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What the Maple Leafs REALLY need

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Old
11-16-2012, 06:57 PM
  #101
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Originally Posted by Whydidijoin View Post
And you have still given no proof of that.
Proof? Known and documented on this board. If you think I am pulling your leg just google it. In fact it was discussed at length years ago on the WHL board. Look it up.

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11-16-2012, 07:08 PM
  #102
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Originally Posted by Gatorade View Post
Proof? Known and documented on this board. If you think I am pulling your leg just google it. In fact it was discussed at length years ago on the WHL board. Look it up.
Then it should be easy for you to reference it. Waiting.

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11-16-2012, 07:38 PM
  #103
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Originally Posted by Whydidijoin View Post
Then it should be easy for you to reference it. Waiting.
Already did. Deny as you wish. You clearly do not follow hockey or maybe you simply ignore his WHL days.

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11-16-2012, 08:13 PM
  #104
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Originally Posted by Gatorade View Post
Already did. Deny as you wish. You clearly do not follow hockey or maybe you simply ignore his WHL days.
No you didn't. You posted an article about an emotional uneducated mother who gave no specific number, and a 41-page thread that doesn't seem to reference any number that high. Point it out specifically. Proof of 7 concussions like you claim.

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11-16-2012, 08:30 PM
  #105
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Originally Posted by Gatorade View Post
You are buying Burke's sell job. Riemer had 6 concussions prior to last season. The math is not hard here.
Where'd anyone reliable say that?

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11-16-2012, 08:43 PM
  #106
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What is obtuse about facts? Are you seriously questioning public record now?
Don't know about PUBLIC record but I sure am questioning you, and your supposed "facts".

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11-16-2012, 09:18 PM
  #107
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I was at the Kingston Frontenacs game tonight and even though it was my first time watching them live, I was VERY impressed with the on ice product! This team was big, they were dumping/chasing all night and laying the body on at all times, not just that ALL players were committed to pitching in defensively, the goaltending wasn't flashy but solid and the biggest thing I noticed is how little they spent in their own end.

The reason I'm bringing this up is because I feel THIS is how Burke should have and should be building the leafs. Like I said the team as a whole lacks heart and committment, goaltending is poor to shaky, and the leafs get pinned in their own end 2/3 of the game because a) they can't make a simple pass and b) can manhandled along the wall.

I don't doubt the leafs have firepower, actually they have a lot of it. The problem is heart and substance, and I really hope Burke seriously addressesses this between now and when the season (whenever that may be) starts.

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11-16-2012, 09:41 PM
  #108
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Originally Posted by Kingstonian84 View Post
I was at the Kingston Frontenacs game tonight and even though it was my first time watching them live, I was VERY impressed with the on ice product! This team was big, they were dumping/chasing all night and laying the body on at all times, not just that ALL players were committed to pitching in defensively, the goaltending wasn't flashy but solid and the biggest thing I noticed is how little they spent in their own end.

The reason I'm bringing this up is because I feel THIS is how Burke should have and should be building the leafs. Like I said the team as a whole lacks heart and committment, goaltending is poor to shaky, and the leafs get pinned in their own end 2/3 of the game because a) they can't make a simple pass and b) can manhandled along the wall.

I don't doubt the leafs have firepower, actually they have a lot of it. The problem is heart and substance, and I really hope Burke seriously addressesses this between now and when the season (whenever that may be) starts.
As DOn Cherry would say:

Well, they need to go out and get themselves some good ol' Kingston boys. Dougy Gilmour was a Kingston boy. YOu know THat? Ya. Well That's what the LEafs need you see. A couple good Kingston boys with HEart to lead the team. Atta boy!!!

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11-16-2012, 09:51 PM
  #109
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Originally Posted by charliolemieux View Post
As DOn Cherry would say:

Well, they need to go out and get themselves some good ol' Kingston boys. Dougy Gilmour was a Kingston boy. YOu know THat? Ya. Well That's what the LEafs need you see. A couple good Kingston boys with HEart to lead the team. Atta boy!!!
If we did have a Dougie Gilmour this team would be on its way.

It would have an identity, leadership, character all rolled up into one and something to really build something around.

Sadly a Dougie only comes around on rare occasion.

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Old
11-16-2012, 10:03 PM
  #110
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Ever notice that there is not one person the team that is able to walk across the blueline in full stride, take a clapper and blow it right past a goalie? Mats was great at that...we need someone like Mats...Dam you TSN making me relieve those glorious moments only to realize Mats is gone...

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11-16-2012, 10:06 PM
  #111
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Originally Posted by Whydidijoin View Post
Lupul just turned 29 (NOT 30), and there is no reason to believe that he won't be back.

- Sorry I was off by one year, anyways my point is he isn't a "young top 6 guy", he's smack in his prime, 3 years in and roughly 3-4 peak years left. IMO it's 50/50 if he'll be back or not, I hope he DOES come back but I'm also a realist and know there is just a good of a chance he'll not re-sign here.

Rielly will most likely be ready to make the team next year, assuming he gets a full junior year under his belt, and he is the type of player that can make an immediate impact.

- I wouldn't be so sure, I mean guys like Phaneuf/Gunnar/Liles/Gardiner/Holzer at this point are all ahead of him on the depth charts. He could make the team whenever the next season is but it's not a sure thing that he makes the first cut.

As for being a lottery team, it tells me that all the right pieces aren't in place or experienced enough yet. That is all. It is the impatient and small-picture people who see that fact as an automatic failure where all players involved are bad and responsible.
- Thank you for proving my point, you are correct the reason we ARE a lottery team is because the key components are not in place, now ask yourself WHO is responsible for that? Answer is Burke. Now look at it this way if your on the job and your a manager at a key corporation (lets say Toyota) and your job is to improve the business and 4 years in you do not make the right improvements I think it would be safe to say you'd be fired! Now I don't think Burke will be fired, I think he'll be given his full contract, but if at the end of his contract date and this leafs team is still utter sh-t, all bets are off about him coming back.

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11-16-2012, 10:42 PM
  #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kingstonian84 View Post
- Thank you for proving my point, you are correct the reason we ARE a lottery team is because the key components are not in place, now ask yourself WHO is responsible for that? Answer is Burke. Now look at it this way if your on the job and your a manager at a key corporation (lets say Toyota) and your job is to improve the business and 4 years in you do not make the right improvements I think it would be safe to say you'd be fired! Now I don't think Burke will be fired, I think he'll be given his full contract, but if at the end of his contract date and this leafs team is still utter sh-t, all bets are off about him coming back.
Lombardi
Sather
Tambellini
Holland hasn't won in 4 years

Personally, I don't think the analogy is apt, and then you would have
to define improvement. If you can see that the team is headed in
the right direction, you can ride out the struggles.

If you're to fire someone, you'll have to think of a name to replace them.

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Old
11-16-2012, 10:45 PM
  #113
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Originally Posted by Pyrophorus View Post
Lombardi
Sather
Tambellini
Holland hasn't won in 4 years

Personally, I don't think the analogy is apt, and then you would have
to define improvement. If you can see that the team is headed in
the right direction, you can ride out the struggles.

If you're to fire someone, you'll have to think of a name to replace them.
I'm not talking about being a cup contender, I'm merely talking about just making the playoffs, hell even if we made them and got bounced in 4 games to me that would be solid progress.

Easy answer to replace Burke: Nonis

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11-16-2012, 11:30 PM
  #114
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Originally Posted by TheKingSlayer View Post
Ever notice that there is not one person the team that is able to walk across the blueline in full stride, take a clapper and blow it right past a goalie? Mats was great at that...we need someone like Mats...Dam you TSN making me relieve those glorious moments only to realize Mats is gone...
Kessels no Sundin but he has that uncanny sniping ability, just to skate through and across the blueline than rip a snapshot and put it in the back of the net.

I think Kessel can accually be a better offensive player than Sundin. Sundins overall game was excellent, underrated. It really helped he had massive reach.

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11-17-2012, 12:09 AM
  #115
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Originally Posted by TheFinnishKulemin View Post
Burke's trade is only questionable to clueless morons who want nothing more than a scapegoat to make them feel better.
Whatever helps you sleep at night.


Having a team finish 2nd last and not having a pick is a terrible accomplishment. He got a great player yes, but he was not a franchise player and never will be. He Also traded away another 2 picks in a time where we were clearly rebuilding. This trade would have been great had we been competitive. We clearly were not and if Burke thinks we were I think thats an even bigger issue. Please tell me why you think this trade isn't questionable, and what good it has really done. Still no playoffs, and lets face it we lost out on Seguin. Don't give me the who knows how things should have went had we not made the trade. Because realistically it would have went the same if not worst, and maybe letting us draft 1st (either way Seguin would have been taken IMO) not to mention the 2 other picks. Im not going to mention Hamilton because that one I will agree we can't know how it would have went.

I don't know how someone can be considered a moron for calling it questionable. I think your more of a moron if you think the deal worked out or can't question it. BTW this was my opinion the whole time, even when I first heard about the deal.

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11-17-2012, 12:18 AM
  #116
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Originally Posted by Kingstonian84 View Post
I'm not talking about being a cup contender, I'm merely talking about just making the playoffs, hell even if we made them and got bounced in 4 games to me that would be solid progress.
Making the playoffs is not a goal, building a contender is. Just because you make the playoffs does not mean that the team is "built right". If Burke goes out and trades our first rounders for over the hill vets JFJ-style just to make the playoffs, will that make you sleep better at night?

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11-17-2012, 12:28 AM
  #117
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What the Leafs need is an elite center and elite goaltending which is why if we have a season sucking horribly for just this one more year could be the best thing that happened to this franchise.

Acquiring a top center on an ELC breaking in at the same time as Reilly could turn this group completely around.

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11-17-2012, 12:35 AM
  #118
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Originally Posted by Leafs87 View Post
Having a team finish 2nd last and not having a pick is a terrible accomplishment. He got a great player yes, but he was not a franchise player and never will be. He Also traded away another 2 picks in a time where we were clearly rebuilding. This trade would have been great had we been competitive. We clearly were not and if Burke thinks we were I think thats an even bigger issue. Please tell me why you think this trade isn't questionable, and what good it has really done. Still no playoffs, and lets face it we lost out on Seguin. Don't give me the who knows how things should have went had we not made the trade. Because realistically it would have went the same if not worst, and maybe letting us draft 1st (either way Seguin would have been taken IMO) not to mention the 2 other picks. Im not going to mention Hamilton because that one I will agree we can't know how it would have went.
So we exchanged one good winger for another, and paid an extra first and 2nd rounder as premium for not having to wait 2-3 years for him to develop into an impact player. With or without Seguin, we're missing the playoffs, the only difference is that our current winger is producing at a much better rate.

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11-17-2012, 09:43 AM
  #119
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Originally Posted by theremedial View Post
Goalies were only part of the problem, the main one being Wilson.
Whatever......the guy who is going to take most of the credit if they were ever successful would be Brian Burke...without a doubt. The guy has been flat out brutal since his arrival and yet over 70% of people of this board think he has been "great" and want him extended. Imagine if he actually did something of significance.....statues will be built. Wilson, JSG, Bozak, Gustavsson, Armie or Lombardi/Connolly/Komisarek....Kessel Lupul or Phaneuf...Its all down to Brian Burke. He is the guy in charge.

IF this and BUT that and IF it wasn't for.....blah blah blah. Bottom line..excuses are for failures and losers.

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11-17-2012, 11:51 AM
  #120
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Originally Posted by 4evaBlue View Post
Making the playoffs is not a goal, building a contender is. Just because you make the playoffs does not mean that the team is "built right". If Burke goes out and trades our first rounders for over the hill vets JFJ-style just to make the playoffs, will that make you sleep better at night?
If an aging Luongo is acquired and a 1st round pick is used to obtain him this theory will be tested in many ways.

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11-17-2012, 01:30 PM
  #121
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Originally Posted by 4evaBlue View Post
Making the playoffs is not a goal, building a contender is. Just because you make the playoffs does not mean that the team is "built right". If Burke goes out and trades our first rounders for over the hill vets JFJ-style just to make the playoffs, will that make you sleep better at night?
Your right the ultimate goal is to be a contender, but its a step by step process, you can't just go from a lottery team to contender over night, thats not what I was trying to imply. What I meant was the goal currently is to take the next step which is to simply make the playoffs and sadly we're nowhere near it, 4 years later still a lottery team, sorry but thats failure, hell even Burke admitted on live tv he has FAILED as a GM words right from the horses mouth.

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