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Nazem Kadri vs Jakob Silfverberg

View Poll Results: Who is the better prospect?
kadri 72 31.72%
Silfverberg 155 68.28%
Voters: 227. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
11-27-2012, 12:32 AM
  #51
ReginKarlssonLehner
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leaf Rocket View Post
Definitely a good point! However there are players who are younger that haven't been in the SEL as long as those young players that have performed or shown greater potential IMO.
Such as current Duck prospect Frederik Andersen, and Marcus Johansson of the Washington Capitals.
Mickelbot hit the point of my argument. I was comparing the success Silfverberg did as compared to his age group putting him in very strong company. Yes there are a couple players who were of age that didn't stay in the SEL but nonetheless, Silfverberg is the youngest since Forsberg to win the award which should say something.

Rundblad was a huge disappointment due to his inability to translate his game to the NHL due to his deficiency on the defensive end. Silfverberg has no holes in his game and his gritty, sneaky game around the net could best serve in the NHL. He is already the leading forward scoring among other top prospects and more experiences players in Bingo(AHL team)

Silfverberg has top-line potential but it remains to be seen if he can achieve it. A lot of Sens fans pencilling him along-side Spezza this year, especially due to the unbelievable shift he had against NYR in last playoff game in the third period. Therefore we know he is capable of it.

Silfverberg is a more safer bet with just as much skill and hockey IQ as Kadri with better work ethic, leadership and defensive responsibility. That's why the clear answer is Silfverberg with quite ease, imo.

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11-27-2012, 01:03 AM
  #52
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Whenever you hear a fan praising hus prospect for being "safer", you know he's just being a homer.

but hey, convince yourselves that your 40pt pace prospect is better than the ppg guy if it majes you feel better, even if he doesn't bring any noticeable edge physicalky or defensively to make up that difference.


i love the "safer" argument. let me try....finn and percy are "safer" prospects than ceci, so they're clearly better prospects.

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11-27-2012, 01:15 AM
  #53
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Originally Posted by zeke View Post
Whenever you hear a fan praising hus prospect for being "safer", you know he's just being a homer.

but hey, convince yourselves that your 40pt pace prospect is better than the ppg guy if it majes you feel better, even if he doesn't bring any noticeable edge physicalky or defensively to make up that difference.


i love the "safer" argument. let me try....finn and percy are "safer" prospects than ceci, so they're clearly better prospects.
Guaranteed buts != safer than Ceci. You're clearly confused.

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11-27-2012, 02:17 AM
  #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zeke View Post
Whenever you hear a fan praising hus prospect for being "safer", you know he's just being a homer.

but hey, convince yourselves that your 40pt pace prospect is better than the ppg guy if it majes you feel better, even if he doesn't bring any noticeable edge physicalky or defensively to make up that difference.


i love the "safer" argument. let me try....finn and percy are "safer" prospects than ceci, so they're clearly better prospects.
You could make the argument, yeah.

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11-27-2012, 02:59 AM
  #55
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Originally Posted by ReginKarlssonLehner View Post
Mickelbot hit the point of my argument. I was comparing the success Silfverberg did as compared to his age group putting him in very strong company. Yes there are a couple players who were of age that didn't stay in the SEL but nonetheless, Silfverberg is the youngest since Forsberg to win the award which should say something.

Rundblad was a huge disappointment due to his inability to translate his game to the NHL due to his deficiency on the defensive end. Silfverberg has no holes in his game and his gritty, sneaky game around the net could best serve in the NHL. He is already the leading forward scoring among other top prospects and more experiences players in Bingo(AHL team)

Silfverberg has top-line potential but it remains to be seen if he can achieve it. A lot of Sens fans pencilling him along-side Spezza this year, especially due to the unbelievable shift he had against NYR in last playoff game in the third period. Therefore we know he is capable of it.

Silfverberg is a more safer bet with just as much skill and hockey IQ as Kadri with better work ethic, leadership and defensive responsibility. That's why the clear answer is Silfverberg with quite ease, imo.
hahahaha, you're kidding right? It's one thing to be psyched about a prospect and think they have top line potential, but are you serious? You know what he is capable of because of one shift? You can not judge a prospect off of one shift...

People bashed Kessel and said 50 games into the season that it was only 50 games and he'd have to keep up his pace for a year before people started giving him praise, there's still people saying he has to do it another year before they'd consider him a top winger....

Also, more safer doesn't make sense.

And one more thing, Kadri's skill is through the roof... that's not what's holding him back and he has more skill then a good chunk of current NHLers.

For who will be better, I'm not going to vote because I'm biased.

Edit: I've seen Tyler Bozak, Mike Brown, Tim Brent, Niklas Hagman, Matt Stajan, etc. have amazing shifts, doesn't mean they're capable of consistently doing it.

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11-27-2012, 03:05 AM
  #56
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Originally Posted by Leaf Rocket View Post
It's nice to rooting for your prospect team but it's better to keep things in perspective. As for the Guldhjalmen, yea it's great that he won it but not necessarily does it mean he will adjust to the NHL standards.
2012 - Jakob Silfverberg, Brynäs IF
2011 - Magnus Johansson, Linköpings HC
2010 - Mats Zuccarello Aasen, Modo Hockey
2009 - Johan Davidsson, HV71
2008 - Tony Mårtensson, Linköpings HC
2007 - Fredrik Bremberg, Djurgårdens IF
2006 - Andreas Karlsson, HV71
2005 - Henrik Lundqvist, Frölunda HC
2004 - Magnus Kahnberg, Västra Frölunda HC
2003 - Niklas Andersson, Västra Frölunda HC
2002 - Ulf Söderström, Färjestads BK
2001 - Kristian Huselius, Västra Frölunda HC
2000 - Rikard Franzén, AIK

Those are the MVP for the last 10 years or so, only 3 has touched the NHL level, while one has proven to be consistent. That's none other than Lundqvist, Zuccarello is the other and no he wasn't as consistent. Huselius is the only one who has shown he can progressively increase his skill level however also sort of showed his unlucky injuries. Everyone else in that list...have done nothing. Only time will tell if he can adjust to it, I am rooting for the guy as I like him.

Also for the best wrister not in the NHL comment....yea no. I can name three easily that'll beat him out on the spot. Off the top of my head, Hall in the AHL atm, Tarasenko, and Yakupov in the KHL.
The Swedish Elite Leauge is not a junior/development leauge. Most people in that list were veterans when they won.

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Old
11-27-2012, 07:56 AM
  #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zeke View Post
Whenever you hear a fan praising hus prospect for being "safer", you know he's just being a homer.

but hey, convince yourselves that your 40pt pace prospect is better than the ppg guy if it majes you feel better, even if he doesn't bring any noticeable edge physicalky or defensively to make up that difference.


i love the "safer" argument. let me try....finn and percy are "safer" prospects than ceci, so they're clearly better prospects.
That is a terribly weak opinion and borders on troll material. We all know that the contrary of safer is boom/bust.

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11-27-2012, 09:06 AM
  #58
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Originally Posted by SpezDispenser View Post
How is a guy who just won the SEL MVP for both the regular season and the playoffs overrated?
Meh, I don't even consider him the best prospect on that team. I'd take Johan Larson over him any day. Almost 2 years younger, 36 points in his 19 year old season(Silfverberg had 16). Both made the leap this year, and Larsson is out scoring him in the AHL.

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11-27-2012, 09:34 AM
  #59
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Originally Posted by ThatGuy22 View Post
Meh, I don't even consider him the best prospect on that team. I'd take Johan Larson over him any day. Almost 2 years younger, 36 points in his 19 year old season(Silfverberg had 16). Both made the leap this year, and Larsson is out scoring him in the AHL.
That's fine, this isn't a poll about Larson vs Silfverberg. And...wow...I couldn't disagree more. A typical HF response of looking at points instead of doing the due diligence on players. Silfverberg did everything for Brynas - especially in that amazing playoff run, he didn't just score, he was a 2-way force...but I'm sure you know that already.

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11-27-2012, 09:41 AM
  #60
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Originally Posted by SpezDispenser View Post
That's fine, this isn't a poll about Larson vs Silfverberg. And...wow...I couldn't disagree more. A typical HF response of looking at points instead of doing the due diligence on players. Silfverberg did everything for Brynas - especially in that amazing playoff run, he didn't just score, he was a 2-way force...but I'm sure you know that already.
I didn't say he wasn't the best player in that playoff run. Doesn't mean he was the best prospect. Two years is a lot of extra development time for Silfverberg. I was just making the point that just because he was a league MVP doesn't mean he's the best thing since sliced bread.

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11-27-2012, 09:46 AM
  #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zeke View Post
Whenever you hear a fan praising hus prospect for being "safer", you know he's just being a homer.

but hey, convince yourselves that your 40pt pace prospect is better than the ppg guy if it majes you feel better, even if he doesn't bring any noticeable edge physicalky or defensively to make up that difference.


i love the "safer" argument. let me try....finn and percy are "safer" prospects than ceci, so they're clearly better prospects.
Feel free convincing yourself that adjustment to smaller ice isn't a real thing.

And feel free convincing yourself that Silfverberg isn't a MUCH better player right now than he was for the first month or two in NA. Although zeke, you'd have to actually be paying attention.

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11-27-2012, 09:49 AM
  #62
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Originally Posted by ThatGuy22 View Post
I didn't say he wasn't the best player in that playoff run. Doesn't mean he was the best prospect. Two years is a lot of extra development time for Silfverberg. I was just making the point that just because he was a league MVP doesn't mean he's the best thing since sliced bread.
To be fair, it would be asking a lot of Larsson to do what Silfverberg did last year even if you gave Larsson a year or two to do it.

It was Mikael Renberg that said Silfverberg appears to be one of the best prospects Sweden has produced in years. Whether that holds true or not, who knows.

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11-27-2012, 09:50 AM
  #63
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Originally Posted by Minister of Offence View Post
Feel free convincing yourself that adjustment to smaller ice isn't a real thing.

And feel free convincing yourself that Silfverberg isn't a MUCH better player right now than he was for the first month or two in NA. Although zeke, you'd have to actually be paying attention.
Save your breath...

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11-27-2012, 09:59 AM
  #64
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Originally Posted by Minister of Offence View Post
Feel free convincing yourself that adjustment to smaller ice isn't a real thing.

And feel free convincing yourself that Silfverberg isn't a MUCH better player right now than he was for the first month or two in NA. Although zeke, you'd have to actually be paying attention.
Notice how many posts the Kadri's fat thread got when he wasn't putting up points? Now notice how many it has gotten in comparison after he's lit it up?

That's what happens...

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11-27-2012, 10:15 AM
  #65
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Personally, if I had to choose between two forwards who have average/above avg size, I would go for the guy with the most offensive skill, and the higher upside.

Using these two categories, I would rather take Kadri.

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11-27-2012, 10:32 AM
  #66
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Originally Posted by Chandrashekhar Limit View Post
Personally, if I had to choose between two forwards who have average/above avg size, I would go for the guy with the most offensive skill, and the higher upside.

Using these two categories, I would rather take Kadri.
Well that settles it.

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11-27-2012, 12:45 PM
  #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zeke View Post
Whenever you hear a fan praising hus prospect for being "safer", you know he's just being a homer.

but hey, convince yourselves that your 40pt pace prospect is better than the ppg guy if it majes you feel better, even if he doesn't bring any noticeable edge physicalky or defensively to make up that difference.


i love the "safer" argument. let me try....finn and percy are "safer" prospects than ceci, so they're clearly better prospects.
Safer in-terms of overall ability to be more successful in the NHL. If Silfverberg does not become a top 6 forward he still has a very strong and sound 2 way game with added aggression for him to play a prominent bottom 6 role as well.

As for the defensive argument, watch Silfverberg play and you wouldn't have made that post. He is extremely strong in his own zone playing a full 200 ft game and one of the best PKers in Bingo.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TMLKesselftw View Post
hahahaha, you're kidding right? It's one thing to be psyched about a prospect and think they have top line potential, but are you serious? You know what he is capable of because of one shift? You can not judge a prospect off of one shift...

People bashed Kessel and said 50 games into the season that it was only 50 games and he'd have to keep up his pace for a year before people started giving him praise, there's still people saying he has to do it another year before they'd consider him a top winger....

Also, more safer doesn't make sense.

And one more thing, Kadri's skill is through the roof... that's not what's holding him back and he has more skill then a good chunk of current NHLers.

For who will be better, I'm not going to vote because I'm biased.

Edit: I've seen Tyler Bozak, Mike Brown, Tim Brent, Niklas Hagman, Matt Stajan, etc. have amazing shifts, doesn't mean they're capable of consistently doing it.
Lmao, typical Leaf fan taking words out of the entire context and trying to base his argument off it. If you were tracking my posts that lead to that one and the pre-arguments I gave, you'd understand that Silfverberg was coming off as the most dominant player in the SEL and one of the youngest at that and for him to play on the TOP LINE against the best team in the east and to not lose an edge in-terms of dominance, makes you believe he can handle it if given a more consistent role. Plus, he played the entire 2 games on the top-line initially and that particular shift showed his impact. Learn to understand context and background information before you insist on trying to make yourself seem correct. Good use of the emoticons, though.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chandrashekhar Limit View Post
Personally, if I had to choose between two forwards who have average/above avg size, I would go for the guy with the most offensive skill, and the higher upside.

Using these two categories, I would rather take Kadri.
What are you basing this "highest offensive skill" in order to make Kadri better than Silfverberg? Silfverberg scored the most goals all-time in the playoffs and was 2nd in points last year while maintaining the best PPG ratio. Silfverberg has just as much skill. If anything, Kadri only has dangling and puck-handling ability on Silfverberg, basically it.

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Old
11-27-2012, 02:08 PM
  #68
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Originally Posted by TieClark View Post
Notice how many posts the Kadri's fat thread got when he wasn't putting up points? Now notice how many it has gotten in comparison after he's lit it up?

That's what happens...
People hate your team, get over it.

Look at the equation

Large city + central sports media -> unrelenting attention + terrible teams + large fan base -->large amount of arrogance and ignorance

=

PEOPLE THINK YOU'RE A JOKE. The result of that equation is practically human nature.

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11-27-2012, 02:57 PM
  #69
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Kadri

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11-27-2012, 03:09 PM
  #70
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Quote:
Corey Pronman ‏@coreypronman
Lean Silfverberg but it's a tough call. RT @BENNY14O4: @coreypronman Who is the better prospect Kadri or Silfverberg?
I'd take Silfverberg

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11-27-2012, 03:48 PM
  #71
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I'd pick Kadri if he were chosen and developed by any other organization.

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11-27-2012, 04:24 PM
  #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ReginKarlssonLehner View Post

Silfverberg is a more safer bet with just as much skill and hockey IQ as Kadri with better work ethic, leadership and defensive responsibility. That's why the clear answer is Silfverberg with quite ease, imo.


Canucks fan disagreeing with you. Kadri's skill level is better - in fact, it's the one thing he can hang his hat on in this comparison. JS obviously being more well-rounded.

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11-27-2012, 05:19 PM
  #73
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Canucks fan disagreeing with you. Kadri's skill level is better - in fact, it's the one thing he can hang his hat on in this comparison. JS obviously being more well-rounded.
What is your definition of skill? He said offensive skill. People think Kadri is better because he pulls off good one vs one moves but offensive skill or just skill is foundation of many attributes such as: Passing, goal-scoring, hockey IQ, vision, skating, puck-handling, offensive awareness. Like I said, Kadri has only puck-handling where it's evidently better than Silfverberg but Silfverberg relies on other components to define his offensive skill like his passing, shooting, awareness, and vision.

Just cause a guy can dangle does not mean he has more skill. Oh, I'd also say Kadri has better skating which allows him to finesse and weave better, hard to do that anymore when you're fat, though

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11-27-2012, 05:20 PM
  #74
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So far in their careers JS has produced and won way more then kadri. He's been the better player and will be the better player. It is close tho, kadri's going to be a good player but JS is just gonna be a beast. No one has dominated at that age in the SEL for a long time

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11-27-2012, 06:33 PM
  #75
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yeah, not since the legendary days of David Runblad have we seen such SEL dominance from a youngster.

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