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Mika Zibanejad is the real deal.

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Old
12-04-2012, 10:08 PM
  #926
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Originally Posted by source View Post
He's a very poor man's Minnesota Wild-edition Heatley. He's been eclipsed by a number of guys taken below him, and hasn't shown very much improvement.
The same Matt Puempel that despite being hurt and missing 4 games is still tied for third in goals in the OHL?

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12-04-2012, 10:11 PM
  #927
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Originally Posted by QuietOnTheFront View Post
You still need high-end skill to execute the moves he pulls off. My point is I don't think the assessment of second line skill is anywhere near accurate. His best asset is his hockey sense no doubt, but his 2nd and 3rd are his speed and skill which are also at elite levels.
He's safe to be a 2nd line center - Zibanejad has the upside to be a 1C and the minimum to be a 3C - lots of variance in his projection - if he meets his total potential he will be better than Couts - but that's about the only way... Either way Hamilton was the BPA so I don't know why we always compare to Couts.

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12-04-2012, 10:12 PM
  #928
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I never heard that line until about a year ago. In fact, at the draft I think the feeling was that Couturier's game wouldn't translate to the NHL and that he was just another one of those guys who'd put up big numbers in the Q but fail at the pro level.

Don't you remember about a year ago when all the hype-sters (Xspyrit and co.) were pencilling him (Zibanejad) onto the 3rd line at a minimum, saying he already had NHL-level defensive abilities? It's funny how the justifications change to suit the facts.
Zibby..Dawg, Petersson also come to mind..

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12-04-2012, 10:12 PM
  #929
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Holmes View Post
unless is favors Zibanejad...

I have already said I like Zibanejad multiple times in this thread. I am also aware that we can't undraft him and draft Couturier, and we all have to live with the decision that the team made on that day.

I just don't know where all the optimism and hype is coming from, because while I can agree that Zibanejad has tons of raw skill and natural ability, what he doesn't have is "hands" or the ability to bury the puck that some guys (like Stone) just have.

You can't teach hands.

People talk about "tempering expectations" and then project this guy to be a 60 point powerforward in the next breath.

How many players had even 40 points last season?

I also never said that it was impossible for Zibanejad to be the better player in the end. Though the people that confidently rap off those rhymes aren't ever called out around here.

Interesting.
you didn't explicitly say that he wouldn't become better, but you have, in my opinion implied that it's not possible. i will say again i haven't formed an opinion on who will be better, and i'm not saying it's wrong to do so. from what i remember seeing (i do have a bad memory), people that have lofty expectations, are most likely projecting max potential, and are willing to concede that they could be wrong. you're confident in your opinion and you have seen both players play. you have a reason you think you're right to, one that has been observed. you do concede that zibby has "natural ability" and "raw skill", but you are giving the impression off that it's impossible for him to be a better player. if you'd say say you could be wrong, i might have not "called you out", but someone that seems so sure of, as i have said earlier, something based on unpredictable variables in my mind is asking to be challenged.
i could be reading you wrong, as i'm a new poster. i have lurked for a while and read some of your posts, so i have some idea of how you express yourself, but if i'm off base, feel free to correct me.

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12-04-2012, 10:14 PM
  #930
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Originally Posted by Qward View Post
The same Matt Puempel that despite being hurt and missing 4 games is still tied for third in goals in the OHL?
Do you expect him to become an NHL player? I haven't seen enough, sorry.

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12-04-2012, 10:25 PM
  #931
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Do you expect him to become an NHL player? I haven't seen enough, sorry.
there ya go.

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12-04-2012, 10:27 PM
  #932
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There are a lot of kool-aid drinkers that post here. Nothing the team does is ever wrong, and anyone that questions them is.

All of our prospects can't miss, until they do.

Regardless, my position is based on evidence. Not wishful thinking. People preparing to serve crow are convinced that the management can do no wrong.

That's how it is around here.

Forget about Couturier. The projections I'm seeing for Zibanejad are just far fetched at best. What are they based on? Prospectitis and wishful thinking perhaps.

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12-04-2012, 10:30 PM
  #933
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there ya go.

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12-04-2012, 10:37 PM
  #934
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Look, I know not all our prospects are gonna make it.
Maybe 1 out of 10 have a good shot (That one is Silfverberg btw)

But at the same time, I don't want to shrug players off before they even had a chance to try to make it.
We could have a couple guys that fade away after a few years and end up playing in Europe for tier 1 DEL. But we could also have a guy that surprises everyone.

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12-04-2012, 10:39 PM
  #935
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Originally Posted by Qward View Post
Look, I know not all our prospects are gonna make it.
Maybe 1 out of 10 have a good shot (That one is Silfverberg btw)

But at the same time, I don't want to shrug players off before they even had a chance to try to make it.
We could have a couple guys that fade away after a few years and end up playing in Europe for tier 1 DEL. But we could also have a guy that surprises everyone.
Well, we have Mark Stone, and I consider him to be miles ahead of Puempel. I agree with you on Silfverberg, and I expect Lehner to be an NHL goalie one day (although that is no guarantee).

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12-04-2012, 10:45 PM
  #936
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I meant comes into the NHL and surprises everyone. IE Alfredsson, Datsyuk etc

I hope Stone can be that guy. I would rank him above Puempel as well. Just saying, don't count him out yet.

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12-04-2012, 10:52 PM
  #937
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Originally Posted by QuietOnTheFront View Post
You still need high-end skill to execute the moves he pulls off. My point is I don't think the assessment of second line skill is anywhere near accurate. His best asset is his hockey sense no doubt, but his 2nd and 3rd are his speed and skill which are also at elite levels.
Yes, refer to the part where I said the "point I was trying to make".

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12-04-2012, 11:00 PM
  #938
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I think at the end of the day Zibby will turn out to be a player very similar to Franzen. He won't be a high point getter like here suggest but won't be as bad as some other people suggest (3-4th liner) 45-55 point winger.

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12-04-2012, 11:05 PM
  #939
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I think at the end of the day Zibby will turn out to be a player very similar to Franzen. He won't be a high point getter like here suggest but won't be as bad as some other people suggest (3-4th liner) 45-55 point winger.
Yep...


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12-04-2012, 11:12 PM
  #940
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Originally Posted by General Granny View Post
I think at the end of the day Zibby will turn out to be a player very similar to Franzen. He won't be a high point getter like here suggest but won't be as bad as some other people suggest (3-4th liner) 45-55 point winger.
I've thought of Franzen before with him. If Zibby embraces and learns that power forward role, he could be a very very effective 50-60 point player. I still think as long as things go well, he could very well score 30 at some point.

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12-04-2012, 11:42 PM
  #941
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Yep...

lol I wish.

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12-05-2012, 12:19 AM
  #942
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next thread: "Mika Zibanejad is the real deal...maybe.

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12-05-2012, 01:56 AM
  #943
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Originally Posted by John Holmes View Post
No he has not. Since the rebuild / firesale, he has done a good job. Before that, he got railed in pretty much every move he made, but I am not going to rehash all that.

Looking at two players here, Couturier and Zibanejad. Couts is clearly ahead of Zbad now. An object in motion tends to stay in motion. Couturier will in all likelyhood improve as he matures.

I don't see how anyone can genuinely say that Zibanejad is ultimately going to be the better player, since there is zero evidence to support that. Believing that will happen is opinion. Believing that Zibanejad will learn how to score goals and be awesome is opinion.

With Couturier, there are results, and there is history. It stands to reason that not only will he continue to do what he has already shown that he can do, but that he will improve as he matures.

So yes, it is my opinion that Couturier will be the better player, based on history. It is your opinion that Zibanejad will be the better player because...???
You're talking about a human being here, where emotion is involved, not an object. If we are looking at this objectively, everyone should be an NHL player, since you know they were set in motion to be that and no NHL player will be better than any other, since they are all following the same linear path.

We didn't think Lehner was the real deal when he was in Eerie, nor did we think that Silfverberg would be anything better than a third line checking forward with a little bit of upside. Yet they are both proving a lot different than what has been said on this board and others boards in the past.

Right now Couturier, who landed on a much more solid team than Zibanejad. A team with a coaching staff more than a year old, and a lot of star players as buffer. Couturier also didn't have to deal with things like going back to Sweden after 9 games, etc etc. Nor did Couturier land himself on a craptastic team, nor has he had to adjust to the ice size and the difference between the speed of game and decision making that comes with it.

So, this object in motion BS you're using is pretty ludicrous. There are a lot of factors between these two players that make them far different. Which means they will develop differently as well.

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12-05-2012, 02:04 AM
  #944
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Yep...

I'd take that...

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12-05-2012, 07:34 AM
  #945
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Originally Posted by Filips Tuba View Post
next thread: "Mika Zibanejad is the real deal...maybe.
He's on pace for a third straight 5 goals season. At least he's consistent.


Last edited by Suiteness: 12-05-2012 at 09:11 AM.
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12-05-2012, 08:18 AM
  #946
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I never saw anything that special in Zibanejad. He should pan out to be a quality player but a 3rd or 2nd line guy at best. His biggest drawback is that he doesn't use his body enough. Tim Murray pointed out that he isnt a skill guy but he is trying to play like one and should rather be more physical. Plus he had to those two concussions. Im more excited about silfverberg and DaCosta. And Weircioch seems to be getting into the swing of things.

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12-05-2012, 08:50 AM
  #947
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He's on pace for a third straight season 5 goals season. At least he's consistent.
Definitely a 30 G / 60 point guy in the future

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12-05-2012, 09:05 AM
  #948
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Definitely a 30 G / 60 point guy in the future
I don't know why people say that either. IMO its completely unclear right now what we have in Zibanejad.

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12-05-2012, 09:10 AM
  #949
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I don't know why people say that either. IMO its completely unclear right now what we have in Zibanejad.
we have a hockey player with no finish, so he will be at least as good as condra.
perhaps less stamina

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12-05-2012, 09:19 AM
  #950
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DylanSensFan View Post
So, this object in motion BS you're using is pretty ludicrous. There are a lot of factors between these two players that make them far different. Which means they will develop differently as well.
It's not BS. Couturier will likely continue to do what he has been doing. ie: produce in the NHL.

Your laundry list of excuses for Zibanejad's non production at every level to date is meaningless.

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