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Mika Zibanejad is the real deal.

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Old
12-01-2012, 09:15 PM
  #776
John Holmes*
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I like him too, I just think he's more raw, and more of a project than most people think.

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12-01-2012, 09:48 PM
  #777
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What about Reilly instead of Kadri then? I don't think Reilly will be that good.
Don't mention this proposal around other leaf fans. They will skin you alive.

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12-01-2012, 10:06 PM
  #778
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Originally Posted by rob1989 View Post
I'm willing to bet that we had Hamilton higher than Zibanejad on our board - based on comments by Murray/Dorion last year. They implied they went with forwards instead of BPA and I wouldn't be surprised if they meant Zibanejad over Hamilton.
I believe it. They thought the best decision for the org was the forward. Not gonna strike gold every year.

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12-01-2012, 11:18 PM
  #779
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I was delighted to see Couturier available when we were going up to pick and thought for sure he'd be our guy. I don't mind Mika, though
I wanted couturier too and was so excited when he was still available, but of the 2 i think it's fair to say couturier is now closer to his ceiling than zibanejad. So he may be the better player right now but just wait. I think we'll be happy.

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12-01-2012, 11:41 PM
  #780
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I wanted couturier too and was so excited when he was still available, but of the 2 i think it's fair to say couturier is now closer to his ceiling than zibanejad. So he may be the better player right now but just wait. I think we'll be happy.
This is exactly what I've been trying to say. Everyone knew Couturier was more NHL ready than Zibanejad so it boggles my mind when people are so surprised that Couturier is doing better now than Zibanejad. Heck, not like Zibanejad has totally been nothing. Just look at his WJC performance. Zibanejad is still more raw and to me he hasn't come close to scratching the surface, Couturier is more accustomed to the NA game and such.

I'm not saying that Couturier will stop progressing on his season last year, I'm just saying that in 2-3 years, Zibanejad will be the better player.

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12-01-2012, 11:59 PM
  #781
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I like him too, I just think he's more raw, and more of a project than most people think.
Well I thought it was clear to everybody from the get go... it has been said so many times : Zibanejad is raw and needs development.

The Sens didn't pick him to play in the NHL right away. Another thing is the coach MacLean who wanted to keep him, I think it confuses people

Zibanejad is ready for 3rd line minutes... just like Couturier, but the Sens want more out of Zibanejad and they will take their time to develop him properly

/thread

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12-02-2012, 12:25 AM
  #782
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Originally Posted by ReginKarlssonLehner View Post

I'm not saying that Couturier will stop progressing on his season last year, I'm just saying that in 2-3 years, Zibanejad will be the better player.
We hope

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12-02-2012, 02:40 AM
  #783
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I think that its a pity Zibanejad was signed last year in Sweden because if he spent a year or two in the OHL he would have had a more realistic chance of reaching his full potential

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12-02-2012, 08:55 AM
  #784
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Originally Posted by ReginKarlssonLehner View Post
This is exactly what I've been trying to say. Everyone knew Couturier was more NHL ready than Zibanejad so it boggles my mind when people are so surprised that Couturier is doing better now than Zibanejad. Heck, not like Zibanejad has totally been nothing. Just look at his WJC performance. Zibanejad is still more raw and to me he hasn't come close to scratching the surface, Couturier is more accustomed to the NA game and such.

I'm not saying that Couturier will stop progressing on his season last year, I'm just saying that in 2-3 years, Zibanejad will be the better player.
He wasn't playing well at all at the WJC. He scored the big goal but I think most Swedes would agree that he was not really at his best that tournament.

As for Couturier, I don't think everyone remember how big a year he had. He played against the toughest competition on a good playoff team, and starter in the defensive zone more than any forward. Even with these tough minutes, he managed to put up a respectable number of points despite stone hands on both wings for the most part. It's pretty damn impressive and something Ziba will be in tough to repeat ever.

Hopefully Mika will be something like that and even better production, but Couturier's rookie season was more impressive than he gets credit for.

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12-02-2012, 09:57 AM
  #785
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I think that its a pity Zibanejad was signed last year in Sweden because if he spent a year or two in the OHL he would have had a more realistic chance of reaching his full potential
did he even get drafted by a CHL team?? i know he KHL but he said he would never go there to play

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12-02-2012, 10:10 AM
  #786
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I think that its a pity Zibanejad was signed last year in Sweden because if he spent a year or two in the OHL he would have had a more realistic chance of reaching his full potential
While I agree last year in the SEL wasn't the best situation for Zib, I still believe playing against men in a good league is better than dominating in juniors from a development perspective.

Zib is playing top line minutes in the AHL, also on the PP and PK. Overall he has looked very strong, just not flashy yet.

The only real knock people may have against him is production.

However it is worth keeping in mind he, like Silf, is adjusting to NA rinks, AHL schedules and travel, as well as playing out of position for the first 14 games or so.

There is nothing I see with Zib that suggests he isn't going to be a good NHL player, the only question is how good.

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12-02-2012, 10:16 AM
  #787
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I don't think Zibanejad will ever be as good as Couturier. We're going to look pretty stupid for passing on him, but we won't be alone.

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12-02-2012, 10:26 AM
  #788
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Originally Posted by steffeG View Post
He wasn't playing well at all at the WJC. He scored the big goal but I think most Swedes would agree that he was not really at his best that tournament.

As for Couturier, I don't think everyone remember how big a year he had. He played against the toughest competition on a good playoff team, and starter in the defensive zone more than any forward. Even with these tough minutes, he managed to put up a respectable number of points despite stone hands on both wings for the most part. It's pretty damn impressive and something Ziba will be in tough to repeat ever.

Hopefully Mika will be something like that and even better production, but Couturier's rookie season was more impressive than he gets credit for.
Maybe he didn't play that well, but in six games he scored 4 goals with 1 assist and was plus-three. One of those goals was the gold-medal winning goal for Sweden in a 1-0 OT win over Russia.

That same tournament Couturier scored 2 goals and added 1 assist for 3 points.

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12-02-2012, 10:29 AM
  #789
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Originally Posted by John Holmes View Post
I don't think Zibanejad will ever be as good as Couturier. We're going to look pretty stupid for passing on him, but we won't be alone.
Fair enough John, I like both players, but having the opportunity to watch Zib play since the draft, believe he has more upside.

Only time will tell.

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12-02-2012, 10:35 AM
  #790
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Originally Posted by Holdurbreathe View Post
Maybe he didn't play that well, but in six games he scored 4 goals with 1 assist and was plus-three. One of those goals was the gold-medal winning goal for Sweden in a 1-0 OT win over Russia.

That same tournament Couturier scored 2 goals and added 1 assist for 3 points.
Couturier never played last year, he was in the NHL

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12-02-2012, 10:36 AM
  #791
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I agree to an extent, but the lack of scoring is what bothers me. That is just something that you either can do, or can't do.

I can't even count how many times I've seen Michalek blow a breakaway or a great chance, and yet he's still put up a couple of 60 point seasons.

If Zibanejad has worse hands than that...I just don't understand why expectations are so high for him.

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12-02-2012, 12:48 PM
  #792
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Originally Posted by John Holmes View Post
I agree to an extent, but the lack of scoring is what bothers me. That is just something that you either can do, or can't do.

I can't even count how many times I've seen Michalek blow a breakaway or a great chance, and yet he's still put up a couple of 60 point seasons.

If Zibanejad has worse hands than that...I just don't understand why expectations are so high for him.
Zibanejad is a player that I see in the exact the same mold as Michalek. However, Zibby has the advantage of having that beauty of a one timer, a tool that Michalek does not posses. He`s also a bit meaner on the ice.

Having said that I wont be surprised if they have similar career totals, with the slight edge (hopefully) going to Zibanejad.

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12-02-2012, 12:56 PM
  #793
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Couturier never played last year, he was in the NHL
Same tournament though, is it not?.

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12-02-2012, 12:58 PM
  #794
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Originally Posted by Holdurbreathe View Post
Same tournament though, is it not?.
To be fair, Sean was younger than Mika when he played in the U20

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12-02-2012, 12:59 PM
  #795
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Originally Posted by steffeG View Post
He wasn't playing well at all at the WJC. He scored the big goal but I think most Swedes would agree that he was not really at his best that tournament.

As for Couturier, I don't think everyone remember how big a year he had. He played against the toughest competition on a good playoff team, and starter in the defensive zone more than any forward. Even with these tough minutes, he managed to put up a respectable number of points despite stone hands on both wings for the most part. It's pretty damn impressive and something Ziba will be in tough to repeat ever.

Hopefully Mika will be something like that and even better production, but Couturier's rookie season was more impressive than he gets credit for.
Couldn't agree more.

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Holmes View Post
I don't think Zibanejad will ever be as good as Couturier. We're going to look pretty stupid for passing on him, but we won't be alone.
I think so too & Mark Scheifele C but Zibanejad could turn into a very good two way 3rd line centre with better offensive potential than most 3rd line centres. However, I have the same hope for Derek Grant.

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12-02-2012, 01:08 PM
  #796
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Originally Posted by Samsquanch View Post
Zibanejad is a player that I see in the exact the same mold as Michalek. However, Zibby has the advantage of having that beauty of a one timer, a tool that Michalek does not posses. He`s also a bit meaner on the ice.

Having said that I wont be surprised if they have similar career totals, with the slight edge (hopefully) going to Zibanejad.
Z is a better passer and playmaker than Michalek. That's for sure.

Actually never seen Michalek make a play lol. If he gets a puck he either shoots it or skates as hard as he can towards the net so as to shoot it better.

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12-02-2012, 01:09 PM
  #797
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Originally Posted by John Holmes View Post
I agree to an extent, but the lack of scoring is what bothers me. That is just something that you either can do, or can't do.

I can't even count how many times I've seen Michalek blow a breakaway or a great chance, and yet he's still put up a couple of 60 point seasons.

If Zibanejad has worse hands than that...I just don't understand why expectations are so high for him.
I don't think the lack of production has much to do with his hands as it does to him adjusting to a smaller ice surface, a new position and new linemates.

IMO he has looked more comfortable at center and if Petersson was finishing better Zib would have more points.

However I admit I tend to believe playing within the structure of the team and winning, is better for player development than pure point production.


Last edited by Holdurbreathe: 12-02-2012 at 01:18 PM.
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12-02-2012, 01:10 PM
  #798
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Originally Posted by Samsquanch View Post
Zibanejad is a player that I see in the exact the same mold as Michalek. However, Zibby has the advantage of having that beauty of a one timer, a tool that Michalek does not posses. He`s also a bit meaner on the ice.

Having said that I wont be surprised if they have similar career totals, with the slight edge (hopefully) going to Zibanejad.
Brett Hull 2.0

Or, a kid who's scored 2 career one-timers.

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12-02-2012, 01:22 PM
  #799
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I think the biggest problem to overcome for European players coming to NA is to read the plays faster & make quicker decisions & no one really knows if a player will be able to think faster & react faster until they get here. On the bigger surfaces players have much more time to see plays develop & make plays without having a defensive player all over them. I think there are many examples of that where players are better in Europe or the AHL, then can't react quick enough in the NHL.

In NA with the smaller ice surface everything happens so much quicker & players need to react that much faster, some can adapt but a lot can't. Hopefully, our Europeans will be able to adapt. I would think that reaction time is faster in the AHL than in Europe & even faster in the NHL. I would think it's quite an adjustment for them.

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12-02-2012, 03:00 PM
  #800
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I think the biggest problem to overcome for European players coming to NA is to read the plays faster & make quicker decisions & no one really knows if a player will be able to think faster & react faster until they get here. On the bigger surfaces players have much more time to see plays develop & make plays without having a defensive player all over them. I think there are many examples of that where players are better in Europe or the AHL, then can't react quick enough in the NHL.

In NA with the smaller ice surface everything happens so much quicker & players need to react that much faster, some can adapt but a lot can't. Hopefully, our Europeans will be able to adapt. I would think that reaction time is faster in the AHL than in Europe & even faster in the NHL. I would think it's quite an adjustment for them.
I think you can find a couple predictor qualities when looking at euro prospects...

How long do they hold onto the puck for? Do they seem slow to notice their options? Even if they are good at moving the puck, if they cannot deal with a player bearing down on them then they will make poor decisions.

How good is their skating? On smaller ice, you might not need a great top gear, but enough gears to separate you from other players is what can buy you some time.

A player like Zibby IMO, does a decent job at moving the puck relatively quickly. He isnt gunna be that creative offense star that threads the needle out of nowhere, and I dont think people expect that.

But he can move it efficiently, and set himself up to shoot pretty well because he has above average mobility (including a nice explosive stride). I think for Mika the key is learning his role on NA ice, especially around the net. Once he finds his positioning a bit more I think it will only be a matter of time before he can get his shot off with more consistency. He tends to make decent decisions, I think he is learning he must make them faster.

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