HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Atlantic Division > Toronto Maple Leafs
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Off-season Madness the 4th: and here we wait in trade-completion limbo

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
11-15-2012, 08:54 PM
  #276
Eyedea
The Legend Continues
 
Eyedea's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Toronto, Ontario
Country: Greece
Posts: 13,036
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Habsfan18 View Post
Why am I getting nervous that this trade will be vetoed?

Probably worrying for nothing, but **** that would seriously suck...
The deal is still under review because some people have not taken a physical yet.

Eyedea is offline  
Old
11-15-2012, 08:54 PM
  #277
The Nemesis
Global Moderator
Semper Tyrannus
 
The Nemesis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Langley, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 48,622
vCash: 500
When I said Cabrera would be in contention, I meant with respect to the fact that he's in the group of people at the top of the list who aren't so far off the lead that they can't garner votes.

I do still think Trout should've won for all the reasons you stated, but while Cabrera might have had multiple factors working against him this isn't a travesty to the level of, say, Maury Wills over Willie Mays or Juan Gonzalez over Alex Rodriguez. Or even (and I know it's going to sound like blasphemy to say it) Justin Morneau over Derek Jeter or David Ortiz.

__________________

"Do you know what "nemesis" means? A righteous infliction of retribution manifested by an appropriate agent."
'14-15 Sharks CI Tracker: 35 GP, 13-17-5 (home-away-Nat'l/In-Region)
Sorry, I am not taking signature requests at this time.
The Nemesis is offline  
Old
11-15-2012, 08:55 PM
  #278
thatshype
Registered User
 
thatshype's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,700
vCash: 500
People don't want to move Buerhle, nor Johnson even. Johnson is approaching UFA status though so if we are talking about moving one then we need to talk about him.


Quote:
He's a trooper, and he knows if he pitches well then the team will do well. We really needed him to step up this year but he couldn't manage, so I hope he can rebound next year with less pressure and all.
Yea, true. He also knows that the spot in the rotation is relatively inconsequential once the series gets going. They pitch every 5 games regardless. Romero won't be opening day starter and might not start a playoff series if we get that far, but beyond that the designation between 1st and 5th starter is somewhat imaginary.


Also, the pressure is off Romero, and he has more mental flexibility to return to his former self.

thatshype is offline  
Old
11-15-2012, 08:58 PM
  #279
Scion
Registered User
 
Scion's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 1,023
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by rojac View Post
As for Trout winning the MVP, he's still just a punk kid. Let him wait awhile before giving him big awards.
I sincerely hope that you are kidding, if not this is easily the most incomprehensibly stupid thing I have ever had the displeasure of reading.

Scion is offline  
Old
11-15-2012, 09:03 PM
  #280
dredeye
BJ Elitist/Hipster
 
dredeye's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Country: Canada
Posts: 20,164
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodman19 View Post
Well, Buerhle is very durable and can be a solid innings eater for a team with some payroll to burn ala Chicago Cubs. Also we can kick in the $8 Million coming our way in that deal to make the financial implications reduced to only $40 million over 3 years, much more affordable for a team in need of a veteran rotation presence.

Also with Buck and Lind's contract coming off the books and a nice $52 Million TV revenue starting in 2014 I doubt there is any issue retaining Josh Johnson and having a Payroll in the 140-150 million range in the next few years, especially if the fans start showing up again.
I thought of Lind after I posted but did forget about Buck. That's a very good chunk of change right there.

dredeye is offline  
Old
11-15-2012, 09:05 PM
  #281
Woodman19
#TeamBernier
 
Woodman19's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 13,254
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by dredeye View Post
I thought of Lind after I posted but did forget about Buck. That's a very good chunk of change right there.
11 million + 52 Million from the new TV deal for a net 63 gain.

Woodman19 is offline  
Old
11-15-2012, 09:07 PM
  #282
Scion
Registered User
 
Scion's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 1,023
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Nemesis View Post
When I said Cabrera would be in contention, I meant with respect to the fact that he's in the group of people at the top of the list who aren't so far off the lead that they can't garner votes.

I do still think Trout should've won for all the reasons you stated, but while Cabrera might have had multiple factors working against him this isn't a travesty to the level of, say, Maury Wills over Willie Mays or Juan Gonzalez over Alex Rodriguez. Or even (and I know it's going to sound like blasphemy to say it) Justin Morneau over Derek Jeter or David Ortiz.
Cabrera was a deserving MVP candidate, but that is it, Mike Trout was in a class of his own this year. Frankly, no one else deserved to be in the conversation with him.

As for the aforementioned examples, with the exception of the Morneau victory, the writers association had far less information back then, and sabre metrics were nowhere near as wide-spread. So while those decisions are similarly baffling, they are understandable. This decision on the other hand is just mind boggling, not Morneau 2006 bad, but bad nonetheless.

Scion is offline  
Old
11-15-2012, 09:11 PM
  #283
dredeye
BJ Elitist/Hipster
 
dredeye's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Country: Canada
Posts: 20,164
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodman19 View Post
11 million + 52 Million from the new TV deal for a net 63 gain.
We could simply take Lind or Buck's money and add it to JJ's current salary and I'm sure he'd be pretty close to where he wants to be or needs to be.

dredeye is offline  
Old
11-15-2012, 09:11 PM
  #284
Sokil
Ukraine Specialitsky
 
Sokil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Toronto
Country: Ukraine
Posts: 6,231
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scion View Post
Cabrera was a deserving MVP candidate, but that is it, Mike Trout was in a class of his own this year. Frankly, no one else deserved to be in the conversation with him.

Sokil is offline  
Old
11-15-2012, 09:14 PM
  #285
Nasty Nazem
The North Remembers
 
Nasty Nazem's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: In my house... duh!
Country: Canada
Posts: 26,782
vCash: 500
Worth noting:

1 Blue Jays Way ‏@1BJW
Just want to point out to everyone that J.A. Happ has an option left and can be sent to the minors without being exposed on waivers

Nasty Nazem is offline  
Old
11-15-2012, 09:14 PM
  #286
Jozay
lolwut?
 
Jozay's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: In someones closet..
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,373
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scion View Post
Cabrera was a deserving MVP candidate, but that is it, Mike Trout was in a class of his own this year. Frankly, no one else deserved to be in the conversation with him.

As for the aforementioned examples, with the exception of the Morneau victory, the writers association had far less information back then, and sabre metrics were nowhere near as wide-spread. So while those decisions are similarly baffling, they are understandable. This decision on the other hand is just mind boggling, not Morneau 2006 bad, but bad nonetheless.
Only knock I have against Trout is the he didnt get his team into the playoffs.

Jozay is offline  
Old
11-15-2012, 09:16 PM
  #287
Jozay
lolwut?
 
Jozay's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: In someones closet..
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,373
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by dredeye View Post
We could simply take Lind or Buck's money and add it to JJ's current salary and I'm sure he'd be pretty close to where he wants to be or needs to be.
I see JJ getting somewhere around 6/100-105. The per year ranges from 16.6-17.5

Jozay is offline  
Old
11-15-2012, 09:19 PM
  #288
RayzorIsDull
Registered User
 
RayzorIsDull's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 7,204
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scion View Post
Cabrera was a deserving MVP candidate, but that is it, Mike Trout was in a class of his own this year. Frankly, no one else deserved to be in the conversation with him.

As for the aforementioned examples, with the exception of the Morneau victory, the writers association had far less information back then, and sabre metrics were nowhere near as wide-spread. So while those decisions are similarly baffling, they are understandable. This decision on the other hand is just mind boggling, not Morneau 2006 bad, but bad nonetheless.
Like it or not writers put a lot of stock into an MVP candidate getting his team to the playoffs. It is now 20 of the last 21 MVP's that have helped his team into the playoffs. To say nobody else deserved to be in the conversation and short sighted and silly. We aren't talking about a vote that went down the wire, Cabrera comfortably defeated Trout. The worst part about these new age stats is to hear a guy like Brian Kenny on MLB Network all but say Miguel Cabrera is a rally killer sighting all the DP's he hit into. Yes the best hitter in MLB is a rally killer. The sabremetric people try too hard to discredit good players that don't fit into their metrics.

RayzorIsDull is offline  
Old
11-15-2012, 09:19 PM
  #289
p.l.f.
mvp
 
p.l.f.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Toronto, CANADA
Posts: 36,292
vCash: 500
signing JJ would be awesome
then were set for 3-5 yrs?

p.l.f. is offline  
Old
11-15-2012, 09:20 PM
  #290
dredeye
BJ Elitist/Hipster
 
dredeye's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Country: Canada
Posts: 20,164
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jozay View Post
I see JJ getting somewhere around 6/100-105. The per year ranges from 16.6-17.5
If I'm right I think he makes 14 this coming year and is looking for a big big raise. I actually think we may have to combine Lind and Buck's salary to his current salary to get it done. i think he'll be looking in the 25 range.

dredeye is offline  
Old
11-15-2012, 09:22 PM
  #291
DeputyMcLaren
Registered User
 
DeputyMcLaren's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Kingston Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 732
vCash: 500
If he has a good year and returns to form of dominating the game he deserves around 20, I think if we offered him around 16 for 5 he would take it and run. Especially due to the fact he's an injury risk.
At the same time he's a potential #1 starter and guys like that get PAID

DeputyMcLaren is offline  
Old
11-15-2012, 09:23 PM
  #292
Scion
Registered User
 
Scion's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 1,023
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sokil View Post
It's amazing how effectively you managed to capture my opinion of you with this post.

Scion is offline  
Old
11-15-2012, 09:23 PM
  #293
Eyedea
The Legend Continues
 
Eyedea's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Toronto, Ontario
Country: Greece
Posts: 13,036
vCash: 500
I wasn't a fan of giving JJ a big big raise, but I'd welcome a 4/5 year deal around 18-20m per.

With Buck coming off the books, and Lind likely bought out/moved, the deal could be done.

Eyedea is offline  
Old
11-15-2012, 09:25 PM
  #294
Scion
Registered User
 
Scion's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 1,023
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jozay View Post
Only knock I have against Trout is the he didnt get his team into the playoffs.
No single player in the history of baseball has taken their team to the playoffs by themselves.

Scion is offline  
Old
11-15-2012, 09:25 PM
  #295
Schennanigans
Registered User
 
Schennanigans's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Etobicoke, on
Posts: 6,057
vCash: 500
So I just read that the trade will be reviewed. Can this deal actually be declined? Can someone explain to me what part of mlb's cba that could lead this to being a rejected trade?

Schennanigans is offline  
Old
11-15-2012, 09:27 PM
  #296
Eyedea
The Legend Continues
 
Eyedea's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Toronto, Ontario
Country: Greece
Posts: 13,036
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Schennanigans View Post
So I just read that the trade will be reviewed. Can this deal actually be declined? Can someone explain to me what part of mlb's cba that could lead this to being a rejected trade?
They can't reject the deal, only way it does not go through is if the physicals of some players reveal injuries I suppose.

Also some of the players (Reyes being one) have yet to take their physical.

Eyedea is offline  
Old
11-15-2012, 09:30 PM
  #297
Jozay
lolwut?
 
Jozay's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: In someones closet..
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,373
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scion View Post
No single player in the history of baseball has taken their team to the playoffs by themselves.
Yes, but that does play a big part in the voting. And like you said, no one was near Trout, so you'd think he could at least get his team into the PO's.

Jozay is offline  
Old
11-15-2012, 09:30 PM
  #298
Jozay
lolwut?
 
Jozay's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: In someones closet..
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,373
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eyedea View Post
They can't reject the deal, only way it does not go through is if the physicals of some players reveal injuries I suppose.

Also some of the players (Reyes being one) have yet to take their physical.
They can. If they feel it is very lopsided, they would reject it.

Jozay is offline  
Old
11-15-2012, 09:31 PM
  #299
Sokil
Ukraine Specialitsky
 
Sokil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Toronto
Country: Ukraine
Posts: 6,231
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scion View Post
It's amazing how effectively you managed to capture my opinion of you with this post.
Yeah but...

Quote:
Originally Posted by RayzorIsDull View Post
To say nobody else deserved to be in the conversation and short sighted and silly. We aren't talking about a vote that went down the wire, Cabrera comfortably defeated Trout.
I'm content with how far out in left field you are on this one.

Sokil is offline  
Old
11-15-2012, 09:31 PM
  #300
DeputyMcLaren
Registered User
 
DeputyMcLaren's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Kingston Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 732
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Schennanigans View Post
So I just read that the trade will be reviewed. Can this deal actually be declined? Can someone explain to me what part of mlb's cba that could lead this to being a rejected trade?
The only reason they are saying this is because a few of the players haven't had their physicals yet/ and Selig is toying with the hearts of the Miami supporters giving them hope the trade doesn't go through. If this trade doesn't happen Selig loses his job, it's simple as that. It's a baseball move, similarly LA and BOS trade 3 months ago.

DeputyMcLaren is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:06 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.