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Lockout thread #2: mediation done - no progress

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Old
11-28-2012, 10:29 AM
  #851
Reimer
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Originally Posted by ponokanocker View Post
They act exactly like any union I have ever seen very closely.
So most unions you see the members go and obtain another job until a new agreement is made with their current employer?

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11-28-2012, 10:45 AM
  #852
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So most unions you see the members go and obtain another job until a new agreement is made with their current employer?
Also, most unions don't have members who are willing to give up millions of dollars of lost wages (individually) so they can role play as downtrodden proletariat.

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11-28-2012, 11:23 AM
  #853
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****it, I think I may take a trip down to PHX next winter. Golf, Oilers, and maybe get myself a new tattoo. Sounds like a nice mid winter get away.

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11-28-2012, 11:38 AM
  #854
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****it, I think I may take a trip down to PHX next winter. Golf, Oilers, and maybe get myself a new tattoo. Sounds like a nice mid winter get away.
probably all for about the same price as just taking in an Oilers game in Edmonton to boot!

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11-28-2012, 01:48 PM
  #855
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A great feature about Marvin Miller and the birth of professional sport's labour movement. While the NHL was colluding with Alan Eagleson to cheat their labour force (aka golden goose) Miller was running ruckshaw over a group of ill-equipped greedy owners to reshape the standards of working conditions and ability for players to maximize their earning potential free from a collusive environment.

http://www.slate.com/articles/sports...he.single.html

A sign of respect between adversaries: Faye Vincent pays tribute to Marvin Miller:
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/11/28/sp...fame.html?_r=0

It's a shame the NHL has not learned from lessons learned elsewhere.

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11-28-2012, 02:38 PM
  #856
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Originally Posted by Behind Enemy Lines View Post
A great feature about Marvin Miller and the birth of professional sport's labour movement. While the NHL was colluding with Alan Eagleson to cheat their labour force (aka golden goose) Miller was running ruckshaw over a group of ill-equipped greedy owners to reshape the standards of working conditions and ability for players to maximize their earning potential free from a collusive environment.

http://www.slate.com/articles/sports...he.single.html



A sign of respect between adversaries: Faye Vincent pays tribute to Marvin Miller:
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/11/28/sp...fame.html?_r=0

It's a shame the NHL has not learned from lessons learned elsewhere.

It's easy to show respect when the ****ers dead.

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11-28-2012, 03:31 PM
  #857
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****, how about the PA and it's members. How do they feel about that? They know that's a sinking ship and is a place that doesn't generate much revenue. If they knew that team was going to QC would they possible feel better about the future revenue numbers?
The players are fine with it. Fantastic weather.

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11-28-2012, 04:14 PM
  #858
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The meeting started a couple hours ago and will likely extend into tomorrow

@reporterchris: Mediation session between NHL and NHLPA is well underway. There's a feeling it might carry over to tomorrow.

Good chance nothing happens i'm still hoping something good comes from this though hard to say what happens after mediation fails does decertification come next

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11-28-2012, 06:21 PM
  #859
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@Real_ESPNLeBrun: NHL/NHLPA mediation meeting is done for the day. They are meeting again tomorrow.

No word on what happen just yet we may not learn much til tomorrow for whatever its worth i think the meeting was over 5 hours

@Real_ESPNLeBrun: Most of today saw NHL and NHLPA separated from each other in different meetings each with mediators. Which was as expected.

@reporterchris: In statement, Don Fehr says a small group of NHLPA staff and players were part of today's mediation session.


Last edited by 402: 11-28-2012 at 07:14 PM.
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11-28-2012, 09:25 PM
  #860
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so I wonder if they are splitting the cost of the mediators 50/50?

Or do the owners have to pay 100% like every other expense?

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11-29-2012, 12:22 AM
  #861
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The longer this draws on, the more ridiculous it becomes. Cory Schnieder who is his teams rep is off to Europe now? If Fehr isn't collecting his pay cheque to show solidarity to the players, why are players directly connected to this going and playing in Europe. The players act like they give a crap about the other guys but have no problem going off to find work elsewhere. If they're desperate to play and get paid, sit down and iron out a deal.

I'm glad major sponsors are publicly ripping the NHL now. I hope a group of them come out and say if no deal is done by December 15th, that they are pulling their brands and their sponsorships.

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11-29-2012, 04:20 PM
  #862
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Looks like that's it for mediation. Anyone surprised?

Chris Johnston ‏@reporterchris

Daly: "After spending several hours with both sides over two days, the presiding mediators concluded that the parties remained far apart."

Next up for the PA?

Elliotte Friedman ‏@FriedgeHNIC
Looks like next stop will be NHLPA Disclaimer of Interest, meaning Fehr no longer represents players. Similar to decertifying, but faster.

Edit: One more development.

Darren Dreger ‏@DarrenDreger

Bettman proposed to Fehr and PA an owner-payer mtng only. No NHL or NHLPA brass. Fehr and PA are believed to be considering.

Seems interesting. I wonder what they'd hope to accomplish there.


Last edited by RipsADrive: 11-29-2012 at 04:29 PM.
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11-29-2012, 04:32 PM
  #863
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Originally Posted by Reimer View Post
So most unions you see the members go and obtain another job until a new agreement is made with their current employer?
In Fort Mac they sure do. I know one guy who was on strike up here with Finning about 5 years ago, who paid some Filipino guy to stand at the strike line for him when he needed to and worked as a blackjack dealer until they went back.

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11-29-2012, 04:37 PM
  #864
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Not that i think it's going to happen, but if players and owners figure this out on their own, then do Fehr, Fehr, Bettman and Daly get canned?

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11-29-2012, 04:43 PM
  #865
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Interesting if they do decertify. Players would sue for damages, most notably the superstars if they follow the same path as the NFL.

Would Sidney Crosby then sue owner Mario Lemieux, a man who billeted him at his house when he first joined the organization for triple damages?

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11-29-2012, 04:44 PM
  #866
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Originally Posted by joestevens29 View Post
Not that i think it's going to happen, but if players and owners figure this out on their own, then do Fehr, Fehr, Bettman and Daly get canned?
You're dreaming.

No chance Bettman or Daly gets fired.

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11-29-2012, 04:46 PM
  #867
joestevens29
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Originally Posted by Master Lok View Post
Interesting if they do decertify. Players would sue for damages, most notably the superstars if they follow the same path as the NFL.

Would Sidney Crosby then sue owner Mario Lemieux, a man who billeted him at his house when he first joined the organization for triple damages?
Probably slept with his daughter, so is it really any worse?

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11-29-2012, 05:05 PM
  #868
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What a joke....

I understand the players pride in all this but c'mon guys, your beat and you know it, Bettman knows it, hell even Fehr knows it! Take the offer and start making money again...

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Old
11-29-2012, 05:11 PM
  #869
Jimmi McJenkins
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I have ZERO labour law experience or knowledge, however I would find it spectacularly hilarious if they NHLPA did use the "Disclaimer of Interest", and that BS was called out by the Canadian courts, how much of a mess would that make for the Association then.

Seriously though, get a deal done or get some ****ing replacement players, because this is getting beyond ****ing stupid.

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11-29-2012, 05:12 PM
  #870
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Here's the full statement drom nhl deputy idiot bill daly

"Today, we concluded two days of mediation with FMCS mediators and representatives of the NHL Players' Association. After spending several hours with both sides over two days, the presiding mediators concluded that the parties remained far apart, and that no progress toward a resolution could be made through further mediation at this point in time. We are disappointed that the mediation process was not successful."

What's next looks like a players and owners only meeting without guys like d. fehr s. fehr b. daly and g. bettman
No word on when or if that will actually happened it would be interesting but i doubt it leads to a deal
Today is day 75 of the lockout

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Old
11-29-2012, 05:22 PM
  #871
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i would have to take a look at the SPC closely again but i am pretty sure the SPC of the NHL specifically states that the contract evaporates if there is no successor CBA and that the contract will be held by the terms and conditions of the successor CBA. Thus I believe should the PA de-certify Bettmans clause will make all contracts null and therefor no lawsuits as nothing would be carried over.
Also with no Union i am pretty sure the NHL could very quickly centralize their business and contracts through the NHL, since no contracts would be left in existence. By de-certifying i am pretty sure the players would lose all their leverage.

I have even heard Bettman state it for the record that the SPC clearly states that its value, upon the current(now past) CBA expiring will be determined and bound by the successor, and that under the clause in the SPC both parties agree that with no CBA the contract is void.

Every player signed this contract.

Decertify= no collective bargaining = no CBA = contracts voided as per agreement signed in legal document = no lawsuits = no pay check = league with no union to have to agree with = league centralizing = league using players running off to KHL etc as proof the NHL is not a monopoly...and can lower wages to KHL numbers. = Bettman signing players and assigning them to a franchise. = take it or leave it offers.

oh yeah and bye bye pension...bye bye benefits... hello seeing players in regular hospital wait rooms.

could be glorious.

This should get interesting


Last edited by oilinblood: 11-29-2012 at 05:29 PM.
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Old
11-29-2012, 05:26 PM
  #872
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I just wanna crawl into a hole and die right now. This is beyond stupid, and makes my head hurt. Why these spoiled babies work it out?

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11-29-2012, 05:32 PM
  #873
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I just wanna crawl into a hole and die right now. This is beyond stupid, and makes my head hurt. Why these spoiled babies work it out?
when it is all said and done it is a crying shame. Just think, there are empty rinks where screaming fans could be giving up their money to cheer on people playing a game. Yet, these rinks are emtpy. Just the pure stupidity of it makes my heart ache and head hurt.

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Old
11-29-2012, 05:54 PM
  #874
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Amazing Tweet.

Quote:
Shaun Deering ‏@deeds82
@bruce_arthur Flanders: Well, I guess we'll have to agree to disagree Krabappel: I don't agree to that Skinner: Me Neither @NHL @NHLPA

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11-29-2012, 05:59 PM
  #875
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At this point I am just totally and utterly disappointed to say the least. I have completely lost any respect for the players in this game. These guys are suppose to be the classiest athletes in sports but are proving that to be untrue. CFL players make very average salaries, risk major injury every game, careers are short, and have never had a lock out in 100 years. These guys get my respect.....playing a game they love to make a "living".

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