HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > National Hockey League Talk
National Hockey League Talk Discuss NHL players, teams, games, and the Stanley Cup Playoffs.

My Re-Alignment / Schedule Idea

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
11-27-2012, 05:06 AM
  #1
MSPGabe
Born & Bred In Maine
 
MSPGabe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Minneapolis
Country: United States
Posts: 1,900
vCash: 500
My Re-Alignment / Schedule Idea

My vision:

PRINCE OF WALES CONFERENCE (Eastern)

ADAMS DIVISION (Northeast)

Boston Bruins
Montreal Canadiens
Ottawa Senators
Toronto Maple Leafs
Buffalo Sabres
New York Islanders
New York Rangers
New Jersey Devils

PATRICK DIVISION (Atlantic)

Detroit Red Wings
Columbus Blue Jackets
Pittsburgh Penguins
Philadelphia Flyers
Washington Capitals
Carolina Hurricanes
Tampa Bay Lightning
Florida Panthers


CLARENCE CAMPBELL CONFERENCE (Western)

NORRIS DIVISION (Central)

Winnipeg Jets
Minnesota Wild
Chicago Blackhawks
St. Louis Blues
Nashville Predators
Dallas Stars
Colorado Avalanche

SMYTHE DIVISION (West)

Edmonton Oilers
Calgary Flames
Vancouver Canucks
San Jose Sharks
Los Angeles Kings
Anaheim Ducks
Phoenix Coyotes



There's bound to be some unhappiness here, especially by splitting the Rangers/Devils away from the Flyers/Penguins. Unfortunately, there's no real way around it. It's mitigated somewhat by putting Detroit into the Patrick Division, along with Washington.

Same frustrations in pulling Detroit out of the current Central. You lose that rivalry with the Blackhawks. But it gets all Eastern Time Zone teams to the Eastern Conference, and the Blackhawks should gain some good games with the Wild/Avalanche/Jets. Over time these will work out nicely.

------------------------------------------------------

The schedule will work as follows...


Each Wales Conference Team plays their own division opponents 4 times, two home, and two away.

7 X 4 = 28 Games

Each Wales Conference Team plays their other Conference division opponents 3 times, alternating home ice each year.

8 x 3 = 24 Games

Each Wales Conference Team plays each Campbell Conference team twice, one home, one away.

14 x 2 = 28 Games

This is an 80 game schedule.



Each Campbell Conference Team plays their own division opponents 4 times, two home, and two away.

6 X 4 = 24 Games

Each Campbell Conference Team plays their other Conference division opponents 3 times alternating home ice each year.

7 x 3 = 21 Games

Each Campbell Conference Team plays each Wales Conference Team twice, one home, one away.

16 x 2 = 32 Games

This is a 77 game schedule.

You'll notice the Western teams only have a 77 game schedule. This is tough. The easiest way I've found to make it work is those last 3 games are played within the division, with a 4 year rotation. For example,

In Year 1, VAN plays an extra divisional game against SJ, @LA, and @ANA.
In Year 2, VAN plays an extra divisional game against EDM, CGY, and @PHX.
In Year 3, VAN plays an extra divisional game against @SJ, LA, and ANA.
In Year 4, VAN plays an extra divisional game against @EDM, @CGY, and PHX.

This way, every 4 years, you get an extra two games against each division opponent, one home, one away.

------------------------------------------------------

Playoff seeding works thusly:

16 team playoff, same as now. 8 teams from each Conference. Top 2 teams in each Division get guaranteed Playoff Berths. The remaining 4 spots in each Conference are the teams with the highest points.

Yes, this means, in theory, the Western teams have a slightly better chance to get into the playoffs, as the last 4 playoff spots are pulled from 10 teams instead of 12. While East Coast teams may view this as unfair, there is a reasoning behind it. Western teams each have to play 3 extra divisional games, and Western teams also have to travel more. These are slight disadvantages, which, in my opinion, equal out the slight advantage in regards to Playoff Berths.

Seeding, and home ice is based on points, nothing else. If the Bruins are 2nd in the Adams Division with 91 points, they are guaranteed a spot. But if they're 5th in points behind Pittsburgh, Philadelphia, Washington, and Detroit, tough luck. They're a 5 seed, and don't have home ice advantage.

As the NHL does now, teams are reseeded after each round.

To determine Home Ice for the Stanley Cup Final, we look at which team has a better winning percentage against the other conference.


Thoughts? Opinions? I haven't exactly gone in and worked out a specific schedule. I would imagine it could get a little complicated, especially out West, making sure teams get 40 home and 40 road games a year. But still, I think it's pretty good.

MSPGabe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 05:17 AM
  #2
Bure All Day
Registered User
 
Bure All Day's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Vancouver Isl.
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,051
vCash: 500
As a Canucks fan, i'm in favor of those divisions

Bure All Day is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 05:29 AM
  #3
Machinehead
Brauch und Stolz
 
Machinehead's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: New York New York
Country: Germany
Posts: 33,110
vCash: 500
It does help the time zone issue to an extent.

I don't like the Atlantic being split up. If we can maybe exchange the Bruins and Habs for Pens and Flyers I'd be happy.

Hate the idea of winning % vs the other conference determining home ice. That's brutal. It should just be better record.

Machinehead is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 05:45 AM
  #4
GuineaPig
Registered User
 
GuineaPig's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Montréal
Posts: 2,124
vCash: 500
There's a lot here that makes sense, but I'd like to wait for either expansion or contraction to pull the trigger. Uneven conferences are the obvious weak element.

GuineaPig is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 06:51 AM
  #5
#66
Registered User
 
#66's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Country: United States
Posts: 10,255
vCash: 500
Contraction and movement. Let the league get strong on these 28 teams and then worry about bringing in Seatle, KC or Hartford. I'm hoping for something like this sooner rather than later...

PRINCE OF WALES CONFERENCE (Eastern)

ADAMS DIVISION (Northeast)

Boston Bruins
Montreal Canadiens
Ottawa Senators
Toronto Maple Leafs
Buffalo Sabres
Quebec...
Hamilton...

PATRICK DIVISION (Atlantic)

New Jersey Devils
New York Rangers
Pittsburgh Penguins
Philadelphia Flyers
Washington Capitals
New York Islanders
Tampa Bay Lightning


CLARENCE CAMPBELL CONFERENCE (Western)

NORRIS DIVISION (Central)

Nashville Predators
Minnesota Wild
Chicago Blackhawks
St. Louis Blues
Detroit Red Wings
Dallas Stars
Winnipeg Jets

SMYTHE DIVISION (West)

Edmonton Oilers
Calgary Flames
Vancouver Canucks
San Jose Sharks
Los Angeles Kings
Anaheim Ducks
Colorado Avalanche

#66 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 06:58 AM
  #6
Lonewolfe2015
Registered User
 
Lonewolfe2015's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Country: United States
Posts: 10,770
vCash: 239
Quote:
Originally Posted by GuineaPig View Post
There's a lot here that makes sense, but I'd like to wait for either expansion or contraction to pull the trigger. Uneven conferences are the obvious weak element.
Agreed, although we won't contract.

The biggest flaw imo is that you just pulled Pittsburgh/Philadelphia away from rivals NY and NJ. It might make more sense to swap Detroit and Columbus into the Northeast and keep Pitt/Philly in the Atlantic.

I like seeing someone putting the Avs in the Central as opposed to Pacific though. Having all the games on Pacific time would be murder as an east coast Avs fan.

E: To the poster above, why does Florida and Carolina lose their franchise? For your own satisfaction?

Lonewolfe2015 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 07:04 AM
  #7
M Gaz
Gogo Yubari
 
M Gaz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Long Island
Country: United States
Posts: 1,725
vCash: 50
Northeast:
Bruins
Canadiens
Maple Leafs
Sabres
Senators

Atlantic:
Devils
Flyers
Islanders
Penguins
Rangers

Southeast:
Capitals
Hurricanes
Lightning
Panthers
PREDATORS

Northwest:
Avalanche
Canucks
Flames
JETS
Oilers

Central:
Blackhawks
Blues
Blue Jackets
Red Wings
WILD

Pacific:
Coyotes
Ducks
Kings
Sharks
Stars

It's the simplest realignment possible, keeps rivalries intact, and doesn't change scheduling too much.

M Gaz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 07:20 AM
  #8
Machinehead
Brauch und Stolz
 
Machinehead's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: New York New York
Country: Germany
Posts: 33,110
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by NashtyAttack View Post
Northeast:
Bruins
Canadiens
Maple Leafs
Sabres
Senators

Atlantic:
Devils
Flyers
Islanders
Penguins
Rangers

Southeast:
Capitals
Hurricanes
Lightning
Panthers
PREDATORS

Northwest:
Avalanche
Canucks
Flames
JETS
Oilers

Central:
Blackhawks
Blues
Blue Jackets
Red Wings
WILD

Pacific:
Coyotes
Ducks
Kings
Sharks
Stars

It's the simplest realignment possible, keeps rivalries intact, and doesn't change scheduling too much.
This is EXACTLY what I want

Machinehead is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 07:55 AM
  #9
beowulf
Poster of the Year!
 
beowulf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Ottawa
Country: Canada
Posts: 34,858
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to beowulf
Quote:
Originally Posted by Machinehead View Post
It does help the time zone issue to an extent.

I don't like the Atlantic being split up. If we can maybe exchange the Bruins and Habs for Pens and Flyers I'd be happy.

Hate the idea of winning % vs the other conference determining home ice. That's brutal. It should just be better record.
How the hell would that work? Habs are not going to be split from the Leafs and Sens that's for sure.

beowulf is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 07:59 AM
  #10
Screw You Rick Nash
🚨🚨🚨🚨🚨🚨🚨🚨
 
Screw You Rick Nash's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Brooklyn, New NY
Country: United States
Posts: 27,221
vCash: 3000
If you are going to put the division names back, then the Rangers should be in the Patrick Division..

Also, I know it's fun to make realignment proposals, but I'd be willing to bet that once the lockout ends, they will use their originally proposed realignment for the following season (with some changes if there is an expansion).

__________________
++++++++++[>+++++++>++++++++++>+++>+<<<<
-]>++++++.>+.+++++++++++++++.>+++++++++.<-.
>-------.<<-----.>----.>.<<+++++++++++.>-------------
-.+++++++++++++.-------.--.+++++++++++++.+.>+.>.

New and improved Hockey Standings
"A jimmie for a jimmie makes the whole world rustled." — -31-

Last edited by Screw You Rick Nash: 11-27-2012 at 08:07 AM.
Screw You Rick Nash is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 08:30 AM
  #11
Minor Boarding
Registered User
 
Minor Boarding's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Corleone
Posts: 1,328
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoBruins231 View Post
My vision:

CLARENCE CAMPBELL CONFERENCE (Western)

NORRIS DIVISION (Central)

Winnipeg Jets
Minnesota Wild
Chicago Blackhawks
St. Louis Blues
Nashville Predators
Dallas Stars
Colorado Avalanche

SMYTHE DIVISION (West)

Edmonton Oilers
Calgary Flames
Vancouver Canucks
San Jose Sharks
Los Angeles Kings
Anaheim Ducks
Phoenix Coyotes


As a Kings fan I would love to be in the same division as Calgary and Edmonton. For old times sake - the rivalries with Edmonton and Calgary were great.

Minor Boarding is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 08:30 AM
  #12
alpine4life
Registered User
 
alpine4life's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Moncton, NB
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,432
vCash: 500
a friend of mine who's an economist seggested that...

mentionned that it would be the most viable solutions for travelling in the NHL while keeping the rivalries together. I dont mind both of them, but if 4 divisions were to be set in the NHL, it would be nice to see 2 teams leave for Divisions to be of equal numbers.

4 Division:


6 Divisions:

alpine4life is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 08:36 AM
  #13
BlackNgold 84
Registered User
 
BlackNgold 84's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Massachusetts
Country: United States
Posts: 2,077
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoBruins231 View Post
My vision:

PRINCE OF WALES CONFERENCE (Eastern)

ADAMS DIVISION (Northeast)

Boston Bruins
Montreal Canadiens
Ottawa Senators
Toronto Maple Leafs
Buffalo Sabres
New York Islanders
New York Rangers
New Jersey Devils

PATRICK DIVISION (Atlantic)

Detroit Red Wings
Columbus Blue Jackets
Pittsburgh Penguins
Philadelphia Flyers
Washington Capitals
Carolina Hurricanes
Tampa Bay Lightning
Florida Panthers


CLARENCE CAMPBELL CONFERENCE (Western)

NORRIS DIVISION (Central)

Winnipeg Jets
Minnesota Wild
Chicago Blackhawks
St. Louis Blues
Nashville Predators
Dallas Stars
Colorado Avalanche

SMYTHE DIVISION (West)

Edmonton Oilers
Calgary Flames
Vancouver Canucks
San Jose Sharks
Los Angeles Kings
Anaheim Ducks
Phoenix Coyotes



There's bound to be some unhappiness here, especially by splitting the Rangers/Devils away from the Flyers/Penguins. Unfortunately, there's no real way around it. It's mitigated somewhat by putting Detroit into the Patrick Division, along with Washington.

Same frustrations in pulling Detroit out of the current Central. You lose that rivalry with the Blackhawks. But it gets all Eastern Time Zone teams to the Eastern Conference, and the Blackhawks should gain some good games with the Wild/Avalanche/Jets. Over time these will work out nicely.

------------------------------------------------------

The schedule will work as follows...


Each Wales Conference Team plays their own division opponents 4 times, two home, and two away.

7 X 4 = 28 Games

Each Wales Conference Team plays their other Conference division opponents 3 times, alternating home ice each year.

8 x 3 = 24 Games

Each Wales Conference Team plays each Campbell Conference team twice, one home, one away.

14 x 2 = 28 Games

This is an 80 game schedule.



Each Campbell Conference Team plays their own division opponents 4 times, two home, and two away.

6 X 4 = 24 Games

Each Campbell Conference Team plays their other Conference division opponents 3 times alternating home ice each year.

7 x 3 = 21 Games

Each Campbell Conference Team plays each Wales Conference Team twice, one home, one away.

16 x 2 = 32 Games

This is a 77 game schedule.

You'll notice the Western teams only have a 77 game schedule. This is tough. The easiest way I've found to make it work is those last 3 games are played within the division, with a 4 year rotation. For example,

In Year 1, VAN plays an extra divisional game against SJ, @LA, and @ANA.
In Year 2, VAN plays an extra divisional game against EDM, CGY, and @PHX.
In Year 3, VAN plays an extra divisional game against @SJ, LA, and ANA.
In Year 4, VAN plays an extra divisional game against @EDM, @CGY, and PHX.

This way, every 4 years, you get an extra two games against each division opponent, one home, one away.

------------------------------------------------------

Playoff seeding works thusly:

16 team playoff, same as now. 8 teams from each Conference. Top 2 teams in each Division get guaranteed Playoff Berths. The remaining 4 spots in each Conference are the teams with the highest points.

Yes, this means, in theory, the Western teams have a slightly better chance to get into the playoffs, as the last 4 playoff spots are pulled from 10 teams instead of 12. While East Coast teams may view this as unfair, there is a reasoning behind it. Western teams each have to play 3 extra divisional games, and Western teams also have to travel more. These are slight disadvantages, which, in my opinion, equal out the slight advantage in regards to Playoff Berths.

Seeding, and home ice is based on points, nothing else. If the Bruins are 2nd in the Adams Division with 91 points, they are guaranteed a spot. But if they're 5th in points behind Pittsburgh, Philadelphia, Washington, and Detroit, tough luck. They're a 5 seed, and don't have home ice advantage.

As the NHL does now, teams are reseeded after each round.

To determine Home Ice for the Stanley Cup Final, we look at which team has a better winning percentage against the other conference.


Thoughts? Opinions? I haven't exactly gone in and worked out a specific schedule. I would imagine it could get a little complicated, especially out West, making sure teams get 40 home and 40 road games a year. But still, I think it's pretty good.
I'm for more of 6 divisions and also.. there being a chance to have two eastern conference teams in the finals.. I'm old fashioned like that i guess.

BlackNgold 84 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 09:10 AM
  #14
Jaymond Flurrie
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Espoo, Finland
Country: Finland
Posts: 2,036
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by alpine4life View Post
6 Divisions:
This would be good. The one thing to do before that (or at least at the same time) about scheduling is to have each team visit each team every season.

Jaymond Flurrie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 09:38 AM
  #15
Buck Aki Berg
My pockets hurt
 
Buck Aki Berg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Ottawa, ON
Country: Canada
Posts: 13,693
vCash: 500
From my experience, about 95% of the people who propose to bring back the old division names don't know the first names of all four people the divisions were named after

Buck Aki Berg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 09:46 AM
  #16
Machinehead
Brauch und Stolz
 
Machinehead's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: New York New York
Country: Germany
Posts: 33,110
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Buck Aki Berg View Post
From my experience, about 95% of the people who propose to bring back the old division names don't know the first names of all four people the divisions were named after
C'mon that's easy.

Chuck Norris, Patch Adams, Spencer Smythe, and Saint Patrick

Machinehead is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 09:54 AM
  #17
MessierII
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 6,099
vCash: 500
I like it the only problem is the Phoenix situation I don't see them sticking around much longer.

MessierII is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 09:58 AM
  #18
MessierII
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 6,099
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by NashtyAttack View Post
Northeast:
Bruins
Canadiens
Maple Leafs
Sabres
Senators

Atlantic:
Devils
Flyers
Islanders
Penguins
Rangers

Southeast:
Capitals
Hurricanes
Lightning
Panthers
PREDATORS

Northwest:
Avalanche
Canucks
Flames
JETS
Oilers

Central:
Blackhawks
Blues
Blue Jackets
Red Wings
WILD

Pacific:
Coyotes
Ducks
Kings
Sharks
Stars

It's the simplest realignment possible, keeps rivalries intact, and doesn't change scheduling too much.
The thing is the current schedule sucks. I hate seeing like teams like Philly and Boston, Pittsburgh once every two years. The Pens played in Edmonton last year for the first time in two years and Crosby was out so we won't see Crosby in Edmonton till maybe next year. We need more inter conference play I don't think it's fair I get to see Crosby play once every 4-5 years while everyone in the east gets to see him 2-3 times per year.

MessierII is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 09:59 AM
  #19
alpine4life
Registered User
 
alpine4life's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Moncton, NB
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,432
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Buck Aki Berg View Post
From my experience, about 95% of the people who propose to bring back the old division names don't know the first names of all four people the divisions were named after
Lets give this a try, if I can rermber right...

Prince of Whale (Conference) - British Monarchy (cant say who was there when that was created though)
C.F. Adams (Division) - Former Boston Bruins Owner
Lester Patrick (Division) - Former NY Rangers goalie

Clarence Campbell (Conference) - Former NHL President who suspended M. Richard during the NHL Playoffs
James Norris (Division) - Former Owner of the Detroit Red Wings
Conn Smythe (Division) - Former Maple Leafs owner

alpine4life is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 10:22 AM
  #20
Swedish Mafia
Baby got Backstrom
 
Swedish Mafia's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Halifax, NS
Country: Canada
Posts: 256
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by alpine4life View Post
a friend of mine who's an economist seggested that...

mentionned that it would be the most viable solutions for travelling in the NHL while keeping the rivalries together. I dont mind both of them, but if 4 divisions were to be set in the NHL, it would be nice to see 2 teams leave for Divisions to be of equal numbers.

4 Division:


6 Divisions:
I prefer the 6 division alignment, but I'm not too sure how Van city would like being excluded from the other Canadian teams

Swedish Mafia is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 10:41 AM
  #21
M Gaz
Gogo Yubari
 
M Gaz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Long Island
Country: United States
Posts: 1,725
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by MessierII View Post
The thing is the current schedule sucks. I hate seeing like teams like Philly and Boston, Pittsburgh once every two years. The Pens played in Edmonton last year for the first time in two years and Crosby was out so we won't see Crosby in Edmonton till maybe next year. We need more inter conference play I don't think it's fair I get to see Crosby play once every 4-5 years while everyone in the east gets to see him 2-3 times per year.
Ok how about this:

84 game schedule
24 games vs divison teams (6 per team)
40 games vs other conference teams (4 per team)
30 games vs teams in the other conference (2 per team, 1 home 1 away)

This is something I'd like to see. What are 2 more games gonna do?

M Gaz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 10:43 AM
  #22
M Gaz
Gogo Yubari
 
M Gaz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Long Island
Country: United States
Posts: 1,725
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Machinehead View Post
This is EXACTLY what I want
Hey you agree with me for once!

M Gaz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 10:45 AM
  #23
Slashers98
HFB Partner
 
Slashers98's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Quebec City
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,162
vCash: 500
Anything including the Phoenix Coyotes is useless speculation!

Slashers98 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 10:47 AM
  #24
MessierII
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 6,099
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by NashtyAttack View Post
Ok how about this:

84 game schedule
24 games vs divison teams (6 per team)
40 games vs other conference teams (4 per team)
30 games vs teams in the other conference (2 per team, 1 home 1 away)

This is something I'd like to see. What are 2 more games gonna do?
That's fair I'll take it

MessierII is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 11:01 AM
  #25
Buck Aki Berg
My pockets hurt
 
Buck Aki Berg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Ottawa, ON
Country: Canada
Posts: 13,693
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by alpine4life View Post
Lets give this a try, if I can rermber right...

Prince of Whale (Conference) - British Monarchy (cant say who was there when that was created though)
C.F. Adams (Division) - Former Boston Bruins Owner
Lester Patrick (Division) - Former NY Rangers goalie

Clarence Campbell (Conference) - Former NHL President who suspended M. Richard during the NHL Playoffs
James Norris (Division) - Former Owner of the Detroit Red Wings
Conn Smythe (Division) - Former Maple Leafs owner
You either know your history, or you've seen my posts griping about this in the past

Charles Adams is the one a lot of people don't know - they think it was named after Jack Adams.

Buck Aki Berg is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:22 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.