HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > Philadelphia Flyers
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

CBA Negotiations III: Why Can't We All Just...Get Along?

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
12-06-2012, 06:19 AM
  #226
Hockeypete49
How you like me now!
 
Hockeypete49's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: South Jersey
Country: Isle of Man
Posts: 4,541
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryker View Post
Thanks for summing it up, Prongo
Same here, thanks.

Hockeypete49 is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 07:52 AM
  #227
GKJ
Global Moderator
Entertainment
 
GKJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Do not trade plz
Country: United States
Posts: 111,106
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrinkFightFlyers View Post
That is lame. I wonder how they would even work that out (i.e. all contracts longer than X years are cut short, or they can be if you want, etc.).
The same way they did last time -- keep demanding until the players say yes.

GKJ is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 08:09 AM
  #228
DrinkFightFlyers
Grave Before Shave
 
DrinkFightFlyers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 12,683
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to DrinkFightFlyers
Quote:
Originally Posted by GKJ View Post
The same way they did last time -- keep demanding until the players say yes.
No I mean how will it work if that goes into effect. Will all contracts longer than five years now become five year deals? Would owner's be able to pick and choose which contracts they want to keep over five years? What will the cap hits be like if the terms are cut short?

DrinkFightFlyers is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 08:22 AM
  #229
Broad Street Elite
Registered User
 
Broad Street Elite's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 3,377
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrinkFightFlyers View Post
No I mean how will it work if that goes into effect. Will all contracts longer than five years now become five year deals? Would owner's be able to pick and choose which contracts they want to keep over five years? What will the cap hits be like if the terms are cut short?
Term would be a lot harder to reduce imho because many deal are heavily front-loaded, so messing with the term would severely cripple half the teams in the league. It's not even just the big market teams that have those kinds of deals.

What I would expect the owners would want is something where they cut the total value of all deals over a certain length or all deals in general by X %.

Broad Street Elite is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 08:22 AM
  #230
McNasty
Registered User
 
McNasty's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Rutgers
Country: United States
Posts: 5,664
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrinkFightFlyers View Post
No I mean how will it work if that goes into effect. Will all contracts longer than five years now become five year deals? Would owner's be able to pick and choose which contracts they want to keep over five years? What will the cap hits be like if the terms are cut short?
No, they would retain the term of their previous contract. That's why there was such a rush to get so many deals in before the lockout.

Also if I'm the NHL I'm proposing that max contract length be tied to CBA term. They want 9 year contract limits, sign a 9 year CBA.


Last edited by McNasty: 12-06-2012 at 08:29 AM.
McNasty is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 09:22 AM
  #231
Prongo
Beer
 
Prongo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: philadelphia
Country: United States
Posts: 14,030
vCash: 500
Bettman and Fehr to rejoin negotiations. Now before anyone panics, this is needed for a deal to be made no matter what. I'm not a huge fan of the 5/7 year max contract deals, but if that becomes the only major standing point between the deal getting made, the NHLPA would be idiotic not to ok it.

Also let's see if they can clear up the honoring of the already signed contracts today. I don't know how the NHL can think the players will agree to this.

Maybe propose if they NHL agrees to honor in full all contracts signed, then the NHLPA wil agree to 5/7 UFA deals? Seems like its fair to me? They seem to be close on the "make whole" part of the deal. Hammer that out and move onto length of the deal. If there is a 10 year deal instead of an opt out at 8 go down to 7?


Last edited by Prongo: 12-06-2012 at 09:33 AM.
Prongo is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 09:38 AM
  #232
RussianRocket10
Registered User
 
RussianRocket10's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Pennsylvania
Country: Brazil
Posts: 4,144
vCash: 500
Today is a day of refreshing HF and watching Twitter all day.

RussianRocket10 is online now  
Old
12-06-2012, 10:09 AM
  #233
RevUpThoseGolfCarts
Experts at losing
 
RevUpThoseGolfCarts's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Philadelphia
Country: United States
Posts: 1,811
vCash: 500
Winning the cup on half a season would suck. Permanent asterisk next to that championship.

RevUpThoseGolfCarts is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 10:12 AM
  #234
Prongo
Beer
 
Prongo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: philadelphia
Country: United States
Posts: 14,030
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by RevUpThoseGolfCarts View Post
Winning the cup on half a season would suck. Permanent asterisk next to that championship.
Not at all. A cup is a cup and you still have to go through 4 rounds of playoffs to get it. There would be no * next to that win.

Prongo is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 10:33 AM
  #235
Flyerfan4life
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Richmond BC, Canada
Country: England
Posts: 12,406
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prongo View Post
Not at all. A cup is a cup and you still have to go through 4 rounds of playoffs to get it. There would be no * next to that win.
only among the sore losers there would be..

mostly out of jealousy.

Flyerfan4life is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 11:16 AM
  #236
dbr2
Lockout Beard
 
dbr2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 9,340
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to dbr2
Quote:
Originally Posted by RevUpThoseGolfCarts View Post
Winning the cup on half a season would suck. Permanent asterisk next to that championship.
I guess the Devils' cup didn't mean anything in 95.

I believe if you win a cup in a condensed season, that shows a lot of character for your team.

dbr2 is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 11:25 AM
  #237
McNasty
Registered User
 
McNasty's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Rutgers
Country: United States
Posts: 5,664
vCash: 500
16/30 teams make the playoffs. 1/16 teams win the stanley cup, only one of those things is "easier" during a shortened season and that's a debatable point in itself.

McNasty is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 11:28 AM
  #238
Devastate
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 1,864
vCash: 500
The main board and business board seems fairly pessimistic. Hopefully things go well today.

Devastate is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 11:32 AM
  #239
Prongo
Beer
 
Prongo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: philadelphia
Country: United States
Posts: 14,030
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Devastate View Post
The main board and business board seems fairly pessimistic. Hopefully things go well today.
The main board has stooped to just blaming Fehr for everything that is happening today when they have not even meet face to face. TBH it's actually pretty [REDACTED] out there right. People just hang on every word from twitter.

Also NHLPA still have internal meetings right now. Maybe they are voting on the proposal from the NHL. I said just a couple of slight variances and this deal could be fair for both sides. Although, I will admit I have no clue what the pension debate is, but seems to be another problem in the negotiations.

Prongo is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 11:33 AM
  #240
GoneFullHextall
Fire Berube
 
GoneFullHextall's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Somewhere in NH
Country: United States
Posts: 31,870
vCash: 500
I dont blame them for being pessimistic. I admit I am.

anyway Jeremy Jacobs is a jackass. but this is nothing new.

http://prohockeytalk.nbcsports.com/2...medium=twitter

Representatives from the NHL and NHLPA got hot under their collars during another round of marathon meetings — but not hot enough to halt momentum.

That was the word out of New York on Wednesday, as multiple sources reported the testiest exchanges came from Boston Bruins owner Jeremy Jacobs and Buffalo Sabres goalie Ryan Miller.

The conversation went something like this.

appearantly Jacobs had a fit and left. yet its the players who are acting childish

“Let’s leave,” said Boston Bruins owner Jeremy Jacobs, turning to NHL deputy commissioner Bill Daly.

“It’s up to you,” replied Daly.

At that point during the talks between the NHL and NHL Players Association on Wednesday, a day that began as a continuation of the momentum generated on Tuesday, both sides were at the precipice, and the 2012-13 season was in jeopardy.

Earlier, Buffalo Sabres goalie Ryan Miller had angrily vented when the owners said they were disappointed with the players responses to an earlier offer and threatened to pull everything off the table

GoneFullHextall is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 12:16 PM
  #241
Prongo
Beer
 
Prongo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: philadelphia
Country: United States
Posts: 14,030
vCash: 500
https://twitter.com/ChrisBottaNHL/st...51617074794496

Quote:
Player sources say they're determined to continue to negotiate for what's right. But there will be a deal and a season.

Prongo is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 12:19 PM
  #242
flyguy
Sean Cubeturier
 
flyguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Anchorage, Alaska
Country: United States
Posts: 6,300
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to flyguy
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoneFullHolmgren View Post
I dont blame them for being pessimistic. I admit I am.

anyway Jeremy Jacobs is a jackass. but this is nothing new.

http://prohockeytalk.nbcsports.com/2...medium=twitter

Representatives from the NHL and NHLPA got hot under their collars during another round of marathon meetings — but not hot enough to halt momentum.

That was the word out of New York on Wednesday, as multiple sources reported the testiest exchanges came from Boston Bruins owner Jeremy Jacobs and Buffalo Sabres goalie Ryan Miller.

The conversation went something like this.

appearantly Jacobs had a fit and left. yet its the players who are acting childish

“Let’s leave,” said Boston Bruins owner Jeremy Jacobs, turning to NHL deputy commissioner Bill Daly.

“It’s up to you,” replied Daly.

At that point during the talks between the NHL and NHL Players Association on Wednesday, a day that began as a continuation of the momentum generated on Tuesday, both sides were at the precipice, and the 2012-13 season was in jeopardy.

Earlier, Buffalo Sabres goalie Ryan Miller had angrily vented when the owners said they were disappointed with the players responses to an earlier offer and threatened to pull everything off the table
They're all acting like children. Except children probably have shorter memories than these people...

flyguy is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 12:25 PM
  #243
GoneFullHextall
Fire Berube
 
GoneFullHextall's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Somewhere in NH
Country: United States
Posts: 31,870
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by flyguy View Post
They're all acting like children. Except children probably have shorter memories than these people...
yeah i know, and I realize things can get heated and such when there is so much on the line. a couple of owners and a couple of players yelling at each other for a short bit.
I just have no use for someone wanting to walk out of a meeting when things arent going his way.

GoneFullHextall is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 12:31 PM
  #244
Prongo
Beer
 
Prongo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: philadelphia
Country: United States
Posts: 14,030
vCash: 500
I find it absolutely hilarious that people are complaining about the players fighting for what they want. The owners were fighting for what they want as well, but it seems like the main board just seems to blame the players.

Also I ****ing can't stand when people say what is there to fight for, more millions of dollars? when referring to the players. We do all realize the owners are making more money than the players right. People saying the players should donate their paychecks to less fortunate families are ignorant.

I am unbiased in this, I really just want to see hockey again. But to sit there and solely blame one side over the other is pathetic. Both sides are in this together, they both deserve the blame.

Prongo is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 01:09 PM
  #245
Subject Orange
Registered User
 
Subject Orange's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: outside Philly
Posts: 121
vCash: 500
As a way to escape today's insanity surrounding the CBA, I watched the NHL's presentation of the classic series, 2010 Playoffs - Flyers vs Bruins.

Makes the day seem that much brighter.

Subject Orange is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 01:12 PM
  #246
GoneFullHextall
Fire Berube
 
GoneFullHextall's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Somewhere in NH
Country: United States
Posts: 31,870
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prongo View Post
I find it absolutely hilarious that people are complaining about the players fighting for what they want. The owners were fighting for what they want as well, but it seems like the main board just seems to blame the players.

Also I ****ing can't stand when people say what is there to fight for, more millions of dollars? when referring to the players. We do all realize the owners are making more money than the players right. People saying the players should donate their paychecks to less fortunate families are ignorant.

I am unbiased in this, I really just want to see hockey again. But to sit there and solely blame one side over the other is pathetic. Both sides are in this together, they both deserve the blame.
some people are under the belief that only the players are being greedy and the players have no right to demand anything and the owners have every right to not to give an inch.
Both sides have been pretty stubborn right up until now and what do you know just like many predicted when zero hour is approaching on the season both sides suddenly may be coming to their senses.

GoneFullHextall is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 01:16 PM
  #247
toughfighter83*
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 563
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prongo View Post
I find it absolutely hilarious that people are complaining about the players fighting for what they want. The owners were fighting for what they want as well, but it seems like the main board just seems to blame the players.

Also I ****ing can't stand when people say what is there to fight for, more millions of dollars? when referring to the players. We do all realize the owners are making more money than the players right. People saying the players should donate their paychecks to less fortunate families are ignorant.

I am unbiased in this, I really just want to see hockey again. But to sit there and solely blame one side over the other is pathetic. Both sides are in this together, they both deserve the blame.
nevermind

toughfighter83* is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 01:47 PM
  #248
Mkoll
Inkvisiittori
 
Mkoll's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Country: Finland
Posts: 832
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoneFullHolmgren View Post
some people are under the belief that only the players are being greedy and the players have no right to demand anything and the owners have every right to not to give an inch.
Both sides have been pretty stubborn right up until now and what do you know just like many predicted when zero hour is approaching on the season both sides suddenly may be coming to their senses.
Are they both greedy? yes.

I think the major difference, and why ppl tend to say players are more greedy is the fact the owners have invested millions of their own money into a business, taking a large risk in losing millions. The players just want a large guaranteed paycheck with no risk (health risk aside because even injured they'll get paid, right?).


And before you jump down my throat, I am neutral on the subject. I just want hockey.

Mkoll is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 01:48 PM
  #249
moosehead81
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Great White North
Country: Canada
Posts: 842
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoneFullHolmgren View Post
I dont blame them for being pessimistic. I admit I am.

anyway Jeremy Jacobs is a jackass. but this is nothing new.

http://prohockeytalk.nbcsports.com/2...medium=twitter

Representatives from the NHL and NHLPA got hot under their collars during another round of marathon meetings — but not hot enough to halt momentum.

That was the word out of New York on Wednesday, as multiple sources reported the testiest exchanges came from Boston Bruins owner Jeremy Jacobs and Buffalo Sabres goalie Ryan Miller.

The conversation went something like this.

appearantly Jacobs had a fit and left. yet its the players who are acting childish

“Let’s leave,” said Boston Bruins owner Jeremy Jacobs, turning to NHL deputy commissioner Bill Daly.

“It’s up to you,” replied Daly.

At that point during the talks between the NHL and NHL Players Association on Wednesday, a day that began as a continuation of the momentum generated on Tuesday, both sides were at the precipice, and the 2012-13 season was in jeopardy.

Earlier, Buffalo Sabres goalie Ryan Miller had angrily vented when the owners said they were disappointed with the players responses to an earlier offer and threatened to pull everything off the table
According to John Shannon, Miller got angry when Jacobs threatened to walk, asked him to continue dialogue and indicated that the PA could just as easily threaten to walk out also. Not sure how accurate this is.

moosehead81 is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 02:10 PM
  #250
Ryker
Registered User
 
Ryker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Triangle, NC, USA
Country: Slovenia
Posts: 2,947
vCash: 500
I don't even know why the NHLPA side let Miller behind the table. I think we've all seen his overreactions in the media after the series against the Flyers, as well as Lucic's hit on him. He clearly can't keep his mouth shut and is just spouting drivel when emotions get the better of him.

Ryker is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:14 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.