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Old
11-30-2012, 10:52 PM
  #26
Bleedred
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No way. No way to the JVR/Larsson swap either. Not super impressed with Kadri, but he did have that sweet shootout goal on Marty.

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Old
11-30-2012, 10:53 PM
  #27
Drew311
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Superunknown94 View Post
Why would/should the Devils do this?
The reasoning was Zidlicky is a UFA after this season and is not a sure fire re-sign. Yes Larsson is considered a puck mover but Gardiner's pure offensive/PP abilities surpass Larsson's. Sure the Devils have some good young defensemen in their system, but none are as proven to the extent of Gardiner.

Granted, I did overlook the thinness of NJ's forward group, but people are making Kadri out to be some kind of bust or throw-in. Reality is he's still considered a legitimate prospect and is highly skilled.

I still think the value is there, but as many have pointed out, both teams probably wouldn't pull the trigger.

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Old
11-30-2012, 10:56 PM
  #28
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I don't see us bringing back Zidlicky. We already need to purge a D man as we have 7 NHL D men right now, and 1 pretty solid depth guy in Harrold. If I had my way I'd throw away Tallinder, and Volchenkov(NTC) and re sign Zidlicky. We have too many defensive defensemen, and both of those guys fall into that category. That won't happen though. Larsson or Gelinas will be good PP QB's.

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Old
11-30-2012, 11:11 PM
  #29
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Agreed that, in a vacuum, the value is there.

But, in terms of needs and overall value to the team.... all it does is make a bad situation worse in New Jersey.

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Old
11-30-2012, 11:30 PM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zippy316 View Post
That's exactly the point.

Could Gardiner quarterback a power play for us? Sure. Do we really need him that badly to give up a position of weakness (top-six forward)? Not at all. Is he that much of an upgrade over Zidlicky to make it worth it? Absolutely not and personally I'd rather Zidlicky than Gardiner.
Would you now? Uh huh.

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Old
11-30-2012, 11:36 PM
  #31
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Omg yes, more Dman!!!

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Old
12-01-2012, 12:15 AM
  #32
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The Devils have a plethora of good defenseman prospects and an absence of good forward prospects, and we're going to trade our best young forward and our best forward prospect for a forward prospect whose development has stalled and a defenseman? Why?

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Old
12-01-2012, 12:30 AM
  #33
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Omg yes, more Dman!!!
Amazing avatar haha, I almost spit out my drink

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Old
12-01-2012, 06:00 AM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 7even View Post
Would you now? Uh huh.
Yes I would too.

Before the debacle in MInnesota where he was benched, not used properly, and hadn't bought into the system he is a 40 point defenseman who is ON our roster. We don't need to give up Adam Henrique who, if Zajac resigns, will be our #2 C.

So based on the fact that we don't want to give up Adam Henrique I'd take Marek Zidlicky over Jake Gardiner.

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Old
12-01-2012, 08:17 AM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vankiller Whale View Post
The Devils need more forwards and less defensemen. Not the other way around.
Exactly this. Gardiner is a nice player, but we don't need him.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leaffan16 View Post
What do you think of JVR+ for Larsson NJD fans?
Larsson is the cornerstone of the future Devils defence. Literally zero chance he is moved.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Drew311 View Post
Granted, I did overlook the thinness of NJ's forward group, but people are making Kadri out to be some kind of bust or throw-in. Reality is he's still considered a legitimate prospect and is highly skilled.
If you're considering trading a forward to the Devils, you have to consider how well the guy plays defence, or at least his capacity to learn to play good defence. Looking at Kadri... no. Just no.

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Old
12-01-2012, 09:08 AM
  #36
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Originally Posted by Drew311 View Post


Jake Gardiner
Nazem Kadri



Adam Henrique
Stefan Matteau
Henrique is a small center. Leafs have Bozak, Grabovsky, Connolly etc. etc. They are a dime a dozen.

Gardnier is one of the best skating D in the legue.

Kadri is a better prospect than Matteau.

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Old
12-01-2012, 09:24 AM
  #37
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I can't believe Devils' fans are saying no to this...

Toronto get fleeced in this one..

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Old
12-01-2012, 09:32 AM
  #38
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Originally Posted by WildcatMapleLeafs28 View Post
I can't believe Devils' fans are saying no to this...

Toronto get fleeced in this one..
A calder trophy finalist (when we are already depleted at forward) and a prospect for a defenseman (which we have 8 of as it currently is) and a forward prospect who hasn't proven squat in the NHL yet.

It's not that hard to see from the Devils' perspective why this would be rejected.

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Old
12-01-2012, 09:41 AM
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zippy316 View Post
Toronto fans see Gardiner, don't see Kovalchuk, reply AINEC

Devils fans see Henrique, don't see the entire Toronto team coming back, reply AINEC

Value is certainly fair. Henrique is a solid all-around 50-60 point centerman with the intangibles that you can't teach. He's the type of player that's more valuable to his team than elsewhere, but as for purely trade market value, this deal is as close as it gets.
I wouldn't reply AINEC if i saw Zajac, and not necessarily Kovalchuk...

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Old
12-01-2012, 09:57 AM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WildcatMapleLeafs28 View Post
I can't believe Devils' fans are saying no to this...

Toronto get fleeced in this one..
It's not about value, it's about the fact that the devils need a C a lot more than a D right now.

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Old
12-01-2012, 10:15 AM
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WildcatMapleLeafs28 View Post
I can't believe Devils' fans are saying no to this...

Toronto get fleeced in this one..
It would be like Toronto giving up Gardiner for another RW where we already have Kesssel, Lupul, JVR, Kulemin and Kadri all able to play.

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Old
12-01-2012, 10:17 AM
  #42
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Originally Posted by birddog View Post
Henrique is a small center. Leafs have Bozak, Grabovsky, Connolly etc. etc. They are a dime a dozen.

Gardnier is one of the best skating D in the legue.

Kadri is a better prospect than Matteau.
Comparing Henrique to those guys is like comparing apples and oranges. Totally different players.

Players like Henrique aren't a dime a dozen. There's not many second line centerman like him with the intangibles he has and he is clutch.

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Old
12-01-2012, 10:19 AM
  #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WildcatMapleLeafs28 View Post
I can't believe Devils' fans are saying no to this...

Toronto get fleeced in this one..
Devils forwards:

Kovalchuk-Zajac-Zubrus
Elias-Henrique-Butler
Tedenby-Josefson-Clarkson
Carter-Gionta-Bernier
Barch/Janssen

Devils defense:

Tallinder-Fayne
Salvador-Zidlicky
Greene-Larsson
Volchenkov-Harrold

Now does it make sense why the Devils say no? Combine that with the fact that we are extremely weak on forward prospects and really strong in our defensive pool, and then you have your answer.

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Old
12-01-2012, 12:09 PM
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zippy316 View Post
Comparing Henrique to those guys is like comparing apples and oranges. Totally different players.

Players like Henrique aren't a dime a dozen. There's not many second line centerman like him with the intangibles he has and he is clutch.
Leafs already have Grabosky and Bozak. Both good on draws and sound defensively. There is little difference here.

Gardiner showed more as a rookie than Larson. Granted Larson was real young. But the point is you don't give up a very good young defenseman for a small second line center. A player like Adam is much easier to find in this league compared to Gardiner.

Kadri also has more potential than Matteau.

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Old
12-01-2012, 12:10 PM
  #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zippy316 View Post
Devils forwards:

Kovalchuk-Zajac-Zubrus
Elias-Henrique-Butler
Tedenby-Josefson-Clarkson
Carter-Gionta-Bernier
Barch/Janssen

Devils defense:

Tallinder-Fayne
Salvador-Zidlicky
Greene-Larsson
Volchenkov-Harrold

Now does it make sense why the Devils say no? Combine that with the fact that we are extremely weak on forward prospects and really strong in our defensive pool, and then you have your answer.
That top 4 on D is scaring nobody.

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Old
12-01-2012, 12:14 PM
  #46
Top 6 Spaling
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Quote:
Originally Posted by birddog View Post
Leafs already have Grabosky and Bozak. Both good on draws and sound defensively. There is little difference here.

Gardiner showed more as a rookie than Larson. Granted Larson was real young. But the point is you don't give up a very good young defenseman for a small second line center. A player like Adam is much easier to find in this league compared to Gardiner.

Kadri also has more potential than Matteau.
I agree this trade doesn't help Toronto. It doesn't help NJD either. Neither team does it.

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Old
12-01-2012, 12:33 PM
  #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by birddog View Post
That top 4 on D is scaring nobody.
Who cares if you're scared or not? It was good enough for the Cup Finals.

As for Henrique, here's the list of +50 point rookie centers since the lockout:

Sidney Crosby
Evgeni Malkin
Anze Kopitar
Nicklas Backstrom
Jonathan Toews
John Tavares
Ryan Nugent-Hopkins
Paul Stastny
Logan Couture
Jeff Skinner
Adam Henrique
Peter Mueller
Matt Duchene


What a bunch of dime-a-dozen scrubs.

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Old
12-01-2012, 12:38 PM
  #48
hlaverty06
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Originally Posted by AfroThunder396 View Post
Who cares if you're scared or not? It was good enough for the Cup Finals.

As for Henrique, here's the list of +50 point rookie centers since the lockout:

Sidney Crosby
Evgeni Malkin
Anze Kopitar
Nicklas Backstrom
Jonathan Toews
John Tavares
Ryan Nugent-Hopkins
Paul Stastny
Logan Couture
Jeff Skinner
Adam Henrique
Peter Mueller
Matt Duchene


What a bunch of dime-a-dozen scrubs.
We should've signed Peter Mueller

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Old
12-01-2012, 12:53 PM
  #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by birddog View Post
That top 4 on D is scaring nobody.
Who cares ???? It gets the job done and we win games with it

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Old
12-01-2012, 01:07 PM
  #50
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Originally Posted by birddog View Post
That top 4 on D is scaring nobody.
Actually a pretty good top 4 IMO, plus Larsson will join it next season and make it even better. Just cause it doesnt have any big, overrated players in it doesnt mean its not effective

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