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Off-Season Madness the 6th: John Gibbons is back, can Josh Towers be far behind?

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Old
11-21-2012, 09:48 PM
  #951
Anthrax442
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Originally Posted by YunelYESco View Post
jays sign cesar iszturis

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11-21-2012, 09:56 PM
  #952
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jays sign cesar iszturis
Yeah it was reported a few pages ago! Minor League deal.

BTW, I know I mentioned Lind had decent stats down the stretch (he hits best in the #5 hole). During the second half Lind posted a .301 average, .342 OBP, .789 OPS, .444 SLG.

Those aren't incredible stats, but they're very solid for his price. Actually, besides his one breakout year, if he could post those over the course of a season, he'd have his second best season and something we could actually work with.

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11-21-2012, 09:56 PM
  #953
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JaysLeafsTFCfan View Post
How can people say that about Moore? He had a pretty average rookie season.
Compare Lincecum and Moore's rookie seasons, near identical. Then look at Matt Moore's 2nd half stats.

2nd half:
3.01 ERA 77.2 innings 1.210 WHIP 9.2 K/9 3.6 BB/9

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Old
11-21-2012, 09:57 PM
  #954
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What do people think about possibly trading away Drabek or even Drabek + Hutchinson for a more established young pitcher? Both players are a non factor next year and of coarse aren't for sure things to be what they are projected be. Both players are cheap and controllable... Both players could be solid 2-3 guys in a rotation, I especially like Drew Hutchinson. A team that wants a surplus of young controllable players would sacrifice the year to get 2 guys with high potential. Sort of like you sacrifice the year, you sacrifice injury concerns, but in the end get TWO young controllable pitchers long term. The player in return would have to have a dominant upside, and be able to pitch effectivley next season.
They have like no value now, especially Drabek who was bad and has now had 2 TJ surgery and is likely a bullpen arm now.

Jays are better off keeping them -- they will need them next season.

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11-21-2012, 10:03 PM
  #955
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They have like no value now, especially Drabek who was bad and has now had 2 TJ surgery and is likely a bullpen arm now.

Jays are better off keeping them -- they will need them next season.
exactly.

no-one will pay for their potential now, especially considering they're on the shelf for most of the season.

no point in trading them when their value is at their lowest. Let them come back, maybe help out in the second half through the bullpen or if injuries hit, or at least rebuild their value in buffalo, and decide what to do with them next winter.

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11-21-2012, 10:08 PM
  #956
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Yeah it was reported a few pages ago! Minor League deal.

BTW, I know I mentioned Lind had decent stats down the stretch (he hits best in the #5 hole). During the second half Lind posted a .301 average, .342 OBP, .789 OPS, .444 SLG.

Those aren't incredible stats, but they're very solid for his price. Actually, besides his one breakout year, if he could post those over the course of a season, he'd have his second best season and something we could actually work with.
He is still going to be the weak link in this lineup if he hits 5th. For me, he needs to have an OPS over .800 and slug over .470 at least. I would prefer to see him shipped out. He does not deserve an opening night start.

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11-21-2012, 10:09 PM
  #957
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Moore has a fastball that is in Verlander and Price's range in terms of velocity and depth/sink. As a rookie it had better swing/whiff then Price, Verlander and Strasburg.

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11-21-2012, 10:09 PM
  #958
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Yeah it was reported a few pages ago! Minor League deal.

BTW, I know I mentioned Lind had decent stats down the stretch (he hits best in the #5 hole). During the second half Lind posted a .301 average, .342 OBP, .789 OPS, .444 SLG.

Those aren't incredible stats, but they're very solid for his price. Actually, besides his one breakout year, if he could post those over the course of a season, he'd have his second best season and something we could actually work with.
His issues have always been pitch recognition and plate discipline. Which is usually what separates the mediocre hitters from the good ones. One thing he does have going for him is his below league average BABIP. Something that was trending up towards the end of the 2012 season. He's definitely not as useless as he's made out to be, but there's serious work to be done.


Last edited by Everlong: 11-21-2012 at 10:16 PM.
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11-21-2012, 10:12 PM
  #959
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He is still going to be the weak link in this lineup if he hits 5th. For me, he needs to have an OPS over .800 and slug over .470 at least. I would prefer to see him shipped out. He does not deserve an opening night start.
I don't believe so. You need some guys to get on base - he does that (at least in the second half) at a high percentage. Yes, it'll be nice for him to hit a few more homeruns, but I feel he can get his OPS over .800 if he continues with his confidence.

I don't think it's impossible to see a .275/.340/.825 season out of Lind this year with ~20 HR.

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11-21-2012, 10:23 PM
  #960
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haha best gif

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11-21-2012, 10:23 PM
  #961
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I don't believe so. You need some guys to get on base - he does that (at least in the second half) at a high percentage. Yes, it'll be nice for him to hit a few more homeruns, but I feel he can get his OPS over .800 if he continues with his confidence.

I don't think it's impossible to see a .275/.340/.825 season out of Lind this year with ~20 HR.
Lind is a definite come back player candident

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11-21-2012, 10:32 PM
  #962
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Old
11-21-2012, 10:41 PM
  #963
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Lind is a definite come back player candident
Maybe two years ago but he sucks now.

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Old
11-21-2012, 10:44 PM
  #964
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Jays should consider signing Delmon Young to platoon with Lind. The whole Delmon Yong idea is kinda total puke but he can hit lefties and as long as he is at DH, that's fine.

Hard to see any team giving much money/term or even an everyday job because he is so not an everyday player.

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11-21-2012, 10:55 PM
  #965
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Jays should consider signing Delmon Young to platoon with Lind. The whole Delmon Yong idea is kinda total puke but he can hit lefties and as long as he is at DH, that's fine.

Hard to see any team giving much money/term or even an everyday job because he is so not an everyday player.
Bonafacio, Davis, Buck,

We could use a bat on that bench...unless I'm forgetting someone. I just never never never want to see Delmon Young in a Jays jersey though. I'd rather see Jim Thome signed than him.

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11-21-2012, 10:55 PM
  #966
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Originally Posted by Nasty Nazem View Post
Jays should consider signing Delmon Young to platoon with Lind. The whole Delmon Yong idea is kinda total puke but he can hit lefties and as long as he is at DH, that's fine.

Hard to see any team giving much money/term or even an everyday job because he is so not an everyday player.
No thank you... he strikes out way to much and can't take a walk ever

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11-21-2012, 10:55 PM
  #967
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Originally Posted by Nasty Nazem View Post
Jays should consider signing Delmon Young to platoon with Lind. The whole Delmon Yong idea is kinda total puke but he can hit lefties and as long as he is at DH, that's fine.

Hard to see any team giving much money/term or even an everyday job because he is so not an everyday player.
Someone to lefties?

Someone who fits with our recent moves?

Reed Johnson

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Old
11-21-2012, 10:58 PM
  #968
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Someone to lefties?

Someone who fits with our recent moves?

Reed Johnson
Oh god no

What about Berkman?

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Old
11-21-2012, 11:05 PM
  #969
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Oh god no

What about Berkman?
A compiled list of guys we need to extend invites to spring training:

Reed Johnson
Eric Hinske
Orlando Hudson
Lyle Overbay
Miguel Batista



But in all seriousness... Berkman would be a solid fit if we could ever get him to come here.

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11-21-2012, 11:10 PM
  #970
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Maybe two years ago but he sucks now.
I wouldnt say he sucks. If you ignore his career year in 2009, he`s always been basically average. Career 4.4 WAR, 3.7 of it came that year. The main thing he has going for him is that while he is just an average fielder, he provides acceptable (20% above average) offense against righties, which is basically 70-75% of pitches thrown. The big knock on him, of course, is that he is just horrible against lefties.

The problem this poses for the jays is that if it's the 6th-9th inning and lind comes up to bat with one or two outs, it's a no-brainer move to just throw a southpaw at him and get an easy out. While lind can be cushioned against starts against lefties through a platoon system, it doesnt solve the problem that in the majority of games, lind is the easy target, and it's especially going to be a problem in close games, which we need to win.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nasty Nazem View Post
Jays should consider signing Delmon Young to platoon with Lind. The whole Delmon Yong idea is kinda total puke but he can hit lefties and as long as he is at DH, that's fine.

Hard to see any team giving much money/term or even an everyday job because he is so not an everyday player.
I thought about mentioning it yesterday. Then i remembered he's delmon young.

1. We're already giving melky a second chance. Do we really want to deal with another player with baggage?

2. He is useless in the field.

3. He is just as slow as lind.

4. While he is, as a batter, the inverse of lind. Not as bad against righties as lind is against lefties, and slightly better against lefties than lind is against righties, but the same logic that applies to lind being an in-game liability applies to young in his starts against lefties, perhaps more so because the odds of the bullpen help of the day being a righty are significantly increased vs a righty being replaced by a lefty.


in summary, a platoon may be a cheap temporary fix to the lind problem, if we get the right guy of course. In the long term, and if we really want to fix the problem this year (probably not realistic), lind has to go and be replaced by an actual balanced 1b/dh.

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11-21-2012, 11:13 PM
  #971
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Why do people keep going on about Farrell? He wanted out. He's gone. We should just move on and forget all about him.
I could not agree more.

People can't be satisfied with the growing buzz & optimism restored by AA. There seems to be a need to dwell on Farrell.

Not a single game has been played and some are gloating like we've conquered the AL.

Sure it gives the organization some extra incentive when the 2 clubs go head to head this season, hell a little gamesmanship will be fun during the season.

If we are fortunate enough to watch a championship run, hopefuly our fan base can focus on the accomplishment & savor the experience, more than the opportunity to post, "hey Farrell, eat crow".

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Old
11-21-2012, 11:14 PM
  #972
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I wouldnt say he sucks. If you ignore his career year in 2009, he`s always been basically average. Career 4.4 WAR, 3.7 of it came that year. The main thing he has going for him is that while he is just an average fielder, he provides acceptable (20% above average) offense against righties, which is basically 70-75% of pitches thrown. The big knock on him, of course, is that he is just horrible against lefties.
Take away his best season and his OBP is hovering just over .300. The average OBP for a first basemen is around .338, so no he's actually awful for the position. Platoon? Sure he could work in that role, but unless he puts up an OBP north of .340 and an OPS over .800 he's a very below average 1B.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nasty Nazem View Post
Jays should consider signing Delmon Young to platoon with Lind. The whole Delmon Yong idea is kinda total puke but he can hit lefties and as long as he is at DH, that's fine.

Hard to see any team giving much money/term or even an everyday job because he is so not an everyday player.
Honestly, no matter how good he is against lefties, I just really hate that name. lol

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11-21-2012, 11:19 PM
  #973
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Take away his best season and his OBP is hovering just over .300. The average OBP for a first basemen is around .338, so no he's actually awful for the position. Platoon? Sure he could work in that role, but unless he puts up an OBP north of .340 and an OPS over .800 he's a very below average 1B.



Honestly, no matter how good he is against lefties, I just really hate that name. lol
One guy who might be interesting to platoon with Lind would be Andruw Jones.

Had a down year this year, especially in the second half but an OPS over .820 over the last 3 years, and was over .920 in 2010 and 2011

Would probably cost pennies.

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Old
11-21-2012, 11:23 PM
  #974
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One guy who might be interesting to platoon with Lind would be Andruw Jones.

Had a down year this year, especially in the second half but an OPS over .820 over the last 3 years, and was over .920 in 2010 and 2011

Would probably cost pennies.
If he's not re-upping with NYY, it could be a good pickup. Although his baserunning is not what it used to be.

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11-21-2012, 11:26 PM
  #975
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If he's not re-upping with NYY, it could be a good pickup. Although his baserunning is not what it used to be.
Don't think he'll be back in NYY after being left off the playoff roster.

Gibby loves those rh/lh platoons. Jones and Lind at DH would make a pretty good combo.

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