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Tyler Biggs's discussion thread.

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Old
11-28-2012, 01:53 PM
  #426
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Originally Posted by stanleyorbust View Post
Its kind of pointless to compare him to Kyle Clifford when he is only two years ahead of Tyler in terms of development/ proven what he can do in the NHL.

Kyle also played a lesser role on a completely stacked Barrie team while Biggs is playing a main role on a team without the same level of talent so its hard to compare their OHL stats.

Biggs will be in the NHL.. its just a matter of him deciding if he is going to be a hard-nosed 4th line guy.. or a 2nd/3rd liner who plays hard, drives the net, and contributes offensively as well.
You're actually providing your very own rebuttal here.

Clifford playing a lesser role with less talented linemates and less prime TOI/g and PP time and producing as he did is a credit to his success, not a weakness as you're trying to imply. Biggs opportunity at the same age is therefore greater so his stats should be greater accordingly, based on that factor of primary verses secondary role player due to situation.

The Clifford comparison is not my own, as its the opinion of actual NHL amateur scouts and can be found in the Hockey News. Leafs own Director of amateur scouting Dave Morrison in THN, himself is on record stating the organization is not expecting Biggs to be big scorer at the NHL level, but rather a big physical presence role player instead..

ie from TSN draft preview:
Quote:
TSN Scout Grant McCagg:
Perhaps the most rugged forward to ever come out of the US development program, Biggs impressed scouts throughout the season with his robust and pro-style game. Strengths - Already built like a man, Biggs dominated his age group in terms of physical maturity and strength. Not afraid to drop the gloves or run over an opponent. Solid positional player, drives hard to the net, possesses a hard shot, strong character. Weaknesses - Feet and hands are average, limited offensive upside, lacks creativity. Prone to taking bad penalties, will need more discipline. NHL Upside - Has been compared to Los Angeles Kings' forward Kyle Clifford. Should be a tough, intimidating second or third-line winger who will battle hard.

http://www.tsn.ca/draftcentre/feature/?id=44970
Which describes Kyle Clifford's role on the Kings, and the reason he was a high selection #35 overall in 2009, for all the intangibles beyond goals and assists he brings to the game. Hitting, fighting, crease crashing and being physically imposing are the areas that Leafs are looking for Biggs to make an impact in, when he gets to the NHL level.

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11-28-2012, 02:26 PM
  #427
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Originally Posted by JVR2112 View Post
Kyle Clifford would be really disappointing tbh.
I agree that there is an adjustment period and he would have been better off if he had went to the OHL right away.
You do realize that over 50% of first round picks dont have much of a career in the NHL, let alone make it. Biggs bring many things to the table, skills that will allow him to be a serviceable NHLer. There is also the theory GM's should swing for the fences on picks, yet these are the very same fans that chirp and whine and call for a beheading of the GM and scouts when these picks dont pan out. OT, was hoping the Leafs picked Biggs teammate in the draft; he's going to be a good one.

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11-28-2012, 02:41 PM
  #428
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Originally Posted by New Liskeard View Post
You do realize that over 50% of first round picks dont have much of a career in the NHL, let alone make it. Biggs bring many things to the table, skills that will allow him to be a serviceable NHLer. There is also the theory GM's should swing for the fences on picks, yet these are the very same fans that chirp and whine and call for a beheading of the GM and scouts when these picks dont pan out. OT, was hoping the Leafs picked Biggs teammate in the draft; he's going to be a good one.
When my team selects in the first round i'm expecting a player that has the potential to be better than Kyle Clifford. I think Kyle might be his low end potential, hopefully.

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11-28-2012, 02:57 PM
  #429
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Originally Posted by JVR2112 View Post
When my team selects in the first round i'm expecting a player that has the potential to be better than Kyle Clifford. I think Kyle might be his low end potential, hopefully.
Who is to say that Biggs, will certainlly only have the potential of Clifford. That story has yet to be written. People are quick to draw conclusions. Biggs looks good, and based on his size, willingness to be physical, and fight, he could likely have an NHL career, how well he does is up to him.

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11-29-2012, 05:50 AM
  #430
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Originally Posted by The K Man View Post
Seems like he's been incredibly inconsistent this year. Goes on a stretch of a nice point streak, then doesn't produce for a couple games. (Just basing off of stats)

Hopefully that's just the transition to the OHL still
His play has been consistent. Ive thought hes had maybe 3 or 4 off games, most of those happened to be the third game in 3 nights scenario. He often doesnt get points even though he is a main factor inthe goal by either screening the goalie or making the D take him and leaving plenty of room for his linemates.

I was skeptical about him leaving Miami but i think he made the right choice now.

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11-29-2012, 09:39 AM
  #431
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Originally Posted by sniper81 View Post
His play has been consistent. Ive thought hes had maybe 3 or 4 off games, most of those happened to be the third game in 3 nights scenario. He often doesnt get points even though he is a main factor inthe goal by either screening the goalie or making the D take him and leaving plenty of room for his linemates.

I was skeptical about him leaving Miami but i think he made the right choice now.
Many were skeptical, but others pointed out the opportunities to actually play the game in the OHL were better. Lots were saying the practice time he'd get in the NCAA was more important, but he came up through the US development system, so he already spent years practicing.

As for education, his signing bonus was $270k. He should be able to pay for his education with that.

It was the right choice if your first goal is the NHL.

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11-29-2012, 03:33 PM
  #432
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Originally Posted by ULF_55 View Post
Many were skeptical, but others pointed out the opportunities to actually play the game in the OHL were better. Lots were saying the practice time he'd get in the NCAA was more important, but he came up through the US development system, so he already spent years practicing.

As for education, his signing bonus was $270k. He should be able to pay for his education with that.

It was the right choice if your first goal is the NHL.
I was hoping he would spend 3 years at college and really work on his offense. DJ Smith is the perfect coach for Biggs, he loves physical forwards and encourages hostility. I think he will need 2 years in the AHL, there is no rush with him.

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11-29-2012, 03:48 PM
  #433
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I'm extremely relieved to see Biggs' production this year.

He's still likely not a top-6 NHL forward, but he's at least showing us that he has a legit chance to be.

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11-29-2012, 04:02 PM
  #434
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Originally Posted by sniper81 View Post
His play has been consistent. Ive thought hes had maybe 3 or 4 off games, most of those happened to be the third game in 3 nights scenario. He often doesnt get points even though he is a main factor inthe goal by either screening the goalie or making the D take him and leaving plenty of room for his linemates.

I was skeptical about him leaving Miami but i think he made the right choice now.
That is great to hear because this team lacks a strong physical net presence.

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11-29-2012, 04:22 PM
  #435
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Originally Posted by Leafsman View Post
That is great to hear because this team lacks a strong physical net presence.
Yup, in some ways this team needs Biggs more than it does Rielly. I'm very pleased that we actually have a legit power forward prospect. The perimeter play of the past couple of seasons has been killing us.

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11-29-2012, 04:42 PM
  #436
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Originally Posted by New Liskeard View Post
You do realize that over 50% of first round picks dont have much of a career in the NHL, let alone make it. Biggs bring many things to the table, skills that will allow him to be a serviceable NHLer. There is also the theory GM's should swing for the fences on picks, yet these are the very same fans that chirp and whine and call for a beheading of the GM and scouts when these picks dont pan out. OT, was hoping the Leafs picked Biggs teammate in the draft; he's going to be a good one.
imo and i saw them play:
boone jenner=boom/bust
tyler biggs=safer pick

biggs can do more things than just score, jenners speed has gotten better but he doesn't fly around the ice. id rather have biggs tbh.

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11-29-2012, 06:18 PM
  #437
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Biggs will score 30 goals this year and be a ppg+ player who scraps and plays the power forward game to a letter

How is this not top 6 talent???

A lot of posters here were expecting 10 goals to 15 goals and 0.6 PPG and calling him a third liner

His stats will be a lot better than that and he is still a third liner? Well you were very wrong on his goal predictions and point predictions and i suspect the prediction of not a top 6 as well

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11-29-2012, 06:29 PM
  #438
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Originally Posted by Hawaiinleaf View Post
Biggs will score 30 goals this year and be a ppg+ player who scraps and plays the power forward game to a letter

How is this not top 6 talent???

A lot of posters here were expecting 10 goals to 15 goals and 0.6 PPG and calling him a third liner

His stats will be a lot better than that and he is still a third liner? Well you were very wrong on his goal predictions and point predictions and i suspect the prediction of not a top 6 as well
Scoring 30 goals in the OHL (which he has yet to do) doesn't make you a top 6 forward.

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11-29-2012, 06:32 PM
  #439
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What he's doing this season means it isnt impossible for him to be in the top 6 in the future, so that's good. It shows his ceiling has yet to be determined, but he's not guaranteed to be a top 6 guy, or bottom 6 either way yet, we'll see how the season progresses.

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11-29-2012, 07:23 PM
  #440
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My point is he is blowing away a lot of peoples expectations of him already including well past several predictions of how many goals he would score this year 10?? what a joke he is half way to 30 and hopefully gets well past that and is a beast in the playoffs

But then i am guessing a power forward at 6'3" 230lb who scores 35 goals and is a beast in playoffs and a better than PPG player who fights will still be a bottom 6 to many here..

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11-29-2012, 07:41 PM
  #441
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He'll be a great PP net presence. He could score 15 in a season from that alone if he has Rielly setting up, Phaneuf/Gardiner shooting from the point, and Kessel sniping from the half-boards.

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11-29-2012, 07:45 PM
  #442
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Originally Posted by Hawaiinleaf View Post
My point is he is blowing away a lot of peoples expectations of him already including well past several predictions of how many goals he would score this year 10?? what a joke he is half way to 30 and hopefully gets well past that and is a beast in the playoffs

But then i am guessing a power forward at 6'3" 230lb who scores 35 goals and is a beast in playoffs and a better than PPG player who fights will still be a bottom 6 to many here..


He is nothing right now - not bottom 6, not top 6. He is in the OHL.

Most PFs never develop the touch to produce in top 6 levels in the NHL. Safe bet is bottom 6 with upside top 6.

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11-29-2012, 07:56 PM
  #443
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Originally Posted by BlueMapleDawg View Post
He'll be a great PP net presence. He could score 15 in a season from that alone if he has Rielly setting up, Phaneuf/Gardiner shooting from the point, and Kessel sniping from the half-boards.
Hes going to score 30 in the NHL because hes on pace to score that much in the OHL.
/sarcasm

I agree with this assessment. Good 3rd line player is what I'm expecting. I think some people around here think being in the "bottom 6" means you suck or didn't meet expectations.

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11-29-2012, 08:14 PM
  #444
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Originally Posted by JVR2112 View Post
Scoring 30 goals in the OHL (which he has yet to do) doesn't make you a top 6 forward.
Either does watching movies in HD. But scoring 30 goals as a PF in a premier junior league like the OHL bodes well for Biggs. Players like Todd Bertuzzi didnt break the 30 goal mark until his 4th OHL season. So it works the other way too. Dustin Brown has seasons of 20, 30 goals in the OHL, he had 40 only once. There are plenty of examples where a 30 goal scorer in the OHL becomes a top 6 player in the NHL.

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11-29-2012, 08:21 PM
  #445
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30 seems like a lot.

With the world jrs. cutting into the year. Id be happy with 25.

Either way, he is progressing into the player we wanted.

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11-29-2012, 08:35 PM
  #446
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Originally Posted by Mess View Post
You're actually providing your very own rebuttal here.

Clifford playing a lesser role with less talented linemates and less prime TOI/g and PP time and producing as he did is a credit to his success, not a weakness as you're trying to imply. Biggs opportunity at the same age is therefore greater so his stats should be greater accordingly, based on that factor of primary verses secondary role player due to situation.

The Clifford comparison is not my own, as its the opinion of actual NHL amateur scouts and can be found in the Hockey News. Leafs own Director of amateur scouting Dave Morrison in THN, himself is on record stating the organization is not expecting Biggs to be big scorer at the NHL level, but rather a big physical presence role player instead..

ie from TSN draft preview:

Which describes Kyle Clifford's role on the Kings, and the reason he was a high selection #35 overall in 2009, for all the intangibles beyond goals and assists he brings to the game. Hitting, fighting, crease crashing and being physically imposing are the areas that Leafs are looking for Biggs to make an impact in, when he gets to the NHL level.
hey mess... I never said anything against Kyle Clifford or that a lesser role should be held against him. I only pointed out that they had/have much different roles in the OHL so its hard to compare when they only thing this poster is comparing is the fact that they play a tough game, and had similar output as 19 year olds in the OHL.

I stand by my point that its ridiculous to compare him to someone who is only two years ahead of his development curve. Who is Kyle Clifford? is he a 2nd or 3rd liner? is he the 4th liner who didnt get to play in the Kings recent playoffs and is destined for the ECHL? Who knows, hes only 20 and has to establish himself as a player first. so why compare him to Tyler Biggs. Hey lets compare two unknowns to eachother.. if that is TSN's claim, it wont be the first time they are being ridiculous.

So as I mentioned.. lets not compare Tyler Biggs to players who have not even established their own roles in the NHL. Ive seen other scouts compare him to Dustin Brown and Milan Lucic.. but really who are we kidding.

So back to my point. Tyler Biggs looks to be a safe pick who likely will top out as a very good third liner. (and no Kyle Clifford is not yet a very good third liner, although he has the skill set to reach this as well)

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11-29-2012, 08:50 PM
  #447
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Originally Posted by crump View Post
Either does watching movies in HD. But scoring 30 goals as a PF in a premier junior league like the OHL bodes well for Biggs. Players like Todd Bertuzzi didnt break the 30 goal mark until his 4th OHL season. So it works the other way too. Dustin Brown has seasons of 20, 30 goals in the OHL, he had 40 only once. There are plenty of examples where a 30 goal scorer in the OHL becomes a top 6 player in the NHL.
Don't really get your point. There are always exceptions to the rule. It's improbable but I would love to be wrong.

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11-29-2012, 08:52 PM
  #448
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hawaiinleaf View Post
Biggs will score 30 goals this year and be a ppg+ player who scraps and plays the power forward game to a letter

How is this not top 6 talent???

A lot of posters here were expecting 10 goals to 15 goals and 0.6 PPG and calling him a third liner

His stats will be a lot better than that and he is still a third liner? Well you were very wrong on his goal predictions and point predictions and i suspect the prediction of not a top 6 as well
It needs to translate to the NHL. Lots of kids put up good jr numbers but they just dont translate.

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12-01-2012, 02:09 AM
  #449
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so apparently he played very good today anyone wanna give a recap?

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12-01-2012, 04:21 AM
  #450
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I hope this guy plays at least 2 years on the Marlies. I want to make sure he has the chance to develop offensively before he makes the NHL. He has shown good offensive instincts thus far and I think taking the extra couple years for offensive development could be the difference between him being a 2nd liner and him being a 3rd liner.

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