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Justin Schultz

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Old
11-29-2012, 07:49 PM
  #326
AngelDuck
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That was some awful defense...nice goal though

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11-29-2012, 07:49 PM
  #327
Vinegar Strokes
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yourface View Post
Gets burned by Palmieri on Houston's opening goal, but makes up for it with a sick individual effort moments later.
I think this basically sums Justin up as a player. I expect a to hear this type of analysis a lot through his career.

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11-29-2012, 07:56 PM
  #328
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Originally Posted by Vinegar Strokes View Post
I think this basically sums Justin up as a player. I expect a to hear this type of analysis a lot through his career.
Not really. The Palmieri goal was from a horrible mistake by Schultz but it's the first time I've seen him make that kind of mistake. His goal was a thing of beauty, though. I almost always expect him to score when he's in the slot like that.

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11-29-2012, 07:59 PM
  #329
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Originally Posted by DCP View Post
Not really. The Palmieri goal was from a horrible mistake by Schultz but it's the first time I've seen him make that kind of mistake. His goal was a thing of beauty, though. I almost always expect him to score when he's in the slot like that.
I've seen a lot of him over the years. He's not the best 1 on 1 player, and he's not that great in the D-zone, it's okay, he's still a phenomenal player. I know Oiler fans will piss and moan about anything bad said about their players, but it's the truth. I love Sami Vatanen, he's my favorite prospect, but I expect the same from him...jaw dropping offensive skills, with some average defense and some facepalm worthy defensive plays.

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11-29-2012, 08:01 PM
  #330
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinegar Strokes View Post
I've seen a lot of him over the years. He's not the best 1 on 1 player, and he's not that great in the D-zone, it's okay, he's still a phenomenal player. I know Oiler fans will piss and moan about anything bad said about their players, but it's the truth. I love Sami Vatanen, he's my favorite prospect, but I expect the same from him...jaw dropping offensive skills, with some average defense and some facepalm worthy defensive plays.
Schultz does lead the AHL in +/-. I think you may be overstating his defensive problems.

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Old
11-29-2012, 08:06 PM
  #331
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Originally Posted by Vinegar Strokes View Post
I've seen a lot of him over the years. He's not the best 1 on 1 player, and he's not that great in the D-zone, it's okay, he's still a phenomenal player. I know Oiler fans will piss and moan about anything bad said about their players, but it's the truth. I love Sami Vatanen, he's my favorite prospect, but I expect the same from him...jaw dropping offensive skills, with some average defense and some facepalm worthy defensive plays.
I've seen every Barons game this year and he's been decent. That gaffe doesn't reflect his defensive play this year. He may have just improved that side of his game since. Not pissing and moaning, just discussing a player. Also, Sami Vatanen is one of my favourite prospects after seeing him play during the WJC a couple years ago.

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11-29-2012, 08:12 PM
  #332
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Originally Posted by DCP View Post
I've seen every Barons game this year and he's been decent. That gaffe doesn't reflect his defensive play this year. He may have just improved that side of his game since. Not pissing and moaning, just discussing a player. Also, Sami Vatanen is one of my favourite prospects after seeing him play during the WJC a couple years ago.
No doubt Schultz makes some pretty horrendous defensive gaffs, but in general he knows his way around. After all, he is playing as OKC's clear #1 D immediately upon starting on his pro career, and that's with another rookie of a similar skill set playing as his partner. He doesnt have any solid defensive D man to anchor him. Thus, any mistakes he makes look especially bad.

Hopefully his defensive game will round out. Obviously, he's an incredible offensive player.


Last edited by Neatman: 11-29-2012 at 08:41 PM.
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Old
11-29-2012, 08:14 PM
  #333
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinegar Strokes View Post
I've seen a lot of him over the years. He's not the best 1 on 1 player, and he's not that great in the D-zone, it's okay, he's still a phenomenal player. I know Oiler fans will piss and moan about anything bad said about their players, but it's the truth. I love Sami Vatanen, he's my favorite prospect, but I expect the same from him...jaw dropping offensive skills, with some average defense and some facepalm worthy defensive plays.
I'm not expecting him to be a defensive stud, but your initial post made it seem like he gets burned all the time. The goal today was a pretty rare gaffe by Schultz. He's not going to be Pietrangelo or anything, but, at least at the AHL level, he's been solid defensively.

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Old
11-29-2012, 08:50 PM
  #334
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Originally Posted by 5RingsAndABeer View Post
I'm not expecting him to be a defensive stud, but your initial post made it seem like he gets burned all the time. The goal today was a pretty rare gaffe by Schultz. He's not going to be Pietrangelo or anything, but, at least at the AHL level, he's been solid defensively.
Nah, that's definitely not how I meant it. What I meant, is that Schultz will be an adequate defensive player, average if you will, but will likely more than make up for it with his offensive game.

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11-29-2012, 08:58 PM
  #335
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Originally Posted by s7ark View Post
Schultz does lead the AHL in +/-. I think you may be overstating his defensive problems.
Jeff Schultz led the NHL in +/-, with superstar defensive forward Alexander Ovechkin holding down the 2nd spot in 2009-10'. So I can only assume that your point is that extremely strong offensive teams can yield high end +/- numbers.

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11-29-2012, 09:32 PM
  #336
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Originally Posted by Vinegar Strokes View Post
Jeff Schultz led the NHL in +/-, with superstar defensive forward Alexander Ovechkin holding down the 2nd spot in 2009-10'. So I can only assume that your point is that extremely strong offensive teams can yield high end +/- numbers.
I don't seem to remember too many Cap fans thinking Jeff Schultz was poor defensively when he led the league in +/-.

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Old
11-29-2012, 09:48 PM
  #337
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Didn't Tom Preissing lead the NHL in +/- a couple of years ago? It's a completely worthless stat.

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Old
11-29-2012, 10:13 PM
  #338
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All I know is, if I was a ducks fan, I'd be depressed as ****. This kid is amazing.

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11-29-2012, 10:16 PM
  #339
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Originally Posted by s7ark View Post
I don't seem to remember too many Cap fans thinking Jeff Schultz was poor defensively when he led the league in +/-.
Really? Because I saw quite a few Caps fans who had complaints about him. I saw a lot of posts saying they thought he was a decent d-man who still needed a lot of improvement defensively.

Sorry man, but +/- is usually garbage unless it is an outlier in very specific situations.

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11-29-2012, 10:18 PM
  #340
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I don't care if Schultz is leading in +/- for my favorite team's farm team, it's a completely garbage stat. And why would you need to use such a stupid stat to justify this kid's obviously awesome talent level...

Still think he projects to be a valuable first pairing defender, I think he can bring a lot of the same elements that Christian Ehrhoff did to the 2010/11 Canucks Cup run team. Jumping up in the rush and providing a very dangerous threat and being a valuable puck mover. Think he will be very comparable stylistically and statistically in the NHL to Ehrhoff. Not yet convinced he is Norris-caliber or ever will be one day, but I'm willing to be pleasantly surprised. Won't count on it though.

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11-29-2012, 10:24 PM
  #341
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Originally Posted by LeafOfBread View Post
Sorry man, but +/- is usually garbage unless it is an outlier
You mean, like tops in the league? Is that enough of an outlier?

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Old
11-29-2012, 10:25 PM
  #342
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**** justin schultz

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11-29-2012, 10:28 PM
  #343
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Originally Posted by Cawz View Post
You mean, like tops in the league? Is that enough of an outlier?
No, it's not enough of an outlier. The stat sucks. People cherrypick it to boost their arguments, it is a terrible statistic.

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Old
11-29-2012, 10:35 PM
  #344
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Originally Posted by oilsp1ll View Post
No, it's not enough of an outlier. The stat sucks. People cherrypick it to boost their arguments, it is a terrible statistic.
Well, I disagree. Its all about context. Taken in the correct context, its a fine stat.

All stats are flawed by the way, becasue they are affected by the other players on the ice.

I just found it funny that he mentioned that it needs to be an outlier. Tops in the league is a pretty good outlier. No-one outlies more at the moment.

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11-29-2012, 10:37 PM
  #345
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Originally Posted by oilsp1ll View Post
No, it's not enough of an outlier. The stat sucks. People cherrypick it to boost their arguments, it is a terrible statistic.
Unlike NHLe, OnSv%, Fenwick or Corsi?

Pfffft.

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11-29-2012, 10:37 PM
  #346
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Ill take leading point scorer over leading +/- any day

+/- is pretty useless but so is saying "he sukz at defense llllol!" if you to watch him play youd see his defense is good and his offensive play doesnt put his team at a risk

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Old
11-29-2012, 10:39 PM
  #347
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Originally Posted by Cawz View Post
Well, I disagree. Its all about context. Taken in the correct context, its a fine stat.

All stats are flawed by the way, becasue they are affected by the other players on the ice.

I just found it funny that he mentioned that it needs to be an outlier. Tops in the league is a pretty good outlier. No-one outlies more at the moment.
So what is the context that differentiates Preissing and Jeff Schultz from being NHL league +/- leaders from Justin Schultz right now? Can we say both those guys are great defensively and were "pretty good outliers" becaus enobody could "outlie" them for 82 games?

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11-29-2012, 10:40 PM
  #348
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Wild fan. Love Schultz. Watched him in college. Sour grapes are normal for fans of teams that failed to land him and even warranted for fans of the Ducks considering how that played out, but the kid is just fantastic offensively and he's well above average playing D. Pair him with someone responsible and he will be on people's top 10 lists in a couple years. Treat to watch.

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Old
11-29-2012, 10:47 PM
  #349
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Originally Posted by oilsp1ll View Post
So what is the context that differentiates Preissing and Jeff Schultz from being NHL league +/- leaders from Justin Schultz right now? Can we say both those guys are great defensively and were "pretty good outliers" becaus enobody could "outlie" them for 82 games?
I dont know. I dont know about those players. But obviously they didnt suck defensively that season if they lead the league in +/-. If you suck defensively, how can you lead your team in +/-? Obviously its not a stat to live or die by, but its calculated by the NHL for a reason.

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11-29-2012, 10:47 PM
  #350
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Originally Posted by topchowda View Post
Ill take leading point scorer over leading +/- any day
As would anybody. Good thing its the same person in this case...

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