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2012 CBA/Lockout talk, Part the Fifth

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Old
12-02-2012, 07:10 PM
  #76
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Quote:
The list of players hasn't been formally confirmed yet, though Josh Rimer hears that both Sidney Crosby and Adrian Aucoin will be in the room.
In a perfect world, the NHLPA should go player-for-owner with their choices. Which Boston Bruins player would step to that plate besides Shawn Thornton?

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12-02-2012, 07:10 PM
  #77
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Hey, when you can't attack the legitimacy of a posters point you may as well just try and attack the poster themselves right.

Next good point he makes, lets question whether or not he's a real fan!
The questioning fanhood argument is always great when it pops up here.

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12-02-2012, 07:27 PM
  #78
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Jacobs and Daly... good faith "negociating" by the NHL.

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12-02-2012, 08:16 PM
  #79
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Originally Posted by sooshii View Post
Puck daddy:
Patrice Bergeron of course. The guy just seems level headed in every situation on the ice and around the team it's hard to imagine he wouldn't use that same common sense, no nonsense approach in every other walk of life. Plus, you get the feeling with him that he actually loves the game and would actually push just as hard for retired and future players as he did himself instead of just talking about it to increase public sympathy for his own plight.

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12-02-2012, 08:16 PM
  #80
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Don't hold your breath.

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12-02-2012, 09:01 PM
  #81
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Originally Posted by Kaoz View Post
Patrice Bergeron of course. The guy just seems level headed in every situation on the ice and around the team it's hard to imagine he wouldn't use that same common sense, no nonsense approach in every other walk of life. Plus, you get the feeling with him that he actually loves the game and would actually push just as hard for retired and future players as he did himself instead of just talking about it to increase public sympathy for his own plight.
Too bad he's in Europe stealing someone's job.

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12-02-2012, 09:20 PM
  #82
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Too bad he's in Europe stealing someone's job.
It's not so much stealing it as it is just plain ol' being better at it.

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12-02-2012, 09:44 PM
  #83
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It's not so much stealing it as it is just plain ol' being better at it.
Call it whatever you want, he's not here helping the negotiations.

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12-02-2012, 10:38 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by patty59 View Post
Call it whatever you want, he's not here helping the negotiations.
Would he help? Would Tyler Seguin or Zdeno Chara? On one hand I'd love to hear those guys sounding off on the whole situation but on the other I'm actually kind of glad I don't have to. If it were one of them over here doing a commercial with flies landing on their eyelids and a tear in their eye, or worse, making veiled threats on an NHL reps life it'd obviously shatter the illusion that those guys aren't that type of idiotic.

With them over there it's easier to disassociate them with the rest of the pack, and perhaps to believe that there are some players that are more interested in playing hockey then arguing over how many millions of our dollars they'll get come the new CBA. It's likely BS I know, but it's a nice thought none the less.

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12-02-2012, 10:54 PM
  #85
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Originally Posted by Kaoz View Post
Would he help? Would Tyler Seguin or Zdeno Chara? On one hand I'd love to hear those guys sounding off on the whole situation but on the other I'm actually kind of glad I don't have to. If it were one of them over here doing a commercial with flies landing on their eyelids and a tear in their eye, or worse, making veiled threats on an NHL reps life it'd obviously shatter the illusion that those guys aren't that type of idiotic.

With them over there it's easier to disassociate them with the rest of the pack, and perhaps to believe that there are some players that are more interested in playing hockey then arguing over how many millions of our dollars they'll get come the new CBA. It's likely BS I know, but it's a nice thought none the less.
Still say the players should been in New York, picketing in front of the office every day...300 of em a day...unity...they also should be putting more pressure on the union heads to get a deal done...Imagine the news coverage every day of 300 NHL'ers a day totally congesting NYC...Reading Thornton the other day, and him talking about the "moderates" inside the union makes me think it's a pretty divided bunch...One that doesn't want to lose another paycheck on December 13th.

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Old
12-02-2012, 11:31 PM
  #86
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Originally Posted by Kaoz View Post
Would he help? Would Tyler Seguin or Zdeno Chara? On one hand I'd love to hear those guys sounding off on the whole situation but on the other I'm actually kind of glad I don't have to. If it were one of them over here doing a commercial with flies landing on their eyelids and a tear in their eye, or worse, making veiled threats on an NHL reps life it'd obviously shatter the illusion that those guys aren't that type of idiotic.

With them over there it's easier to disassociate them with the rest of the pack, and perhaps to believe that there are some players that are more interested in playing hockey then arguing over how many millions of our dollars they'll get come the new CBA. It's likely BS I know, but it's a nice thought none the less.
**** the PR garbage. Can't use not negotiating during a season as an excuse... and then take off to play hockey whilst your union brethren negotiate. Unacceptable.

If you're unified, then be unified. It may have done little to change the outcome, but now we'll never know. I seem to think that having the union together, informed and focused on the same goal would have been nothing but beneficial.

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Old
12-03-2012, 06:35 AM
  #87
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Originally Posted by WhamBamCam8 View Post
Still say the players should been in New York, picketing in front of the office every day...300 of em a day...unity...they also should be putting more pressure on the union heads to get a deal done...Imagine the news coverage every day of 300 NHL'ers a day totally congesting NYC...Reading Thornton the other day, and him talking about the "moderates" inside the union makes me think it's a pretty divided bunch...One that doesn't want to lose another paycheck on December 13th.
I'd actually hope most Bruins would fall on the moderate side... but in that sense you're absolutely right. If those moderates had a stronger voice it would create more pressure to get a deal done and back to hockey. But what about the negative aspects of doing so. When these players do come back to work they again need to be a team. If I were in the players shoes and there was a strike I didn't fully agree with I might just cut bait and work elsewhere as well. Aside from the lure of getting to spend a year abroad, you also distance yourself from all the infighting happening back here. Anytime you have hundreds of employees on strike you'll have a different level of commitment from each and being one of those dissenters could cause some undue harsh feelings between yourself and teammates further down the road. While it may not be the best course of action I could certainly understand someone wanting to distance themselves from such a situation as much as possible. I don't believe for a second most are playing overseas to make ends meet, they've had a year to prep for this lockout as it was all but a certainty the moment Fehr was brought on. Most have been working with their agents/accountants/financial strategists/whoever to prepare themselves for just this situation. Those who didn't should have planned better, they all make more then enough to have rainy day money. Most are likely doing it because you get to travel, you get paid to do so, and it's a kick ass experience.

There should be more then enough moderates still near the situation to properly represent the larger group, yet they don't seem to have a unified voice either. It seems to be a case of putting all your faith in the Player reps and union heads and leaving the nasty work for them while distancing yourself. Again, maybe not the most conducive approach to forcing someones hand, but one I can understand especially if it means you can avoid another Ference/Recchi like situation.

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Originally Posted by Mr. Make-Believe View Post
**** the PR garbage. Can't use not negotiating during a season as an excuse... and then take off to play hockey whilst your union brethren negotiate. Unacceptable.

If you're unified, then be unified. It may have done little to change the outcome, but now we'll never know. I seem to think that having the union together, informed and focused on the same goal would have been nothing but beneficial.
Just to be clear I don't think that is a valid excuse at all and would lose respect for any current Bruin player playing overseas who tried to spout that garbage. I haven't heard them do that however so I see no issue with it and am in fact happy they remain playing. In fact, the bleeding heart stories from Bruins just don't seem to be rearing their ugly heads although many have had their chance. Thornton's comments were likely the closest thing to it that I've heard so far, and even they were rather generic and guarded.

In short, I don't think all the players are unified. There are simply too many to all share the same opinion. There are too many that the owners proposals, in regards to the financials, will barely affect. I think there is a reason (other then PR) that you see all the leagues top players and most highly paid standing beside Fehr at each meeting. They are united because they stand to be affected far more then your average player, who would likely give more on the financials aspect in order to gain more in the contractual restrictions department.

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Old
12-03-2012, 06:51 AM
  #88
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Originally Posted by WhamBamCam8 View Post
Still say the players should been in New York, picketing in front of the office every day...300 of em a day...unity...they also should be putting more pressure on the union heads to get a deal done...Imagine the news coverage every day of 300 NHL'ers a day totally congesting NYC...Reading Thornton the other day, and him talking about the "moderates" inside the union makes me think it's a pretty divided bunch...One that doesn't want to lose another paycheck on December 13th.
Envisioning Derek Roy rolling up in his uber expensive new ride screaming about the necessity for economic fairness

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12-03-2012, 06:54 AM
  #89
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Originally Posted by patty59 View Post
Call it whatever you want, he's not here helping the negotiations.
And how is Patrice Bergeron supposed to "help the negotiations", exactly?

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12-03-2012, 07:31 AM
  #90
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And how is Patrice Bergeron supposed to "help the negotiations", exactly?
Maybe he could get the coffee and donuts

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12-03-2012, 07:43 AM
  #91
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So Jacobs is in the room

ok I guess it's WJC only for this year!!! No NHL deal with Jacobs around and no Dolan and Molson who want this **** to get settled once and for all, guess Jacobs had a big say in the 6 owners who were going to be there

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12-03-2012, 08:05 AM
  #92
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Originally Posted by Bruinsfan_37 View Post
So Jacobs is in the room

ok I guess it's WJC only for this year!!! No NHL deal with Jacobs around and no Dolan and Molson who want this **** to get settled once and for all, guess Jacobs had a big say in the 6 owners who were going to be there
As chairman of the board of governors he has a lot of say in a lot of things, the least of which was likely who the 6 owners attending would be.

When you look at who actually was chosen it's a fairly diverse group. 3 Canadian (Winnipeg, Calgary, Toronto) teams and 3 American (Pittsburgh, Boston, Tampa). Winnipeg's owner Chapman being the guy Jacobs allegedly told to know his place, and a guy allegedly in favor of ending the lockout (although that report was obviously very dubious in nature and has since been refuted by the NHL and Jets Org.). They have a struggling Southern market represented by Tampa Bay. They have the wealthiest team in the league represented in Toronto, a team that is losing revenue faster then any other right now and has a a billion reasons to want the lockout to end a.s.a.p.

The staff coming to the party will be Daly and Steve Fehr.

It will be interesting to see who represents the players side. My guess would be Crosby and Lundqvist to start with, but hopefully they can add in some guys who won't be as affected by the financial aspects of the lockout.

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12-03-2012, 08:31 AM
  #93
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Would he help? Would Tyler Seguin or Zdeno Chara? On one hand I'd love to hear those guys sounding off on the whole situation but on the other I'm actually kind of glad I don't have to. If it were one of them over here doing a commercial with flies landing on their eyelids and a tear in their eye, or worse, making veiled threats on an NHL reps life it'd obviously shatter the illusion that those guys aren't that type of idiotic.

With them over there it's easier to disassociate them with the rest of the pack, and perhaps to believe that there are some players that are more interested in playing hockey then arguing over how many millions of our dollars they'll get come the new CBA. It's likely BS I know, but it's a nice thought none the less.
You suggested that Bergeron represent the Bruins in the upcoming meeting. I said he was in Europe stealing jobs, you know, not helping negotiations.

I'm with you that I'm glad that we don't have to listen to Bruins players make fools of themselves in the media regarding this whole thing. But, as a whole, I'm with Lou and Scott that these guys(all players) shouldn't be playing hockey anywhere, they should be "here" putting pressure on getting a deal done.

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12-03-2012, 08:35 AM
  #94
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Maybe he could get the coffee and donuts
Sure, He will bring the Tim Horton's care package.

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12-03-2012, 08:39 AM
  #95
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Originally Posted by patty59 View Post
Call it whatever you want, he's not here helping the negotiations.
"Helping the negotiations"?

Are you serious? What's he going to do? What's any one player going to do?

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12-03-2012, 08:46 AM
  #96
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Originally Posted by patty59 View Post
You suggested that Bergeron represent the Bruins in the upcoming meeting. I said he was in Europe stealing jobs, you know, not helping negotiations.

I'm with you that I'm glad that we don't have to listen to Bruins players make fools of themselves in the media regarding this whole thing. But, as a whole, I'm with Lou and Scott that these guys(all players) shouldn't be playing hockey anywhere, they should be "here" putting pressure on getting a deal done.
On the other hand, when or if the lockout ends, we'll be glad to have our core players in game shape.

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12-03-2012, 08:52 AM
  #97
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Huge 48 hours coming up

players and owners meet hopefully will set the stage for a positive meeting when all the owners get together Wednesday

there are to many GOOD owners- deal makers who will get this done; as crazy as it sounds better to have Jacobs in there if he is one of the so called Hawks to hear it all first hand and make his comments and opinions then

tonight the Bruins should be playing the Coyotes

I'm very optimistic this no matter how it is played off the bat is the beginning of the end of this lockout

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12-03-2012, 08:54 AM
  #98
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"Helping the negotiations"?

Are you serious? What's he going to do? What's any one player going to do?
I've never been more serious. Every single player overseas right now, is not helping with getting a deal done. Even our beloved Bergeron. You ask what one player could do? Maybe provide some leadership?

Or hey, maybe someone else will do it. That seems to be working just fine.

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12-03-2012, 09:04 AM
  #99
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Originally Posted by patty59 View Post
I've never been more serious. Every single player overseas right now, is not helping with getting a deal done. Even our beloved Bergeron. You ask what one player could do? Maybe provide some leadership?

Or hey, maybe someone else will do it. That seems to be working just fine.
Yeah the "Let somebody else take care of it" mentality has worked great over the years for the NHLPA hasn't it?

I feel for guys like Thornton and a guy like Jay Beagle who place their futures in the hands of guys like Lundqvist and Crosby who never have to work another day in their lives.

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12-03-2012, 09:10 AM
  #100
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Originally Posted by Bruinsfan_37 View Post
So Jacobs is in the room

ok I guess it's WJC only for this year!!! No NHL deal with Jacobs around and no Dolan and Molson who want this **** to get settled once and for all, guess Jacobs had a big say in the 6 owners who were going to be there
At least MLSE is represented ... I would wager they'd prefer to get the season underway.

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