HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > National Hockey League Talk
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
National Hockey League Talk Discuss NHL players, teams, games, and the Stanley Cup Playoffs.

Are the fastest NHL skaters really all that fast?

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
11-20-2012, 05:16 PM
  #76
FrozenJagrt
Registered User
 
FrozenJagrt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Waterloo, Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,463
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by TieClark View Post
In this comparison no... you are not going to notice a couple feet difference from 2 separate videos and that was the point. One wasn't international ice compared to NA ice.


No I'm saying this is how they're built in the GTA. I'm sure you provide boards that would fit the 200 by 85.

It has nothing to do with the size of the rink. They're designed to fit around 200 by 85 rinks. Whether or not the rinks may be off by a foot or 2 wasn't the point.
So now the rinks are no longer a standard NA size, but you were talking about the building rather than the rinks anyway, which is irrelevant to this conversation. Is that what this has devolved to?

FrozenJagrt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-20-2012, 05:20 PM
  #77
FrozenJagrt
Registered User
 
FrozenJagrt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Waterloo, Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,463
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by craigcaulks View Post
You ever watch a situation so embarrassing for someone it's hard to watch? They often decide to throw random insults or nitpick tiny little details because they can't just say, ooops.
Welcome to TieClark's world. I've been putting up with that for about 5 years now.

FrozenJagrt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-20-2012, 05:31 PM
  #78
The Zetterberg Era
Nyquist Explosion!
 
The Zetterberg Era's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Ft. Myers, FL
Country: United States
Posts: 17,581
vCash: 515
It is an interesting study, but the title should really be about average NHL skaters? Because yes when you look at Gaborik, Grabner, Helm and some of the other great skaters it is flat out explosive on a level that is incredibly rare. Their acceleration and top end speed are extremely different. Also tenths of a second to up to a second on a surface as small as the standard ice (I know they aren't all the same) is a huge difference, it can be mph average difference that would shock you.

As others have pointed out what really seperates these guys anyway is their ability to do things at speed. Now my guess is while they improved overtime several of the NHL players were pretty explosive even at age 14 and could matchup to some of the guys in the league but there is an obvious reason for that, they had that kind of future.

The Zetterberg Era is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
11-20-2012, 05:41 PM
  #79
Harry Waters
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 154
vCash: 500
I get the feeling that we need boarding penalties on this board. Seems logical, doesn't it?

Harry Waters is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-20-2012, 06:30 PM
  #80
RandV
It's a wolf v2.0
 
RandV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Vancouver
Country: Canada
Posts: 14,370
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yellowstone View Post
I'm going to take down the video.

My point was very simple and was not well received.

I suspect that some day, one of you guys will dupicate this test and come back and say "Hey, there are kids that can compete in the NHL straight-line skating competition".

That was my simple point.

So if kids can ring up these numbers, then the NHL skills speed skating test is not very impressive. The NHL competition, as it is now designed, does not showcase the NHLer's true skating skills.

Also, the next time I'm at this rink, I will confirm that the face-off-dot to face-off-dot distance is consistant with an NHL rink (should be 132 feet)... but still, I doubt that even that would satisfy some of you.

Oh well, it was a lively discussion... while it lasted.
If you're video is actually accurate (which like others I'm not sold on) then perhaps an alternate conclusion can be made that rather than implying an NHL'ers straightaway speed is a common skill it suggests being small and light gives you an overall edge in skating?

RandV is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-21-2012, 12:25 AM
  #81
sully61
Unregistered User
 
sully61's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Michigan
Posts: 1,407
vCash: 500
Having played with ex NHLers in adult league, what separates me from them in speed is not top end speed, it's acceleration, they get to top end speed so much quicker

sully61 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-21-2012, 06:15 AM
  #82
ZARTONK
Headscratcher!
 
ZARTONK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Montreal
Country: Armenia
Posts: 8,006
vCash: 50
Well in a small distance such as the lenght of an ice rink (standard size, nhl size, or any size) its hard to see the real difference between two players..

I mean for example, ussain bolt can outrun an f1 racecar for the fist 30 feet if theyre both go from a standstill...

ZARTONK is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-21-2012, 11:52 AM
  #83
craigcaulks*
Registered Luser.
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: East Van!
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,000
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZARTONK View Post
Well in a small distance such as the lenght of an ice rink (standard size, nhl size, or any size) its hard to see the real difference between two players..

I mean for example, ussain bolt can outrun an f1 racecar for the fist 30 feet if theyre both go from a standstill...
No he can't. F-1 cars can go 0-60 in less than 2 seconds.

craigcaulks* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-21-2012, 03:53 PM
  #84
malkovsby
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 416
vCash: 500
acceleration and agility set the nhl players apart big time..but if your lapping the rink in under 14 seconds like kovalchuk a few years ago thats insanely fast, i consider myself a good skater and the best iv got is just over 15

also the difference of a second or half a second is basically the entire neutral zone so you have to put it in perspective

in conclusion..nhl players are fast

malkovsby is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-21-2012, 09:54 PM
  #85
Arpeggio
Registered User
 
Arpeggio's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Edmonton
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,212
vCash: 500
I don't know why I didn't think of this, but has no one watched skills competitions at lower levels? NHLers can go sub 14 seconds in the lap race. Kids just can't do that. From what I remember the fastest kids generally skated just sub 15.

You guys can say whatever you want about how it's what the NHLers can do at high speeds that sets them apart, which is true, but the fact is that bantam, midget level guys are not going to touch any NHLer in a lap around the rink.

Arpeggio is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-21-2012, 10:13 PM
  #86
JAVO16
Registered User
 
JAVO16's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Montréal
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,574
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by craigcaulks View Post
No he can't. F-1 cars can go 0-60 in less than 2 seconds.
I lol'd

JAVO16 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
11-21-2012, 10:16 PM
  #87
craigcaulks*
Registered Luser.
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: East Van!
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,000
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arpeggio View Post
I don't know why I didn't think of this, but has no one watched skills competitions at lower levels? NHLers can go sub 14 seconds in the lap race. Kids just can't do that. From what I remember the fastest kids generally skated just sub 15.

You guys can say whatever you want about how it's what the NHLers can do at high speeds that sets them apart, which is true, but the fact is that bantam, midget level guys are not going to touch any NHLer in a lap around the rink.

Add to that there are lots of track stars aged 15-16 that run ridiculous times. The problem is, if you gave them a ball and a bunch of monsters hitting them, they'd be dead.

craigcaulks* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-22-2012, 10:41 AM
  #88
startainfection
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Long Island
Posts: 6,256
vCash: 500
the way they did fastest skater last year was retarded, it should be a full lap

btw on my high school team the fastest skater skated a lap in like 15.5 seconds, i skated one in 18

startainfection is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-22-2012, 04:50 PM
  #89
Nordic*
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Tellus
Country: Russian Federation
Posts: 12,611
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by danyhabsfan View Post
This thread is awesome

Id like to skate with NHL players.

Im a pretty quick guy and a good player.

Id like to know what I look like on TV. Maybe Id say I look so slow (Mathieu Darche) or maybe I could skate with most NHL players.

You'll have a better shot at swimming with dolphins.

Nordic* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-22-2012, 06:14 PM
  #90
RANDOMH3RO
Registered User
 
RANDOMH3RO's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,196
vCash: 500
I don't think it's a good idea to question the ability of pros at the most important skill in the game. Too many people in this thread claiming very very young minor hockey players have NHL quality skating potential. uh-uh.

RANDOMH3RO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-23-2012, 12:12 AM
  #91
TAnnala
HFBoards Sponsor
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Oulu
Posts: 9,678
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by iPunch View Post
Being on the ice with a current or former NHL player is a humbling experience. I played against a then 60ish year old Jim McKenny and other NHL alumni when I was on a hotshot AAA bantam team and we got absolutely destroyed.

Yes they are that fast, and they are better than you think they are.
Would be fricking awesome to play against old NHL veteran some time. My uncle was pretty good hockey player when he was young. Well he is still only 43 years but he has had some serious knee problems, that is what destroyed his career.

When i play with my uncle it is absolutely ridiculous how good he is and he never even had a real chance at the NHL. More of a FEL player.

TAnnala is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-23-2012, 12:19 AM
  #92
LatvianTwist
Global Moderator
 
LatvianTwist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Houston
Country: Tibet
Posts: 18,027
vCash: 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by Barrie22 View Post
just have to look at trevor daley when he was in the ohl, he would skate end to end, get the puck stripped from him behind the other teams net and them make a break out pass before daley was even past the goal line and he would be the defensemen back in position to break up the play going the other way.

now he just looks average at best skating wise in the nhl.
Daley definitely looks more than above average in the NHL...

I've been on the ice with him. When he actually tried in the scrimmage (against a bunch of A-AA players down here) it was ungodly how he destroyed us. At one point both teams all got out on the ice against him (~20 players) and even still, we couldn't stop him (no checking, of course ). Television doesn't do these players justice. Hell, even being at the game doesn't. You don't realize just how insane the level of skill is in the NHL until you actually experience it.

LatvianTwist is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-23-2012, 12:50 AM
  #93
Hitchslap
Registered User
 
Hitchslap's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 1,348
vCash: 50
I wish I could have seen this video, but I don't think there's any chance in hell any 14 year old can keep up with an NHLer in a true speed test. There was something flawed with this test. I've been around hockey my whole life and I can sure as hell tell you there is no 14 year old that could even match me.

Hitchslap is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
11-23-2012, 07:42 AM
  #94
FrozenJagrt
Registered User
 
FrozenJagrt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Waterloo, Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,463
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hitchslap View Post
I wish I could have seen this video, but I don't think there's any chance in hell any 14 year old can keep up with an NHLer in a true speed test. There was something flawed with this test. I've been around hockey my whole life and I can sure as hell tell you there is no 14 year old that could even match me.
I don't think you can say there are NO 14 year olds in the world with NHL skating. Hell, Phil Kessel started getting a lot of attention around that age because of his incredible speed and shot.

FrozenJagrt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-23-2012, 08:45 AM
  #95
#57
Registered User
 
#57's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 7,713
vCash: 500
I disagree that this 14 years old kid skates just as fast as Hagelin but to be honest I kinda agree with the fact that a number of juniors/minor pro guys are just as fast as NHL guys.

The difference IMO is the quicknest at which the NHL players make plays and their acceleration. They completely blow away the minor leagues for execution, that's for sure.

But I wouldn't put it past a couple of our fastest junior players to beat some NHLers in straight races.

Even for shooting/passing, I mean, how many times have we seen younger players come into their first couple of games and score top shelf on NHL goaltenders? It happens. It's not out of the realm of possibilities to say that some junior players have better skill level than a bunch of NHL guys.

Hagelin came out of the NCAA and was already one of the fastest skater in the NHL

#57 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-23-2012, 09:36 AM
  #96
FlyingKostitsyn
Registered User
 
FlyingKostitsyn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Quebec
Country: Australia
Posts: 8,016
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by #57 View Post
I disagree that this 14 years old kid skates just as fast as Hagelin but to be honest I kinda agree with the fact that a number of juniors/minor pro guys are just as fast as NHL guys.

The difference IMO is the quicknest at which the NHL players make plays and their acceleration. They completely blow away the minor leagues for execution, that's for sure.

But I wouldn't put it past a couple of our fastest junior players to beat some NHLers in straight races.

Even for shooting/passing, I mean, how many times have we seen younger players come into their first couple of games and score top shelf on NHL goaltenders? It happens. It's not out of the realm of possibilities to say that some junior players have better skill level than a bunch of NHL guys.

Hagelin came out of the NCAA and was already one of the fastest skater in the NHL
But there is a massive difference in development between a drafted, elite junior 18+yr old who makes the NHL out of camp and a 14 years old who isn't in major junior yet.

The ''younger players'' who make their mark early in the NHL are already adults. Hagelin was 23 when he made the NHL, his body was fully developed then.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ace14
I don't think you can say there are NO 14 year olds in the world with NHL skating. Hell, Phil Kessel started getting a lot of attention around that age because of his incredible speed and shot.
This is true but these would be very rare exceptions and even then, while these exceptionally quick youth might compare to average skating NHLers they would never come close to the top skaters.

FlyingKostitsyn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-23-2012, 12:00 PM
  #97
SERE 24
LGR
 
SERE 24's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: New York
Country: United States
Posts: 9,779
vCash: 500
I agree with the last poster, but I still think it's possible to have the speed to beat some NHL players in a straight line when you're 15 or so. Not the leg strength or endurance to keep it up throughout an entire game, against 200lb men, grinding in the corners and constantly stopping and starting, but the simple straight line speed? Sure. But these kids are children who have exceptional skating skill, not some bender who doesn't even play competitively like the kid in the OPs original video. Kids who are getting drafted into the CHL or scouted for college might have good enough edge work and technique to be fast enough to compare to the average NHLer in straight line speed (again, endurance, strength, explosiveness are all different stories - as is being able to stay fast as you bulk up; fast at 140lbs and fast at 200lbs are a ways apart). Kids who play in beer league and don't even look comfortable on their edges simply don't have a shot, no matter how fast you might think they look in your hand-filmed, homemade speed course.

SERE 24 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-03-2012, 03:40 PM
  #98
drs151
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 1,286
vCash: 500
I didnt watch the video but it is possible for some kids to be close to average NHL speed but not the fastest guys. And not even average. And when I say kids I mean 16-17 year olds. I know this because I used to be one of these kids. Im 25 years old now. But at 16 years old I was at a camp and Barry Smith was there. I believe he was the coach or assistant for the Red Wings. But anyways we used the same style of course he said he used for his players. I cant remember the exact numbers but for the course he used I believe he said the average of his players was 14.7 seconds, and the fastest were around 14.1. I did my course in 15.0 seconds. Now im not trying to pump my tires, I wasnt the biggest and didnt have the best hands or the best hockey IQ. But I had many scouts tell me that I was one of the fastest hockey players they had seen. I also won fastest skater at a moose jaw warriors WHL camp. (didnt make it haha)

So really no kids are any where near the fastest skaters in the NHL. I was one of the fastest kids at 16 years old in western Canada and I was almost a second slower than the fastest guys on the Detroit Red Wings. And who knows those guys might not have been even the fastest compared to others in the NHL.

drs151 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-03-2012, 04:04 PM
  #99
SERE 24
LGR
 
SERE 24's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: New York
Country: United States
Posts: 9,779
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by drs151 View Post
I didnt watch the video but it is possible for some kids to be close to average NHL speed but not the fastest guys. And not even average. And when I say kids I mean 16-17 year olds. I know this because I used to be one of these kids. Im 25 years old now. But at 16 years old I was at a camp and Barry Smith was there. I believe he was the coach or assistant for the Red Wings. But anyways we used the same style of course he said he used for his players. I cant remember the exact numbers but for the course he used I believe he said the average of his players was 14.7 seconds, and the fastest were around 14.1. I did my course in 15.0 seconds. Now im not trying to pump my tires, I wasnt the biggest and didnt have the best hands or the best hockey IQ. But I had many scouts tell me that I was one of the fastest hockey players they had seen. I also won fastest skater at a moose jaw warriors WHL camp. (didnt make it haha)

So really no kids are any where near the fastest skaters in the NHL. I was one of the fastest kids at 16 years old in western Canada and I was almost a second slower than the fastest guys on the Detroit Red Wings. And who knows those guys might not have been even the fastest compared to others in the NHL.
I agree with everything you wrote and outlined a similar experience involving myself earlier in the thread (I'm the same age as you as well), but just to quell your curiosity, since you didn't see the video, I'll just come out and say it. The kid in the video was a bender. I've tried to be more eloquent in my previous posts, saying he was mediocre at best, but the kid didn't even have a good stride, let alone the latent fluency you would expect from someone who is being compared to an NHL skater. The entire premise was ridiculous (that the video served as evidence and this kid was comparable, not that it's possible for kids outside of the NHL to compare in general).

SERE 24 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-03-2012, 06:03 PM
  #100
Beville
#ForTheBoys
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Engerlanddd!
Country: United Kingdom
Posts: 3,528
vCash: 500
Difference is, an NHL'er will go that fast, for the full 60 minutes...

Beville is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:27 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.