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The trade that will never happen

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Old
12-04-2012, 05:10 PM
  #26
topchowda
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Petro is one of the best young defensman in the NHL, if no the best under 25. These players are a once every 15 years type players

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Old
12-04-2012, 05:10 PM
  #27
Phion Keneuf
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BleedBlue247 View Post
Good joke. Kessel will be a ufa in a year and a half and Phaneuf is not nearly as good as pietrangelo.
Yea and I'm sure the Leafs will let Kessel walk.

Makes sense right?


Pietrangelo = great #1
Phaneuf = lower end #1

Kessel = consistent 30+ goal scorer and our best player.

The difference between Pietrangelo and Phaneuf is no where near a player of Kessels talent.

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Old
12-04-2012, 05:13 PM
  #28
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Pietrangelo is probably the highest-valued defenseman right now. His value is higher than Suter, Weber Keith, etc. because he's a top 10 defenseman right now and he's pretty cheap until he hits RFA. St. Louis wouldn't trade him for anyone not named Stamkos or Tavares.

Add in their most prized prospect in Tarasenko and you can see why St. Louis wouldn't even consider this. Besides, I doubt Kessel fits into Hitchcock's defense-first system.

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Old
12-04-2012, 05:13 PM
  #29
Vladys Gumption
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phion Keneuf View Post
Yea and I'm sure the Leafs will let Kessel walk.

Makes sense right?


Pietrangelo = great #1
Phaneuf = lower end #1

Kessel = consistent 30+ goal scorer and our best player.

The difference between Pietrangelo and Phaneuf is no where near a player of Kessels talent.
And yet you completely ignore the fact that Hitch would eat him alive. A soft one-dimensional forward that plays zero defense? Yea that'll happen. Who says he would re-sign with the Blues either? Whether you want to admit it or not, a player's contract status most definitely lessens his value.

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Old
12-04-2012, 05:16 PM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BleedBlue247 View Post
And yet you completely ignore the fact that Hitch would eat him alive. A soft one-dimensional forward that plays zero defense? Yea that'll happen. Who says he would re-sign with the Blues either? Whether you want to admit it or not, a player's contract status most definitely lessens his value.
Again, the deals great if Phaneuf and Kessel are not extended, but if they are there is a difference between "Leaf fans are delusional if they think this is bad for them" and "Neither player fits our system so although the value is in our favour it will essentially hurt our team".

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Old
12-04-2012, 05:22 PM
  #31
Vladys Gumption
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Originally Posted by chrisx101 View Post
Again, the deals great if Phaneuf and Kessel are not extended, but if they are there is a difference between "Leaf fans are delusional if they think this is bad for them" and "Neither player fits our system so although the value is in our favour it will essentially hurt our team".
Except all I'm being told is how terrible it is for the Leafs. They would be a better team in the long run, and the Blues would be worse. So yes, it's a good deal for Toronto.

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Old
12-04-2012, 05:29 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by BleedBlue247 View Post
Except all I'm being told is how terrible it is for the Leafs. They would be a better team in the long run, and the Blues would be worse. So yes, it's a good deal for Toronto.
How exactly would thye be better in the long run? The difference between Kessel and Pietro is 2 years and between Phaneuf and Pietro is 5.... Its not like we are trading 30+ years olds for world class 20 year olds. The Leafs are dealing a #1 D for a #1 D and a top 5 RW in the game for a top 5 prospect...


Last edited by The Podium: 12-04-2012 at 05:44 PM.
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Old
12-04-2012, 05:33 PM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisx101 View Post
How exactly would thye be better in the long run? The difference between Kessel and Pietro is 2 years and between Phaneuf and Pietro is 3.... Its not like we are trading 30+ years olds for world class 20 year olds. The Leafs are dealing a #1 D for a #1 D and a top 5 RW in the game for a top 5 prospect...
You need to learn how to do math dude. Phaneuf is 27, Petro is 22. 5 years is a hell of a lot, epsecially considering Pietrangelo is already significantly better. Tarasenko is about to turn 21. Kessel is 25. Kessel is better now, but Tarasenko will be a dandy in two years.

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Old
12-04-2012, 05:43 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by BleedBlue247 View Post
You need to learn how to do math dude. Phaneuf is 27, Petro is 22. 5 years is a hell of a lot, epsecially considering Pietrangelo is already significantly better. Tarasenko is about to turn 21. Kessel is 25. Kessel is better now, but Tarasenko will be a dandy in two years.
Sorry, I though Phaneuf was a year older than Kessel and neglected the extra year between Kessel and Pietrangelo since October is only 4 months before January Also it is highly unlikely that Tarasenko ever has a season like the one Kessel just had, he leaded his position and as much as Pietro is "the best D under 25" (which i dont agree with), Kessel can be argued to be the best player in his position. The value difference between Pietro and Phaneuf is not comparable between that of Kessel and Tarasenko.

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Old
12-04-2012, 05:49 PM
  #35
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Kessel is NOT the best at his position...He doesn't even play in his own end!

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12-04-2012, 05:50 PM
  #36
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Wow...some homers in here.

Firstly...I imagine this will be locked soon.

Secondly, how can anyone think that this is a good deal for the Leafs? Honestly? Pietrangelo is a great Defenseman....but from the way you're all talking is that he's the second coming of bobby Orr here.

He's not. I'm just going to go ahead and say that.

Kessel is one of the best wingers in the league right now. He may not be there defensively...but let's face it...on St. Louis...he don't need to be.

I honestly now nothing about Tarasenko, but it's puzzling that at 21 he hasn't broken into the league yet, considering what his pedigree is supposed to be.

Even with Kessel and Phaneuf, St. Louis is a playoff team. That being said I don't see a reason for St. Louis to make this trade. Just like I don't see a reason for Toronto to make this trade.

I can see why Blues fans wouldn't make this deal...but don't kid yourself, it's terrible for Toronto as well.

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Old
12-04-2012, 05:50 PM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisx101 View Post
Sorry, I though Phaneuf was a year older than Kessel and neglected the extra year between Kessel and Pietrangelo since October is only 4 months before January Also it is highly unlikely that Tarasenko ever has a season like the one Kessel just had, he leaded his position and as much as Pietro is "the best D under 25" (which i dont agree with), Kessel can be argued to be the best player in his position. The value difference between Pietro and Phaneuf is not comparable between that of Kessel and Tarasenko.
Firstly, where did I ever say Pietrangelo is the best D under 25? I didn't. He is top 3 for sure. And Kessel's the best player at his position? Kovalchuck, Parise, and St. Louis say hi. Who says Tarasenko won't ever have a season like Kessel? He was for all intents and purposes a top 5 talent his draft year, and he's only increased his stock. Again, Kessel and Phaneuf don't fit Hitch's system like Petro and Tarasenko do, which lowers their value to the Blues. So you can go ahead and keep your guys.

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Old
12-04-2012, 05:52 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by CarvinSigX View Post
Kessel is NOT the best at his position...He doesn't even play in his own end!
I said arguable...I consider him top 5 however.

Only Hossa and Perry would be clearly better IMO, Iginla and St. Louis are reaching in age and a slight decline is becoming evident, and i have him on par with Gaborik and Parise. (Kovalchuck was a LW last season)

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12-04-2012, 05:54 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by laundryman View Post
Stamkos for Shelly and a 7th
Philly says throw in St Louis or no deal

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12-04-2012, 05:55 PM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BleedBlue247 View Post
Firstly, where did I ever say Pietrangelo is the best D under 25? I didn't. He is top 3 for sure. And Kessel's the best player at his position? Kovalchuck, Parise, and St. Louis say hi. Who says Tarasenko won't ever have a season like Kessel? He was for all intents and purposes a top 5 talent his draft year, and he's only increased his stock. Again, Kessel and Phaneuf don't fit Hitch's system like Petro and Tarasenko do, which lowers their value to the Blues. So you can go ahead and keep your guys.
I was targeting all posts in this thread, and yes Kessel is above St. Louis at this current time and on par with Parise if last season was any indication of the future. Kovalchuck played LW last season so i didnt consider him. Also, an 82 point season is an all-star calibre season, a feat that very few players ever manage which is why i said "highly unlikely" rather than "never will". I also said that it obviously doesnt make sense for St. Louis due to playing style, but to claim it "good value" for Toronto if both were extended is just ridiculous.

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12-04-2012, 05:56 PM
  #41
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Originally Posted by Phion Keneuf View Post
Leafs say no.

awesome,just awesome

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Old
12-04-2012, 05:57 PM
  #42
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Kessel >>>>> Tarasenko
Pietro >>>>> Phaneuf

difficult

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Old
12-04-2012, 05:59 PM
  #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisx101 View Post
I was targeting all posts in this thread, and yes Kessel is above St. Louis at this current time and on par with Parise if last season was any indication of the future. Kovalchuck played LW last season so i didnt consider him. Also, an 82 point season is an all-star calibre season, a feat that very few players ever manage which is why i said "highly unlikely" rather than "never will". I also said that it obviously doesnt make sense for St. Louis due to playing style, but to claim it "good value" for Toronto if both were extended is just ridiculous.
THEY AREN'T EXTENDED. It's a moot point to say if they were. And offense isn't everything. I'd take Zach Parise 100 times out of 100. I'll take ten less points for vastly improved all around play.

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12-04-2012, 05:59 PM
  #44
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Originally Posted by CarvinSigX View Post
Kessel is NOT the best at his position...He doesn't even play in his own end!
most leafs dont

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Old
12-04-2012, 06:01 PM
  #45
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Value isn't that far off. Jessel just scored over 80 points, did he not? Tarasenko hasn't played an NHL game yet.

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Old
12-04-2012, 06:03 PM
  #46
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Originally Posted by BleedBlue247 View Post
THEY AREN'T EXTENDED. It's a moot point to say if they were. And offense isn't everything. I'd take Zach Parise 100 times out of 100. I'll take ten less points for vastly improved all around play.
I clearly said if they werent extended then i would take the deal? Your really talking in circles now... to sum up my thoughts:

- if extended then no deal, if not extended then deal
- Phaneuf is worse than Pietro which is true, however he is still a #1D. Tarasenko is worse than Kessel, and no where close to a top 5 RW in the game however. The value between Phaneuf and Pietro is no where close to that between Kessel and Tarasenko.
- Regardless of contract situation, neither player will fit in St. Louis essentially making them worse, so i cant see them doing it even though the value is in their favour.

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Old
12-04-2012, 06:03 PM
  #47
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Originally Posted by sully1410 View Post
Wow...some homers in here.

Firstly...I imagine this will be locked soon.

Secondly, how can anyone think that this is a good deal for the Leafs? Honestly? Pietrangelo is a great Defenseman....but from the way you're all talking is that he's the second coming of bobby Orr here.

He's not. I'm just going to go ahead and say that.

Kessel is one of the best wingers in the league right now. He may not be there defensively...but let's face it...on St. Louis...he don't need to be.

I honestly now nothing about Tarasenko, but it's puzzling that at 21 he hasn't broken into the league yet, considering what his pedigree is supposed to be.

Even with Kessel and Phaneuf, St. Louis is a playoff team. That being said I don't see a reason for St. Louis to make this trade. Just like I don't see a reason for Toronto to make this trade.

I can see why Blues fans wouldn't make this deal...but don't kid yourself, it's terrible for Toronto as well.
Tarasenko hasn't broken through because he has been in the KHL and there is this thing called the lockout which prevented him from coming over. He is one of the leading scorers in the KHL, outscoring multiple top NHL scorers, so it isn't out of the question for him to have some decent immediate success.

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Old
12-04-2012, 06:03 PM
  #48
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Potter from the Oilers for a #1 stud defence man
Gagner from the Oilers for a big 2 way center that can win faceoffs ,fight ,score ,pass and hit ...sound like Benn to me

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Old
12-04-2012, 06:07 PM
  #49
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Good trade for Toronto after this they will finish last place and win the lottery

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Old
12-04-2012, 06:12 PM
  #50
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Non-Blue fans, we have a strict budget and a very specific system, so regardless of value, this deal would never happen.

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