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The Lockout Thread Part I

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Old
12-06-2012, 06:23 PM
  #901
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Originally Posted by Crede777 View Post
Even as a moderator how does one accumulate 34,000+ posts on a lightbulb message board?

1 post to put the lightbulb in the socket, 33,999 posts to screw it in.

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12-06-2012, 07:44 PM
  #902
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Sounds like the talks just broke down and term limits were part of the reason

I understand some of the concerns of the players but why the hell are they choosing term limits as being the sword they are willing to fall on??!!?

First, this affects so few players that it should be a non-issue. In the Jackets history I believe they've signed one player for longer than 5 years and that was Rick Nash.

Second, many of these deals have gone bad (Gomez, Redden, etc). Yes, the players still get their cash, but being buried in the minors or facing the scorn of fans for being 'cap space' anchors isn't ideal from a player's perspective. If they aren't buried in the minors, they are taking up salary space that could go to other players.

Finally, I think most fans prefer that these cap-circumventing, back-diving contracts are eliminated, so you can't even get the fans on your side for this issue.

It makes no sense.

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12-06-2012, 08:09 PM
  #903
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Originally Posted by Skraut View Post
48 game season:


50 game season:


80 game season:


82 game season:


You're right, nobody remembers who won the cup unless a full 82 games are played.

The cup is awarded to those who win the playoffs. The regular season determines who is in the playoffs, and their seeding. A championship is a championship no matter how much of a season is played, because you still have to go through every other team to get there. No matter how much my fellow Clevelanders who are NBA fans don't want to admit it.


Personally I'm getting excited to take my son to an NHL game again. But I still worry at the way it is playing out. I think the owners plan all along was to give the players a couple months, try to squeeze as much as possible out of them, then get back to the game and recoup their losses for the rest of the season.

What is to stop them from using the same tactic next time?
...Am I the only one who noticed "Ass Man?"

EDIT: And "Ass Train"!

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12-06-2012, 08:24 PM
  #904
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Originally Posted by cbjgirl View Post
I haven't posted often, but I read just about everyday. We've been season ticket holders since the beginning.

I don't mind this lockout and I'll tell you why.

Last summer, I was VERY excited headed into the season. We had made moves, I thought things were going to swing in a positive direction and things would be good. Then the first two weeks of the season happened.

Having this break, and being able to step back from it, has been helpful on a personal level. I was emotionally invested last summer, then crushed by the dismal start (and everything else that happened).

At this point I'm optimistically curious about this season (or next) to see what we really have, but my expectations are lower. I see this as a rebirth of the team. If I have to wait a little bit to see it, so be it.
I want us to play at least a shortened season so we don't get screwed out of the #1 pick next summer. feel a lot better about this franchise with JD on board.

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12-06-2012, 08:29 PM
  #905
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I went back to check my assertion that Nash is the only one signed more than 5 years (he signed an 8-year). Tyutin signed a 6-year contract. However, this would be acceptable under the NHL's proposal because they can sign current players for 7 years.

I did forget about Wiz, however. I think he and Nash are the only CBJ signings that break the current proposal. Personally, I like Wiz but I wish his contract had been limited to no more than 5 years.

And yes, I realize Carter and JMFJ also have contracts that would no longer be allowed, but those contracts weren't initiated by the CBJ.

Bottom line, I hope for the players sake there was more than term limits that caused the breakdown. Try telling a Jared Boll or a Derek MacKenzie that it's necessary to lose a year to preserve the 8-year plus back-diving contracts.

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12-06-2012, 09:10 PM
  #906
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Originally Posted by Sore Loser View Post
...Am I the only one who noticed "Ass Man?"

EDIT: And "Ass Train"!
I see "Claude Lemieux", so I guess we found the same thing.

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12-07-2012, 07:19 AM
  #907
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Oy! Eh? What is wrong with these people. Sounded like they were getting close, then bam, its over.

Players are losing tons of money that they will never recover. Many owners are actually making money (i.e. not losing money). Others who make money at hockey don't need it, Seems to me the owners have that advantage.

8 year term seems reasonable for a CBA but 10 is better.

Contract length of 5 seems good and the front loaded deals have to go away.

In round numbers 300 out of 383 is 75% so that means that the hit to the players is significantly less than originally proposed.

I don't get it. Seems to me that superstar deals are the big stumbling block in many ways. I'm sure all the 3rd and 4th liners are all for not doing the deal if they can't possibly get a 10 year deal.

This all sucks; I'm pretty much in the owners camp at this point and I don't think there will be a season this year. Next year? Who knows?


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Old
12-07-2012, 07:35 AM
  #908
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Originally Posted by WinSock View Post
1 post to put the lightbulb in the socket, 33,999 posts to screw it in.
And you earn the first part of your user name!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mayor Bee View Post
I see "Claude Lemieux", so I guess we found the same thing.
And now it's a tie!

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12-07-2012, 08:02 AM
  #909
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The players brought a gun with them to the negotiations when they brought in Fehr. If their fears were they would have gotten a worse deal with Kelly, then they'll be surprised when they get an even worse deal with Fehr AND lose a season of hockey

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12-07-2012, 08:40 AM
  #910
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I've grown real tired with hearing the term "dying on a hill." I just dont like to hear this nonsense compared to a kid sacrificing his life serving his country and defending freedom.

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12-07-2012, 08:57 AM
  #911
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I haven't logged on to here for months. Not that you aren't all wonderful, but I really haven't missed the talk. I will say this though, following the happenings last night on Twitter was some real entertainment. I was laughing about Fehr basically getting a spanking from the NHL last night. I really think that if everyone would have kept their mouths shut and not talked about details, we might be talking about a deal. I think this lockout has went long enough and it's time to knock off all the PR BS and just hammer out a deal. Months have went by since I purchased season tickets for the first time and I'm still asking "what the hell were you thinking?"

That said, I hope there is hockey this season and sooner rather than later. What I'd like to see is these guys start to act like grown men instead of politicians or children. Hockey was nearly irrelevant in the sports landscape before the lockout, now only the die hards will support the sport in the short term when its over. The NHL has become a joke and it's sad for those of us that love the sport.

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12-07-2012, 09:09 AM
  #912
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Pretty much sums it up I think


love the motorcycle helmets, and Crosby's right handed "golf" swing.

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12-07-2012, 11:17 AM
  #913
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BluejacketNut View Post
The players brought a gun with them to the negotiations when they brought in Fehr. If their fears were they would have gotten a worse deal with Kelly, then they'll be surprised when they get an even worse deal with Fehr AND lose a season of hockey
Yep. It's the players fault that the owners apparently fear/hate their boss enough to yank provisions off the table simply at the mention of him being asked to review the final deal even though owners likely would have accepted it without his presence

Typical union thuggary. It makes me sick.

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Last edited by Samkow: 12-07-2012 at 11:23 AM.
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12-07-2012, 10:00 PM
  #914
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http://blogs.denverpost.com/avs/2012...toronto/11978/

Quote:
But it got downright nasty at one point between the two. MacLean made a point that third- and fourth-liners are doing just fine, salary-wise, in the NHL and that a deal as it might have been done with the current terms would keep them still doing fine. He also said “nobody gives a crap” about the bottom 400 players in the NHL, that people only care about the top 300. Kypreos disagreed, and that’s when things got heated. Kypreos unloaded with this fusillade: “Maybe that’s why you never won in Columbus, because you crapped all over third- and fourth-liners.” MacLean blew his stack, firing back, “Maybe that’s why you only had an eight-year career. Maybe that’s why you got kicked out. Don’t start throwing darts when you don’t know what you’re talkin’ about.” And it went on from there.
LOL.

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12-07-2012, 10:48 PM
  #915
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Freakin' beautiful. I have always wondered if one of those intelligent hockey personalities would call Dougie Mac on his complete ineptitude as an NHL general manager. Now I know.

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12-07-2012, 11:07 PM
  #916
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Pretty much sums it up I think
That was pretty amusing.

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Old
12-08-2012, 10:21 AM
  #917
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Quite frankly, my anger at the start of this nonsense was 100% at the owners. At this point, though, I am now 50/50 anger at owners and players. They all are pissing me off.

I will spit on both Fehr, and Bettmans graves. That is, of course, if I somehow manage to outlive both of them.

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12-08-2012, 02:17 PM
  #918
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Originally Posted by Dr. Fire View Post
Quite frankly, my anger at the start of this nonsense was 100% at the owners. At this point, though, I am now 50/50 anger at owners and players. They all are pissing me off.
That's just about my story, too, though I still have about 10% more rancor for the owners.

Quote:
I will spit on both Fehr, and Bettmans graves. That is, of course, if I somehow manage to outlive both of them.

I'm lousy at spitting, plus I'm older than both! I've always disliked Bettman, but I must admit that both he and Fehr are just doing what they're hired to do. I hate what the results of that is, though. I need hockey, because I've really lost interest in most of basketball, with the exception of OSU men and women.

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12-08-2012, 02:32 PM
  #919
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I've been supporting Ft Wayne Komets. But I think next Saturday, I will hit the arena district for some dinner at BDP and then run over to catch Buckeyes.

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Old
12-08-2012, 06:20 PM
  #920
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I'm lousy at spitting, plus I'm older than both! I've always disliked Bettman, but I must admit that both he and Fehr are just doing what they're hired to do. I hate what the results of that is, though. I need hockey, because I've really lost interest in most of basketball, with the exception of OSU men and women.
This week has been torture. College football season is essentially over, and the Spokane Chiefs are on their bi-annual eastern division road swing - that has seen them out of town for nearly two weeks. The silver lining is that they are 5-0 on the trip so far, catapulting them to the second best record in the WHL.

I have no idea what I'm going to do once college football is completely over. I hate basketball of any sort.

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12-08-2012, 09:27 PM
  #921
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I think all CBJ fans should make a trip or two down to the Arena District to support those restaurants and watering holes through this. They're among those losing the most through this crap.

I went tonight. Be prepared to be a little sad when you walk past NWA though.

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12-08-2012, 11:24 PM
  #922
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I have read many of the comments posted here and not surprisingly the philosophical approach to adversity is unchanged by many of the same posters.

Owners, players and fans.... few would argue that they are the building blocks of the NHL.... tell me, where do the fans enter in this strike equation?

How many fans across the USA and Canada had special occasions planned around cancelled NHL hockey games, how many fan birthday or wedding plans have been trashed because of this impasse?

As always the fans will be an afterthought to the owners and players... mere pawns to those brokering the sport money.. How many strike seasons will it take before the fans realize they are meaningless to the owners and players... when and how are fan grievances met?

This strike season did not need to happen; the cancelled season, ASG and Winter Classic did not need to happen.... I can understand some fan forgiveness to the league next season but silence and passive acceptance of not even having a voice in contract seasons is passiveness to the extreme I doubt even Gandhi would tolerate....

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12-09-2012, 01:01 AM
  #923
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pete goegan View Post
I know of no Stanley Cup winner that is thought less of because of a shortened season. As long as the playoffs remain the same, they continue to be the toughest test to a league championship among North American sports. The regular season is essentially for seeding (and selling 82 games worth of tickets, concessions, and merchandise!). 40, 52, 60 games? A legitimate champ will still emerge.

You may feel lucky if the season is cancelled, I won't.
You jest... even Rodger Maris had an asterik for many years.... Don't refute for the sake of refutaion Pete... The current standard NHL season is 82 games, anything less is an asterik..

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12-09-2012, 01:18 AM
  #924
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Double-Shift Lassť View Post
So in a regular, full-length season... screw the homeless?

This attitude always gets me with regard to this lockout - people getting all moral about how not having hockey is going to make them a better person. Whatever.

Not more moral Mr. Socrates, more philanthropic in general with said funds....


Last edited by Robert: 12-09-2012 at 01:25 AM.
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12-09-2012, 10:14 AM
  #925
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.... I can understand some fan forgiveness to the league next season but silence and passive acceptance of not even having a voice in contract seasons is passiveness to the extreme I doubt even Gandhi would tolerate....
That's right, not having hockey to amuse you is just like being under the boot heel of an army of occupation. Please lead us in revolt, Mahatma Robert!

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You jest... even Rodger Maris had an asterik for many years.... Don't refute for the sake of refutaion Pete... The current standard NHL season is 82 games, anything less is an asterik..
Myth: Maris' 61 had an asterisk next to it in the official record books. Never happened.

A Cup champion is a Cup champion. World Series winners in seasons of 154 games are held in no less esteme than those of 162. You can think of them however you like, though, Robert, disregard whomever you wish.

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