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Lockout thread #2: mediation done - no progress

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Old
11-27-2012, 11:16 AM
  #826
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Originally Posted by s7ark View Post
I have a question about decertification. If the union does that, it would mean the NHL draft is illegal. Since Seth Jones is 18, could Katz go to Portland and offer them a chuck of cash to buy out Jones and sign him here?

Oh and I am in support of expanding 2 more teams. I dont' see why it would mean 4th line enforcers get more ice time. It would probably just draw more European players who prefer their home country to the AHL back into the mix.
I heard on the radio yesterday that if there is no cba there can/will be no draft.

It would likely be cancelled and pushed back until there is a new cba like they did in 04/05.

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11-27-2012, 11:18 AM
  #827
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Just throwing it out, but does more teams equal more advertisement money and bigger TV deals?
Possibly in the right markets. But likely not if the new teams are in Mississippi and Oklahoma.

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11-27-2012, 11:19 AM
  #828
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Oh and I am in support of expanding 2 more teams. I dont' see why it would mean 4th line enforcers get more ice time. It would probably just draw more European players who prefer their home country to the AHL back into the mix.
Wouldn't mean more ice-time just mean more jobs for them. The talent pool is diluted enough already. So while yeah more euros might come back so to speak I don't think all 46 jobs would be taken up by them.

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11-27-2012, 12:23 PM
  #829
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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
I heard on the radio yesterday that if there is no cba there can/will be no draft.

It would likely be cancelled and pushed back until there is a new cba like they did in 04/05.
If the union decertifies, then there can't be a draft. It would violate antitrust laws. Unless they recertified and signed an agreement.

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Wouldn't mean more ice-time just mean more jobs for them. The talent pool is diluted enough already. So while yeah more euros might come back so to speak I don't think all 46 jobs would be taken up by them.
The same arguments were brought up the last time there was expansion. Sure it would dilute the pool for a bit, but more players would step in shortly and it would be fine after a couple of years. I am certain many 1st and 2nd line SEL and KHL players would jump at the chance to play 2nd or 3rd line in the NHL.

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11-27-2012, 12:41 PM
  #830
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Originally Posted by s7ark View Post
I have a question about decertification. If the union does that, it would mean the NHL draft is illegal. Since Seth Jones is 18, could Katz go to Portland and offer them a chuck of cash to buy out Jones and sign him here?
Yes, I believe that in the case of decertification, there is no longer any "artificial" rules that exist between players and teams. Each team would be a separate entity expected to compete against the other 29 other teams with no restrictions. Contracts would still be in effect however. But there would be no draft, no restricted free agency, no qualifying offers, no compensation for RFAs, no RFAs, everyone would be a free agent.

But then on the other side, there would also be no paid expenses like airflight travel, hotel accomodations, physiotherapy and medical expenses, equipment expenses, etc. Everything and anything that isn't expressed in players contract is no longer covered.

I believe that you are correct on katz offering a dump of cash for Seth Jones, but then any team could do the same thing. In fact, there is nothing restricting any team from signing contracts to any players, regardless of age. So the Toronto Maple Leafs for example, could go out and sign every single ranked player from age 14 (or younger) and up if they so wished to do so.

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11-27-2012, 12:43 PM
  #831
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Originally Posted by s7ark View Post
If the union decertifies, then there can't be a draft. It would violate antitrust laws. Unless they recertified and signed an agreement.
True, but that's a different situation.

No CBA agreed does not necessarily mean decertification. Currently there is no CBA (it expired) but the union is still certified. A draft could theoretically still occur but probably won't until a new CBA is signed.

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11-27-2012, 01:07 PM
  #832
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Can we please stop calling these jokers a union?

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11-27-2012, 01:08 PM
  #833
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They are not a union. They steal peoples jobs lol.

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11-27-2012, 01:12 PM
  #834
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Yeah they are only "unified" when it comes to their own matters, however when it comes to looking out for themselves currently they jump at the opportunity to play in Europre for the time being.

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11-27-2012, 01:16 PM
  #835
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I just picture the mediation as basically sitting them in a circle and asking every one there name, why they love hockey and what they want out of this.

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11-27-2012, 01:21 PM
  #836
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They should ask for what they think they deserve and we luv em, but man these guys are hypocrites.

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11-27-2012, 01:23 PM
  #837
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Quote:
Originally Posted by okgooil View Post
I just picture the mediation as basically sitting them in a circle and asking every one there name, why they love hockey and what they want out of this.
Hi I'm Gary Bettman...and I like to party.
Hi I'm Bill Daly...and I also like to party

Hi I'm Donald Fehr...and I like to party more than those guys.
Hi I'm Steve Fehr...and we party way harder than those guys

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11-27-2012, 01:44 PM
  #838
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Originally Posted by Reimer View Post
Hi I'm Gary Bettman...and I like to party.
Hi I'm Bill Daly...and I also like to party

Hi I'm Donald Fehr...and I like to party more than those guys.
Hi I'm Steve Fehr...and we party way harder than those guys
mediator "ok guys this isnt' about who parties more or less"

Bettman "well thats good casue there is no way Donald could shot gun a beer as fast as me"

Fehr "oh really, is that a bet?"

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11-27-2012, 01:54 PM
  #839
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Fehrs - "nobody wants to watch you shotgun a beer"

Daly+Bettman - "we paid for the beer"

/stalemate

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11-27-2012, 01:59 PM
  #840
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Originally Posted by nabob View Post
No to two more teams. The talent pool is watered down too much already. 80% of regular season games are boring enough as it is.
The talent pool is far deeper now than it was when there were fewer teams. It's not even really close. That's part of what drags out a lot of regular season games. Defensive systems and more parity among the players, harder for skill to stand out.

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11-27-2012, 04:12 PM
  #841
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Sakich View Post
Fehrs - "nobody wants to watch you shotgun a beer"

Daly+Bettman - "we paid for the beer"

/stalemate
I imagine it would go like this


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11-27-2012, 04:21 PM
  #842
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Dumb and Dumber and Dumbest..........

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Old
11-27-2012, 05:58 PM
  #843
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Originally Posted by BlueChip01 View Post
Can we please stop calling these jokers a union?
They act exactly like any union I have ever seen very closely.

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Old
11-27-2012, 06:07 PM
  #844
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Quote:
Originally Posted by s7ark View Post
I have a question about decertification. If the union does that, it would mean the NHL draft is illegal. Since Seth Jones is 18, could Katz go to Portland and offer them a chuck of cash to buy out Jones and sign him here?

Oh and I am in support of expanding 2 more teams. I dont' see why it would mean 4th line enforcers get more ice time. It would probably just draw more European players who prefer their home country to the AHL back into the mix.
In the current lockout situation there would simply be no draft until the lockout ends and a new cba is signed in the situation your talking about (decertification) i don't know what would happen to the prospects I believe they could simply go to the highest bidder however i'm not sure that's what would actually happen because that would just be stupid. With no cba and a decertyified union that means no rules no entry level contracts so wouldn't teams like the rangers be able to offer long and big money contracts to these guys ? Maybe the owners will agree not to sign anyone until the situation is resolved. Wouldn't decertification be a temporary thing like just a step in the process towards a cba, i'm not sure

Either way here is a part of a article that was posted earlier in this thread

" The purpose of decertifying would be to eliminate Bettman's negotiating partner. Without a functioning PA, it’s the players’ hope that an owners’ lockout would be deemed illegal and instantly lifted. Dissolving the unions also dissolves the salary cap, linkage, escrow, salary arbitration, rookie cap, you name it. The owners could argue decertifying jeopardizes existing contracts. But some owners, such as the Pittsburgh Penguins’ Mario Lemieux or Los Angeles Kings’ Philip Anschutz, might not like the idea of losing Sidney Crosby to the Rangers or Jonathan Quick to the Leafs when hockey finally returns, and the players would obviously argue they have valid contracts that should be honoured.

You can forget the NHL draft as well. Projected top picks Nathan McKinnon and Seth Jones would simply go to the highest bidder. With the exception of unrestricted free agency, everything else would be deemed illegal in the eyes of the courts. When sports deals are negotiated in good faith, it’s called a CBA. When they aren't, it’s called price fixing. Price fixing leads to accusations of antitrust, and antitrust is a word that doesn't make any billionaire sports-club owner feel warm and fuzzy."

Word of nick kypreos

Link: http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl-l..._gary_bettman/

Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueChip01 View Post
Can we please stop calling these jokers a union?
Your right it's not a union it's an association

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Old
11-27-2012, 11:37 PM
  #845
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I didn't know where to put this.

Quote:
Bruce Arthur ‏@bruce_arthur
Glendale city council approves a $320-million, 20-year arena deal for the Coyotes. Good luck with it, everyone.
Quote:
Bruce Arthur ‏@bruce_arthur
Glendale mayor Elaine Scruggs says the city has less than zero in its general fund, which seems relevant.
Quote:
John Shannon ‏@JSportsnet
Greg Jamison and his group get their lease approved for the arena. The Coyotes ownership situation will now be resolved in next 60 days.
Laughable stuff. And here we are fretting about the future of the Edmonton Oilers in Edmonton. Oh right, new arena with fancy amenities. I forgot.

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11-28-2012, 02:18 AM
  #846
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Moonlapse Vertigo View Post
I didn't know where to put this.







Laughable stuff. And here we are fretting about the future of the Edmonton Oilers in Edmonton. Oh right, new arena with fancy amenities. I forgot.
So the coyotes are staying in phoenix, well they better start attracting more fans its teams like the yotes that contribute to overall crappy league Profit. People complain about the pa and say players should take less because so many teams aren't even profiting, well maybe the league should do more to fix that problem i'm usually not in favor of relocating teams but maybe the teams that are losing the most should be moved

Anyway best of like to the yotes they're definitely a team i don't dislike

Meeting should happen tomorrow both sides and mediators this should take a couple days i believe they are keeping the location secret so no media might be wrong on that though lets hope something good comes from this we are in a critical phase of this lockout

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11-28-2012, 03:24 AM
  #847
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Originally Posted by Moonlapse Vertigo View Post
I didn't know where to put this.

Laughable stuff. And here we are fretting about the future of the Edmonton Oilers in Edmonton. Oh right, new arena with fancy amenities. I forgot.
Holy crap, great news for the Coyotes fans, but how are the non NHL fans feeling about this?

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11-28-2012, 06:24 AM
  #848
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Originally Posted by devils4cup View Post
I imagine it would go like this

Is there a whole movie out there as lame as that sequence was? Glad I missed it.

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11-28-2012, 07:15 AM
  #849
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Originally Posted by Bryanbryoil View Post
Holy crap, great news for the Coyotes fans, but how are the non NHL fans feeling about this?
This may not be over yet.

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11-28-2012, 10:28 AM
  #850
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Originally Posted by Bryanbryoil View Post
Holy crap, great news for the Coyotes fans, but how are the non NHL fans feeling about this?
****, how about the PA and it's members. How do they feel about that? They know that's a sinking ship and is a place that doesn't generate much revenue. If they knew that team was going to QC would they possible feel better about the future revenue numbers?

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