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Offseason Madness the 7th: Jose Reyes edition

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11-22-2012, 11:56 AM
  #51
Eyedea
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I think Gose can become an Austin Jackson type player, but with more speed. Like he said before if he can put more balls in to play, that reduces his strikeouts and increases his average (his speed can beat out grounders). It's quite spectacular that we have not only this type of talent in the system, but possibly an even quicker guy below him in DJ Davis.

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11-22-2012, 11:59 AM
  #52
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Originally Posted by Eyedea View Post
I think Gose can become an Austin Jackson type player, but with more speed. Like he said before if he can put more balls in to play, that reduces his strikeouts and increases his average (his speed can beat out grounders). It's quite spectacular that we have not only this type of talent in the system, but possibly an even quicker guy below him in DJ Davis.
DiamondJoeQuimby made a great post awhile ago showing a select few really good young players and there stats in there first stint. The post showed how similar Gose's and Jacksons stats were and Gose has a even better skillset when it comes to defense, speed and arm.

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11-22-2012, 12:06 PM
  #53
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Originally Posted by weems View Post
DiamondJoeQuimby made a great post awhile ago showing a select few really good young players and there stats in there first stint. The post showed how similar Gose's and Jacksons stats were and Gose has a even better skillset when it comes to defense, speed and arm.
Yeah not many people have an arm like Gose.

It's like Ankiel with accuracy.

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11-22-2012, 12:18 PM
  #54
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When will Santos be ready?
christmas eve


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11-22-2012, 12:20 PM
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Originally Posted by p.l.f. View Post
christmas eve

Our BP is so stacked this year, even if AA doesn't make another move.

I would love to have Los Del V back... just to play is usual role... Even let him fight with Happ for the 5th starter's job with the loser going to the pen (although he'd lose).

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11-22-2012, 12:28 PM
  #56
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I am not sold on Gose at all right now in the Centre Field Position. Sure his defense and speed are top notch but I think those qualities are now redundant on this team given the acquisition of Reyes. His bat simply doesnt have a role in our lineup. We no longer have a need for a 1-2 hitter for the next 2-3 seasons. Colby will be here for a while whether you like it or not.

When Lawrie, Bautista, EE and Rasmus were all healthy they formed a deadly top of the lineup. Colby hitting in the 2 spot saw many more fastballs hitting in front of Jose and was really finding a groove. Once Jose got hurt Colby suffered by seeing a poor pitch selection. Given our line up now I see now reason for him to be inconsistent and he will likely receive some of the better pitch selection.
How does Reyes in any way make Gose redundant? You can have two great speedy players and Gose provides elite defense at CF. Bringing Reyes along actually helps him because now, team won't be putting him in the leadoff because of his speed but rather, they can bat him 9th and even if he is weak there, you can live with it because he will provide elite baserunning and defense. If his bat eventually improves to average or above average, you have a Devon White on your hands.

It doesn't matter much right now as Colby won't be traded and Gose will start out in Buffalo but long-term, he is the CF. I don't have much faith in Rasmus anymore, he is a platoon bat whose 2010 season looks more and more like an outlier at this point. If he has a decent or even a solid season and Gose continues to improve in Buffalo, Jays should sell high.

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Originally Posted by Eyedea View Post
I think Gose can become an Austin Jackson type player, but with more speed. Like he said before if he can put more balls in to play, that reduces his strikeouts and increases his average (his speed can beat out grounders). It's quite spectacular that we have not only this type of talent in the system, but possibly an even quicker guy below him in DJ Davis.
Jackson is a high K player but he makes good contact and finds ways to get hits. Maybe Gose can do that but he would need to have a crazy high BABIP over his career (Jackson is at career .370). Austin Jackson also hits a lot of line drives which is why its possible for him to sustain a high BABIP despite the strikeout rate. Gose doesn't do that and that's probably why I don't see him hitting for too much average... unless he cuts down his K rate significantly. If he can hit .250-.260, he'll be great because he draws enough walks to have an above average OBP and his speed will be a huge factor. Has some pop in the bat too that is still developing.

Austin Jackson was also never projected to be this good... he just developed when he got to the majors.

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11-22-2012, 12:29 PM
  #57
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The call-up options aren't all so bad. Cooper at 1B/DH, Sierra at RF/LF, Izturis at 2B/SS, plenty of RP's. Counting on the SP's at AAA is a bit dicier, and I'm not sure there's a great backup plan at 3B there. But there's plenty of off-season left.
Either of Bonifacio and Bautista can put in time at 3B if required.

Oh, and to those thinking Rogers' billing has been impacted by the Jays acquisitions, we're talking about a company with annual revenues north of $4 BILLION. Their pricing structure is not impacted by an increase of a few tens of millions in salaries in one of their content properties. For context, compare it to the hundreds of millions (if not billions) they're spending upgrading their high-speed infrastructure across the country. Besides, as was pointed out above, they need to stay compeititive in their procong model. so no, the Jays are not a factor.

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11-22-2012, 12:33 PM
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I don't want to put any pressure on Bautista, but if Gose has a strong season in Buffalo and Colby pulls off a career year I could see Gose move into CF/RF and Bautista at 1B/DH with EE. Defence is such a valuable part to the game and Bautista has never been a good tracker in the outfield. His arm is strong, but he lets a lot of balls fly over his head like Jay Bruce.

Not to mention it could preserve him and let his prime years last a little longer.


Last edited by Eyedea: 11-22-2012 at 12:43 PM.
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11-22-2012, 12:41 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by Eyedea View Post
I don't want to put any pressure on Bautista, but if Gose has a strong season in Buffalo and Colby pulls off a career year I could see Gose move into RF and Bautista at 1B/DH with EE. Defence is such a valuable part to the game and Bautista has never been a good tracker in the outfield. His arm is strong, but he lets a lot of balls fly over his head like Jay Bruce.

Not to mention it could preserve him and let his prime years last a little longer.
I think I would rather move Rasmus into RF and give Gose CF. But I like the idea in general.

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11-22-2012, 12:42 PM
  #60
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Agreed, as he should be. He'll prove how valuable he is this season.
I hope so, otherwise it's safe to say he's as good as gone in 2014, if not sooner

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11-22-2012, 12:42 PM
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I think I would rather move Rasmus into RF and give Gose CF. But I like the idea in general.
Yeah that would be wise. I was initially thinking CF, but I'm not sure how Rasmus' arm will fair in RF. I don't know, I think either way could work.

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11-22-2012, 12:44 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by Eyedea View Post
I don't want to put any pressure on Bautista, but if Gose has a strong season in Buffalo and Colby pulls off a career year I could see Gose move into CF and Bautista at 1B/DH with EE. Defence is such a valuable part to the game and Bautista has never been a good tracker in the outfield. His arm is strong, but he lets a lot of balls fly over his head like Jay Bruce.

Not to mention it could preserve him and let his prime years last a little longer.
I think long term for sure, Bautista will be a 1b/DH. He's a pretty good fielder overall, given his versatility. He plays an above average third base as it is, but to make him last longer, it makes sense to move him out of rf.

I think long term (after the next 1-2 years) we'll see Bautista and EE at 1b/DH for the rest of their contracts.

As for 3b, Maicer Izturis played a ton of 3b in LA. If something were to ever happen to Lawrie, or he's given a day off, I imagine he'll be the first one slotted in there.

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11-22-2012, 12:45 PM
  #63
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Start d'Arnaud and Gose in AAA.
If they tear it up the first 1-2 months, put a trade package of Rasmus+JPA together and bring the 2 young players up.

I dont doubt Rasmus could have a really good year here or there but I seriously wonder just how consistant this guy will be year in year out.

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11-22-2012, 12:51 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by weems View Post
Start d'Arnaud and Gose in AAA.
If they tear it up the first 1-2 months, put a trade package of Rasmus+JPA together and bring the 2 young players up.

I dont doubt Rasmus could have a really good year here or there but I seriously wonder just how consistant this guy will be year in year out.
So unreal that we have so many options with our lineup/system.

There's probably at least 5 different arguments as to what guys wanna do with TDA and Gose... (for the record i think the sit and wait approach like you mentioned is the best one). No one is really right or wrong at this point in terms of what is best... but its going to be damn interesting if Colby and JP are both having good years.

Nice problem to have.

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11-22-2012, 12:53 PM
  #65
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I'd give rasmus his time and would hope the jays keep him.

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11-22-2012, 12:59 PM
  #66
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Swisher will be one of the biggest busts in baseball next season. He is going to sign a ridiculous contract probably in the range of 15-16 mil over 5-6 years. Boston can have him.
That is a perfectly fair contract for Nick Swisher, he is an excellent player, with a skill-set that tends to age well.

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Yeah not many people have an arm like Gose.

It's like Ankiel with accuracy.
That is an exageration, Rick Ankiel has the best OF arm in baseball, and it's really not even close.

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11-22-2012, 01:13 PM
  #67
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[QUOTE=Scion;55962181]That is a perfectly fair contract for Nick Swisher, he is an excellent player, with a skill-set that tends to age well.



I'm pretty surprised the yanks aren't bringing him back, he did well their and he's like the perfect #5 hitter. I would love either him or a guy like Hunter Pence to slot in #5 behind Bautista and EE. I guess at this point in time thats more of a luxury though.

edit: would not want him him at 15 million x 5 years though

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11-22-2012, 01:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Scion View Post
That is a perfectly fair contract for Nick Swisher, he is an excellent player, with a skill-set that tends to age well.



That is an exageration, Rick Ankiel has the best OF arm in baseball, and it's really not even close.
Yes I'm definitely exaggerating, but wasn't Gose clocked in the mid 90s during his senior year of HS? That's pretty insane if you ask me.

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11-22-2012, 01:16 PM
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Yes I'm definitely exaggerating, but wasn't Gose clocked in the mid 90s during his senior year of HS? That's pretty insane if you ask me.
Yeah just looked it up... clocked at 94mph as a pitcher in HS.

Pretty insane... although it does seem like all mlb players were pitchers with big arms in HS, just because of their natural athletic ability.

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11-22-2012, 01:20 PM
  #70
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Originally Posted by weems View Post
Start d'Arnaud and Gose in AAA.
If they tear it up the first 1-2 months, put a trade package of Rasmus+JPA together and bring the 2 young players up.

I dont doubt Rasmus could have a really good year here or there but I seriously wonder just how consistant this guy will be year in year out.
I would do that with TDA but not with Gose. I think he needs to spend an entire season in Buffalo (that likely won't happen for a WHOLE season because there will be injuries and he'll get a call-up or two at some point next season) but I wouldn't trade Colby and limit our depth, especially when Gose's bat isn't that good. The move makes sense in the next off-season though.


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11-22-2012, 01:41 PM
  #71
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Originally Posted by weems View Post
Start d'Arnaud and Gose in AAA.
If they tear it up the first 1-2 months, put a trade package of Rasmus+JPA together and bring the 2 young players up.

I dont doubt Rasmus could have a really good year here or there but I seriously wonder just how consistant this guy will be year in year out.
If that were to happen, I would just move JPA, and do this for the outfield:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eyedea View Post
I don't want to put any pressure on Bautista, but if Gose has a strong season in Buffalo and Colby pulls off a career year I could see Gose move into CF/RF and Bautista at 1B/DH with EE. Defence is such a valuable part to the game and Bautista has never been a good tracker in the outfield. His arm is strong, but he lets a lot of balls fly over his head like Jay Bruce.

Not to mention it could preserve him and let his prime years last a little longer.
We could internally solve our problem at 1B/DH. All that really leaves, is 2B, which isn't that big of a concern.

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11-22-2012, 01:55 PM
  #72
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If that were to happen, I would just move JPA, and do this for the outfield:



We could internally solve our problem at 1B/DH. All that really leaves, is 2B, which isn't that big of a concern.

Its not to often that you move your all-star and face of the franchise from 3rd to right field to first base within the span of 3 years. Although Bautista is the ultimate team player, that's just asking too much out of him. He was gracious enough to move because he saw the talent that Brett Lawrie brought.


Also, on a side note.... the Rule 5 draft is in about 2 weeks. I just need some clarification on this. As long as a player is not on a 40 man roster, he is fair game?

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11-22-2012, 01:57 PM
  #73
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Originally Posted by showtime8 View Post
Its not to often that you move your all-star and face of the franchise from 3rd to right field to first base within the span of 3 years. Although Bautista is the ultimate team player, that's just asking too much out of him. He was gracious enough to move because he saw the talent that Brett Lawrie brought.


Also, on a side note.... the Rule 5 draft is in about 2 weeks. I just need some clarification on this. As long as a player is not on a 40 man roster, he is fair game?
Players are eligible for selection in the Rule 5 draft who are not on their major league organization's 40-man roster and:
were signed at age 19 or older and have been in the organization for four years; or
were signed at age 18 or younger and have been in the organization for five years.

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11-22-2012, 02:04 PM
  #74
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Hello from Marlins land. First off, I want to say Jeffrey Loria is an idiot. And secondly, I think the player you guys will like most in this trade is Emilio Bonifacio. One of the fastest players in the Majors. If he is starting and he is healthy, he will lead the Majors in stolen bases. He is very patient at the plate and has a high on-base percentage. He is everything you want in a lead-off hitter, although with Reyes there, I don't know where he will bat in the lineup. He plays very solid defense and is very versatile. He can play 2B, CF (any outfield possition really), 3B, and SS. So enjoy Blue Jays fans, I'll be rooting for you. And again, Jeffrey Loria is an idiot, that is all.

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11-22-2012, 02:04 PM
  #75
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Its not to often that you move your all-star and face of the franchise from 3rd to right field to first base within the span of 3 years. Although Bautista is the ultimate team player, that's just asking too much out of him. He was gracious enough to move because he saw the talent that Brett Lawrie brought.
Huh? His preference has always been to play right field. He took over 3rd base duties temporarily untill Lawrie was ready. The fact that EE couldn't throw to 1st didn't help either.

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