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2012 CBA & Re-alignment: Lockout in Effect. Thanks Gary/Donald! PART II

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Old
11-25-2012, 08:06 PM
  #901
Captain Hook
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Bettman at least does some good though. Hockey would be baseball on ice if he wouldn't have convinced the owners to lose a season or two to fix the system. Sid and/or Geno may already be playing in New York or Toronto if the changes didn't happen.

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11-25-2012, 09:38 PM
  #902
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Bettman has grown the sport of hockey, he has a vested interest in the success of the game as a whole. His position is to ensure the survivability of the smaller market teams so the league grows as a whole. He has made it a point to try to grow the sport in non traditional areas which takes a long time to do and yields little to no immediate results but pays off big down the road. I don't doubt that Gary Bettman is doing what he feels is best for the NHL.

Ask yourself whether Donald Fehr is acting in the best interest of the sport? Just see the damage he did with Baseball, it's clear he does not give one crap about the sports that the players he leads play. It sickens me when fans take up on his side like he's looking out for us. Gary Bettman is painted to be a villian but he at least has a vested interest in the sport.

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11-26-2012, 01:18 PM
  #903
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Here's a good look at what likely comes next: Decertification. This is serious b'ness.

If it happens we can for sure say goodbye to this season, because it takes a while (month+) to go into effect, then all the court battles start. This seems like the sort of thing that if the courts side with the players and put big fines on the owners, we could be talking about a league-altering event. The owners could turn this whole thing into a giant legal war, possibly ending the league as we know it because of the costs involved.

Somehow if the court rules the lockout is illegal, I don't see that being the end of it / the owners making a new CBA with their tail between their legs. I see them taking out their own legal guns and opening fire on whoever is available as a target. Ego-driven billionaires aren't going to back down in that situation IMO.

http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=410312

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11-26-2012, 01:31 PM
  #904
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If we lose the season, I'm fine with the league going through a prolonged legal battle. **** needs to change.

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Old
11-26-2012, 01:43 PM
  #905
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Some thoughts that suggest this whole thing is being run by losers like Leonsis and Liepold, who can't figure out how to make a profit in a good hockey market, with full arenas... while the bigtime owners making money (Jacobs aside) are on the sidelines doing nothing.

Not sure how reliable this reporter or paper is but interesting thoughts.

http://www.montrealgazette.com/sport...720/story.html

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11-26-2012, 01:49 PM
  #906
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Meantime Puck Daddy was giving Mario the business about moving into his "hovel" of a $20M home in Quebec. Never too early for populist jabs.

http://www.strathmorestandard.com/20...tremblant-home

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11-26-2012, 03:32 PM
  #907
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But how can he afford that when he's losing money every year!?!?!

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11-26-2012, 03:57 PM
  #908
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Mario is such a bourgeoisie *******. How dare he be successful in his career and with his business ventures. Capitalist pig to the max.

#Occupy 66


Last edited by Sivek: 11-26-2012 at 05:03 PM.
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11-26-2012, 04:10 PM
  #909
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chancellor Vitale View Post
The owners could turn this whole thing into a giant legal war, possibly ending the league as we know it because of the costs involved.
*fingers crossed*

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11-26-2012, 04:26 PM
  #910
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The owners obviously make their big bucks outside of hockey or in Mario's case during his playing career. Their big houses and rich lifestyles aren't necessarily a reflection of how much money their teams are making. Although the Pens with their new arena and a number of large market teams do probably make some decent money but some teams don't and I suppose that's the problem.

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11-26-2012, 04:27 PM
  #911
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The deal for that house was in the works years ago.

And maybe I'm missing something but I don't see how this is even news, anyway. I don't have a side in this mess since I think both parties are completely wrong-headed. But if this non-story constitutes some sort of pro-PA talking point... then they are in much worse shape than I imagined.

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Old
11-26-2012, 04:54 PM
  #912
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Mario's house isn't news. Puck Daddy basically finds about two dozen blurbs a day to update people on random stuff so he's going to be grasping for straws on some stuff just based on the fact there isn't much going on from day to day.

I brought it up because I thought it was kind of funny. Maybe if we ever get back to playing and the playoffs, we can use Mario's mansion in the avatar. "Uncle Gary's Revenue Sharing Plan"


Meanwhile in the Bat Cave... US Mediators being dragged into the fray. Didn't work last time, won't work this time. I honestly don't get the point of a non-binding mediator. At that point it becomes a tool for both sides to say "see we tried everything; it's their fault!"

http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=410329

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11-26-2012, 05:02 PM
  #913
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Really feel this is going to be the week that either leads to the cancelling of the season or salvaging it. If the big meetings that are supposed to take place this week (Wednesday?) don't lead to serious common ground, I'm done keeping tabs at what's going on.

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Old
11-26-2012, 05:24 PM
  #914
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Hook View Post
The owners obviously make their big bucks outside of hockey or in Mario's case during his playing career. Their big houses and rich lifestyles aren't necessarily a reflection of how much money their teams are making. Although the Pens with their new arena and a number of large market teams do probably make some decent money but some teams don't and I suppose that's the problem.
Iirc the Pens lost about 0.7 mil in the most recent season.

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11-26-2012, 06:01 PM
  #915
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Originally Posted by DyerMaker66 View Post
Iirc the Pens lost about 0.7 mil in the most recent season.
I bet they were still cash flow positive. Owners can depreciate the purchase price of their franchise over the course of 15 years. That's a non cash 'cost' of ~$6.5 million.

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11-26-2012, 07:21 PM
  #916
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Hook View Post
The owners obviously make their big bucks outside of hockey or in Mario's case during his playing career. Their big houses and rich lifestyles aren't necessarily a reflection of how much money their teams are making. Although the Pens with their new arena and a number of large market teams do probably make some decent money but some teams don't and I suppose that's the problem.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlindWillyMcHurt View Post
The deal for that house was in the works years ago.

And maybe I'm missing something but I don't see how this is even news, anyway. I don't have a side in this mess since I think both parties are completely wrong-headed. But if this non-story constitutes some sort of pro-PA talking point... then they are in much worse shape than I imagined.
Try explaining that on the business board and see how far you get. People don't seem to realize that an owner's personal bank account is a bit different than that of the team, esp since Mario is a minority owner.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Chancellor Vitale View Post
Some thoughts that suggest this whole thing is being run by losers like Leonsis and Liepold, who can't figure out how to make a profit in a good hockey market, with full arenas... while the bigtime owners making money (Jacobs aside) are on the sidelines doing nothing.

Not sure how reliable this reporter or paper is but interesting thoughts.

http://www.montrealgazette.com/sport...720/story.html


That article is a bit strange. It makes a pity party out of Montreal & Toronto even though I believe Burke has been in the room for the league on a few occasions and Molson saying "he and other owners are being kept informed of the situation and that he has confidence in commissioner Gary Bettman and his small inner circle of owners.".


Sounds like even if they're not at the table, they're just as involved as the "losers" Leopold & Leonsis.


Also, Pat Hickey is the guy who called out Theo Fleury for being a hypocrite for being silent after his sexual abuse.




Finally, this may seem bad, and I'm definitely glad the players are raising money for charities and awareness, but I really no interest in the games themselves.


Last edited by KaylaJ: 11-26-2012 at 08:10 PM.
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Old
11-26-2012, 08:37 PM
  #917
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Originally Posted by Sideline View Post
I bet they were still cash flow positive. Owners can depreciate the purchase price of their franchise over the course of 15 years. That's a non cash 'cost' of ~$6.5 million.
I'm willing to bet you're right.

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Old
11-27-2012, 11:06 AM
  #918
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I could be way off, admittedly, but it seems to me that the fundamental issue is that the owners are trying to force the players to bail out the struggling franchises. I don't blame the players at all for fighting that.

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Old
11-27-2012, 11:33 AM
  #919
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KaylaJ View Post
That article is a bit strange. It makes a pity party out of Montreal & Toronto
In my quick reading of it yesterday I more interpreted as "guys like Molson and other big money owners who have some sway need to get involved and push the extreme agendas of Jacobs, Leonsis et al more to the middle, instead of just saying 'i trust whatever Gary and that small group of owners is doing'." IOW, they don't care because they're going to make big bank either way, so they're not trying to use their influence (when necessary) to say "hey what we're demanding here and here is unreasonable, let's find a better way to manage that situation so we can get a deal done."

Basically the owners that constantly bleed money when they have no excuse for doing so (bad management practices), shouldn't put the onus on covering those contingencies or costs, on the players. If you're in a good hockey market, selling lots of seats every year... you should be making money, period. If you're not, don't blame the players for your mismanagement (including stupid contracts, Liarpold).

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11-27-2012, 11:58 AM
  #920
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Crosby weighed in on Hamrlik saying Jehova:

Quote:
"They have a right to state what they think and...to be honest, to get 750 guys to have the exact same outlook on every single detail it's pretty tough and pretty much impossible. But I think a good chunk of the guys realize what's going on and I think if you look at Roman Hamrlik's situation, this is his third lockout. He's probably got a couple years left of playing in his mind and for this to be happening, I'm sure he's beyond frustrated, I think everyone's got that right."
Typical Sid-speak. He also sounds pretty frustrated by the crawling pace of negotiations, more than actually being mad at the league.

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Old
11-27-2012, 12:14 PM
  #921
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Crosby weighed in on Hamrlik saying Jehova:



Typical Sid-speak. He also sounds pretty frustrated by the crawling pace of negotiations, more than actually being mad at the league.
Bu I love that he said it that way. He doesn't come off as an uneducated idiot like most players. He actually puts himself in Romans shoes.

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Old
11-27-2012, 12:37 PM
  #922
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Yah. If you want Sid-speak, check out the Lockout Distraction thread. Epic Sid-isms.

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11-27-2012, 01:06 PM
  #923
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And compare those word to that of Ovechkin. I am so glad we have a superstar like Sid and not Ovechkin.

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Old
11-27-2012, 02:39 PM
  #924
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Hook View Post
The owners obviously make their big bucks outside of hockey or in Mario's case during his playing career. Their big houses and rich lifestyles aren't necessarily a reflection of how much money their teams are making. Although the Pens with their new arena and a number of large market teams do probably make some decent money but some teams don't and I suppose that's the problem.
Penguins barely break even (if not take small loses). And if that's not a sign that the economics need to be changed, I don't know what is.

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11-27-2012, 03:27 PM
  #925
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Originally Posted by PensFanSince1989 View Post
Penguins barely break even (if not take small loses). And if that's not a sign that the economics need to be changed, I don't know what is.
Accounting losses are not the same as economic. I have my doubts that they are literally losing cash or are breaking even on a cash basis. Either way, I agree that the economics need to be changed.

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