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Old
11-14-2012, 10:36 PM
  #51
Benny FTW
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vankiller Whale View Post
I know I shouldn't do this but...

Which of:

Yakupov
Tarasenko
Huberdeau
Hamilton
Granlund

Wouldn't any sane Sens fan prefer over Stone?
I would take all of them except Tarasenko over Stone.

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11-14-2012, 10:40 PM
  #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vankiller Whale View Post
I know I shouldn't do this but...

Which of:

Yakupov
Tarasenko
Huberdeau
Hamilton
Granlund

Wouldn't any sane Sens fan prefer over Stone?
You do make an excellent point but remember how Huberdeau and Stone were toe-to-toe in play and complementing each other so well and matching one another in play and scoring, even though Stone got more during the WJC.

Watching Stone play in the A, I really think I underrate him over guys like Silfverberg and Zibanejad. He makes passes and plays like a top-line NHL player most of the times. It amazes me.

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Old
11-14-2012, 10:43 PM
  #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Benny FTW View Post
I would take all of them except Tarasenko over Stone.
I hope to goodness it's because you're worried he'll stay in the KHL(which I think is extremely unlikely). He's scoring well over PPG in the best league in the world at the moment while getting bottom-6 minutes.

Stone is a great prospect and all, but top-5 in the league is far too much hype.

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Old
11-14-2012, 11:31 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by Vankiller Whale View Post
I hope to goodness it's because you're worried he'll stay in the KHL(which I think is extremely unlikely). He's scoring well over PPG in the best league in the world at the moment while getting bottom-6 minutes.

Stone is a great prospect and all, but top-5 in the league is far too much hype.
That is exactly why I wouldn't want him. Not a fan of non-CHL russians.

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11-15-2012, 12:41 AM
  #55
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It's kind of a lateral move. It doesn't help or hurt the Sens or Kings, it's basically trading one top prospect for another.

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Old
11-15-2012, 03:19 AM
  #56
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A lot of Sens fans in here are exaggerating Stone, but that being said, I'll still take Stone over Toffoli. Their skillsets seem fairly even, but Stone is the MUST safer bet in my eyes. Character coming out his wazoo.

That being said, this talk of Stone being a top-5 prospect in the NHL is homer-talk hogwash. He's a kid who looks like he'll be able to hold his own as a top 6 winger in the NHL. He has 1st line upside, but I wouldn't count on it. Let's not oversell him before he's even played a regular season game with us.

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Old
11-15-2012, 03:59 AM
  #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BonkTastic View Post
A lot of Sens fans in here are exaggerating Stone, but that being said, I'll still take Stone over Toffoli. Their skillsets seem fairly even, but Stone is the MUST safer bet in my eyes. Character coming out his wazoo.

That being said, this talk of Stone being a top-5 prospect in the NHL is homer-talk hogwash. He's a kid who looks like he'll be able to hold his own as a top 6 winger in the NHL. He has 1st line upside, but I wouldn't count on it. Let's not oversell him before he's even played a regular season game with us.
Agreed (as usual).

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Old
11-15-2012, 04:12 AM
  #58
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If Stone can continue his play in the pro game. He'll be regarded in the same vein as elite prospects.

Just an incredibly smart hockey player, with outstanding vision and all around game.

Skating isn't a liability anymore.

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Old
11-15-2012, 06:14 AM
  #59
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Skating isn't a liability anymore.
That's Chang we can believe in...

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Old
11-15-2012, 06:56 AM
  #60
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I would rank Stone in the top 45 - 50 of forward prospects.

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Old
11-15-2012, 03:43 PM
  #61
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As a Sens fan in Ottawa I've seen Toffoli plenty of times.

I like Stone as a prospect and hope he continues his development, but how can so many people here say Toffoli isn't going to contribute at the NHL level?

He does tend to look disinterested at times, but the league is filled with players like this. He was a step above most players on the ice in the O.

I think Toffoli and Stone will probably carve out similar careers stats-wise (not style-wise), with both of them becoming top-9 players just outside of the top line position.

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Old
11-15-2012, 04:17 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by Hayzed1 View Post
As a Sens fan in Ottawa I've seen Toffoli plenty of times.

I like Stone as a prospect and hope he continues his development, but how can so many people here say Toffoli isn't going to contribute at the NHL level?
Of course he played for the 67's. Then Ottawa drafted Shane Prince and Toffoli became the 3rd/4th best player of that team. The icing on the cake was that he would never contribute at the NHL level.

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Old
11-15-2012, 06:10 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by Frolov 6'3 View Post
Of course he played for the 67's. Then Ottawa drafted Shane Prince and Toffoli became the 3rd/4th best player of that team. The icing on the cake was that he would never contribute at the NHL level.
Let's not put words into some fans mouths here. Toffoli was clearly, CLEARLY the most talented player on those 67's teams in terms of skill.

If anything, his time here in Ottawa showed that. In fact, it was his biggest criticism: "kid has every tool, but no toolbox". His problem in a lot of Ottawa fans eyes isn't below his neck, it's above it.

If Toffoli had played his junior hockey elsewhere, I think a lot of Sens fans would be a lot more receptive to OP's proposed deal. With him being a 67 however, a lot of us got a much better sneak-peak at him than most other fans, and the character issue was fairly obvious. That's not to say it's going to keep Toffoli from the NHL, as there are lots of skilled NHLers who maybe didn't go 100% during junior because their skill level allowed them to coast from time to time... but I think if the price to find out if Toffoli can find that extra gear is Mark Stone, most sens fans will politely decline.

It's not that most of us don't want Toffoli (because trust me, there's nothing this city loves more than the potential of having ex-67's on the Senators - just look at the love Zenon Konopka got last season) it's that we don't want him that badly.

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Old
11-16-2012, 01:19 AM
  #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BonkTastic View Post
Let's not put words into some fans mouths here. Toffoli was clearly, CLEARLY the most talented player on those 67's teams in terms of skill.

If anything, his time here in Ottawa showed that. In fact, it was his biggest criticism: "kid has every tool, but no toolbox". His problem in a lot of Ottawa fans eyes isn't below his neck, it's above it.

If Toffoli had played his junior hockey elsewhere, I think a lot of Sens fans would be a lot more receptive to OP's proposed deal. With him being a 67 however, a lot of us got a much better sneak-peak at him than most other fans, and the character issue was fairly obvious. That's not to say it's going to keep Toffoli from the NHL, as there are lots of skilled NHLers who maybe didn't go 100% during junior because their skill level allowed them to coast from time to time... but I think if the price to find out if Toffoli can find that extra gear is Mark Stone, most sens fans will politely decline.

It's not that most of us don't want Toffoli (because trust me, there's nothing this city loves more than the potential of having ex-67's on the Senators - just look at the love Zenon Konopka got last season) it's that we don't want him that badly.
Exactly.

As I said earlier, I've watched Toffoli play easily more than 100 times in my life. He is one of the most talented snipers in the history of one of the CHL's most legendary franchises, but he's incredibly frustrating.

Too often he'll refuse to backcheck, refuse to go the extra mile, shy away from a hit in the corner (the Toffoli Spin Off Move) and it's just something I haven't seen from Mark Stone. Both have knocks on their speed (if Toffoli doesn't he should have it), but from what I've seen Stone has the potential to be a more complete player than Tyler Toffoli.

It's certainly within the realm of possibility that Stone is one day a third liner in the NHL, but Toffoli will either boom or bust, simple as that.

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Old
11-16-2012, 01:07 PM
  #65
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Originally Posted by guyzeur View Post
I can assure you than Zbad, Stone and Silverberg are 1,2 and 3 in no particular order ahead of Noesen and Ceci. Lehner is our star prospect goalie, he should not be in the discussion since we are talking about forwards

Those 3, no one knows who will be the best NHL player right now.

It's only 1 play but see the pass that Stone made vs Rangers in last year playoff in his first game ever in the NHL. the defenseman was Ryan McDonagh. Stone played only 8 min in his only NHL game so far.

WOW... he looked like ****ing Gretzky.
what do you think 200pt next season?

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Old
11-16-2012, 01:32 PM
  #66
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Exactly.

As I said earlier, I've watched Toffoli play easily more than 100 times in my life. He is one of the most talented snipers in the history of one of the CHL's most legendary franchises, but he's incredibly frustrating.

Too often he'll refuse to backcheck, refuse to go the extra mile, shy away from a hit in the corner (the Toffoli Spin Off Move) and it's just something I haven't seen from Mark Stone. Both have knocks on their speed (if Toffoli doesn't he should have it), but from what I've seen Stone has the potential to be a more complete player than Tyler Toffoli.

It's certainly within the realm of possibility that Stone is one day a third liner in the NHL, but Toffoli will either boom or bust, simple as that.

I have only seen Toffoli a hand full of times but to me hes got the top 6 potential for sure. With the kings bottom six forwards there is alot of young forwards in the mix already clifford king nolon lewis not to mention the ones coming up. The kings need a top 6 scoring forward more and worth the risk to me to gamble on rather then a for sure bottom six player as u describe him. Nothing against stone just we need that boom player more then a for sure one.

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Old
11-16-2012, 04:31 PM
  #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BonkTastic View Post
Let's not put words into some fans mouths here. Toffoli was clearly, CLEARLY the most talented player on those 67's teams in terms of skill.

If anything, his time here in Ottawa showed that. In fact, it was his biggest criticism: "kid has every tool, but no toolbox". His problem in a lot of Ottawa fans eyes isn't below his neck, it's above it.

If Toffoli had played his junior hockey elsewhere, I think a lot of Sens fans would be a lot more receptive to OP's proposed deal. With him being a 67 however, a lot of us got a much better sneak-peak at him than most other fans, and the character issue was fairly obvious. That's not to say it's going to keep Toffoli from the NHL, as there are lots of skilled NHLers who maybe didn't go 100% during junior because their skill level allowed them to coast from time to time... but I think if the price to find out if Toffoli can find that extra gear is Mark Stone, most sens fans will politely decline.

It's not that most of us don't want Toffoli (because trust me, there's nothing this city loves more than the potential of having ex-67's on the Senators - just look at the love Zenon Konopka got last season) it's that we don't want him that badly.
I cant recall I've said anything about Stone or other things you talk about.

Somebody asked a question and I answered. Of course there are many exceptions but I've seen it all over here, trust me. I always have to laugh as well when 18 year old's talk about character issues. I will give my opinion about Toffoli's character within a couple of years.


Last edited by Frolov 6'3: 11-16-2012 at 04:37 PM.
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Old
11-16-2012, 06:39 PM
  #68
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Originally Posted by Frolov 6'3 View Post
I cant recall I've said anything about Stone or other things you talk about.

Somebody asked a question and I answered. Of course there are many exceptions but I've seen it all over here, trust me. I always have to laugh as well when 18 year old's talk about character issues. I will give my opinion about Toffoli's character within a couple of years.
Oh, right. I probably should have said somewhere that my post was directed more to the thread in general, and less to you specifically. I think I was just piggybacking off your comment, rather than addressing it specifically.

I omitted that information, my bad.

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Old
11-18-2012, 11:37 AM
  #69
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No thanks, I'd rather keep Toffoli, I just don't see the incentive for moving our best prospect in an area of weakness in the organisation.
I love how 'the area of weakness' has Jeff Carter, Dustin Brown, Justin Williams, Dustin Penner, Simon Gagne, and co.

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11-18-2012, 12:53 PM
  #70
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I love how 'the area of weakness' has Jeff Carter, Dustin Brown, Justin Williams, Dustin Penner, Simon Gagne, and co.
... I didn't know those guys were prospects.

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11-18-2012, 12:56 PM
  #71
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... I didn't know those guys were prospects.
I think his point is that the King are set down the middle for the next while.

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11-18-2012, 01:00 PM
  #72
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I think his point is that the King are set down the middle for the next while.
Doesn't matter they aren't permanent injuries and trades then what have sub par wingers for however long. Keep Toffoli we need him. Those our are roster players not our prospects we should think of the future and other cases which we should be strengthening our weakness.

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11-18-2012, 10:47 PM
  #73
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I love how 'the area of weakness' has Jeff Carter, Dustin Brown, Justin Williams, Dustin Penner, Simon Gagne, and co.
Penner and Gagne only have one year left on their contracts and both Gagne and Williams have proven to be quite fragile in the recent past.

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