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*OFFICIAL* Kitchener Rangers 2012-13 Season Thread

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11-13-2012, 01:29 PM
  #826
Ward Cornell
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Originally Posted by Tim Wallach View Post
I have to refresh myself on it, but I believe the rule Ward is referring to is only for NHL drafted NCAA players. It was to prevent them from jumping to junior as OAs and then declaring NHL free agency sooner. i.e. NCAA players' rights are owned by NHL teams longer, but if they play junior, they have to sign within two years of their draft.

I believe both Paulley and Bondra are free agents in terms of NHL status and therefore, it doesn't apply.

OK....you may be right!
I thought it was revised because originally the OA was brought in to allow previous OHL players to extend their junior career. Then when Mike VanRyn incident happened, I thought they had to have previous OHL playing time. (but like I said...you could very well be correct, since these players are on the list)

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11-13-2012, 01:35 PM
  #827
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OK....you may be right!
I thought it was revised because originally the OA was brought in to allow previous OHL players to extend their junior career. Then when Mike VanRyn incident happened, I thought they had to have previous OHL playing time. (but like I said...you could very well be correct, since these players are on the list)
That may be partially correct too. I know at the time there was chatter from the CHL's side that they felt it was unfair to kids who had given their service to the league to be pushed out of their OA year by outsiders.

I do, however, think the NHL was also complicit in the actual rule change in order to protect their own interests in regards to retaining players' rights.

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11-13-2012, 01:50 PM
  #828
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Pardon the long post, but I clipped this from the NHLPA's case vs. the Plymouth Whalers in the Van Ryn suit. It appears from this that the rule was changed mostly to prevent NHL prospects from getting to free agency earlier, but also to protect current CHLers from being bumped by "defectors" as Ward pointed out:

OHL eligibility rules permit each team to carry only three twenty-year-old, or “overage,” players.   Additionally, under the OHL's Rule 7.4, which is at the heart of this case, no overage player can be signed by an OHL team unless he was previously on a Canadian Hockey Association (“CHA”) or USA Hockey Player's Registration the previous season.   The National College Athletic Association (“NCAA”) does not permit players holding either type of registration to play at a NCAA school.   These two rules-the OHL rule requiring overage players to have a been on a CHA or USA Hockey Registration, and the NCAA rule barring players with either of those registrations-combine to prevent OHL teams from signing any twenty-year-old NCAA players, because such a player would not have been permitted by the NCAA to have obtained the registration required by the OHL of twenty-year-old players.

Rule 7.4 is commonly referred to as the “Van Ryn Rule.” Mike Van Ryn (“Van Ryn”) was a University of Michigan hockey player when he was drafted by the New Jersey Devils, an NHL team, in June 1998.   Pursuant to the Collective Bargaining Agreement (“CBA”) between the NHL and the NHLPA, the Devils thus obtained the rights to Van Ryn for one year, at which point, if the Devils failed to sign Van Ryn, he would become an unrestricted free agent.   Under the terms of the CBA,1 those rights would only be extended past one year if Van Ryn remained in NCAA competition, or went to play for a non-affiliated hockey league.

Van Ryn remained in NCAA competition at the University of Michigan for one year following the draft, which extended the Devils' rights to him for one year.   He then signed with the Sarnia Sting, an OHL club.   The OHL is affiliated with the NHL, and therefore, the Devils' rights to Van Ryn were not extended by Van Ryn's signing with the Sting.   Van Ryn thus became an unrestricted free agent in June 2000, and signed a three-year contract with the NHL's St. Louis Blues.   Had Van Ryn not played in an affiliated league for the year during which the Devils had exclusive rights to him, his only path to free agency would have been to sit out for the season.

The Devils, with the support of the NHL, attempted to declare Van Ryn a “defected player” ineligible for free agency, but an arbitrator rejected this effort.   Within two months of the arbitration decision and Van Ryn's signing with the Blues, the OHL adopted the “Van Ryn Rule.” Unsurprisingly, Plaintiffs regard the adoption of the rule as an attempt to prevent other NCAA players from achieving free agency via the route traveled by Van Ryn. Defendants dispute this motive, and note that a rule similar to the Van Ryn Rule, which prevented overage players from playing in the OHL if they had not played there as nineteen-year-olds, was in effect from 1992 to 1998.   David Branch, the OHL Commissioner, has stated that the rule was implemented because, given that “the opportunities for overage players are obviously limited by OHL rules, it seemed fitting and appropriate to include those players who had given the OHL their time and talent over a number of years and to exclude those who had not done so.”

Defendants also point out that former NCAA players who will not turn twenty before December 31 of any season may play in the OHL. However, pursuant to Section 8.4 of the CBA, players generally must be at least nineteen years old to be selected in the NHL Entry Draft. Thus, few NCAA players who have been drafted by an NHL team will be able to sign with an OHL team and follow the path taken by Mike Van Ryn to unrestricted free agency.

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11-13-2012, 01:53 PM
  #829
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Hey Ranger fans,

I was wondering if someone would be willing to give an update on how McEneny has been playing? Did missing a year hinder his development much? I see he has put up 7 points so far, how is he performing on the defensive side of his game?


Thanks guys!

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11-13-2012, 02:02 PM
  #830
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Hey Ranger fans,

I was wondering if someone would be willing to give an update on how McEneny has been playing? Did missing a year hinder his development much? I see he has put up 7 points so far, how is he performing on the defensive side of his game?


Thanks guys!
Expectedly, he had a bit of a tentative start. I'd say his first 10 games were only decent. Some good moments, but he avoided physicality for the most part and had some positioning errors.

But lately, he has found that extra gear that comes with finding his confidence. He's starting to use that frame to hit a bit and he's starting to command his own zone. I'd say he's well on his way to being a top-2 defender for us and perhaps a #1 next year. Solid player all around. One of a very few who is average or above in just about every aspect of the game.

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11-13-2012, 02:46 PM
  #831
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Expectedly, he had a bit of a tentative start. I'd say his first 10 games were only decent. Some good moments, but he avoided physicality for the most part and had some positioning errors.

But lately, he has found that extra gear that comes with finding his confidence. He's starting to use that frame to hit a bit and he's starting to command his own zone. I'd say he's well on his way to being a top-2 defender for us and perhaps a #1 next year. Solid player all around. One of a very few who is average or above in just about every aspect of the game.
My sentiments exactly. Had he not missed last year I think you'd be looking at a player who was drafted 2nd round or so of the past draft, maybe higher.

So far he looks to be picking up where he left off from his limited time last year.

Slowly but surely he is turning the corner and will be a very solid defender for this team come the playoffs, if he progresses as he has thus far this season.

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11-13-2012, 05:24 PM
  #832
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Braun came from Saginaw, not sure if he was in the Sol trade though. I think Braun was here prior to Sol arrival.

Braun came over with Sol for sure. I believe the deal was Sol and Braun from Saginaw for Mickey Sartoretto and either two 2nd rounders or a 2nd and a 3rd rounder. Not sure if a pick came our way with Sol and Braun. If one did, it would have been mid-round at the highest.

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11-13-2012, 05:31 PM
  #833
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Also, to do with the "Mike Van Ryn" rule:

Didn't Oshawa try to have a player (Aquino?) enter the OHL from the NCAA, since the MVR rule was instituted, but were denied even after he played games? (may have been ex-games)

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11-13-2012, 05:37 PM
  #834
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My sentiments exactly. Had he not missed last year I think you'd be looking at a player who was drafted 2nd round or so of the past draft, maybe higher.

So far he looks to be picking up where he left off from his limited time last year.

Slowly but surely he is turning the corner and will be a very solid defender for this team come the playoffs, if he progresses as he has thus far this season.

I agree on McEneny 100%. He plays all situations and plays them well. Right now I feel he is the 2nd best d-man on the Rangers today behind Murphy. He's spent some time alongside Murphy on the top pairing and fared well. At the end of the day, that's who I'd have there post trade deadline if Spott is unable to get that horse, veteran d-man he says he's looking for.

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11-13-2012, 09:29 PM
  #835
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Originally Posted by Tim Wallach View Post
Expectedly, he had a bit of a tentative start. I'd say his first 10 games were only decent. Some good moments, but he avoided physicality for the most part and had some positioning errors.

But lately, he has found that extra gear that comes with finding his confidence. He's starting to use that frame to hit a bit and he's starting to command his own zone. I'd say he's well on his way to being a top-2 defender for us and perhaps a #1 next year. Solid player all around. One of a very few who is average or above in just about every aspect of the game.
Its good to hear that he is hitting his stride after a tentative start. Hopefully his play can continue to get better for you guys & your team has a long season! I was happy to see that Gillis was able to go out & get a young dman who by the sounds of it has some promise.

It may be a little early but what would you guys say he projects as? Any comparisons?

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Old
11-14-2012, 08:13 AM
  #836
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Its good to hear that he is hitting his stride after a tentative start. Hopefully his play can continue to get better for you guys & your team has a long season! I was happy to see that Gillis was able to go out & get a young dman who by the sounds of it has some promise.

It may be a little early but what would you guys say he projects as? Any comparisons?
Comparisons are very tough because it's nearly impossible to get an exact fit, but a couple NHL comparables I can see are:

- Josh Gorges (solid all around, but not flashy. Can make an offensive play, but relies more on solid positioning and grit. But McEneny is a bit bigger.)
- Ladislav Smid (above average upside in almost all facets of the game, but won't blow you away in any one regard.)

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11-15-2012, 06:25 PM
  #837
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Any rumors on the trade front for kitchener lately?

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11-15-2012, 07:36 PM
  #838
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Any rumors on the trade front for kitchener lately?
After Hanes was traded to Kingston, Spott said he was definately looking to fill the third OA spot. He said it would likely be a defensman.

He was apparently in on the Beukeboom trade talks.

Outside of the above, that's about it.

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11-17-2012, 07:40 PM
  #839
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After McEneny has one of his best games of the season, he's having one of his worst tonight. Passing is weak, defense is only so-so and he gives up a blatant turnover that leads to goal about 5 seconds later.

I'm saying this because I usually jinx things.

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11-17-2012, 09:27 PM
  #840
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it's about time we get one!

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11-17-2012, 09:53 PM
  #841
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it's about time we get one!
Beautiful win! Very deserving too.

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Old
11-18-2012, 07:39 PM
  #842
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Im watching the Kitchener/knights game, I don't see Nick Czinder is he hurt?

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11-18-2012, 08:49 PM
  #843
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For as good as Gibson's been this year, he cost Kitchener the game today. Two awful goals, first the brutal turnover than the mishandling and subsequent losing site of the puck.

Also, I think Iafrate is playing too much. He got caught way up ice on that first goal, I mean he wasn't even across centre ice when London scored. His shot is so innaccurate and he's prone to turnovers when he plays offensively. On the plus side, this was probaby Murphys best defensive game in a Rangers uniform. Didn't get beat once and had numerous strong defensive plays. Also was pretty dominant offensively in the last 10 minutes.

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11-18-2012, 09:41 PM
  #844
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For as good as Gibson's been this year, he cost Kitchener the game today. Two awful goals, first the brutal turnover than the mishandling and subsequent losing site of the puck.

Also, I think Iafrate is playing too much. He got caught way up ice on that first goal, I mean he wasn't even across centre ice when London scored. His shot is so innaccurate and he's prone to turnovers when he plays offensively. On the plus side, this was probaby Murphys best defensive game in a Rangers uniform. Didn't get beat once and had numerous strong defensive plays. Also was pretty dominant offensively in the last 10 minutes.
That looked to be the case for Gibson tonight but he single handedly won a few for us this year already. I think he deserves a pass.

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11-18-2012, 10:10 PM
  #845
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I know and that's why I can't be too mad but Kitchener really should have won and this was a big game. Not to mention it was the first game I got to go to this season, didn't like that I got to see Gibson wet the bed.

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11-18-2012, 10:19 PM
  #846
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That looked to be the case for Gibson tonight but he single handedly won a few for us this year already. I think he deserves a pass.
This. It's ridiculous for people to be jeering Gibson.

EDIT: And, Kitchener did not deserve to win that game at all. Quite frankly, they played 5 minutes where they looked good... the last 5 minutes of the game.

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11-19-2012, 12:29 AM
  #847
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They were playing good enough to win, especially since London was having the same mistakes as Kitchener. Poor passing, poor entry into the zone, taking stupid retalitory penalties, whiffing on the puck. Not like London looked good, both looked average but Kitchener didn't deserve to lose like that.

How many times do you see a superstar goalie mess up like that so quickly in a row (And it could have been 3 goals remember, about 30 seconds after Gibson's escapade behind the net and him somehow thinking the London player was a Ranger he did it again). Then almost did it
once more on the 4th goal, but just ended up looking lost which frankly wasn't much better.

Obviously you don't want to take things too far but those are pretty unacceptable mistakes from Gibson. Doesn't matter that this is the first time this season, doesn't mean you can say it doesn't matter, because this game was huge and I'm sure Gibson doesn't think that it was OK because he's been great in other games. I'm sure he's beating him self up about that, especially the 3rd goal.

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11-19-2012, 07:37 AM
  #848
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The boys owed Gibson this game -- he's won enough for them, it was up to them to win one for him. Wasn't to be.

I thought the Bailey-***-Pederson line was fantastic all night -- either with Sterk or Meighan at centre. They had numerous scoring chances (in addition to their 2 goals) and had the Knights pinned down in their end of the ice on almost every shift.

Good to see Reider get one - he needs to do that a lot more. I thought McEneny had a rough game - certainly not his usual self.

They need to regroup and move on from this one. London took advantage of mistakes - good teams do that.

Crappy weekend for the Rangers. Guess they won't win the November Cup at this rate.

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11-19-2012, 07:58 AM
  #849
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My thoughts are, while you expect more out of your superstar goalie, you dont overly criticize him when he has on off game. While this weekend was big.......its NOVEMBER. Its not like we lost a playoff spot or even home ice advantage at this point in the season. This is a blip in the radar in the grand scheme of things. If it starts to be a trend, then people can start to worry and be critical.

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11-19-2012, 08:45 AM
  #850
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My thoughts are, while you expect more out of your superstar goalie, you dont overly criticize him when he has on off game. While this weekend was big.......its NOVEMBER. Its not like we lost a playoff spot or even home ice advantage at this point in the season. This is a blip in the radar in the grand scheme of things. If it starts to be a trend, then people can start to worry and be critical.
Yeah...I hope the next bad game for Gibby will be in the Gold Medal against Canada!

He's allowed 2 bad games a year!

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