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Some trade proposals of mine

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Old
11-21-2012, 09:23 PM
  #126
Chevrier
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I was also about to propose Barrie for Smith, but then I looked up their stats and realized Barrie is actually better.

Tyson Barrie stats:

AHL: 2012/13
16 games, 12 points.

2011/12
49 games, 32 points


Brendan Smith stats:

AHL: 2012/13
14 games, 9 points

2011/12
57 games, 34 points.


Obviously Smith also has 7 points in 14 games in the NHL, but Barrie is two years younger. Next year I could easily see Barrie surpassing that. In his first AHL season Barrie managed 32 points in 49 games...Smith only got 32 in 63...and Smith was even a year older than Barrie when he entered the AHL. Hmm, now that I think about it, we might have a future star in Barrie. In two years he'll probably be better than EJ. We don't even need Smith. We already have someone just as good.



Don't you love stats.
It's exactly these kind of stupid posts that do not make me miss this place at times, hockey or not. Sorry, but Smith and Nyquist are worth more than Erik Johnson now and in the future. There's a reason he was traded, argue and justify it any which way you want but all of those with some knowledge of the game will tell you that Smith and Nyquist are both extremely highly touted propsects. Barrie'll be good, sure, I'm a fan of his but using that justification, that he scored so many points in less games mean nothing. See TJ Hensick above.

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Old
11-21-2012, 09:43 PM
  #127
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Originally Posted by Chevrier View Post
It's exactly these kind of stupid posts that do not make me miss this place at times, hockey or not. Sorry, but Smith and Nyquist are worth more than Erik Johnson now and in the future. There's a reason he was traded, argue and justify it any which way you want but all of those with some knowledge of the game will tell you that Smith and Nyquist are both extremely highly touted propsects. Barrie'll be good, sure, I'm a fan of his but using that justification, that he scored so many points in less games mean nothing. See TJ Hensick above.
I'm sorry you don't understand my point...Do I believe Barrie is better or equal to Smith? Hell no. I was merely pointing out how ridiculous stats can be...if I did not have a clue about, lets say, Smith, and just looked at stats, I could indeed make an assumption that these players are close. A large portion of HFboards seem to do just that. Luckily, I'm not clueless, and I do realize just how good Smith is. Clearly this all passed over your head though, so I'm glad I could clear that up for you. People on here never cease to amaze me with their lack of ability to comprehend....I thought my last sentence of my post made it incredibly clear I was being sarcastic...



I'm not even going to bother responding to your last bit...if you want to believe two prospects hold more value than our(highlighting this so people don't freak out and tell me EJ is not a #1 D. Merely saying that he is our #1 D) go ahead. Avs fans feel differently.


Edit: If you look at what I was replying to and how I replied, there is no excuse for you not to realize I was being sarcastic...

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Old
11-21-2012, 09:49 PM
  #128
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Originally Posted by Chevrier View Post
It's exactly these kind of stupid posts that do not make me miss this place at times, hockey or not. Sorry, but Smith and Nyquist are worth more than Erik Johnson now and in the future. There's a reason he was traded, argue and justify it any which way you want but all of those with some knowledge of the game will tell you that Smith and Nyquist are both extremely highly touted propsects. Barrie'll be good, sure, I'm a fan of his but using that justification, that he scored so many points in less games mean nothing. See TJ Hensick above.
There IS a reason he was traded, but you don't seem to know it.

EJ was being surpassed by Pietrangelo, one of the top defenders in the game currently. That doesn't make EJ bad, it means Pietrangelo is good. EJ can't play the left side and the Blues had a serious need for a PWF like Stewart (whom at the time had 40 goal potential, still does but has character concerns imo) and needed more of a mobile PMD than a 2-way, defensive guy like EJ.

They got what they needed, we got what we needed and added a young stud prospect like Siemens along in the deal.

EJ is now and should be for quite some time better than Smith, which isn't a knock on Smith but moreso a sentiment to the fact that EJ is a #1 defender, not a #3. Nyquist may have top line potential, but he's hardly the upgrade on any of the Avs current prospects that make the downgrade from EJ to Smith even remotely worth pursuing given the rather ridiculous hole we'd have on defense, worse than what Detroit currently sports without EJ on our roster.

So tell me, should the Avs offer up Barrie + Sgarbossa for Kronwall? Seems fair to me. Maybe we'll even throw in a 3rd rounder to 'even it up'? Barrie might even end up better one day, so you may win in the long run!

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Old
11-21-2012, 09:52 PM
  #129
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Originally Posted by Chevrier View Post
It's exactly these kind of stupid posts that do not make me miss this place at times, hockey or not. Sorry, but Smith and Nyquist are worth more than Erik Johnson now and in the future. There's a reason he was traded, argue and justify it any which way you want but all of those with some knowledge of the game will tell you that Smith and Nyquist are both extremely highly touted propsects. Barrie'll be good, sure, I'm a fan of his but using that justification, that he scored so many points in less games mean nothing. See TJ Hensick above.
Sorry but if you seriously cannot take off your homer goggles long enough to make a rational realization, then maybe it's ok that you don't miss this place.

Those 2 guys are prospects...PROSPECTS!!!! The same way that Pavel Brendl was a sure-fire, can't miss prospect. The same way that Filatov, Patrick Stefan, Benoit Pouliot and Cam frikkin' Barker were can't miss prospects and do you think that fans of the teams that picked them were on HFBoards arguing with fans of other teams CLAIMING their superiority based on junior and AHL stats??!?! You bet your ass they were.

I love it that it is absolutely IMPOSSIBLE for Nyquist and/or Smith to NOT LIVE UP to the #1 pairing / Top Line Forward billing that is being force-fed down our throats. It's just not going to happen.

What do we have to rely on to ensure that they will turn out as you all seem to think? Some hardcore wings fans opinions, 32 NHL games combined and some AHL stats.

Where do I sign?

Maybe we can trade you Landeskog for Tomas Tatar...but only if you guys SWEAR that he'll be better in the end!

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Old
11-22-2012, 06:14 AM
  #130
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Originally Posted by Bender View Post
Maybe we can trade you Landeskog for Tomas Tatar...but only if you guys SWEAR that he'll be better in the end!
Colorado has to add a 1st or something but we'll take it.

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Old
11-22-2012, 10:51 AM
  #131
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Colorado has to add a 1st or something but we'll take it.
Just a first? SHERMAN GET ON THE PHONE NOW!!!

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Old
11-22-2012, 03:10 PM
  #132
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Originally Posted by Datsyuk Dangles View Post
I don't even see how you can call Johansson better, yet alone a big upgrade. Gagner has been better every single year.
better in what regard. simply going on points. gagne has 366 nhl games with best point production of 49pts as a rookie and 47 last season. Johansson has 147 nhl games in a mostly to entirely defensive system and he had 46pts last season.

i am not sure i would say that johansson has proven to be as yet and upgrade but at more than 200 games less experience he shown to have a greater chance of more unrealized potential.

the caps dont need yak. they need him even less if kuznetsov comes to the caps. so this trade is wasted energy anyway

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Old
11-22-2012, 10:55 PM
  #133
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Originally Posted by txpd View Post
better in what regard. simply going on points. gagne has 366 nhl games with best point production of 49pts as a rookie and 47 last season. Johansson has 147 nhl games in a mostly to entirely defensive system and he had 46pts last season.

i am not sure i would say that johansson has proven to be as yet and upgrade but at more than 200 games less experience he shown to have a greater chance of more unrealized potential.

the caps dont need yak. they need him even less if kuznetsov comes to the caps. so this trade is wasted energy anyway
He's 23 years old. How is playing 366 games so far a bad thing? All that means is Johansson wasn't good enough and therefore played against inferior competition.

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Old
11-23-2012, 12:49 PM
  #134
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There IS a reason he was traded, but you don't seem to know it.

EJ was being surpassed by Pietrangelo, one of the top defenders in the game currently. That doesn't make EJ bad, it means Pietrangelo is good. EJ can't play the left side and the Blues had a serious need for a PWF like Stewart (whom at the time had 40 goal potential, still does but has character concerns imo) and needed more of a mobile PMD than a 2-way, defensive guy like EJ.

They got what they needed, we got what we needed and added a young stud prospect like Siemens along in the deal.

EJ is now and should be for quite some time better than Smith, which isn't a knock on Smith but moreso a sentiment to the fact that EJ is a #1 defender, not a #3. Nyquist may have top line potential, but he's hardly the upgrade on any of the Avs current prospects that make the downgrade from EJ to Smith even remotely worth pursuing given the rather ridiculous hole we'd have on defense, worse than what Detroit currently sports without EJ on our roster.

So tell me, should the Avs offer up Barrie + Sgarbossa for Kronwall? Seems fair to me. Maybe we'll even throw in a 3rd rounder to 'even it up'? Barrie might even end up better one day, so you may win in the long run!

Pietrangelo still wasn't receiving as much hype as you thought he had. EJ got traded because of his poor play. He wasn't playing physical, wasn't getting any points, and just flat out looked like Eric Brewer out there. EJ is a #1 on the Avs but isn't anywhere close to being a solidified #1 defensemen, #2 at best, and I would put him at #3. To be honest it really wasn't a shock hearing Erik Johnson was traded due to his play that season. Blame the golf cart though and not EJ.

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Old
11-23-2012, 12:53 PM
  #135
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Originally Posted by Lonewolfe2015 View Post
So tell me, should the Avs offer up Barrie + Sgarbossa for Kronwall? Seems fair to me. Maybe we'll even throw in a 3rd rounder to 'even it up'? Barrie might even end up better one day, so you may win in the long run!
You can't just replace two players with two players that you think are equal using stats or whatever you're using to compare them. Smith and Nyquist are going to be much better and have so much more potential then barrie and sgarbossa.

Also, you can't replace Erik Johnson with Kronwall just because they are both #1's on their teams. Kronwall would start over EJ any day because he is that much better, so it's hard to compare the original trade with your opinion of the equivalent of that trade because they are completely different

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Old
11-23-2012, 02:32 PM
  #136
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Originally Posted by Bender View Post
Sorry but if you seriously cannot take off your homer goggles long enough to make a rational realization, then maybe it's ok that you don't miss this place.
You first.

Although I did notice that his location was Toronto...

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Originally Posted by Bender View Post
Those 2 guys are prospects...PROSPECTS!!!! The same way that Pavel Brendl was a sure-fire, can't miss prospect. The same way that Filatov, Patrick Stefan, Benoit Pouliot and Cam frikkin' Barker were can't miss prospects and do you think that fans of the teams that picked them were on HFBoards arguing with fans of other teams CLAIMING their superiority based on junior and AHL stats??!?! You bet your ass they were.
The same way Pavel Datsyuk was a prospect. The same way Zetterberg was a prospect. Speaking of which, wasn't Zetterberg ranked below Raffi Torres on most prospect lists?

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Originally Posted by Bender View Post
I love it that it is absolutely IMPOSSIBLE for Nyquist and/or Smith to NOT LIVE UP to the #1 pairing / Top Line Forward billing that is being force-fed down our throats. It's just not going to happen.
Oh it's certainly possible, just not nearly as likely as you seem to be hell-bent on believing.

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What do we have to rely on to ensure that they will turn out as you all seem to think? Some hardcore wings fans opinions, 32 NHL games combined and some AHL stats.
What do you have to ensure they wont turn out as we seem to think, other than your own blind denial?

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Where do I sign?
Nowhere, we've already stated that we don't like the trade.

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Old
11-23-2012, 03:36 PM
  #137
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Originally Posted by Bender View Post
Sorry but if you seriously cannot take off your homer goggles long enough to make a rational realization, then maybe it's ok that you don't miss this place.

Those 2 guys are prospects...PROSPECTS!!!! The same way that Pavel Brendl was a sure-fire, can't miss prospect. The same way that Filatov, Patrick Stefan, Benoit Pouliot and Cam frikkin' Barker were can't miss prospects and do you think that fans of the teams that picked them were on HFBoards arguing with fans of other teams CLAIMING their superiority based on junior and AHL stats??!?! You bet your ass they were.

I love it that it is absolutely IMPOSSIBLE for Nyquist and/or Smith to NOT LIVE UP to the #1 pairing / Top Line Forward billing that is being force-fed down our throats. It's just not going to happen.

What do we have to rely on to ensure that they will turn out as you all seem to think? Some hardcore wings fans opinions, 32 NHL games combined and some AHL stats.

Where do I sign?

Maybe we can trade you Landeskog for Tomas Tatar...but only if you guys SWEAR that he'll be better in the end!
+1 for truth.

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Old
11-23-2012, 04:00 PM
  #138
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Ok lets see.
We are trading the #1 pick in 2006 who is 24 years old and has played in the NHL for years for the #27 pick of the 2007 draft who is 23 and has played 14 NHL games but showed that he can handle himself in the AHL quite well and for another 23 year old late rnd draft pick who played 18 games but was PPG in the AHL last year.

EJ is playing very solid and is our #1 defender. But he has not lived up close to his potential and draft rank so far. We can agree on this one.
But why should those 2 guys who are a year younger be so much better than him in the future? Does EJ not have a chance of improving only because he made the jump to the big league much earlier?
Will Smith be good? Yeah I guess. But I am not sure that he will ever be able to do what EJ is doing right now. Holding down the #1 spot and not totally look out of place there. And thats EJ's "rightnowproduction" and again he is only 1 yr older.
Nyquist might be good. He might be not. He certainly is no blue chipper that will certainly turn out to be a first liner. I see him more as a 2nd liner but again only time will tell.
All in all it is bad for the Avs

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Old
11-23-2012, 06:34 PM
  #139
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Originally Posted by Wingsfan2965 View Post
You first.

Although I did notice that his location was Toronto...
Oh right, fans of other teams don't exist unless they are from that town.

All I had to was see your proposal in the other thread where you seriously suggested that the Habs trade Subban for Franzen, to know that you are indeed what I suspected, a giant homer with no real perspective. LOL

I'm not a huge fan of Subban but to trade him for a soon to be 33 year old, is an absolute joke. [and the fact that you don't see it as a joke, IS an even bigger joke]

You win, champ.

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11-23-2012, 07:49 PM
  #140
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Originally Posted by capitalsrock View Post
You can't just replace two players with two players that you think are equal using stats or whatever you're using to compare them. Smith and Nyquist are going to be much better and have so much more potential then barrie and sgarbossa.

Also, you can't replace Erik Johnson with Kronwall just because they are both #1's on their teams. Kronwall would start over EJ any day because he is that much better, so it's hard to compare the original trade with your opinion of the equivalent of that trade because they are completely different
I can replace two players of higher value with two players of lower value when the player being acquired is less valuable than that originally being asked for.

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Old
11-23-2012, 10:03 PM
  #141
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Oh right, fans of other teams don't exist unless they are from that town.
They absolutely do, the problem here is you're assuming that he's a Detroit fan just because he backed a Detroit prospect, even though there's no evidence of him being a Detroit fan.

Unless of course you're hell-bent on believing that everything that comes from Detroit sucks and only Detroit fans would highly tout it...

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All I had to was see your proposal in the other thread where you seriously suggested that the Habs trade Subban for Franzen, to know that you are indeed what I suspected, a giant homer with no real perspective. LOL

I'm not a huge fan of Subban but to trade him for a soon to be 33 year old, is an absolute joke. [and the fact that you don't see it as a joke, IS an even bigger joke]

You win, champ.
Actually the real joke is that you thought I was serious...

Also funny that you didn't bother replying to the rest of my post. Hard to argue against logic isn't it?

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11-23-2012, 10:26 PM
  #142
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They absolutely do, the problem here is you're assuming that he's a Detroit fan just because he backed a Detroit prospect, even though there's no evidence of him being a Detroit fan.

Unless of course you're hell-bent on believing that everything that comes from Detroit sucks and only Detroit fans would highly tout it...



Actually the real joke is that you thought I was serious...

Also funny that you didn't bother replying to the rest of my post. Hard to argue against logic isn't it?
Oh sorry, I guess I must have missed your sarcasm smiley there. Just the fact that it's hard to tell if you are serious or not, should tell you something.

Lol...WHAT logic is that?

The fact that you mention that Datsyuk and Zetterberg were once prospects too? It only goes further to PROVE my point. What team would have traded for Datsyuk and/or Zetterberg and given up a considerable asset when these players were virtual unknowns at the NHL level? NONE!

It's super nice that they turned out as well as they did but to make some sort of bold prediction about their future success at THAT time is just as ridiculous as the one you're making today.

Do you think the Toronto Maple Leafs would have traded Tomas Kaberle back in 2000-2001 for Pavel Datsyuk? I sure as hell don't even though, it would have turned out to be the right move for their franchise.

How are you not getting this?

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11-23-2012, 10:32 PM
  #143
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Oh sorry, I guess I must have missed your sarcasm smiley there. Just the fact that it's hard to tell if you are serious or not, should tell you something.
The fact that you need a smiley to tell whether somebody was serious tells me a lot about your intelligence...

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Lol...WHAT logic is that?

The fact that you mention that Datsyuk and Zetterberg were once prospects too? It only goes further to PROVE my point. What team would have traded for Datsyuk and/or Zetterberg and given up a considerable asset when these players were virtual unknowns at the NHL level? NONE!

It's super nice that they turned out as well as they did but to make some sort of bold prediction about their future success at THAT time is just as ridiculous as the one you're making today.

Do you think the Toronto Maple Leafs would have traded Tomas Kaberle back in 2000-2001 for Pavel Datsyuk? I sure as hell don't even though, it would have turned out to be the right move for their franchise.

How are you not getting this?
The point was more that for every top pick bust you seem to love to point out, there's a low pick boom to come right back with.

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11-23-2012, 10:49 PM
  #144
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Originally Posted by Wingsfan2965 View Post
The fact that you need a smiley to tell whether somebody was serious tells me a lot about your intelligence
Tell me...how is
Quote:
Franzen for Subban.
supposed to be obviously sarcastic? Someone asked the value of a top 6 forward to the Habs, and in post #5, you just decided to post that? There is nothing in the previous posts, or in your post, to suggest that's possibly sarcastic. You decided to post some dumb, apparently sarcastic comment, in the beginning of a serious thread for what...? Sorry, but that looked pretty serious to me.

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11-23-2012, 10:58 PM
  #145
Bender
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Originally Posted by Wingsfan2965 View Post
The fact that you need a smiley to tell whether somebody was serious tells me a lot about your intelligence...



The point was more that for every top pick bust you seem to love to point out, there's a low pick boom to come right back with.
Thanks. It's difficult to see through true homerism when it's to the point of insanity.

Oh yeah but the point you CONTINUE to miss, is that the low pick BOOM is very seldom quite obvious from the get-go. In fact, it's very often incredibly subtle and just creeps up on you. There's a reason I used Brunnstrom as an example. This guy was supposed to be AMAZING and yet he couldn't do it in the NHL. There are literally TONS of players who, for whatever, just can't cut it. Do you really believe that the Dallas Stars signed this guy to a 2 year - $4.5M contract with any doubts that he was going to be a great player? I'm pretty sure they were quite surprised he flopped...and that's the REAL point. With EJ, perhaps not as good as everyone thought he would be, now having just finished 4th full NHL season as a 24 yr old, you at least know what you're getting and the risk is minimal. With your two prospects, there is just more risk no matter how highly touted those guys are.

Now I applaud you for having seen the future and being absolutely enamored with these 2 guys. I'm still waiting for fans of OTHER teams to come in and tell me that, hey, I'm absolutely wrong and that Nyquist and Smith are going to tear up the AHL this season, because let's face it, if they are already as good as you're claiming they are, the AHL should be cake. Then, after they are done destroying the AHL, they are going to come in and do some damage at the NHL level because these two guys are BLUE-CHIPPERS.

For right now, I'm not seeing that. I mean c'mon, 9 points in 14 games for Smith, that's Tyson Barrie production level for cryin' out loud! (and as EVERYONE knows, Smith is way, way, WAY superior in all facets of the game than Barrie)

Now Nyquist is doing well with over a point per game with 17 pts in 14 games but as a 23 year old, is it really that impressive? We have a 20 year old first year pro, who's put up 15 points in 17 games played...should we freak out about him? Claim he's going to be a bona-fide top line NHL forward? When you think about it, what's really more impressive?

When it's all said and done, both Nyquist and Smith will most likely DO end up being important parts of the red wings team, I just wouldn't peg them as #1 d-man and top line forward, just yet.

(But apparently, I'm not entitled to my opinion or to think that...or what are we still arguing about again? Sorry, you know, my intelligence, I just can't remember...)

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Old
11-23-2012, 11:09 PM
  #146
Pierce Hawthorne
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Originally Posted by capitalsrock View Post
You can't just replace two players with two players that you think are equal using stats or whatever you're using to compare them. Smith and Nyquist are going to be much better and have so much more potential then barrie and sgarbossa.

Also, you can't replace Erik Johnson with Kronwall just because they are both #1's on their teams. Kronwall would start over EJ any day because he is that much better, so it's hard to compare the original trade with your opinion of the equivalent of that trade because they are completely different

How does Nyquist have so much more value then Sgarbossa, or so much more potential. There both similar players producing at very similar levels in the AHL... The only reason Nyquist has more "Potential" or is better then Sgarbossa is because he was drafted by the Wings, and therefore must be destined for stardom.

If Nyquist were drafted by any other team but Detroit, he'd be a sleeper prospect just like Sgarbossa. Smith and Barrie are the same way, but they both player very different styles, so IMO you cant really compare them. Barrie is better on Offense, Smith better on Defense.

As for the Kronwall Johnson comment, IMO they are very close to each other. We'll see how Kronwall plays this year without Lidstrom. Theyre both Top 20-25 Dmen in the NHL, Johnson still has a couple years to grow, Kronwall probably doesnt.

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11-23-2012, 11:24 PM
  #147
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Tell me...how is supposed to be obviously sarcastic? Someone asked the value of a top 6 forward to the Habs, and in post #5, you just decided to post that? There is nothing in the previous posts, or in your post, to suggest that's possibly sarcastic. You decided to post some dumb, apparently sarcastic comment, in the beginning of a serious thread for what...? Sorry, but that looked pretty serious to me.
Unless HTT3 is the one saying it, it should be pretty easy to figure out that a #1 D-man in his early 20s for a top six forward in his early 30s wasn't serious.

And that's before you take multiple other factors about Franzen into account.

Like I said, if you needed a smiley to figure that out, you have bigger problems.

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Oh yeah but the point you CONTINUE to miss, is that the low pick BOOM is very seldom quite obvious from the get-go.
Good point, and I'm pretty sure nobody said Nyquist was gonna be a top line forward the day he was drafted.

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Originally Posted by Bender View Post
With EJ, perhaps not as good as everyone thought he would be, now having just finished 4th full NHL season as a 24 yr old, you at least know what you're getting and the risk is minimal. With your two prospects, there is just more risk no matter how highly touted those guys are.
I never said EJ wasn't good. I said he wasn't worth that. Of course, there is a risk, but that risk goes both ways. Colorado risks them busting, hell they risk them getting into a plane crash on the way to Denver. At the same token Detroit risks EJ's career plummeting or Nyquist or Smith exceeding their projections.

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Originally Posted by Bender View Post
Now I applaud you for having seen the future and being absolutely enamored with these 2 guys. I'm still waiting for fans of OTHER teams to come in and tell me that, hey, I'm absolutely wrong and that Nyquist and Smith are going to tear up the AHL this season, because let's face it, if they are already as good as you're claiming they are, the AHL should be cake. Then, after they are done destroying the AHL, they are going to come in and do some damage at the NHL level because these two guys are BLUE-CHIPPERS.
Pretty good assessment.

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Originally Posted by Bender View Post
For right now, I'm not seeing that. I mean c'mon, 9 points in 14 games for Smith, that's Tyson Barrie production level for cryin' out loud! (and as EVERYONE knows, Smith is way, way, WAY superior in all facets of the game than Barrie)

Now Nyquist is doing well with over a point per game with 17 pts in 14 games but as a 23 year old, is it really that impressive? We have a 20 year old first year pro, who's put up 15 points in 17 games played...should we freak out about him? Claim he's going to be a bona-fide top line NHL forward? When you think about it, what's really more impressive?
Are you going to continue to rehash the same stupid crap we already went over three or four pages ago? First of all, you seem to be hell bent on comparing your prospects to ours, when the fact of the matter is I couldn't give a rip what your prospects are doing.

Secondly, I believe I said two days ago that judging defenders by stats alone is foolish. Though if you'd like me to bring up the .50 PPG average Smith has in the NHL thusfar while averaging third pairing minutes, I can do that. And I'm sure you'll reply with "It's only 14 games", but hey, that's only four more games than your precious Barrie has played in the NHL, and he's still yet to register a point.

Now, on to Nyquist, you're right that he's 23, a fact that isn't very relevant at all. The only people ahead of him on the scoring race are RNH, Schultz, B. Schenn, Neidereitter, and Eberle. (And it's worth speculating that three of those guys are mutually benefitting from each other on the stats sheet) That's pretty good company to be in, regardless of age. He's only eight months older than Eberle and was drafted the same year and is nearly putting up just as many points on the scoresheet. If he puts up 76 points like Eberle did last year, you're not gonna find any complaints. (Especially considering Eberle went 22nd and Nyquist went 141st)

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Originally Posted by Bender View Post
When it's all said and done, both Nyquist and Smith will most likely DO end up being important parts of the red wings team, I just wouldn't peg them as #1 d-man and top line forward, just yet.
Barring a serious improvement defensively, I wouldn't call Smith a number one defender. (In the same way I wouldn't call Green or Yandle a number one defender) In my opinion, he's a projected offensive stud/#1PP QB, but I don't see him as the guy Babcock would look to when he needs to kill a penalty in overtime during the playoffs.


Last edited by Wingsfan2965*: 11-23-2012 at 11:42 PM.
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11-23-2012, 11:27 PM
  #148
MBauer
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How does Nyquist have so much more value then Sgarbossa, or so much more potential. There both similar players producing at very similar levels in the AHL... The only reason Nyquist has more "Potential" or is better then Sgarbossa is because he was drafted by the Wings, and therefore must be destined for stardom.

If Nyquist were drafted by any other team but Detroit, he'd be a sleeper prospect just like Sgarbossa. Smith and Barrie are the same way, but they both player very different styles, so IMO you cant really compare them. Barrie is better on Offense, Smith better on Defense.

As for the Kronwall Johnson comment, IMO they are very close to each other. We'll see how Kronwall plays this year without Lidstrom. Theyre both Top 20-25 Dmen in the NHL, Johnson still has a couple years to grow, Kronwall probably doesnt.
Kronwall didn't even play with Lidstrom last year, if anything his offensive stats will increase because he will get first pairing minutes and top unit pp time.

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11-23-2012, 11:32 PM
  #149
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Unless HTT3 is the one saying it, it should be pretty easy to figure out that a #1 D-man in his early 20s for a top six forward in his early 30s wasn't serious.

And that's before you take multiple other factors about Franzen into account.

Like I said, if you needed a smiley to figure that out, you have bigger problems.
It says you've been here since December 2011...that should have been enough time for you to tell there are many many posters on here who would have posted that seriously...my apologies for not realizing you were not one of them. A tip, unless there is some sort of context for it, or a clearly sarcastic piece in your comment, it will come across as serious, especially at the beginning of a thread that is asking for a top 6 forward. I viewed that comment as yet another biased homer who did not have a clue about Subban/wildly overrated Franzen. Scan through some threads on here and some of the proposals...its not that uncommon to see something like that.

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11-23-2012, 11:36 PM
  #150
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Originally Posted by Avs44 View Post
It says you've been here since December 2011...that should have been enough time for you to tell there are many many posters on here who would have posted that seriously...my apologies for not realizing you were not one of them. A tip, unless there is some sort of context for it, or a clearly sarcastic piece in your comment, it will come across as serious, especially at the beginning of a thread that is asking for a top 6 forward. I viewed that comment as yet another biased homer who did not have a clue about Subban/wildly overrated Franzen. Scan through some threads on here and some of the proposals...its not that uncommon to see something like that.
I thought Franzen for Subban was sarcastic enough, though I suppose there are some posters on here who might legitimately say something that foolish.

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