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Old
11-28-2012, 07:56 AM
  #101
nmbr_24
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Originally Posted by AJMHABS View Post
Because Backstrom is a top 10 center in the league currently.

The Caps play bad when he is out of the lineup, as proven last year.

And Boston won't do either if they have to include Hamilton, forgot to iclude that in my post above.
I don't think Boston does it without Hamilton, nevermind with him. With Hamilton included it is ridiculously bad for Boston.

By your name I am guessing you are a Habs fan, would you trade Plekanec, Pacioretty, Beaulieu, and a 1st for Backstrom and Chimera? That could be less than what you are saying it would take to make it a fair deal if I am not mistaken.

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11-28-2012, 08:00 AM
  #102
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Krejci + Marchand for Backstrom is terrible value for Boston. And you say ADD Hamilton???

Krejci
Marchand
Hamilton

for

Backstrom

?? Thats just ridiculous!!!

Add Ovechkin & its a deal

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Old
11-28-2012, 08:21 AM
  #103
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Originally Posted by nmbr_24 View Post
I don't think Boston does it without Hamilton, nevermind with him. With Hamilton included it is ridiculously bad for Boston.

By your name I am guessing you are a Habs fan, would you trade Plekanec, Pacioretty, Beaulieu, and a 1st for Backstrom and Chimera? That could be less than what you are saying it would take to make it a fair deal if I am not mistaken.
No because it sucks for the Habs, but not so much as compared to the Bruins with Hamilton. Beaulieu is not on the same level as Hamilton, and adding Backstrom would make the Habs a bit better, but losing Patches would sting a lot.

I see you point. It would be a bad deal for Boston as well.

TBH I kind of skimmed through the deal and thought Boston also got Forsberg in the deal. My bad, it's been a long night.


Last edited by AJMHABS: 11-28-2012 at 08:45 AM.
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Old
11-28-2012, 08:32 AM
  #104
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I think it's funny how everyone is claiming that Backstrom is underrated here. What about Krejci? The guy gets thrown into almost every Bruins proposal. He's a consistent 60 point guy that plays 2 way hockey. He is a proven playoff performer, (see 47 points in 59 games, and the 2011 playoffs as reference). Ask Flyers fans; he's murdered their team in the playoffs the past few seasons; and they keyed on him each time (taking him out of the series one year). Don't be fooled, if Krejci doesn't get hurt, the Bruins don't lose 4 straight in 2010!!
I'll concede that the regular season Backstrom is much better than the regular season Krejci; but the playoff versions are much closer (career stats don't lie).

And then apparently not nearly enough love for how much better Marchand is than Chimera. Chimera is 33 and had a career season at 20 goals last year. Marchand is 23 years old and has broke 20 goals in both of his only 2 NHL seasons; plus he is one of the best agitators in the game (a guy that every other fan base can't stand but is adored by his own fans). Moving Marchand would also be a very bad PR move for Boston.

As a Bruins fan, I don't make this trade; but think the value is much more fair than it's being made out.

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11-28-2012, 09:10 AM
  #105
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I think Backstrom has developed fantastic leadership abilities throughout his career. Something Krejci, from what I've seen (and I watch a lot of Bruin games), doesn't have playing on a team with fantastic leaders like Lucic, Chara, Bergeron and Thomas.

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11-28-2012, 10:01 AM
  #106
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I think Backstrom has developed fantastic leadership abilities throughout his career. Something Krejci, from what I've seen (and I watch a lot of Bruin games), doesn't have playing on a team with fantastic leaders like Lucic, Chara, Bergeron and Thomas.
Really? Krejci "lead" the Bruins to a Stanley Cup in 2011, as their top line center, as the NHL's top playoff scorer. THAT'S leadership..

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11-28-2012, 10:44 AM
  #107
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if you would really rather have krejci or bergeron than backstrom. cool. caps will keep backstrom and everybody will be happy.

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11-28-2012, 10:46 AM
  #108
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One star player and Chimera for two good, but not greats? Pass bigtime from Washington.

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Old
11-28-2012, 10:50 AM
  #109
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if you would really rather have krejci or bergeron than backstrom. cool. caps will keep backstrom and everybody will be happy.
It's not really Krejci or Bergeron over Backstrom, you need to add Chimera, Marchand and a 1st in there as well.

What would you rather have, 3 dimes or a quarter? If you are only going to have one, you want the quarter, if you want the most money you take the 3 dimes.

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Old
11-28-2012, 10:51 AM
  #110
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I can see why Washington fans are getting their panties in a knot here. BUT i dont get why Boston would trade the two forwards that carried the offense during their stanley cup run.

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11-28-2012, 10:53 AM
  #111
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Originally Posted by HockeyGuruPitka View Post
I can see why Washington fans are getting their panties in a knot here. BUT i dont get why Boston would trade the two forwards that carried the offense during their stanley cup run.
I don't think they would.

Stranger things have happened, but I doubt either team is looking to trade these players.

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11-28-2012, 11:03 AM
  #112
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Originally Posted by HockeyGuruPitka View Post
I can see why Washington fans are getting their panties in a knot here. BUT i dont get why Boston would trade the two forwards that carried the offense during their stanley cup run.
i dont think they would either. this trade is a non starter. ive heard some chatter that boston might trade krejci at one point or another and i assumed that was contract based.

backstrom is under contract forever. the caps have no interest in trading him even for an unrealistic haul.

now....chimera i could see as a bruin at some point. i think his game fits what boston does nicely. not that the caps are unhappy with him in anyway.

most trade thread suggestions have no basis in reality even if the overall value is decent.

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Old
11-28-2012, 04:22 PM
  #113
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what team are you watching? washington has an extremely passive defensive system, id say washington's system limits offence more than the bruins does
Am I missing something? Washington was a run & gun team until Hunter took over as coach, right?

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11-28-2012, 04:33 PM
  #114
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I doubt there's a single player on the Bruins roster that could convince Wahington to give up Backstrom. Chara is the only one with equivalent talent, but he's a decade older.
Ummm...Tyler Seguin?

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11-28-2012, 04:37 PM
  #115
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Originally Posted by bp13 View Post
Ummm...Tyler Seguin?
This.

I doubt Washington would do a 1 for 1, but that would be a damn good starting point..

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Old
11-28-2012, 05:39 PM
  #116
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Originally Posted by Oates2Neely View Post
Nobody is debating wether or not Backstrom is elite, everybody agrees he is.

The debate is wether he would maintain his point totals in a defensive system. It's been 2 years since Backstrom broke 70 points, is that a coincidence that thats when Washington switched from "agressive" offense, to a more restricted offense? No, clearly Backstrom struggled with the adjustment as his points show. As did Ovechkin.

There's no telling what Oates will impliment this season, most likely he will let Backstrom & Ovechkin roam freely & use their offensive talents.
Yes. His points dropped off because he had a broken thumb and a concussion. When he was healthy and used to the scheme his production returned to normal despite the scheme. How are you not getting this?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Killer B View Post
Am I missing something? Washington was a run & gun team until Hunter took over as coach, right?
No. As I and several other Caps fans have said in this very thread, Boudreau switched to a defensive system during our 8 game losing streak in December of 2010. It wasn't as extreme as Hunter's system, but it did have a dramatic effect on the Caps' offensive production as a whole. The Caps were scoring at a 3.46 GPG rate prior to that losing streak, and dropped to a 2.30 the rest of the way.

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Old
11-28-2012, 06:09 PM
  #117
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Originally Posted by Oates2Neely View Post
Really? Krejci "lead" the Bruins to a Stanley Cup in 2011, as their top line center, as the NHL's top playoff scorer. THAT'S leadership..
He was at best the 4th most important Bruin in the postseason behind Thomas, Chara and Bergeron (totally shutdown the Canucks). I might even be inclined to say that Seidenberg was more important.

I get your point that Krejci is underrated, but seriously, the original deal vastly favors the Bruins. They'd do it in a heartbeat.

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Old
11-28-2012, 06:13 PM
  #118
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Originally Posted by Killer B View Post
You switch the 2 players and Krecji's number will go up (particularly his assist totals) and
Backstrom's number decline.

That's my opinion...
And I agreed with that. Saying that Krejci is close to Backstrom's value is what I found ridiculous.

You are entitled to your opinion, but I am as well, and that's mine.

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11-28-2012, 06:14 PM
  #119
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Originally Posted by nmbr_24 View Post
It's not really Krejci or Bergeron over Backstrom, you need to add Chimera, Marchand and a 1st in there as well.

What would you rather have, 3 dimes or a quarter? If you are only going to have one, you want the quarter, if you want the most money you take the 3 dimes.
Flawed logic because dimes (in this case) are much more plentiful and easily obtained. An 80pt player is more than 2x valuable than a 40 pt player because there were 9 players that scored 80 or more pts last year, but 157 players who scored 40 or more. Thus, it's easier for a team to add a dime than it is a quarter. So while they may be trading away dimes, by adding the quarter they can easily add another dime and another nicked through other methods and end up having 40 cents to 30 cents for 3 players.

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11-28-2012, 06:15 PM
  #120
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Originally Posted by nmbr_24 View Post
It's not really Krejci or Bergeron over Backstrom, you need to add Chimera, Marchand and a 1st in there as well.

What would you rather have, 3 dimes or a quarter? If you are only going to have one, you want the quarter, if you want the most money you take the 3 dimes.
So you'd trade us Chara for Chimera, Beagle, Ward, Perreault, Hendricks, Schultz, and Neuvirth?

That's a lot of nickels after all.

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11-28-2012, 06:16 PM
  #121
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Ummm...Tyler Seguin?
Not one for one.

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Old
11-28-2012, 06:16 PM
  #122
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Am I missing something? Washington was a run & gun team until Hunter took over as coach, right?
no....season before last the caps were 19th in goals for and 4th in goals against. its easy to look up. the cap trap was what that was about.

hunter went to the extreme which was sitting on every one goal lead the team got. it meant skating his checking line first line minutes and leaving ovechkin and company on the bench for 3rd period power plays.

the caps were so defensive that they were not permitted to attempt to score into the empty net at the end of games.

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11-28-2012, 06:16 PM
  #123
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Originally Posted by bp13 View Post
Ummm...Tyler Seguin?
Doesn't get you Backstrom in a straight up deal right now. Now I can buy the argument that in a couple years Seguin MAY be better than Backstrom (though that's arguable), right now it's not even close.

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Old
11-28-2012, 06:20 PM
  #124
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Originally Posted by txpd View Post
no....season before last the caps were 19th in goals for and 4th in goals against. its easy to look up. the cap trap was what that was about.

hunter went to the extreme which was sitting on every one goal lead the team got. it meant skating his checking line first line minutes and leaving ovechkin and company on the bench for 3rd period power plays.

the caps were so defensive that they were not permitted to attempt to score into the empty net at the end of games.
In that season (2 years ago) Washington gave up the 9th fewest shots in the league, Boston gave up the 2nd most. Now clearly there's more to defense than just shots allowed, but also it's clear that a "run and gun" team wouldn't be top 10 in shots allowed.

Krejci is a very similar player to Backstrom, just not as good. The Bruins are happy to have Krejci and he will continue to be a core player for them, but Backstrom is on the next level above. There's no sense in arguing anything different.

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Old
11-28-2012, 07:14 PM
  #125
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Originally Posted by Oates2Neely View Post
Nobody is debating wether or not Backstrom is elite, everybody agrees he is.

The debate is wether he would maintain his point totals in a defensive system. It's been 2 years since Backstrom broke 70 points, is that a coincidence that thats when Washington switched from "agressive" offense, to a more restricted offense? No, clearly Backstrom struggled with the adjustment as his points show. As did Ovechkin.

There's no telling what Oates will impliment this season, most likely he will let Backstrom & Ovechkin roam freely & use their offensive talents.
Whats wrong with you? As mentioned before last season he had a concussion and missed half the season, but still put up a point per game. And the caps played terrible without Backstrom in the lineup. Like someone else said its not Backstrom who benefits from Ovi, its the other way around.
And the year before that im pretty sure he played while injured and still got 65 points while playing in a defense system which is similar to Bostons.

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