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Lockout Discussion Thread 3.0

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Old
12-08-2012, 02:31 PM
  #1026
Andy
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Prust is a loser.

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Old
12-08-2012, 02:32 PM
  #1027
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Originally Posted by 68 View Post
I'm starting to dislike Brandon Prust. He's making fun of a fan that makes 40k on Twitter. What a ****ing idiot. Thank God PK and Patches are keeping their mouth shut.
PK actually has been interacting with fans and media probably more than anyone. He just doesn't say anything stupid.

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12-08-2012, 02:38 PM
  #1028
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Originally Posted by fantasybaseballchamp View Post
That's the main reason baseball found labor peace, fans got fed up and it scared both parties straight.

If the NHL "wins" again and the fans comeback again, I don't see any deterrent at the end of the next CBA. Try and crush the players again.
See, I don't think the NHL is trying to crush the players, not when players' problems during this lockout is getting expensive vacations. Not when your salary diminishes by a couple hundred K's when you're a multi- millionaire.

I appreciate guys like Subban stating their concern over the fans getting hurt in all of this and actually following through by keeping his mouth shut and provide the lol's. Unlike guys like Prust who go after fans who are rightfully frustrated at his unconscious comments.

Subban is 23 years old and is showing much more maturity than many other players publicly.

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Old
12-08-2012, 02:42 PM
  #1029
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Originally Posted by Watsatheo View Post
PK actually has been interacting with fans and media probably more than anyone. He just doesn't say anything stupid.
Well by keeping his mouth shut I think he meant not Prust-ing fans.

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Old
12-08-2012, 02:53 PM
  #1030
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Myron Gaines View Post
I saw that too, can't say I find it funny. Replying to a frustrated fan with sarcasm; Not very strong.

But to be honest, I'm mad at both parties. The NHLPA because they act like a bunch of oppressed slaves who happen to be millionaires and Gary Bettman 'cause he keeps accumulating lockouts.

I miss NHL hockey so much, I realized it this week as funny as it sounds. I just wish that a lot of fans lose interest for the NHL once it's back, wish we could make our own lockout.
I miss hockey too man. What is funny is that I will forgive all these players when they will wear the CH jersey. Bouillon needs to go though.

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Old
12-08-2012, 03:02 PM
  #1031
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Myron Gaines View Post
See, I don't think the NHL is trying to crush the players, not when players' problems during this lockout is getting expensive vacations. Not when your salary diminishes by a couple hundred K's when you're a multi- millionaire.

I appreciate guys like Subban stating their concern over the fans getting hurt in all of this and actually following through by keeping his mouth shut and provide the lol's. Unlike guys like Prust who go after fans who are rightfully frustrated at his unconscious comments.

Subban is 23 years old and is showing much more maturity than many other players publicly.
Well put!

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Old
12-08-2012, 03:27 PM
  #1032
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Watsatheo View Post
PK actually has been interacting with fans and media probably more than anyone. He just doesn't say anything stupid.
He's too busy #Joel-ing to care.

He also doesn't have a contract...

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Old
12-08-2012, 03:33 PM
  #1033
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This lockout is beyond ridiculous. NHL and PA had months (if not a whole year) to negotiate and find solutions.

I blame them both. Particularly Bettman and Fehr, two jerks who are killing the Goose that laid the Golden Eggs.

I hate Fehr since the 90's with his tactics that finally destroyed OUR Montreal Expos. It certainly block them to reach the World Series in 1994. His style of negotiating (lack of) must be very frustrating for anyone across the table. He's kind of passive and a tease at the same time. An hypocrit of a large scale.

As for Bettman, my list would be too long. But, as a Commissioner, he failed badly. How could he not stop some fools to give 10-15 years contracts to some players with so much front loaded money (even few weeks and days before calling another lockout...) ? It was not the for the best of the sport for sure.

Now, it is very obvious that Bettman and some owners want to crush Fehr by overpassing him at the negotiation table. They won't succeed. They don't know the Beast. He is not another Goodenough.

These giuys, owners, players and NHL % PA bosses are TOTALLY disconnected from reality.

The money is not there anymore. Hockey is a REGIONAL game, not a NATIONAL game, outside Canada. You can'ty compare the NHL to any of the other 3 big leagues. Hockey players are dreaming if they think they can get the dough that the other athletes in these leagues are making.

Finally. Twitter is definately the worst invention of the Human kind.

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12-08-2012, 03:42 PM
  #1034
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Well I just heard Fehr giving the latest spin on whats going on.
He is still at war, no backing down at all. Ok well thats it then.
If I were the NHL I would cancel the year right now. I would go right back to square one with the original offer made back in August. 43% for the players and 57% for the owners. ALL contract change in effect. Any loss of revenue would be taken out of the 43% of the players. so if the NHL suffers a big loss it ALL come out of the NHLPA. Escro to go up to 50% in case of NHL losses. NHL plants a stick in the ground for sept 1 2013. If the players dont agree to ALL NHL demands the 2014 season will be cancelled. If the players dont agree then the NHL will desolve and a NEW league will be started.

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12-08-2012, 03:43 PM
  #1035
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Donald Fehr holds up the MLB CBA as the model to follow. He cites years of labor peace and that is hard to argue with.

In a book authored by Andrew Zimbalist he found that the players' share of revenue dropped from 67% in 2002 to 51% by 2008. So it is in line with the other major sports. In 2012 the average team salary was about $98 million which would put the average team revenue at about $200 million.

So far that puts MLB approximately in line with the other sports. It seems clear that most major sports are paying somewhere between 50% and 55% of revenues.

What is interesting when you compare hockey to baseball is the range between the minimum salary and the maximum salary. The minimum salary in MLB is $480,000 per year and at the same time there are about 40 players who make in excess of $15 million per year. In other words, the top players make 30x the amount of bottom players.

From a team perspective, the highest team salary is almost 4x as high as the lowest team salary.

That would be the environment the players would be working under if they followed Fehr's preferred path. Overall spending by teams might increase somewhat but the beneficiaries would be a handful of players. At the bottom end, the players could end up worse than they are now.

On a relative scale, let's say the Leafs payroll ballooned to $90 to $100 million per year. Using the MLB blueprint you could see some teams spending as little as $25 million in salary.

Let's not kid ourselves. The upper echelon players would be huge beneficiaries while the average 3rd or 4th line player, or anyone playing on a small market team, may not be so happy with the result.

The next time Fehr holds up the MLB model as an example of success, the players should look at that agreement a little more closely.

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Old
12-08-2012, 03:44 PM
  #1036
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It is difficult to sympathize with people who make 44 times the average persons salary for playing a game that millions pay to play, rather than being paid.

It is equally difficult to sympathize with people who know they are investing in a business with poor economics, yet do so anyway.

What I do know is that arguing that this sides actions are more just is foolishness, as no person, or side, is right all the time. We all make mistakes.

I also know that employees do not have a job, unless the company they work for makes money, that is the basis of capitalism.

The NHL and PA have a big pie to divide, they are so close to an agreement, seems crazy it should break down now.

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Old
12-08-2012, 03:46 PM
  #1037
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HCH View Post
Donald Fehr holds up the MLB CBA as the model to follow. He cites years of labor peace and that is hard to argue with.

In a book authored by Andrew Zimbalist he found that the players' share of revenue dropped from 67% in 2002 to 51% by 2008. So it is in line with the other major sports. In 2012 the average team salary was about $98 million which would put the average team revenue at about $200 million.

So far that puts MLB approximately in line with the other sports. It seems clear that most major sports are paying somewhere between 50% and 55% of revenues.

What is interesting when you compare hockey to baseball is the range between the minimum salary and the maximum salary. The minimum salary in MLB is $480,000 per year and at the same time there are about 40 players who make in excess of $15 million per year. In other words, the top players make 30x the amount of bottom players.

From a team perspective, the highest team salary is almost 4x as high as the lowest team salary.

That would be the environment the players would be working under if they followed Fehr's preferred path. Overall spending by teams might increase somewhat but the beneficiaries would be a handful of players. At the bottom end, the players could end up worse than they are now.

On a relative scale, let's say the Leafs payroll ballooned to $90 to $100 million per year. Using the MLB blueprint you could see some teams spending as little as $25 million in salary.

Let's not kid ourselves. The upper echelon players would be huge beneficiaries while the average 3rd or 4th line player, or anyone playing on a small market team, may not be so happy with the result.

The next time Fehr holds up the MLB model as an example of success, the players should look at that agreement a little more closely.
And that tells you everything you need to know about who Fehr is working for. It's "the players" sure, but not all players are created equal..

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Old
12-08-2012, 03:51 PM
  #1038
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Originally Posted by RC51 View Post
Well I just heard Fehr giving the latest spin on whats going on.
He is still at war, no backing down at all. Ok well thats it then.
If I were the NHL I would cancel the year right now. I would go right back to square one with the original offer made back in August. 43% for the players and 57% for the owners. ALL contract change in effect. Any loss of revenue would be taken out of the 43% of the players. so if the NHL suffers a big loss it ALL come out of the NHLPA. Escro to go up to 50% in case of NHL losses. NHL plants a stick in the ground for sept 1 2013. If the players dont agree to ALL NHL demands the 2014 season will be cancelled. If the players dont agree then the NHL will desolve and a NEW league will be started.
I don't know that the newly ex-NHL owners would be thrilled about having to fulfill their contractual obligations to their former players...

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Old
12-08-2012, 04:00 PM
  #1039
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Listening to Fehr's latest presser... he said that the NHL players suffered salary reductions in the last CBA? Cause I thought the players have been getting paid quite well over the last 7 years...

Is that what he meant?

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Old
12-08-2012, 04:06 PM
  #1040
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I hope the NHL never comes back.. Brandon Prust can pump my gas.. what a plug.

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Old
12-08-2012, 04:19 PM
  #1041
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dirty Danglez View Post
Listening to Fehr's latest presser... he said that the NHL players suffered salary reductions in the last CBA? Cause I thought the players have been getting paid quite well over the last 7 years...

Is that what he meant?
Salaries are hard-locked to hockey-related revenues since the last lockout. Before the lockout the players, in a quasi-free market, they were getting ~70% of HRR. After the lockout they were locked in at 57%. That's a 13% reduction right?

That's what he meant.

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Old
12-08-2012, 04:22 PM
  #1042
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Originally Posted by WhiskeySeven View Post
Salaries are hard-locked to hockey-related revenues since the last lockout. Before the lockout the players, in a quasi-free market, they were getting ~70% of HRR. After the lockout they were locked in at 57%. That's a 13% reduction right?

That's what he meant.
of HRR yah. ok thanks!

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Old
12-08-2012, 05:19 PM
  #1043
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Any Habs fan who will still cheer for Prust in the future must like being disrespected and fed pure BS.

He's totally Bergevin's worst mistake as a GM so far.

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Old
12-08-2012, 05:25 PM
  #1044
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CN_paladin View Post
Any Habs fan who will still cheer for Prust in the future must like being disrespected and fed pure BS.

He's totally Bergevin's worst mistake as a GM so far.
yes because what Prust says really affects me and i only cheer for
hockey
players that use social medias responsibly.
What bad mistake Berger hurting our fans feelings like that. you should of know

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Old
12-08-2012, 05:33 PM
  #1045
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CN_paladin View Post
Any Habs fan who will still cheer for Prust in the future must like being disrespected and fed pure BS.

He's totally Bergevin's worst mistake as a GM so far.
Good to see you're not overreacting at all.

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Old
12-08-2012, 05:38 PM
  #1046
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 68 View Post
I'm starting to dislike Brandon Prust. He's making fun of a fan that makes 40k on Twitter. What a ****ing idiot. Thank God PK and Patches are keeping their mouth shut.
In response to?

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Old
12-08-2012, 05:43 PM
  #1047
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Can a moderator or someone create a poll. That would would ask us fans.
Would you boo a. Eric Cole and Josh Gorges b. Geoff Molson C. neither

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Old
12-08-2012, 05:43 PM
  #1048
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NotProkofievian View Post
In response to?
https://twitter.com/brandonprust8/st...13992809730048

I know I'll get over it once hockey actually starts but right now, I'm disliking him more and more every day.

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Old
12-08-2012, 05:44 PM
  #1049
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Originally Posted by old scotia View Post
Can a moderator or someone create a poll. That would would ask us fans.
Would you boo a. Eric Cole and Josh Gorges b. Geoff Molson C. neither
how about you start a new thread, i'm sure mods would love it

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Old
12-08-2012, 05:46 PM
  #1050
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Originally Posted by old scotia View Post
Can a moderator or someone create a poll. That would would ask us fans.
Would you boo a. Eric Cole and Josh Gorges b. Geoff Molson C. neither
I'd boo them all. Booing ftw

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