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Philadelphia Phillies (MLB): The "Ruf"fled Offseason Thread

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12-04-2012, 05:21 PM
  #501
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I like Justin Upton and would love to get him. But trading Cliff Lee for a second time would be a horrendous mistake.
This is exactly how i feel. Regardless of who its for. There isn't anyone i'd honestly feel happy about trading Cliff Lee for.

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12-04-2012, 05:26 PM
  #502
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Pedro Gomez ‏@pedrogomezESPN
Phillies and Diamondbacks are discussing Justin Upton for Cliff Lee. Money coming to AZ would also be involved.

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12-04-2012, 05:28 PM
  #503
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er, apparently already posted

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12-04-2012, 05:34 PM
  #504
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Already denied too

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12-04-2012, 05:37 PM
  #505
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Originally Posted by RussianRocket10 View Post
Now on ESPN they were just talking about Boston being interested in Lee and possibly a Cliff Lee for Jacoby Ellsbury swap.
I believe Ellsbury is an impending FA...but nobody in their right mind would make that trade. That's horrendous for Boston.

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12-04-2012, 06:20 PM
  #506
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Now on ESPN they were just talking about Boston being interested in Lee and possibly a Cliff Lee for Jacoby Ellsbury swap.
I'd rather have Upton.

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12-04-2012, 06:37 PM
  #507
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Victorino officially off of the market.

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12-04-2012, 07:45 PM
  #508
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Victorino's deal with the Red Sox is 3 years, 39 mil.

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12-04-2012, 07:52 PM
  #509
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Originally Posted by RussianRocket10 View Post
Victorino's deal with the Red Sox is 3 years, 39 mil.
What a horrible deal.

Also seems like Boston is trying to trade Ellsbury for starting pitching. He is UF after this year, Phillies should only go into that if they know they will be able to sign him long term.

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12-04-2012, 07:52 PM
  #510
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Victorino's deal with the Red Sox is 3 years, 39 mil.
There's a lot of money flying around so far.

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12-04-2012, 09:08 PM
  #511
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What a horrible deal.

Also seems like Boston is trying to trade Ellsbury for starting pitching. He is UF after this year, Phillies should only go into that if they know they will be able to sign him long term.
That's astoundingly bad, but I think he fits that ballpark well. Way, way too much money over 3 years.

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12-04-2012, 09:09 PM
  #512
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Lee for Upton or Ellsbury is a great deal for us from a monetary and need perspective.

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12-04-2012, 09:17 PM
  #513
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Lee for Upton or Ellsbury is a great deal for us from a monetary and need perspective.
Would much rather go Upton over Ellsbury. 10 times out of 10 too.

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12-04-2012, 09:43 PM
  #514
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Would much rather go Upton over Ellsbury. 10 times out of 10 too.
I would go either. Ellsbury would be an unreal leadoff, centerfield option for the next 7 years. He's 1 year removed from an MVP-2 season.

Upton is middle of the line-up threat with 40HR, 120RBI kind of potential.

That said, we would clearly need a significant chunk of Lee's salary for a team like ARZ to bite. They do not have the pockets for a 25M a year pitcher. Eating that salary contradicts half the value fo a trade for either imo.

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12-05-2012, 07:42 AM
  #515
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I would go either. Ellsbury would be an unreal leadoff, centerfield option for the next 7 years. He's 1 year removed from an MVP-2 season.

Upton is middle of the line-up threat with 40HR, 120RBI kind of potential.

That said, we would clearly need a significant chunk of Lee's salary for a team like ARZ to bite. They do not have the pockets for a 25M a year pitcher. Eating that salary contradicts half the value fo a trade for either imo.
I like Ellsbury. I thought I read somewhere that he was still injured (but don't quote me on that). The guy is either peanut brittle or just really unlucky. I obviously would prefer Upton because he's under team control for more years and will be cheaper and has a massive upside. I can't imagine what Ellsbury will cost to re-sign.

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12-05-2012, 08:59 AM
  #516
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Does anyone just have that guy feeling Amaro is up to something big here. We need to fill so many holes and he is known to making that big splash. He has to have something up his sleeve. J-roll for Upton lol.

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12-05-2012, 09:08 AM
  #517
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Does anyone just have that guy feeling Amaro is up to something big here. We need to fill so many holes and he is known to making that big splash. He has to have something up his sleeve. J-roll for Upton lol.
Really wish the Phils would have done a Red Sox last year. Just blew the whole thing up.

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12-05-2012, 09:16 AM
  #518
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Really wish the Phils would have done a Red Sox last year. Just blew the whole thing up.
I feel like they still have the players to win. Reports earlier were Howard and Utley are both doing well this offseason. We just need a stud out fielder, that unlike some around here, I am willing to unload for.

If Cliff Lee had to be gone for a guy like Upton, thats a no brainer. Ellsbury not to sure about that, maybe see how they value Worley. Ellsbury is a Boras player though, so he will be going to free agency almost guaranteed.

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12-05-2012, 10:09 AM
  #519
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I would go either. Ellsbury would be an unreal leadoff, centerfield option for the next 7 years. He's 1 year removed from an MVP-2 season.

Upton is middle of the line-up threat with 40HR, 120RBI kind of potential.

That said, we would clearly need a significant chunk of Lee's salary for a team like ARZ to bite. They do not have the pockets for a 25M a year pitcher. Eating that salary contradicts half the value fo a trade for either imo.
Unfortunately even if acquired Charlie wouldn't put him in the leadoff spot. That's Rollins' spot until he is no longer on the roster.

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12-05-2012, 11:29 AM
  #520
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That's astoundingly bad, but I think he fits that ballpark well. Way, way too much money over 3 years.
He fits very well there. That right field is a bear! But boy he hit the jackpot with that contract.

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12-05-2012, 11:38 AM
  #521
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Unfortunately even if acquired Charlie wouldn't put him in the leadoff spot. That's Rollins' spot until he is no longer on the roster.
I could see Jimmy sliding down to the two spot if need be. Just waiting for Ruben to get rolling. One player that would look good here in CF would be Dexter Fowler. His splits last year were bad, but I would take a chance on him if a deal can be swung.

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12-05-2012, 11:42 AM
  #522
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Trading Lee is a mistake.

Doc wasn't the same last year, Cole had his best year ever and Lee had a down year. If we want to seriously compete going forward, we need to keep Cole and Lee. Doc will be gone soon.

I'd like Upton, but not for Lee.

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12-05-2012, 12:58 PM
  #523
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Originally Posted by Prongo View Post
I feel like they still have the players to win. Reports earlier were Howard and Utley are both doing well this offseason. We just need a stud out fielder, that unlike some around here, I am willing to unload for.

If Cliff Lee had to be gone for a guy like Upton, thats a no brainer. Ellsbury not to sure about that, maybe see how they value Worley. Ellsbury is a Boras player though, so he will be going to free agency almost guaranteed.
The Phillies are in a pickle. They have a bunch of aging guys on the downside of their careers. Ruben's trying to win now, but he runs the risk of putting this team in a hole if he trades a package of prospects again for another piece in attempt to make a run. Washington is clearly a step ahead of us now and in the immediate future (until Strasburg and Harper hit the FA market in 5 years). They have the TV deal coming up so they aren't going to rebuild. I just don't like the outlook of this team.

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Old
12-05-2012, 01:09 PM
  #524
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Maybe Howard can start juicing and get caught after he hits 60, and we win another WS?

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12-05-2012, 01:15 PM
  #525
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I could see Jimmy sliding down to the two spot if need be. Just waiting for Ruben to get rolling. One player that would look good here in CF would be Dexter Fowler. His splits last year were bad, but I would take a chance on him if a deal can be swung.
Except that he shouldn't be hitting in the 2 hole either. Guys who hit .250 with an OBP just over .300 should be at the bottom of the lineup, not the top. But Charlie won't move him from the leadoff spot.

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