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Old
11-21-2012, 02:17 PM
  #1
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Croatian hockey

Quote:
Originally Posted by Thesensation19 View Post
The Croatian team might go play in there and they even inspired the Italian Hockey team of Milan to be promoted and attempt to join the KHL

Milan was in KHL talks before Medvescak.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Thesensation19 View Post
Croatia now has a real team that is ranked #12 in popularity in Europe.
And never less senior players in our (short) hockey history, while NT regressing. EBEL has very little in common with Croatian hockey. Sooner or later Medvescak will run out of the money and become bottom feeder in EBEL and that will lead to lower interest and they gonna eventually be kicked out of the league, which is primarly Austrian one. If that happens, and we stay out of KHL, hockey in Croatia will suffer long and painful death. From being 12th most attended team in Europe hockey in Croatia, or should I say croatian hockey, doesn't have much...

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11-23-2012, 09:02 AM
  #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CroHabitant View Post
Milan was in KHL talks before Medvescak.




And never less senior players in our (short) hockey history, while NT regressing. EBEL has very little in common with Croatian hockey. Sooner or later Medvescak will run out of the money and become bottom feeder in EBEL and that will lead to lower interest and they gonna eventually be kicked out of the league, which is primarly Austrian one. If that happens, and we stay out of KHL, hockey in Croatia will suffer long and painful death. From being 12th most attended team in Europe hockey in Croatia, or should I say croatian hockey, doesn't have much...
I did not say Medvescak inspired Milan, I said that KHL inspired Milan to grow.
Both Medvescak and Milan, as well as others, are being told they can enter the KHL if they build their team up.

Could not disagree with you more on Medvescak's future.
Where in the world are your supporting evidence to show Medvescak is losing money?
There are an incredibly intelligent organization that has done nothing but wonders in the last 5 years, they have not shown ONE sign of going down hill from what I have been watching...

In the last 5 years I have seen nothing but immense growth for the club.
- Champions of Slovenian league
- Enter EBEL (where the team can gain real competition and support)
- Make EBEL playoffs first year, 2nd year and 3rd year
- Lose first years in playoffs to eventual champions, beat them 3rd time around and make it to the semi finals after a successful regular season
- The team went from being off the map to being the #12 popular team in EUROPE!
- Team makes some great European signings for the 4th year... have an outdoor game
- Outdoor game at the Roman Ampitheatre in Pula is still talked about today, both games inspired KHL to have further interest in the club, the simple idea of the game has brought in new sponsors and new fans... the game has put the team on the map in hockey.
- Though its only a 3rd line NHL player... They were able to sign Dustin Jeffrey for the time being
- The team currently ranks #1 in the EBEL standings




Their sponsor and relationship with UNICEF has grown in the last 2 years. Since 2 years ago... they corp sponsors have doubled including the likes of companies like American Express.

Even before the pula game, Medvescak was able to enter the news over here in America and Canada... New York Times wrote an article about the teams success and popularity in a country unheard of in the world of hockey. NHL has had several articles on the team. And many more


They didnt even have to use much money on Dustin Jeffrey as their sponsors was more than happy to bring him in for them. They may even have room for one more player but for now the team is #1 and their is no point to fix anything.

Ideas like a game in Pula will surely keep coming. Maybe Milan wants to play an outdoor game of their own in Italy next year and ask Medvescak to play them. The attendance will only grow with success and marketing which bothhave been extremely high.

Soon the team will enter the KHL... gain more investors. They will probably start off on the bottom but after a year or two start seeing a more competitive playing field. Hopefully soon they open up a better Pro Shop for fans and a better way for their international fans to watch games. There are hundreds of people here in NY who would love to watch the games if capable.

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Old
11-23-2012, 09:32 AM
  #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CroHabitant View Post
And never less senior players in our (short) hockey history, while NT regressing. EBEL has very little in common with Croatian hockey. Sooner or later Medvescak will run out of the money and become bottom feeder in EBEL and that will lead to lower interest and they gonna eventually be kicked out of the league, which is primarly Austrian one. If that happens, and we stay out of KHL, hockey in Croatia will suffer long and painful death. From being 12th most attended team in Europe hockey in Croatia, or should I say croatian hockey, doesn't have much...
EBEL has very little in common with Croatian hockey.
I dont understand this at all. You do realize Austria has 4 foreign teams in its league now and are looking to expand with two new teams both of which are not from Austria. The EBEL and Austria does not have strong enough teams within its country to just be a league made up of only Austrian teams. In fact, if you look at the time they allowed foreign countries to join then you could also see a huge rise in popularity from the league. It went from #14 in 2006, then allowing Hungry and Slov teams to join and going down to #11. Croatia joined and they became #9. And last year they were #7.


Sooner or later Medvescak will run out of the money and become bottom feeder
I apologize, but WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT? Where is any evidence they will lose money? In a huge recession, the team has done nothing but grow its popularity and profit in the last 10 years... The last 5 years their growth has been exponential.

They went from being an unheard about team to the #13 attendance in Europe. The first and only team that cracked Europes top 20.

That popularity will only grow after a successful event in Pula, currently being #1 in the EBEL and signing top players in the world like Dustin Jeffrey. Their relationship with their sponsors, investors and fans have done nothing but GROW. The KHL has come out and said they have higher interest in bringing the team to the KHL now as well. They have sold out every game they have played in their Dome (the 15,000 capacity arena) and have increased their playing time their annually.

EBEL and that will lead to lower interest and they gonna eventually be kicked out
I highly doubt the team will be kicked out since they are the most popular team in the league. Their sponsors have grown, signing with American Express and UNICEF. The only way they will leave the EBEL is when they find themself ready to move onto the KHL. They have said no the KHL for now, believing that the team must grow its core first before there thrown into a pit of higher competition. And they are 100% right. No need to jump onto a bandwagon that is the KHL until fully being comfortable with the current team roster.


I dont care where you live, your 100% about the current status of Medvescak hockey. You act as though the team has not done anything in years. You act as though the teams popularity as not grown immensely in the last 5 years, or the last 3 years.

The growth of the team continues and continues to inspire a better result from Croatia National team and other Croatian Hockey clubs. The Medvescak team has already inspired a new club to join the Croatia league. I know the Croatia league is a joke but any growth is a positive.

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11-23-2012, 09:40 AM
  #4
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Old
11-28-2012, 10:53 AM
  #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thesensation19 View Post
EBEL has very little in common with Croatian hockey.
I dont understand this at all. You do realize Austria has 4 foreign teams in its league now and are looking to expand with two new teams both of which are not from Austria. The EBEL and Austria does not have strong enough teams within its country to just be a league made up of only Austrian teams. In fact, if you look at the time they allowed foreign countries to join then you could also see a huge rise in popularity from the league. It went from #14 in 2006, then allowing Hungry and Slov teams to join and going down to #11. Croatia joined and they became #9. And last year they were #7.


Sooner or later Medvescak will run out of the money and become bottom feeder
I apologize, but WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT? Where is any evidence they will lose money? In a huge recession, the team has done nothing but grow its popularity and profit in the last 10 years... The last 5 years their growth has been exponential.

They went from being an unheard about team to the #13 attendance in Europe. The first and only team that cracked Europes top 20.

That popularity will only grow after a successful event in Pula, currently being #1 in the EBEL and signing top players in the world like Dustin Jeffrey. Their relationship with their sponsors, investors and fans have done nothing but GROW. The KHL has come out and said they have higher interest in bringing the team to the KHL now as well. They have sold out every game they have played in their Dome (the 15,000 capacity arena) and have increased their playing time their annually.

EBEL and that will lead to lower interest and they gonna eventually be kicked out
I highly doubt the team will be kicked out since they are the most popular team in the league. Their sponsors have grown, signing with American Express and UNICEF. The only way they will leave the EBEL is when they find themself ready to move onto the KHL. They have said no the KHL for now, believing that the team must grow its core first before there thrown into a pit of higher competition. And they are 100% right. No need to jump onto a bandwagon that is the KHL until fully being comfortable with the current team roster.


I dont care where you live, your 100% about the current status of Medvescak hockey. You act as though the team has not done anything in years. You act as though the teams popularity as not grown immensely in the last 5 years, or the last 3 years.

The growth of the team continues and continues to inspire a better result from Croatia National team and other Croatian Hockey clubs. The Medvescak team has already inspired a new club to join the Croatia league. I know the Croatia league is a joke but any growth is a positive.

Answer to bold part 1

Medvescak has little in common with Croatian hockey, because Medvescak roster is made mostly of foreginers and players with Croatian roots but trained outside of Croatia. Second, their youth system is one big BS. Second, they don't have any attention to change it. I know that hockey player can't be produced in two or three years, that is one long and hard process, but Medvescak is already in it's 4th EBEL season and there are no signs that things are improving in that area.

Answer to bold part 2

I perfectly know what I am talking about, because I read all what media writes and I know few people who has close connections with Medvescak board. Salary are coming late and later every month. Andy Sertich, our D who is with Medvescak from it's first day in EBEL, already packed his bags and wanted to return to USA because he didn't recieve his salary for months. Team president Gojanovic paid to him from his own pocket just to stay with team. The public secret is that Medvescak next season will either play in KHL or will return to it's pre-EBEL amateur status, because there is not possible anymore to bring adequate amount of money for some good placement in EBEL.

Answer to bold part 3

What I wrote it in previous section is tightly connected with this. EBEL will say OK for season or two being heavily underdogs, but later one they will think twice whether will they keep foregin team that serves as machine for getting better goal advantage !?


National team ? In pre-EBEL time Croatia played in D1, now we are third in D2A ! Sapienti sat.

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11-29-2012, 10:59 AM
  #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CroHabitant View Post
Answer to bold part 1

Medvescak has little in common with Croatian hockey, because Medvescak roster is made mostly of foreginers and players with Croatian roots but trained outside of Croatia. Second, their youth system is one big BS. Second, they don't have any attention to change it. I know that hockey player can't be produced in two or three years, that is one long and hard process, but Medvescak is already in it's 4th EBEL season and there are no signs that things are improving in that area.

REPLY

First off, your first argument said that Medvescak and Croatians had little in common with the Austrian EBEL. Now your bringing up a differ argument but do not fear I do have a reply to that as well since your 110% wrong. The simple facts and numbers show you your wrong.

For 6-7 years now, since Medvescak became serious in its strive to become a BETTER hockey club, the average attendance has tripled on a yearly basis. SOLD OUT crowds at both their 15k dome arena and 6k seat old arena shows that they have HUGE fan support. So where do you get that "but Medvescak is already in it's 4th EBEL season and there are no signs that things are improving in that area.". SOLD OUT CROWDS... In 6 years the club went from being a no name club and people asking "WOW theres hockey in Croatia hahahahahaha" to being the #13 rated club in Europe in terms of average attendance at home games. So right off the bat, you have no facts for your statement and mine clearly show improvement.

The club does not need to have PURE BRED Croatians playing. All they need is some Croatian Roots, for home games to be played in Croatia and for them to be successful. Check, Check and OH YEA DOUBLE CHECK on the success part.

I guarantee you that Medvescak will have a better avg attendance this year... as the team is #1, and the outdoor Pula game sparked global interest. O yea and they have an NHL player. All signs of more fans being interested.

---------------------------------------------------------------------

Answer to bold part 2

I perfectly know what I am talking about, because I read all what media writes and I know few people who has close connections with Medvescak board. Salary are coming late and later every month. Andy Sertich, our D who is with Medvescak from it's first day in EBEL, already packed his bags and wanted to return to USA because he didn't recieve his salary for months. Team president Gojanovic paid to him from his own pocket just to stay with team. The public secret is that Medvescak next season will either play in KHL or will return to it's pre-EBEL amateur status, because there is not possible anymore to bring adequate amount of money for some good placement in EBEL.


REPLY #2
First off, your biggest issue there is you read too much into the media. I too have connections with inside of Medvescak on all levels. Plus I also have friends who play for the team and the junior team.

1) You mean Medvescak is the only team to have money issues in terms of late paychecks? What is this a joke? Even in European Football the highest leagues have teams that cant pay all its players guaranteed money. There was a whole issue with that in La Liga and Serie A two seasons ago with half of its teams having contract issues. I am sure all over Europe with hockey clubs its the same thing and probably worse. But this does not mean much.

2) It does not mean much because they are a team playing in the EBEL. Not a top 3 league... a top 7 European hockey league. They were asked to join the KHL this year but opted to say no to give it just a little more time in putting the pieces together. There taking their time with this decision and thats smart. Once they enter the KHL, they will have more publicity, more promotions, more investors and a higher shared revenue. This is how you properly grow a hockey club. You think its going to be easy with money whenever you start a business? . this does not mean the team is doomed, it just means there patient.


Answer to bold part 3

What I wrote it in previous section is tightly connected with this. EBEL will say OK for season or two being heavily underdogs, but later one they will think twice whether will they keep foregin team that serves as machine for getting better goal advantage !?


National team ? In pre-EBEL time Croatia played in D1, now we are third in D2A ! Sapienti sat.

REPLY #3
I really didnt understand your English there buddy. But from what I understand you say that the EBEL will second think about having foreign teams?

You do know that in the last 5 years the EBEL had to shut down one Austrian team because they were unsuccessful. And they expanded the league with 4 foreign teams.

Since signing those 4 outside clubs, the league went from being #12 in European hockey leagues to now being #7.

You do also know that they just brought in a new foreign team as early as last year... and they are looking to expand again with two teams (Slovakia, Hungry) in the next 2-3 years. So what are you talking about?


National team ? In pre-EBEL time Croatia played in D1, now we are third in D2A

The Croatian National team has gone from Division I A to Division II B like roller coaster since 2001. You act as though joining the EBEL made us go into Division II.

2001- Division 1 group B
2002- Division 1 group A
2003- Division 1 Group B
2004- Division II group A
2005- Division II Group B

*** As you can see the trend... this is pre EBEL. And the team was going DOWN DOWN DOWN. Not because of Medvescak... because of terrible management and coaching and no proper youth system.

2006- Division I B
2007- Division II A
2008- Division I

Now we are just on a roller coaster going back and forth between luck and bad management

2009- MEDVESCAK JOINS THE EBEL
2009- Division I A
2010-Division I B
2011- Division II Group B
2012- Division II Group B

Do not tell me that joining the EBEL is what made our National team go into Division II. They are hardly related at this point. Its one big roller coaster. Back and forth between division 1 and division 2. Remember the Croatian national team in 2011 lost to Romania by ONE GOAL! And if we won that game we would be in division I. Where we would only go back to division II in a year or two.

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11-29-2012, 11:00 AM
  #7
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Answer to bold part 1

Medvescak has little in common with Croatian hockey, because Medvescak roster is made mostly of foreginers and players with Croatian roots but trained outside of Croatia. Second, their youth system is one big BS. Second, they don't have any attention to change it. I know that hockey player can't be produced in two or three years, that is one long and hard process, but Medvescak is already in it's 4th EBEL season and there are no signs that things are improving in that area.

REPLY

First off, your first argument said that Medvescak and Croatians had little in common with the Austrian EBEL. Now your bringing up a differ argument but do not fear I do have a reply to that as well since your 110% wrong. The simple facts and numbers show you your wrong.

For 6-7 years now, since Medvescak became serious in its strive to become a BETTER hockey club, the average attendance has tripled on a yearly basis. SOLD OUT crowds at both their 15k dome arena and 6k seat old arena shows that they have HUGE fan support. So where do you get that "but Medvescak is already in it's 4th EBEL season and there are no signs that things are improving in that area.". SOLD OUT CROWDS... In 6 years the club went from being a no name club and people asking "WOW theres hockey in Croatia hahahahahaha" to being the #13 rated club in Europe in terms of average attendance at home games. So right off the bat, you have no facts for your statement and mine clearly show improvement.

The club does not need to have PURE BRED Croatians playing. All they need is some Croatian Roots, for home games to be played in Croatia and for them to be successful. Check, Check and OH YEA DOUBLE CHECK on the success part.

I guarantee you that Medvescak will have a better avg attendance this year... as the team is #1, and the outdoor Pula game sparked global interest. O yea and they have an NHL player. All signs of more fans being interested.

---------------------------------------------------------------------

Answer to bold part 2

I perfectly know what I am talking about, because I read all what media writes and I know few people who has close connections with Medvescak board. Salary are coming late and later every month. Andy Sertich, our D who is with Medvescak from it's first day in EBEL, already packed his bags and wanted to return to USA because he didn't recieve his salary for months. Team president Gojanovic paid to him from his own pocket just to stay with team. The public secret is that Medvescak next season will either play in KHL or will return to it's pre-EBEL amateur status, because there is not possible anymore to bring adequate amount of money for some good placement in EBEL.


REPLY #2
First off, your biggest issue there is you read too much into the media. I too have connections with inside of Medvescak on all levels. Plus I also have friends who play for the team and the junior team.

1) You mean Medvescak is the only team to have money issues in terms of late paychecks? What is this a joke? Even in European Football the highest leagues have teams that cant pay all its players guaranteed money. There was a whole issue with that in La Liga and Serie A two seasons ago with half of its teams having contract issues. I am sure all over Europe with hockey clubs its the same thing and probably worse. But this does not mean much.

2) It does not mean much because they are a team playing in the EBEL. Not a top 3 league... a top 7 European hockey league. They were asked to join the KHL this year but opted to say no to give it just a little more time in putting the pieces together. There taking their time with this decision and thats smart. Once they enter the KHL, they will have more publicity, more promotions, more investors and a higher shared revenue. This is how you properly grow a hockey club. You think its going to be easy with money whenever you start a business? . this does not mean the team is doomed, it just means there patient.


Answer to bold part 3

What I wrote it in previous section is tightly connected with this. EBEL will say OK for season or two being heavily underdogs, but later one they will think twice whether will they keep foregin team that serves as machine for getting better goal advantage !?


National team ? In pre-EBEL time Croatia played in D1, now we are third in D2A ! Sapienti sat.

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11-29-2012, 11:15 AM
  #8
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You cannot tell me that Medvescak is the only European sports clubs with money problems. Its EUROPE! Unless your in the 5% of wealth then your always going to run into money issues. Barcelona sports is in debt and there one of the richest in the world.

Yet Medvescak is doing everything right.

They are winning games and selling out crowds. There expanding their seating capacity and raising ticket prices and still sold out crowds. Events like the Pula outdoor game and signing players like Dustin Jeffrey will only further increase investors support and advertisement.

Medvescak reunited only about 10 years ago, they are doing 100x better than everyone expectations.

1) Win Croatia league
2) Enter Slovakia
3) 2-3 years dominate Slovakia hockey
4) Enter EBEL
5) 1 year playoffs, 2 years qtr finals, 3 years semi finals, 4 years ranked #1
6) team needs publicity... they sign an NHL player and host an outdoor game in Pula that makes global headlines.

Now what can they do?
7) Enter KHL... make more money, make more investors, make more sponsors, sign better players, more young Croatian are inspired to play the game and grow it from the youth. The team in 4-5 years starts to be a premier team in the KHL.

What else can they do
8) medvescak and their official fan page is now looking to bring live stream games to the online world so fans from all overthe world can watch... There are hundreds of people in New York who love the team but cant watch.

What else can they do?
Make an online shop with selling jerseys and sell the logo and market the team



They have not declined.
Facts... Austria league #11 in 2008. 2011 Austria league is #7 with Medvescak being #13 in average attendance. This will only increase with signing NHL player, signing better players, winning games and being #1 and hosting the outdoor game which will count for this years average attendance rankings

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Old
11-29-2012, 12:16 PM
  #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thesensation19 View Post
You cannot tell me that Medvescak is the only European sports clubs with money problems. Its EUROPE! Unless your in the 5% of wealth then your always going to run into money issues. Barcelona sports is in debt and there one of the richest in the world.

Yet Medvescak is doing everything right.

They are winning games and selling out crowds. There expanding their seating capacity and raising ticket prices and still sold out crowds. Events like the Pula outdoor game and signing players like Dustin Jeffrey will only further increase investors support and advertisement.

Medvescak reunited only about 10 years ago, they are doing 100x better than everyone expectations.

1) Win Croatia league
2) Enter Slovakia
3) 2-3 years dominate Slovakia hockey

4) Enter EBEL
5) 1 year playoffs, 2 years qtr finals, 3 years semi finals, 4 years ranked #1
6) team needs publicity... they sign an NHL player and host an outdoor game in Pula that makes global headlines.

Now what can they do?
7) Enter KHL... make more money, make more investors, make more sponsors, sign better players, more young Croatian are inspired to play the game and grow it from the youth. The team in 4-5 years starts to be a premier team in the KHL.

What else can they do
8) medvescak and their official fan page is now looking to bring live stream games to the online world so fans from all overthe world can watch... There are hundreds of people in New York who love the team but cant watch.

What else can they do?
Make an online shop with selling jerseys and sell the logo and market the team



They have not declined.
Facts... Austria league #11 in 2008. 2011 Austria league is #7 with Medvescak being #13 in average attendance. This will only increase with signing NHL player, signing better players, winning games and being #1 and hosting the outdoor game which will count for this years average attendance rankings
Not Slovakia, but Slovenia...

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11-29-2012, 12:29 PM
  #10
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Im glad thats the only thing you corrected.

Everything else im good with.
Medvescak #13 in average attendance. By the end of this season they will be anywhere between #11-#15 and ill be happy with that. There #'s in attendance will grow this year as they will be playing more in the Dome this season and they are #1 and they have big name players.

Hopefully they win the trophy in EBEL and then KHL

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11-29-2012, 12:31 PM
  #11
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Originally Posted by Thesensation19 View Post
REPLY #3
I really didnt understand your English there buddy. But from what I understand you say that the EBEL will second think about having foreign teams?

You do know that in the last 5 years the EBEL had to shut down one Austrian team because they were unsuccessful. And they expanded the league with 4 foreign teams.

Since signing those 4 outside clubs, the league went from being #12 in European hockey leagues to now being #7.


2012- Division II Group B
Division 2 Group A...it is new IIHF system of groups...since 2012.



Well...from reading your posts it seems that my croatian sucks, despite being croatian, and that everything is ok with Medvescak. Money is there, new sponsors and invesments are there...great Must be bunch of lies in croatian media about Medvescak's debts and players not recieving salary for months.

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11-29-2012, 12:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Thesensation19 View Post
Im glad thats the only thing you corrected.

Everything else im good with.
Medvescak #13 in average attendance. By the end of this season they will be anywhere between #11-#15 and ill be happy with that. There #'s in attendance will grow this year as they will be playing more in the Dome this season and they are #1 and they have big name players.

Hopefully they win the trophy in EBEL and then KHL

Medvescak will never win the trophy in EBEL. Let's not lie ourselves, no matter of four foregin teams, it is still Austrian league. For winning the title we would need a lot of lucky breaks, and ref's in EBEL are so much pro-austrian there is no way they won't help them in crucial moments in playoffs. Second, Medvescak has the thinnest roster of all main title contenders like KAC, RBS, Vienna and Linz. Few injuries, suspension or two, and we are swept out of PO-s.

p.s. It would be nice if moderators could switch posts of this conversation between me and my fellow countryman in USA in new thread, because we are way in OT.

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11-29-2012, 12:46 PM
  #13
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Originally Posted by Thesensation19 View Post
. So where do you get that "but Medvescak is already in it's 4th EBEL season and there are no signs that things are improving in that area.". SOLD OUT CROWDS... In 6 years the club went from

That was about not improving their youth system in order to get domestic trained players in upcoming years. I never said that Medvescak don't have good fan support.

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11-30-2012, 03:05 AM
  #14
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Originally Posted by CroHabitant View Post
p.s. It would be nice if moderators could switch posts of this conversation between me and my fellow countryman in USA in new thread, because we are way in OT.
Done!

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