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Roster Talk '13 — Canada

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Old
12-03-2012, 09:02 PM
  #926
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And it's important to note that Murphy's coach will be in charge of the forwards not the defense so I don't think he'll have that much input into if Murphy is on the bottom pairing or if he's the 7th D man. Either way he'll be one of the four on the PP

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12-03-2012, 09:12 PM
  #927
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Faidh ar Rud Eigin View Post
Yeah and if Hamilton plays like he did in the Canada-Russia challenge he won't see any ice time.

It's safe to say if you're the best defensemen on the best junior team defensively in the world, you'll probably do OK in the international tournement.

It's not about loyalties, it's about what you know a player can do. If a player performs poorly, they'll suffer the consequences. That's not just Murphy, that's anybody.
Umm...not really. I get that you're holding onto this Murphy-Kitchener connection as a point to make Murphy more reliable, but we are not bringing the whole Kitchener team to Ufa. If we focus on Murphy as an invdividual and look at his games in the summer series and super series, we can see some defensive lapses.

Murphy is capable of playing really good defensively, but out of all the defenders that are considered locks on this team, I pretty much can only see Murphy as a viable 7th dman.

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12-03-2012, 09:14 PM
  #928
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Originally Posted by the banks View Post
And it's important to note that Murphy's coach will be in charge of the forwards not the defense so I don't think he'll have that much input into if Murphy is on the bottom pairing or if he's the 7th D man. Either way he'll be one of the four on the PP
This is true.

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Old
12-03-2012, 09:22 PM
  #929
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the banks View Post
Murphy will be pretty easily the worst defensively in the top 6, if he doesn't produce offense in games that matter I can easily see the D coach going with the 7th guy (Dumba or Sproul imo)
Spott isnt going to throw his star player under the bus. Like it or not, Murphy is on the team and he will be in the top six.

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12-03-2012, 09:33 PM
  #930
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Atomos2 View Post
Umm...not really. I get that you're holding onto this Murphy-Kitchener connection as a point to make Murphy more reliable, but we are not bringing the whole Kitchener team to Ufa. If we focus on Murphy as an invdividual and look at his games in the summer series and super series, we can see some defensive lapses.

Murphy is capable of playing really good defensively, but out of all the defenders that are considered locks on this team, I pretty much can only see Murphy as a viable 7th dman.
You're really just refuting that without actually giving a reason why. Why would the best defensmen playing 40 minutes on one of the best junior teams defensively not matter? It's proof that Murphy's doing that job, he's doing it great, and there's no reason to not play him even strength.

You can find defensive lapse's for any player. Why does it matter for Murphy and not Hamilton (Who was actually far worse in the summer tournement)? Or Rielly?

Again your last statement, it's a statement, but there's really not arguement behind it. Murphy's the most offensively gifted defensemen, he's the best skater, he's proven to be reliable and even very good defensively this year. Why would you waste your best offensive talent to only play 5 or 6 minutes a game? The 7th defensemen is going to be a guy who can fill any fill, shutdown, even strength, powerplay. Guys like Dumba or Wotherspoon fit that job better.

And Spott is the head coach, if he thinks Murphy should play top 4 minutes, he will play top 4 minutes.

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12-03-2012, 09:47 PM
  #931
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StringerBell's lineup is the best I've seen too.

I'd take McNeill over Monahan though, especially if he starts as the 13th forward. McNeill is so versatile and could play on any line at each forward position.

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12-03-2012, 10:01 PM
  #932
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Originally Posted by Ohashi_Jouzu View Post
I think I'd be leaning toward Sproul.
It depends what you're looking for from the 7th defenseman. Sproul is an offensive defenseman who's really good on the PP. Right-handed, booming shot (scores a lot of goals), PP QB, but not very good defensively. Not sure about the other guys but I really think it depends on the needs of the team. So if they have enough offensive defenseman and are fine on the PP I see them taking a more well-rounded defenseman. So it really depends on who the top-6 will be.

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12-03-2012, 10:05 PM
  #933
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This. It combines what was observed during the SSS and Canada Russia challenge - both huge factors. Also, since the SSS was so low scoring I suspect they'll use the Canada-Russia Challenge as a better benchmark as it also combined players from all 3 leagues.
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Best lineup so far, congrats!
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I liiiiike this.
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Originally Posted by Atomos2 View Post
Yup, I can picture a gold medal with this lineup.
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This is pretty good! I would maybe switch up the lines, though.
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I love that 2nd line. I could see them tear up things
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StringerBell's lineup is the best I've seen too.
Thanks guys!

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Old
12-03-2012, 10:30 PM
  #934
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Faidh ar Rud Eigin View Post
You're really just refuting that without actually giving a reason why. Why would the best defensmen playing 40 minutes on one of the best junior teams defensively not matter? It's proof that Murphy's doing that job, he's doing it great, and there's no reason to not play him even strength.

You can find defensive lapse's for any player. Why does it matter for Murphy and not Hamilton (Who was actually far worse in the summer tournement)? Or Rielly?

Again your last statement, it's a statement, but there's really not arguement behind it. Murphy's the most offensively gifted defensemen, he's the best skater, he's proven to be reliable and even very good defensively this year. Why would you waste your best offensive talent to only play 5 or 6 minutes a game? The 7th defensemen is going to be a guy who can fill any fill, shutdown, even strength, powerplay. Guys like Dumba or Wotherspoon fit that job better.

And Spott is the head coach, if he thinks Murphy should play top 4 minutes, he will play top 4 minutes.
Rielly was actually one of the better defenceman in that tournament. As for Hamilton, he's a returning player and they usually perform better than they did in the previous year, although I don't really want to make excuses for them like you probably will for Murphy. If they play badly then they shouldn't be counted on.

But the fact is, in the super series, Murphy was 1/2 of the defensive pairing that let in 2 goals 30 seconds apart in the third. Something that gave me flashbacks of that epic third period collapse 2 years ago against Russia in the finals. He has those holes in his game. Tell me how I'm suppose feel confident in Murphy's ability when I know that is a possibility.

The 7th dman can be any type of player. In 2008, Subban was the 7th dman brought to be a powerplay specialist. And no, Spott won't go up to the assistant coach whose changing the defence and say "I think Murphy should get more minutes," I don't know why you are using the coach as if Murphy is a teacher's pet or something.

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12-03-2012, 10:35 PM
  #935
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Why do so many people put Danault on the wing? I've heard him called the best faceoff guy in the Q at the very least.

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12-03-2012, 10:39 PM
  #936
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My new prediction

Huberdeau, RHN, schifflie
Drouin, mackinnon, rattie
Hudon, Strome, Ritchie
Danult, jenner, Wilson
Monahan

Hamilton, riely
Harrington, oullette
Rienhart, Murphy
Dumba

Subban
Binnington
Brossoit

Line 1 : idk if anyone remembers but in the 2011 chl top prospects game RHN and huberdeau had great chemistry and schifflie on the wing would be a solid choice. Possibly best line in the tournement.

Line 2 : goal scoring line, 3 high skilled guys who should have good chemistry and put the puck in the net

Line 3: good chemistry with Strome and ritchie. Hudon should be a good fit on LW. Ritchie brings size, hudon brings grit and Strome brings skill

Line 4 : physical line. Wilson will be a big force on wing who will create room for danult and Jenner who are more skilled but also very physical.

I would like to see mcniel and sproul there but I feel that there is to much depth and they will have a very slim chance at making the team.

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Old
12-03-2012, 10:56 PM
  #937
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scout97 View Post
My new prediction

Huberdeau, RHN, schifflie
Drouin, mackinnon, rattie
Hudon, Strome, Ritchie
Danult, jenner, Wilson
Monahan

Hamilton, riely
Harrington, oullette
Rienhart, Murphy
Dumba

Subban
Binnington
Brossoit

Line 1 : idk if anyone remembers but in the 2011 chl top prospects game RHN and huberdeau had great chemistry and schifflie on the wing would be a solid choice. Possibly best line in the tournement.

Line 2 : goal scoring line, 3 high skilled guys who should have good chemistry and put the puck in the net

Line 3: good chemistry with Strome and ritchie. Hudon should be a good fit on LW. Ritchie brings size, hudon brings grit and Strome brings skill

Line 4 : physical line. Wilson will be a big force on wing who will create room for danult and Jenner who are more skilled but also very physical.

I would like to see mcniel and sproul there but I feel that there is to much depth and they will have a very slim chance at making the team.
McNeill over Wilson, Wilson can come back next year, McNeill brings physicality as well along with better skills and skating.

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Old
12-03-2012, 11:13 PM
  #938
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Atomos2 View Post
Rielly was actually one of the better defenceman in that tournament. As for Hamilton, he's a returning player and they usually perform better than they did in the previous year, although I don't really want to make excuses for them like you probably will for Murphy. If they play badly then they shouldn't be counted on.

But the fact is, in the super series, Murphy was 1/2 of the defensive pairing that let in 2 goals 30 seconds apart in the third. Something that gave me flashbacks of that epic third period collapse 2 years ago against Russia in the finals. He has those holes in his game. Tell me how I'm suppose feel confident in Murphy's ability when I know that is a possibility.

The 7th dman can be any type of player. In 2008, Subban was the 7th dman brought to be a powerplay specialist. And no, Spott won't go up to the assistant coach whose changing the defence and say "I think Murphy should get more minutes," I don't know why you are using the coach as if Murphy is a teacher's pet or something.
And so was Murphy. Murphy was Canada's best player in the other games.

And you're absolutely wrong about Spott letting the assistant coach set lines. The head coaches decisions trumps all. Most teams in the NHL have one associate coach handle special teams, well if the powerplay sucks the coach will take over, and the coach usually decides who plays. While another coach may handle the defense in practice, Spott absolutely will set the lines and will be the one giving out minutes. If Spott thinks Murphy deserves the minutes (And he has said numerous times in Kitchener that he does deserve them), Murphy will get them.

I don't know where people are getting this idea that one coach decides which defensive parings go out and and the head coach decides the forwards. Where is this coming from? This isn't how any coaching system works in hockey. The head coach has absolute authority.

Quote:
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Why do so many people put Danault on the wing? I've heard him called the best faceoff guy in the Q at the very least.
Because he's a winger? You can take faceoffs but play on the wing. Plenty of guys in the NHL do it, Steve Ott is a good example.

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Old
12-03-2012, 11:29 PM
  #939
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Subban
Brossoit

Hamilton, rielly
Harrington, oullette
Rienhart, Wootherspoom
Murphy

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12-03-2012, 11:30 PM
  #940
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where is ryan murray?

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Old
12-03-2012, 11:32 PM
  #941
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where is ryan murray?
injured

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12-03-2012, 11:34 PM
  #942
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Huberdeau - Nugent-Hopkins - Rattie
Drouin - MacKinnon - Scheifele
Jenner - Strome - Ritchie
Danault - Catenacci - McNeill/Wilson
Monahan

Rielly - Hamilton
Ouellet - Harrington
Reinhart - Murphy
Dumba

Subban
Brossoit

The forwards after the top 6 are going to be all over the place, but the defense and goaltenders are easy to pick, IMO. On paper, at least.

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Old
12-03-2012, 11:36 PM
  #943
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Originally Posted by Faidh ar Rud Eigin View Post
And so was Murphy. Murphy was Canada's best player in the other games.

And you're absolutely wrong about Spott letting the assistant coach set lines. The head coaches decisions trumps all. Most teams in the NHL have one associate coach handle special teams, well if the powerplay sucks the coach will take over, and the coach usually decides who plays. While another coach may handle the defense in practice, Spott absolutely will set the lines and will be the one giving out minutes. If Spott thinks Murphy deserves the minutes (And he has said numerous times in Kitchener that he does deserve them), Murphy will get them.

I don't know where people are getting this idea that one coach decides which defensive parings go out and and the head coach decides the forwards. Where is this coming from? This isn't how any coaching system works in hockey. The head coach has absolute authority.



Because he's a winger? You can take faceoffs but play on the wing. Plenty of guys in the NHL do it, Steve Ott is a good example.
If Murphy deserves the time, he'll get the time. If he ends up being a liability like he was in game 2 and the super series than he won't. BTW, I'm all for Murphy getting regular time if it helps team Canada, but in international games I put team success above individual success. I wasn't comfortable with Murphy's game in game 2 of the summer series; my friend was even screaming to keep Murphy off the ice. But in the next game we were excited everytime he was out there.

And before you use the ever so popular "that's just one game" statement, you should realize that this tournament is based off one game eliminations so all it takes is one bad game.


Last edited by Atomos2: 12-04-2012 at 12:14 AM.
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Old
12-03-2012, 11:40 PM
  #944
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My prediction

Monahan-RNH-Scheifele
Huberdeau-Strome-Ritchie
Drouin-MacKinnon-McNeill
Danault-Jenner-Lipon
Rattie or Hudon

Rielly-Hamilton
Harrington-Ouellet
Reinhart-Murphy
Dumba

Subban
Brosssoit
Binnington

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Old
12-03-2012, 11:53 PM
  #945
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What we will actually see, for all you fools who expect to see a '95 on the second line.

Huberdeau-RNH-Schiefele
Drouin-Strome-Rattie
Hudon-Jenner-Ritchie
Danault-MacKinnon-Wilson
Monahan

Reilly-Hamilton
Harrington-Ouellet
Murphy-Reinhart
Dumba

oh my god am i looking forward to this. boy do we deserve it!

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Old
12-04-2012, 12:09 AM
  #946
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I do believe you are selling binnington short or the character part has everyone forgot this kid had to come in cold to win game 6 and game 7 in o/t against the top ranked team in the chl for the attack to win the ohl championship? was named the top goalie of the memorial cup? and he has only gotten better since. so dont sell this kid short when the chips are down is when you see him play his best. would not shock me in the least to see him earn the starters job right out of camp. and remember spott has seen binnington play more then any of the other goalies and knows he is capable of making that big save when needed the most. he is not leading the ohl in most catagories for goalies by fluke.nothing against subban he is very capable goalie as well. just saying i think everyone is giving that starters job upa tad early. and yes ill admit im biased.but facts are facts this kid is as good under pressure as anyone.

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Old
12-04-2012, 12:17 AM
  #947
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Calirose View Post
What we will actually see, for all you fools who expect to see a '95 on the second line.

Huberdeau-RNH-Schiefele
Drouin-Strome-Rattie
Hudon-Jenner-Ritchie
Danault-MacKinnon-Wilson
Monahan

Reilly-Hamilton
Harrington-Ouellet
Murphy-Reinhart
Dumba

oh my god am i looking forward to this. boy do we deserve it!
Easy there big boy

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Old
12-04-2012, 12:23 AM
  #948
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Where did I exaggerate? Please elaborate.
Although I'm only replying to one person and one post, I'm really replying to both posters but too lazy to multiquote the convo.

What advance stats can you use for prospects? There is only boxcar stats. CHL doesn't have players shots or time on ice or anything of the sort. Heck, AHL doesn't even have advance stats.

Why is the argument against people who use stats to supplement what they observe always something along the lines of I know because I watch the game. It makes no sense.... Does the other person not watch the game? Does watching clear you from mistakes? errors? over weighting something that is rare but stands out in your memory?

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Old
12-04-2012, 12:42 AM
  #949
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Rattie - Nugent-Hopkins - Schiefele
Huberdeau - Strome - MacKinnon
Jenner - Danault - Hudon
Ritchie - Monahan - McNeill
Drouin/Shinkaruk

Reilly - Hamilton
Harrington - Ouellet
Reinhart - Dumba
Murphy

Subban
Binnington

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Old
12-04-2012, 01:28 AM
  #950
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I think a lot of people who don't watch RNH regularly will be surprised by how strong he is on the puck along the boards, especially against kids as opposed to the men he's been playing against the last year and a half, and his fiestiness (he's thrown some big hits and has been playing some scrappy games in the AHL this year).

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