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12-08-2012, 01:58 AM
  #426
Quattro
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Originally Posted by Grillinnap View Post
The NBA has less players to pay, though.
and their cap is so ridiculously soft that it is really non-existent

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12-08-2012, 02:30 AM
  #427
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Originally Posted by Quattro View Post
and their cap is so ridiculously soft that it is really non-existent
From a technical standpoint only. The penalties imposed on going over are incredibly punitive, to the point is they don't need a technical hard cap...their soft cap + penalties has the desired effect.

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12-08-2012, 03:25 AM
  #428
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Here is a good read on what might happen next and why.

http://rss.cnn.com/~r/rss/si_hockey/~3/dQR935Gt3Qg/

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12-08-2012, 01:03 PM
  #429
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This could probably be a thread within itself, but it seems like a lot of anger is directed towards players because of the money they make and are fighting for. How much do you guys think these guys should be paid? In the end, it is just a game right? They play sports for a living. Should that be a 7 to 8 figure salary?

I don't know, I should be mad because here I am without a job and they are fighting for millions of dollars. But I'm not really because I guess if someone is willing to pay them that then whatever.

It's just hard for me to get on board with the owners. They came up with the new cap system then did their best to exploit that system by adding ridiculous amounts of years to contracts. Are the players supposed to turn that down? Then the owners coming back wanting a contract limit, but I'm sure there will be another way they'll find to exploit the system. This all leaves less money for the players.

But still, do they deserve millions, tens of millions, hundreds of thousands? What should be the salary of someone who plays sports for a living? A lot of people just want them to accept less and just play hockey cause really it's millions of freaking dollars still but they feel like they are worth more.

I guess, I just think the whole thing comes down to the fact that pro athletes salaries have gradually become more and more to the point of ridiculousness. However, the ones upping these salaries are the owners. It's hard to blame someone for taking more money and then getting angry when that money is taken away (not based on performance).

But still it's millions of dollars and I've got like 10 bucks in my bank account right now. Ugh. Both sides get on my nerves.

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12-08-2012, 01:22 PM
  #430
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Originally Posted by jml87 View Post
This could probably be a thread within itself, but it seems like a lot of anger is directed towards players because of the money they make and are fighting for. How much do you guys think these guys should be paid? In the end, it is just a game right? They play sports for a living. Should that be a 7 to 8 figure salary?

I don't know, I should be mad because here I am without a job and they are fighting for millions of dollars. But I'm not really because I guess if someone is willing to pay them that then whatever.

It's just hard for me to get on board with the owners. They came up with the new cap system then did their best to exploit that system by adding ridiculous amounts of years to contracts. Are the players supposed to turn that down? Then the owners coming back wanting a contract limit, but I'm sure there will be another way they'll find to exploit the system. This all leaves less money for the players.

But still, do they deserve millions, tens of millions, hundreds of thousands? What should be the salary of someone who plays sports for a living? A lot of people just want them to accept less and just play hockey cause really it's millions of freaking dollars still but they feel like they are worth more.

I guess, I just think the whole thing comes down to the fact that pro athletes salaries have gradually become more and more to the point of ridiculousness. However, the ones upping these salaries are the owners. It's hard to blame someone for taking more money and then getting angry when that money is taken away (not based on performance).

But still it's millions of dollars and I've got like 10 bucks in my bank account right now. Ugh. Both sides get on my nerves.
The fan anger has more to do with the idiotic attitude of some players

Upshall complaining about how the NHLPA is treated like cattle or Prust making fun of fan making 40k today

Those are the statements that anger fans the most

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12-08-2012, 02:00 PM
  #431
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jml87 View Post


I guess, I just think the whole thing comes down to the fact that pro athletes salaries have gradually become more and more to the point of ridiculousness. However, the ones upping these salaries are the owners. It's hard to blame someone for taking more money and then getting angry when that money is taken away (not based on performance).
Think about the Drew Doughty drama from last year. The kid wouldn't budge..in his own mind he was worth more than the owner/team was offering. If you're an owner with a team on the crest of contending for the cup and your best offensive defensman is threatening not to sign what are you going to do? You don't want to lose him and you know you have a shot of going all the way. Obviously you're going to have to oblige and give him close to what he's asking for.

My point here is the owners aren't solely responsible for the ridiculous contracts. Players ego's and negotiating tactics are to blame here as well.

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12-08-2012, 02:28 PM
  #432
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Originally Posted by BehindEnemyLines View Post
Think about the Drew Doughty drama from last year. The kid wouldn't budge..in his own mind he was worth more than the owner/team was offering. If you're an owner with a team on the crest of contending for the cup and your best offensive defensman is threatening not to sign what are you going to do? You don't want to lose him and you know you have a shot of going all the way. Obviously you're going to have to oblige and give him close to what he's asking for.

My point here is the owners aren't solely responsible for the ridiculous contracts. Players ego's and negotiating tactics are to blame here as well.
Actually Players AGENTS have the most ego...

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12-08-2012, 03:09 PM
  #433
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Originally Posted by BehindEnemyLines View Post
Think about the Drew Doughty drama from last year. The kid wouldn't budge..in his own mind he was worth more than the owner/team was offering. If you're an owner with a team on the crest of contending for the cup and your best offensive defensman is threatening not to sign what are you going to do? You don't want to lose him and you know you have a shot of going all the way. Obviously you're going to have to oblige and give him close to what he's asking for.

My point here is the owners aren't solely responsible for the ridiculous contracts. Players ego's and negotiating tactics are to blame here as well.
^^^ exacxtly.

DL paid a bit more than he wanted for DD, but this also shows that the salary cap works. Pre-cap, DD could have held out for even more, and hurt the whole team. But with the cap, DL can just tell him, "look at how much we've already allocated to our team. We want to pay you a good amount to keep you here. But you need to meet us half way."

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12-08-2012, 11:52 PM
  #434
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So there is dissension among the ranks and the NHLPA will be meeting next week in some fashion to deal with it in one way or another or so it has been said.

I hear that the optimism that I was referring last week was due to the at the time rumored meeting(s) that ended up taking place last week and that it is as a result of what happened at those meetings that there is no longer a sense of optimism any longer.

There is allot of concern among several players that they aren't being properly represented any longer by the people that they have appointed to represent them.

So it is interesting anyways.

My opinion is that this is going to get ugly over the next ten days and then that we will be on a fast track to fixing things shortly there after.

12/9/12

ALLOT more reason for optimism today.

"It's all happening..............maybe"


I remain optimistic but then why not, there is so much money on the line and the memories of how hard hit the majority of players where by the 04 lock out to add to any lack of inspiration.


Last edited by etherialone: 12-09-2012 at 08:41 PM. Reason: Living good is the best revenge or at least the best medicine
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Old
12-10-2012, 07:01 AM
  #435
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Originally Posted by BehindEnemyLines View Post
Think about the Drew Doughty drama from last year. The kid wouldn't budge..in his own mind he was worth more than the owner/team was offering. If you're an owner with a team on the crest of contending for the cup and your best offensive defensman is threatening not to sign what are you going to do? You don't want to lose him and you know you have a shot of going all the way. Obviously you're going to have to oblige and give him close to what he's asking for.

My point here is the owners aren't solely responsible for the ridiculous contracts. Players ego's and negotiating tactics are to blame here as well.
They aren't solely responsible but at the same time if Doughty had no one to go to to get the money he was asking it wouldn't have been a problem. Kings knew there was another owner out there who would give him the money he wanted. There are also owners giving defensemen more than they are worth which sets the bar for someone like Doughty.

As another example, the Flyers structured Weber's contract in a way that would cripple Nashville management. Then we have guys who take manageable contracts and are subsequently traded because they are much easier to move. For me, this stuff starts with the owners, so I'm more annoyed with them.

The sad part is the Kings and their players really showed how it should be done this offseason. With Quick signing for a reasonable amount and Penner, Stoll, etc., signing for great prices and years. I feel like this is how it should be, but every year it seems like there is one owner who will give a 1 million dollar player 5 million, and it just screws up the whole system.

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Old
12-10-2012, 12:15 PM
  #436
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This is the week where we should learn if the two sides can work something out and salvage the season or if my own and others optimism was in vein. Another meeting will happen likely on Wed but might even happen tomorrow am (phone conference talks today) and if they can overcome a couple of things then we should have a happy christmas announcement.

If not then I don't see them salvaging a season beyond that point. It has gotta happen in the next ten days at most or they will start losing a serious amount of games for January and after that the whole thing falls down.

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12-10-2012, 02:00 PM
  #437
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Went to the Clippers game on Saturday..was my first time at Staples since the SCF. All I wanted to do was look up and see that banner that should already be hanging

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Old
12-10-2012, 08:09 PM
  #438
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tonellisghost View Post
This is the week where we should learn if the two sides can work something out and salvage the season or if my own and others optimism was in vein. Another meeting will happen likely on Wed but might even happen tomorrow am (phone conference talks today) and if they can overcome a couple of things then we should have a happy christmas announcement.

If not then I don't see them salvaging a season beyond that point. It has gotta happen in the next ten days at most or they will start losing a serious amount of games for January and after that the whole thing falls down.
I bet mike Richards is itching to play since he is losing the largest dollar amount (for kings players)

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Old
12-10-2012, 08:21 PM
  #439
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I bet mike Richards is itching to play since he is losing the largest dollar amount (for kings players)
That would make sense to me. MR is one of the Kings players who I really don't have contact with at all. I have seen him over the past few years and even sat at a table with him once at a charity event right before his draft but other than brief casual chat I don't know the guy.

Judging by his character though I can't imagine that waiting to play hockey is something that he is handling really well especially when he has a long term deal all locked up.

One King who is really struggling with the layoff that I know of is Kyle Clifford who, while still playing is desperate to get back to the NHL and prove he belongs as an anchor of our checking line for the next several years. He is fire and vinegar about having to wait to get to playing.

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Old
12-10-2012, 08:22 PM
  #440
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and their cap is so ridiculously soft that it is really non-existent
If any cap is soft, it's been the NHL's since 2005.

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12-10-2012, 08:22 PM
  #441
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When Westy mentioned that they'd rather be playing, I could not help but wonder what ice time he thought he was going to be seeing this season.

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Old
12-10-2012, 08:42 PM
  #442
Ron
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Originally Posted by br3ds0x View Post
Went to the Clippers game on Saturday..was my first time at Staples since the SCF. All I wanted to do was look up and see that banner that should already be hanging
Question: Have they moved the other Kings banners yet to the rafters? It's a given they will, just wondering if it had already been done.

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12-10-2012, 08:46 PM
  #443
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Update on games cancelled: to December 30.

****ing NHL. Unbelievable. I can see it now...first Kings home game, December 31, NYE. And I might not be able to see the banner raised, because I have (possibly) another commitment.

I mean, you have got to be ****ing kidding me. Did anyone else see this coming? I did, as soon as Bettman blew up at the reporter suggesting a pre-determined January 1 start date. I just KNEW this might happen.

And if they do this to us Kings fans at this late date, there will be a huge ****ing hue and cry. They need to set up that first home date on January 2 or later (if it comes to pass).

I repeat: ****ing NHL.

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12-10-2012, 08:53 PM
  #444
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Quote:
Ron M @RonM11
@NHL
Please tell me you are not going to set up the first Kings home game (banner raising) on NYE. (cont.)

Please tell me you won't screw Kings fans over like that. Please.

I repeat, please don't screw over loyal Kings season ticket holders by scheduling the first home game on December 31!!!
And I plan a full frontal attack on them every day to ensure this doesn't happen. Let's see if I get a response (yeah, right).

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12-10-2012, 09:08 PM
  #445
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Ron, how do you copy and paste Tweets, complete with the profile picture?

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12-10-2012, 09:15 PM
  #446
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Merry Christmas everyone. See you in October 2013.

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Old
12-10-2012, 09:35 PM
  #447
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Update on games cancelled: to December 30.

****ing NHL. Unbelievable. I can see it now...first Kings home game, December 31, NYE. And I might not be able to see the banner raised, because I have (possibly) another commitment.

I mean, you have got to be ****ing kidding me. Did anyone else see this coming? I did, as soon as Bettman blew up at the reporter suggesting a pre-determined January 1 start date. I just KNEW this might happen.

And if they do this to us Kings fans at this late date, there will be a huge ****ing hue and cry. They need to set up that first home date on January 2 or later (if it comes to pass).

I repeat: ****ing NHL.
The Kings weren't even scheduled to play on opening night this season.

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Old
12-10-2012, 09:37 PM
  #448
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When Westy mentioned that they'd rather be playing, I could not help but wonder what ice time he thought he was going to be seeing this season.
Westy appeared on sportsnet hc at noon segment and looked pretty bad during that entire segment. One of the hosts asked him point blank about the 300 million 'make whole' tying to salary arbitration/contracts/pension and Westgarth took a long time to just not give an answer. I like Westgarth and how involved he is with this whole process, but that whole interview made me eye roll.

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Old
12-10-2012, 09:46 PM
  #449
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron View Post
Update on games cancelled: to December 30.

****ing NHL. Unbelievable. I can see it now...first Kings home game, December 31, NYE. And I might not be able to see the banner raised, because I have (possibly) another commitment.

I mean, you have got to be ****ing kidding me. Did anyone else see this coming? I did, as soon as Bettman blew up at the reporter suggesting a pre-determined January 1 start date. I just KNEW this might happen.

And if they do this to us Kings fans at this late date, there will be a huge ****ing hue and cry. They need to set up that first home date on January 2 or later (if it comes to pass).

I repeat: ****ing NHL.
12/31 isn't going to be the first game of the year.

How ****ing awesome would that be? I would get a room at the JQ Marriot and start drinking about 3am. (Even though the bar is closed, no hotel employees complain when you bring your own and kick it by the fireplace sipping scotch in a robe with an unlit cigar in your mouth.)
At sunrise I'll by a hawaiian punch slurpee and dump in a fifth of rum and hoof it back to JW for a brekfast and minmosas.
The Yardhouse will open about 11am and yard of Stone IPA would go great with their Mac and Cheese. After 7 or 8 yards, I'll wander up and down Figueroa until I find a midget or a hunchback and I'll him he/she/it to the Palm for Margaritas and LOBSTER AND BACON FONDUE(that's right).
Pregame I'll run back to the hotel room and fill a Camelback with Gatorade and Tequila.

After the game, I'll throw up a lot and I'll wake up somewhere in the Valley with an alpaca under one arm and a stuffed Pink Panther under the other.


Last edited by Gentle Ben Kenobi: 12-10-2012 at 09:53 PM.
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Old
12-10-2012, 09:52 PM
  #450
Ron
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Ron, how do you copy and paste Tweets, complete with the profile picture?
It takes a little bit to get it to work like that...I put the profile pic in an image tag here and then I apply the fonts and attributes...

When I am in a hurry i just cut and paste...but to make it look "good" takes a minute, maybe. No big deal.

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