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Team Canada 2014: Goalie #2

View Poll Results: #2
Roberto Luongo 69 40.59%
Cam Ward 81 47.65%
Marc-Andre Fleury 11 6.47%
Martin Brodeur 3 1.76%
Mike Smith 6 3.53%
James Reimer 0 0%
Corey Crawford 0 0%
Voters: 170. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
11-29-2012, 09:23 PM
  #101
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MandyAlwaysKnows View Post
Quantity is not the same as quality. Miller was reDQless.

Goals on Luongo were soft-ish, he was not in control.
He looked like an OK average NHL goalie, not a dominant elite top 3 goalie in the world.
Right. A weak goal through the 5 hole from a bad shooting angle is okay to let in, but a goal with 2 opposing players all alone in your crease is unacceptable. Wow you're really on a roll.

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Old
11-29-2012, 09:25 PM
  #102
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MandyAlwaysKnows View Post
Quantity is not the same as quality. Miller was reDQless.

Goals on Luongo were soft-ish, he was not in control.
He looked like an OK average NHL goalie, not a dominant elite top 3 goalie in the world.
On the 1st goal the puck changed direction like 10 feet in front of him. On the 2nd goal Parise was left untouched in the crease. Clearly the goalie's fault.

You seem to have this delusion that the entire game was in the USA's zone and Miller was the only reason it was close. I think you need to watch the game again.

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Old
11-29-2012, 09:26 PM
  #103
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Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
You're right. Luongo choked his way to winning an Olympic gold medal, while Ward clutched his way to pissing away a World Hockey Championship by giving up 5 goals in a game, and clutched his way again this year getting ventilated once again. Infallible argument.
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Originally Posted by Machinehead View Post
I think Luongo sucks in the playoffs so let me have Marc Andre Fleury instead.

Man that logic only works on HF
Both Fleury and Ward have cups, Lu does not.

Ward is more consistent throughout the NHL season.

I didn't watch the Worlds. No clue what happened. Frankly I don't care because again, Ward is more consistent during the NHL season.

Quote:
Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
Oh you're right. It was Luongo choking that caused Miller to give up a weak goal in overtime. Gotcha.
It was a bullet from Sidney Crosby pretty much alone in front of the net. No goalie in the world stops that let alone you're boy Lu

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11-29-2012, 09:29 PM
  #104
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Originally Posted by Machinehead View Post
On the 1st goal the puck changed direction like 10 feet in front of him. On the 2nd goal Parise was left untouched in the crease. Clearly the goalie's fault.

You seem to have this delusion that the entire game was in the USA's zone and Miller was the only reason it was close. I think you need to watch the game again.
1st goal he would have stopped if he was square, it went between his arm and his body.

2nd he gives up a rebound and opens up his legs leaving a HUGE 5 hole gap, easy slide in for Parise. Didn't give himself a chance.

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11-29-2012, 09:31 PM
  #105
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I can't even....

I don't know how you consistently defend Luongo without tearing your hair out y2k.

He could give up a goal 10 on 0 and it would be his fault.

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11-29-2012, 09:32 PM
  #106
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MandyAlwaysKnows View Post
Both Fleury and Ward have cups, Lu does not.

Ward is more consistent throughout the NHL season.

I didn't watch the Worlds. No clue what happened. Frankly I don't care because again, Ward is more consistent during the NHL season.



It was a bullet from Sidney Crosby pretty much alone in front of the net. No goalie in the world stops that let alone you're boy Lu
Lol you couldn't be more wrong. I think you need to rewatch the Olympics because your account of what happened is ridiculously wrong. Also check out Ward's pathetic performance at the World Championships.

You're right about one thing though. Ward is consistent....at posting worse stats than Luongo.

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11-29-2012, 09:33 PM
  #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Machinehead View Post
I can't even....

I don't know how you consistently defend Luongo without tearing your hair out y2k.

He could give up a goal 10 on 0 and it would be his fault.
It's difficult. The blind hate towards Luongo and the double standard has reached stupid levels. You can come up with logical arguments but people will resort to illogic in order to defend another goalie against Luongo. It's stupid.

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11-29-2012, 09:34 PM
  #108
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And like I said, I don't think Luongo is quite what he used to be going forward, but the things in past seasons he gets blamed for, I don't know...

Then again, goalies have been known to keep going til they're 40 I wouldn't count him out.

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11-29-2012, 09:37 PM
  #109
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Miller: No way way of controlling the rebound on the first goal. A high and hard shot in front of the net.
Second goal from Perry... do I even need to explain. Can't be faulted at all.
3rd goal is from Crosby... Let's be honest, you really think that was weak? Absolute bullet that was sniped.. Crosby is the best in the world at scoring from there.


Luongo: 1st goal it did change direction but it was a weak shot and wasn't that close to the net. Went through arm and body.
2nd, rebound, and opened up way too much for Parise. Maybe a pock check could have been useful as well...


Lu wasn't horrible, he just wasn't great. Nothing special

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11-29-2012, 09:39 PM
  #110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Machinehead View Post
And like I said, I don't think Luongo is quite what he used to be going forward, but the things in past seasons he gets blamed for, I don't know...

Then again, goalies have been known to keep going til they're 40 I wouldn't count him out.
Regardless I feel much more comfortable with an aging Luongo in net than Cam Ward who hasn't looked that great since that one hot playoffs which he will have been 8 years removed from. Ward since then, in international play specifically, has looked very bad.

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11-29-2012, 09:40 PM
  #111
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MandyAlwaysKnows View Post
Miller: No way way of controlling the rebound on the first goal. A high and hard shot in front of the net.
Second goal from Perry... do I even need to explain. Can't be faulted at all.
3rd goal is from Crosby... Let's be honest, you really think that was weak? Absolute bullet that was sniped.. Crosby is the best in the world at scoring from there.


Luongo: 1st goal it did change direction but it was a weak shot and wasn't that close to the net. Went through arm and body.
2nd, rebound, and opened up way too much for Parise. Maybe a pock check could have been useful as well...


Lu wasn't horrible, he just wasn't great. Nothing special
This is so one sided its comical.

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11-29-2012, 09:44 PM
  #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
Lol you couldn't be more wrong. I think you need to rewatch the Olympics because your account of what happened is ridiculously wrong. Also check out Ward's pathetic performance at the World Championships.

You're right about one thing though. Ward is consistent....at posting worse stats than Luongo.
Dude, Carolina vs Vancouver. Who do you think will have better goalie stats??

Montreal vs Vancouver. Who do you think will have better goalie stats???

I mean, you have to take context into account. Luongo's not what he used to be. And Ward will be in his prime in 2014.

ReDQless. I mean Ward has been .915+ consistently on a non-playoff team... Luongo is trending downwards.

Honestly, being your team's backup is reason enough to not hand you the starting job... I certainly don't want a goalie who's played 5 games all season to play in the OG, do you y2k?

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11-29-2012, 09:44 PM
  #113
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It's sad that Ward is going to win this poll because quite simply there isn't a logical argument in favor of him over Luongo and not a single person has come up with one that's well supported. All this proves is people don't know what they're talking about and I'll get my satisfaction in just over a year when Hockey Canada proves me right. Lest they decide to make a huge mistake and actually go with Ward. Then it'll just be a countdown before people make excuses for why he couldn't win for Canada.

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11-29-2012, 09:45 PM
  #114
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Quote:
Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
This is so one sided its comical.
Yet nothing I said was wrong.

You're right Miller was clearly better

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11-29-2012, 09:47 PM
  #115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MandyAlwaysKnows View Post
Dude, Carolina vs Vancouver. Who do you think will have better goalie stats??

Montreal vs Vancouver. Who do you think will have better goalie stats???

I mean, you have to take context into account. Luongo's not what he used to be. And Ward will be in his prime in 2014.

ReDQless. I mean Ward has been .915+ consistently on a non-playoff team... Luongo is trending downwards.

Honestly, being your team's backup is reason enough to not hand you the starting job... I certainly don't want a goalie who's played 5 games all season to play in the OG, do you y2k?
Ever thought that Luongo is a major reason why Vancouver is so good? In fact it was because of our goaltending that we won the Presidents trophy last year, anyone who watched the Canucks will tell you that.

You also realize that 0.915 is around league average right? Funny how you're happy with Ward being at 0.915, yet Luongo posts 0.919 in a down year and he's considered bad. thanks for the laugh though, with all the depressing rain here it was much needed.

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11-29-2012, 09:48 PM
  #116
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MandyAlwaysKnows View Post
Yet nothing I said was wrong.

You're right Miller was clearly better
Actually your "analysis" was completely wrong. How you can blame a goalie for letting in a goal where 2 opposing players were left untouched in his crease, but absolve another for a weak 5 hole goal in overtime is comical.

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11-29-2012, 09:48 PM
  #117
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1 Price
2 Ward
3 Luongo

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11-29-2012, 09:51 PM
  #118
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Quote:
Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
It's sad that Ward is going to win this poll because quite simply there isn't a logical argument in favor of him over Luongo and not a single person has come up with one that's well supported. All this proves is people don't know what they're talking about and I'll get my satisfaction in just over a year when Hockey Canada proves me right. Lest they decide to make a huge mistake and actually go with Ward. Then it'll just be a countdown before people make excuses for why he couldn't win for Canada.
Arguments for Ward over Luongo

1-Ward will be in his prime
2-Luongo will be old and worse than he was in 2011-12 (scary)
3-Luongo's stats are inflated from playing in front of the best team in hockey
4-Ward's stats are worse from playing on a bad
5-Luongo will play very little in 2013-14 due to Schneider
6-Luongo has a history of inconsistency in the regular season and playoffs

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11-29-2012, 09:57 PM
  #119
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MandyAlwaysKnows View Post
Arguments for Ward over Luongo

1-Ward will be in his prime
2-Luongo will be old and worse than he was in 2011-12 (scary)
3-Luongo's stats are inflated from playing in front of the best team in hockey
4-Ward's stats are worse from playing on a bad
5-Luongo will play very little in 2013-14 due to Schneider
6-Luongo has a history of inconsistency in the regular season and playoffs
1. Means nothing. Jose Theodore was in his prime in 2010, should he have made the team over Brodeur?
2. Scary? He posted better numbers than Ward this past year, how is it scary? Also how do you know he will be worse? With psychic abilities like that have you won the lottery?
3. No they aren't. In fact the Canucks team defense isn't anything special. Luongo is one of the major reasons we are the best team in hockey.
4. Or maybe Ward's stats are worse because he's not that good? How else do you explain his bad performance for team Canada?
5. Are you the coach of the Canucks? How can you say that with any certainty?
6. Actually Luongo has been one of the most consistent goalies in the NHL. Just because you say something doesn't mean you're not wrong.

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11-29-2012, 09:58 PM
  #120
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If Ward gets any game action for Canada at the Olympics, Canada is screwed.

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11-29-2012, 10:02 PM
  #121
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MandyAlwaysKnows View Post
Arguments for Ward over Luongo

1-Ward will be in his prime
2-Luongo will be old and worse than he was in 2011-12 (scary)
3-Luongo's stats are inflated from playing in front of the best team in hockey
4-Ward's stats are worse from playing on a bad
5-Luongo will play very little in 2013-14 due to Schneider
6-Luongo has a history of inconsistency in the regular season and playoffs
1- Yeah, was Thomas in his prime when he won the cup? How about Brodeur when he backstopped an underdog team to the SCF?

2-See point 1. Most goalies don't suddenly implode at age 35.

3/4- Goalie stats don't tend to get inflated from playing on good teams or vice versa. Unless Luongo magically started sucking when he came to Vancouver, because his average sv% is almost identical here than it was in Florida.

5-I can guarantee Schneider and Luongo won't be on the same team in 2013-2014.
6-So does every goalie ever to play. It's not like Ward is a beacon of stability himself. Luongo has actually won a gold medal. Because of that he will get the nod as starter, and it's his position to lose.

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11-29-2012, 10:06 PM
  #122
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Quote:
Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
1. Means nothing. Jose Theodore was in his prime in 2010, should he have made the team over Brodeur?
2. Scary? He posted better numbers than Ward this past year, how is it scary? Also how do you know he will be worse? With psychic abilities like that have you won the lottery?
3. No they aren't. In fact the Canucks team defense isn't anything special. Luongo is one of the major reasons we are the best team in hockey.
4. Or maybe Ward's stats are worse because he's not that good? How else do you explain his bad performance for team Canada?
5. Are you the coach of the Canucks? How can you say that with any certainty?
6. Actually Luongo has been one of the most consistent goalies in the NHL. Just because you say something doesn't mean you're not wrong.
1. Huh? Hart Trophy anyone?
2. His stats are inflated, and was bad in the playoffs... worse than he was in 2011-12 would be scary for Canada... He will be worse because of age, that's how it goes. 35 years old, ouch.
3. Dude, the Canucks gave up less than 200 goals. Burrows, Kesler, Edler and the 2nd pair, according to you guys a top 4 guy in Ballard on the 3rd pair, Hamhuis...probably missing some guys, that's a very good defensive team. Schneider showed what a real goalie does in front of that team.
4. Have you seen Carolina's team the past few years?
5. Schneider is a much better goalie. You probably expect him to make USA too, right? How is that possible? I don't think either team will take a cold backup. If they do it will be Luongo as the 3rd string.
6. ??? Wow. No. No. There is a reason for the hate that you think is irrational. I'm afraid you are wrong.

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11-29-2012, 10:10 PM
  #123
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MandyAlwaysKnows View Post
1. Huh? Hart Trophy anyone?
2. His stats are inflated, and was bad in the playoffs... worse than he was in 2011-12 would be scary fro Canada... He will be worse because of age, that's how it goes. 35 years old, ouch.
3. Dude, the Canucks gave up less than 200 goals. Burrows, Kesler, Edler and the 2nd pair, according to you guys a top 4 guy in Ballard on the 3rd pair, Hamhuis...probably missing some guys, that's a very good defensive team. Schneider showed what a real goalie does in front of that team.
4. Have you seen Carolina's team the past few years?
5. Schneider is a much better goalie. You probably expect him to make USA too, right? How is that possible? I don't think either team will take a cold backup. If they do it will be Luongo as the 3rd string.
6. ??? Wow. No. No. There is a reason for the hate that you think is irrational. I'm afraid you are wrong.
1. So? Brodeur wasn't in his prime, I thought that mattered to you? Proof that this point you came up with is bunk.
2. That's how it goes? Tell that to Tim Thomas, Dwayne Roloson, Martin Brodeur (who had a renaissance this year after a few sub par years), etc. proof this point is bunk.
3. The Canucks gave up less than 200 goals BECAUSE of Luongo this isn't a point.
4. Yes I have. Have you addressed my counter argument? No you haven't.
5. I think Luongo and Schneider will split time or one will be traded and both will be full time starters. This point is bunk.
6. The stats prove you wrong. This point is bunk.

Can you come up with anything that's legitimate and not pure crap?

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11-29-2012, 10:12 PM
  #124
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Luongo. He'll probably start too.

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11-29-2012, 10:13 PM
  #125
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vankiller Whale View Post
1- Yeah, was Thomas in his prime when he won the cup? How about Brodeur when he backstopped an underdog team to the SCF?

2-See point 1. Most goalies don't suddenly implode at age 35.

3/4- Goalie stats don't tend to get inflated from playing on good teams or vice versa. Unless Luongo magically started sucking when he came to Vancouver, because his average sv% is almost identical here than it was in Florida.

5-I can guarantee Schneider and Luongo won't be on the same team in 2013-2014.
6-So does every goalie ever to play. It's not like Ward is a beacon of stability himself. Luongo has actually won a gold medal. Because of that he will get the nod as starter, and it's his position to lose.
1-Thomas is a freak, everyone knows that. There is nothing normal about him. Brodeur is WAY past his prime, sorry. I mean LOL at Brodeur... do you think he should be there because of his performance this year too?
2-Well they decline, just like every other player. Doesn't mean they can't play anymore, just means they aren't as good.
3/4-Lu's not as good as he was in florida. And goalie stats aren't inflated?!!! Mike Smith, Brian Elliott, etc. Check out the Save% leaders... all from playoff teams. Are you for real?
5-Leafs are interested. No one else. How can you make that guarantee, especially when Gillis thinks like Canicks fans (overrates him) and everyone else thinks something closer to me?
6-He can lose it quite easily. Was far from spectacular in 2011-12. Not playing this year. In y2k's words, ''has horrible octobers'' or something like that... yeah I don't like his chances.

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