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NJ - Boston (Larsson)

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Old
11-18-2012, 12:07 PM
  #51
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Originally Posted by Oates2Neely View Post
Minus their Captain and best player
Parise's going to be missed but what you said is not true. Elias and Kovalchuk were better than Parise in the regular season.
Henrique, Kovalchuk and Brodeur > Parise in the playoffs as well.

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Old
11-18-2012, 12:23 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by Oates2Neely View Post
Minus their Captain and best player
That is true, but I still don't think they would be interested in trading a potential all-star level d-man. That is of course unless the price was something that Boston wouldn't be interested in doing.

We still don't know what is going to happen with the salary cap so, that could have an impact on everyone and we may see a bunch of players being moved for cap reasons, that is the only way I see Boston making a move to acquire such a high end young player.

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Old
11-18-2012, 01:11 PM
  #53
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Originally Posted by Oates2Neely View Post
Minus their Captain and best player
Parise is gone, but Kovalchuk is still here...

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Old
11-18-2012, 01:48 PM
  #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oates2Neely View Post
Minus their Captain and best player
Has that ever stopped the Devils before? They've lost great players over the years and still made the playoffs.

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Old
11-18-2012, 02:15 PM
  #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oates2Neely View Post
Minus their Captain and best player
We didnt lose Kovy or Elias .

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Old
11-18-2012, 02:41 PM
  #56
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Not a bad package(Marchand and Subban... the Knight one is laughable), but NJ is looking to deal Larsson as much as Boston is looking to deal Seguin or Hamilton.

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Old
11-18-2012, 04:54 PM
  #57
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This is horrible value

Would you do Hamilton for Wedgewood and Clarkson?

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Old
11-18-2012, 05:23 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by Halpysback View Post
This is horrible value

Would you do Hamilton for Wedgewood and Clarkson?
No!Like Clackson but Lucic is more valuable to us then david would be,give ya Horton for him

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11-18-2012, 06:43 PM
  #59
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Clarkson is also very unlikely to be traded. He has a very good relationship with both Lou and DeBoer, and he just had a breakout 30 goal season.

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Old
11-18-2012, 08:34 PM
  #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Halpysback View Post
This is horrible value

Would you do Hamilton for Wedgewood and Clarkson?
Clarkson is overrated by many. I don't have a problem with the value, only thing I have a problem is how it doesn't fit the Devils needs. Although I'd love to add Hamilton, a Hamilton-Larsson future on defense would be INSANE, the Devils can't afford to trade Clarkson with their lack of scoring up front and their lack of immediate replacements right now. That and their strength, both on the NHL level and in prospect wise, is our defense, so Hamilton isn't really needed.

Similarly, they can't afford to give up their most likely successor to the goaltending position, especially since Brodeur/Hedberg aren't going to be around much longer. Had the scenario been different, let's say Marty was 5 years younger and we resigned Poni or signed another forward, I'd do the deal.

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Old
11-19-2012, 08:51 AM
  #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zippy316 View Post
Clarkson is overrated by many. I don't have a problem with the value, only thing I have a problem is how it doesn't fit the Devils needs. Although I'd love to add Hamilton, a Hamilton-Larsson future on defense would be INSANE, the Devils can't afford to trade Clarkson with their lack of scoring up front and their lack of immediate replacements right now. That and their strength, both on the NHL level and in prospect wise, is our defense, so Hamilton isn't really needed.

Similarly, they can't afford to give up their most likely successor to the goaltending position, especially since Brodeur/Hedberg aren't going to be around much longer. Had the scenario been different, let's say Marty was 5 years younger and we resigned Poni or signed another forward, I'd do the deal.
I can understand not wanting to trade Larsson, but to say the offer didnt fit the Devils needs is a lil off. Marchand is a feisty LW who potted close to 30 goals last season. He would help fill the void left by Parise. Subban while unproven, is a tad more highly regarded than Wedgewood. And Subbans time frame would fit the Devils (Brodeur & Hedberg) perfectly as both have contracts expiring after 2 seasons. Perhaps the 'value' is off, but the 'needs' IMO werent off at all.

I also think a few NJ fans are overlooking the impact of losing Parise will have on this team. He was the heartbeat of that team. Lou needs to make sure he finds someone to at least partially fill that void. I expect NJ to struggle this season (if).

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Old
11-19-2012, 09:06 AM
  #62
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everyone expects NJ to struggle every season

it is never any different.

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Old
11-19-2012, 09:28 AM
  #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oates2Neely View Post
I can understand not wanting to trade Larsson, but to say the offer didnt fit the Devils needs is a lil off. Marchand is a feisty LW who potted close to 30 goals last season. He would help fill the void left by Parise. Subban while unproven, is a tad more highly regarded than Wedgewood. And Subbans time frame would fit the Devils (Brodeur & Hedberg) perfectly as both have contracts expiring after 2 seasons. Perhaps the 'value' is off, but the 'needs' IMO werent off at all.

I also think a few NJ fans are overlooking the impact of losing Parise will have on this team. He was the heartbeat of that team. Lou needs to make sure he finds someone to at least partially fill that void. I expect NJ to struggle this season (if).
Extremely routine prediction for Devils fans, meh...

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11-19-2012, 09:33 AM
  #64
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Goalie prospects are always a crap shoot. Subban is highly regarded, but that means nothing to me when I can't predict his career progression with any level of confidence. Wedgewood is a good goalie too, and Devils fans are excited about his puck handling skills which remind us of Marty's. Who can say which will become the better goalie? Neither is a sure thing to be a star, or a sure thing to bust.

We are not overlooking the impact of losing Parise. Replacing his scoring will be difficult. Replacing his leadership, less so.

Keep predicting the decline of the Devils, we're used to seeing it every year, but it doesn't happen with Lou in charge. Barring DeBoer turning into John MacLean overnight, I expect the Devils to be competitive again.

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11-19-2012, 12:36 PM
  #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oates2Neely View Post
I can understand not wanting to trade Larsson, but to say the offer didnt fit the Devils needs is a lil off. Marchand is a feisty LW who potted close to 30 goals last season. He would help fill the void left by Parise. Subban while unproven, is a tad more highly regarded than Wedgewood. And Subbans time frame would fit the Devils (Brodeur & Hedberg) perfectly as both have contracts expiring after 2 seasons. Perhaps the 'value' is off, but the 'needs' IMO werent off at all.

I also think a few NJ fans are overlooking the impact of losing Parise will have on this team. He was the heartbeat of that team. Lou needs to make sure he finds someone to at least partially fill that void. I expect NJ to struggle this season (if).
Nothing new. Lou wont allow that to happen

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Old
11-19-2012, 01:30 PM
  #66
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Goalie prospects, no matter how highly regarded they are, will always be a crapshoot. There's just no guarantee that they will transition their game well into the NHL. Obviously this can be said about every prospect no matter their position but this applies to goalies the most.

There's no way M. Subban would be one of the centerpieces in a deal involving Larsson, that would be way too much of a risk on the Devils side. I'd love to get Marchand but not at the price of Larsson. Wedgewood and Kinkaid may not have the same assumed potential as Subban but I'd rather test our luck with those two then trade away our potential franchise Dman for yet another goalie prospect and Marchand.

The loss of Parise is big, no doubt about it. That doesn't mean Lou is going to rush to find a replacement for him and make an absurd deal, such as trading away Larsson. Devils fans have outlined the two Dman that would be most expendable, if a deal can't be worked around those two (Tallinder and Volchenkov) then there isn't a deal to be made.

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11-19-2012, 01:50 PM
  #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheddabombs View Post
Goalie prospects, no matter how highly regarded they are, will always be a crapshoot. There's just no guarantee that they will transition their game well into the NHL. Obviously this can be said about every prospect no matter their position but this applies to goalies the most.

There's no way M. Subban would be one of the centerpieces in a deal involving Larsson, that would be way too much of a risk on the Devils side. I'd love to get Marchand but not at the price of Larsson. Wedgewood and Kinkaid may not have the same assumed potential as Subban but I'd rather test our luck with those two then trade away our potential franchise Dman for yet another goalie prospect and Marchand.

The loss of Parise is big, no doubt about it. That doesn't mean Lou is going to rush to find a replacement for him and make an absurd deal, such as trading away Larsson. Devils fans have outlined the two Dman that would be most expendable, if a deal can't be worked around those two (Tallinder and Volchenkov) then there isn't a deal to be made.
Good post.

Any names on Lou's radar yet for a top-6 wing? I cant imagine the team wants to run with Clarkson there, he seems perfectly suited for a 3rd line checking role.

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Old
11-19-2012, 01:55 PM
  #68
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Zach Parise was not the catalyst of the Devils offense. He never was, even when he scored 94 points.

It's not Ilya Kovalchuk either, despite his incredible season last year.

The engine that drives the Devils offense is Patrik Elias. It always has been. When Patrik does well, the team does well.

Losing Parise sucks but he's not irreplaceable offensively. Having a healthy Zajac return is going to be at least a 50-60 point buffer.

I have a hunch that a full season of the Cater/Gionta/Bernier line is going to provide quite a bit of offensive support from the 4th line as well.

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Old
11-19-2012, 01:59 PM
  #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheddabombs View Post
Goalie prospects, no matter how highly regarded they are, will always be a crapshoot. There's just no guarantee that they will transition their game well into the NHL. Obviously this can be said about every prospect no matter their position but this applies to goalies the most.

There's no way M. Subban would be one of the centerpieces in a deal involving Larsson, that would be way too much of a risk on the Devils side. I'd love to get Marchand but not at the price of Larsson. Wedgewood and Kinkaid may not have the same assumed potential as Subban but I'd rather test our luck with those two then trade away our potential franchise Dman for yet another goalie prospect and Marchand.

The loss of Parise is big, no doubt about it. That doesn't mean Lou is going to rush to find a replacement for him and make an absurd deal, such as trading away Larsson. Devils fans have outlined the two Dman that would be most expendable, if a deal can't be worked around those two (Tallinder and Volchenkov) then there isn't a deal to be made.
Then why do well-respected GMs like Chiarelli take a "crapshoot" pick like Subban in the 1st round? Goalie prospects are hard to judge, but they absolutely are NOT equal.

I agree with the rest of your post tho, well done. Subban as the centerpiece of a deal would be idiotic for you guys.

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11-19-2012, 02:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Tim Vezina Thomas View Post
Then why do well-respected GMs like Chiarelli take a "crapshoot" pick like Subban in the 1st round? Goalie prospects are hard to judge, but they absolutely are NOT equal.

I agree with the rest of your post tho, well done. Subban as the centerpiece of a deal would be idiotic for you guys.
Marchand was the centerpiece.

I see Marchand as a 30g 30a, fast, young, crash the net, pesty type. Very good top-6 winger.

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11-19-2012, 02:15 PM
  #71
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Marchand was the centerpiece.

I see Marchand as a 30g 30a, fast, young, crash the net, pesty type. Very good top-6 winger.
He noted Subban as the centerpiece wouldn't be smart for the Devils, I was just agreeing with him. (Wait, read that wrong, thought he said "the" centerpiece...disregard)

On paper your proposal is interesting and close value wise IMO, but I think Larsson means too much to them organizationally to even consider it. I however would do it in a second haha.

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11-19-2012, 02:19 PM
  #72
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Originally Posted by Tim Vezina Thomas View Post
He noted Subban as the centerpiece wouldn't be smart for the Devils, I was just agreeing with him. (Wait, read that wrong, thought he said "the" centerpiece...disregard)

On paper your proposal is interesting and close value wise IMO, but I think Larsson means too much to them organizationally to even consider it. I however would do it in a second haha.
I agree, thats why I proposed B's snag him. Larsson is a future stud. It'd hurt to give up Marchand, because I think he's just starting to hit his stride, but a future defense with Hamilton & Larsson anchoring it just cries out "more Stanley Cups"

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11-19-2012, 02:35 PM
  #73
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Good post.

Any names on Lou's radar yet for a top-6 wing? I cant imagine the team wants to run with Clarkson there, he seems perfectly suited for a 3rd line checking role.
There are a few names on Devils fans' radar for sure but those dont translate to what Lou is thinking. There was a divide among Devils fans in terms of signing Semin this past off-season but ultimately that didnt pan out.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tim Vezina Thomas View Post
Then why do well-respected GMs like Chiarelli take a "crapshoot" pick like Subban in the 1st round? Goalie prospects are hard to judge, but they absolutely are NOT equal.

I agree with the rest of your post tho, well done. Subban as the centerpiece of a deal would be idiotic for you guys.
Goalie prospects are highly regarded and therefore chosen in the first round but it is still a big gamble. There have been too many instances in which goalie prospects picked in later rounds turned out better than those picked ahead of them. Obviously Chiarelli is one of the better GM's in the league so who am I to judge really. I'm just saying I would not personally be shocked if either Subban or Vasilevski dont pan out as expected, even Dansk for that matter.

However, even if we we're talking about another highly regarded prospect, I'd be hard-pressed to give up Larsson for them. Larsson has the potential to be a franchise Dman while already playing solid his first year in the NHL. Even if he were to peak at the level he played at last year he will still be a good #2/#3 for the Devils moving forward. I doubt that will happen and expect him to continue to develop into our future #1 but that's obviously not guaranteed.

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11-19-2012, 03:37 PM
  #74
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Originally Posted by Oates2Neely View Post
I can understand not wanting to trade Larsson, but to say the offer didnt fit the Devils needs is a lil off. Marchand is a feisty LW who potted close to 30 goals last season. He would help fill the void left by Parise. Subban while unproven, is a tad more highly regarded than Wedgewood. And Subbans time frame would fit the Devils (Brodeur & Hedberg) perfectly as both have contracts expiring after 2 seasons. Perhaps the 'value' is off, but the 'needs' IMO werent off at all.

I also think a few NJ fans are overlooking the impact of losing Parise will have on this team. He was the heartbeat of that team. Lou needs to make sure he finds someone to at least partially fill that void. I expect NJ to struggle this season (if).
Even if he may be a bit better, we still have Wedgewood, Clermont, Kinkaid, and Frazee. There is absolutely no room for Subban, and I'm not giving up Larsson to get a little bit of an upgrade in a position that is actually one of our strengths in the prospect pool, especially not a position that is extremely boom or bust.

Marchand may fill a need, but he's not worth it at the expense of Larsson.

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11-19-2012, 03:40 PM
  #75
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no thanks. not interested in trading Larsson for anything short of an overpayment.
yeah... that sound about roght I'd say

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