilson who have negative trade value, so if anyone moves, it'll be JP.

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11-15-2012, 10:05 AM
  #43
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This is me just throwing BS at the wind here (like Leafs fans do all the time, but hey, I'm from Toronto so it's in my blood)

but wouldn't it be amazing if Philly falls apart again and we brought back Doc after next season?

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Old
11-15-2012, 10:06 AM
  #44
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i think guys are severely underating happ here. i was at the game vs. Texas where he had 9 k's through like 5 innings. he was absolutely disgusting. as a #5 happ is more than enough imo. its not like we'd be trotting josh towers out there every 5th day.

he doesn't have the ability to give you 200 innings...but that's why he's your 5th starter

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Old
11-15-2012, 10:07 AM
  #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AndMat View Post
I don't think this Organization can trade JP just like that. From a Marketing point of view and a fan point of view hes not going anywhere or it's not so simple to just trade him for anybody.
So if we do trade a catcher one of the other catchers might go and not JP that's what i believe.
Well, my hope would be that AA would not share your point of view. Travis d'Arnaud is in a different league than J.P, and it would be foolish to deal him unless it was for a stud pitcher. Catchers like him do not come along very often.

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11-15-2012, 10:07 AM
  #46
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Originally Posted by Budsfan View Post
It's my understanding, that is the reason Darvish signed in Texas because of the taxes, even though we had the best offer.
Not how that worked. Texas paid his Japanese team the most for the exclusive right to talk to him. He had no say in the matter. He could only choose to sign with Texas or stay in Japan.

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Old
11-15-2012, 10:10 AM
  #47
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Originally Posted by dredeye View Post
Apparently, Canada as whole has a much higher tax rate. Toronto is also said to be the highest cost of living market in all of the MLB including housing costs
Taxes yeah because we have health care and a stable economy. Housing? Not a chance it's more then downtown new york

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Old
11-15-2012, 10:13 AM
  #48
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Originally Posted by Diamond Joe Quimby View Post
Well, my hope would be that AA would not share your point of view. Travis d'Arnaud is in a different league than J.P, and it would be foolish to deal him unless it was for a stud pitcher. Catchers like him do not come along very often.
how good is TDA? he's been hurt or been in a stupid league a while now...i don't know how to gauge him.

ppl talk like he's a generational talent at catcher. but the ability follow it up with "above average across the board". he's already breaking down it seems with "catcher related injuries". what do we have with him? are we talking buster posey?

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11-15-2012, 10:14 AM
  #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AndMat View Post
I don't think this Organization can trade JP just like that. From a Marketing point of view and a fan point of view hes not going anywhere or it's not so simple to just trade him for anybody.
So if we do trade a catcher one of the other catchers might go and not JP that's what i believe.
Most fans could care less if he goes

Only people who might care are some teenage girls who think he's good looking.

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Old
11-15-2012, 10:16 AM
  #50
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Originally Posted by Ohio Jones View Post
You're entitled to that belief. He's a "good guy" on the club, but the fans now have a winner to cheer for, so the marketing impact is inconsequential. He's being pressured by a better all-around player in d'Arnaud. He could stay and split time, but he'll bring a quality return, unlike Buck or Wilson who have negative trade value, so if anyone moves, it'll be JP.
From a marketing, business point of view... the only thing that matters is WINNING.

If AA believes player x (Darnaud) gives us a better chance to win than player y (JPA) and he can use the money saved to bolster another position... you can bet the house that he will try his hardest to make that move

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