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Roster Talk '13 — Russia

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Old
12-08-2012, 06:24 PM
  #76
Yakushev72
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Originally Posted by StrappingYoungChad View Post
Haha a little jaded are we?
He's referring to the "Russian Factor," which clearly affects the NHL draft status of Russian players. A lot of really good Russian players are drafted in 5th, 6th and 7th rounds for fear that they will choose the KHL instead.

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12-08-2012, 06:39 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by Yakushev72 View Post
He's referring to the "Russian Factor," which clearly affects the NHL draft status of Russian players. A lot of really good Russian players are drafted in 5th, 6th and 7th rounds for fear that they will choose the KHL instead.
But typically not those playing in the CHL.

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12-08-2012, 06:47 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by bluesfan94 View Post
But typically not those playing in the CHL.
If a Russian kid played in the CHL and was drafted in the first or second round, then yes, you're probably right. But if they are drafted in the 6th or 7th round, I doubt that that's true. If they are drafted in late rounds, they're probably headed to the AHL, and Russian kids have another option now. That's why they call it the Russian Factor.

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12-08-2012, 06:49 PM
  #79
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Originally Posted by Yakushev72 View Post
If a Russian kid played in the CHL and was drafted in the first or second round, then yes, you're probably right. But if they are drafted in the 6th or 7th round, I doubt that that's true. If they are drafted in late rounds, they're probably headed to the AHL, and Russian kids have another option now. That's why they call it the Russian Factor.
I don't think Galchenyuk would have been drafted any later than he was because he was Russian. That's what the original statement alleged

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12-08-2012, 06:54 PM
  #80
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Originally Posted by bluesfan94 View Post
I don't think Galchenyuk would have been drafted any later than he was because he was Russian. That's what the original statement alleged
Normally, I would strongly disagree with you, but Galchenyuk is a special case. He has so many ties to the US, and lived there for so many years as a kid, that he would likely be considered an exception to the rule. The only other Russian I can think of who was a similar prospect with ties to the US when he was growing up is Viktor Tikhonov, and he plays in the KHL.

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12-08-2012, 06:59 PM
  #81
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Originally Posted by bluesfan94 View Post
I don't think Galchenyuk would have been drafted any later than he was because he was Russian. That's what the original statement alleged
Even Yakupov and Grigerenko were questioned over and over again about playing in the KHL after years in the CHL. Playing in the CHL does not necessarily diminish the perception of the Russian factor. Teams look at a player like Radulov, fairly or not, and factor that in. Tarasenko and Kuznetsov never should have dropped so low, yet neither has played an NHL game, so there is a reason teams may be skeptical. And there are several second line talents at the time of the draft who develop even better that get drafted in late rounds or not at all. This has nothing to do with talent.

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12-08-2012, 07:02 PM
  #82
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Originally Posted by Yakushev72 View Post
He has so many ties to the US, and lived there for so many years as a kid
I thought he left America when he was four and returned three years ago after spending some years being developed by Dynamo Moscow?

Anyway he considers himself American, gave up Russian citizenship and I think none of this had to do with the Draft.

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12-08-2012, 07:46 PM
  #83
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Originally Posted by Nash View Post
Even Yakupov and Grigerenko were questioned over and over again about playing in the KHL after years in the CHL. Playing in the CHL does not necessarily diminish the perception of the Russian factor. Teams look at a player like Radulov, fairly or not, and factor that in. Tarasenko and Kuznetsov never should have dropped so low, yet neither has played an NHL game, so there is a reason teams may be skeptical. And there are several second line talents at the time of the draft who develop even better that get drafted in late rounds or not at all. This has nothing to do with talent.
Tarasenko and Kuznetsov were playing in Russia, not North America. I don't get how he thought that Galchenyuk chose America because of his draft status. Not when Galchenyuk was playing in America and the #1 was a Russian playing in Canada.

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12-08-2012, 11:16 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by Yakushev72 View Post
He's referring to the "Russian Factor," which clearly affects the NHL draft status of Russian players. A lot of really good Russian players are drafted in 5th, 6th and 7th rounds for fear that they will choose the KHL instead.
That too is what I was referring to.

Looking back at the last 15 drafts, you'd see a LOT more Russians drafted in the first round. I don't think too many played very long in the NHL so I can see why teams are careful.

Don't get me wrong, I actually prefer "big ice" hockey to North American hockey. I just wish the NHL would adopt it, but I know it'll never happen.

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12-09-2012, 12:47 AM
  #85
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I don't think he wanted to take any chances. The Russian factor does exist.

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12-09-2012, 01:49 AM
  #86
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I don't think he wanted to take any chances. The Russian factor does exist.
Which is why Yakupov didn't go first overall, right?

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12-09-2012, 02:15 AM
  #87
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Originally Posted by Dynamo81 View Post
I thought he left America when he was four and returned three years ago after spending some years being developed by Dynamo Moscow?

Anyway he considers himself American, gave up Russian citizenship and I think none of this had to do with the Draft.
Hard to know what country he fits in to. He was born in the US, left as a child and grew up wandering around Europe with his father. Italy, Belarus, Russia and then back to the US at 14 or 15. Then to Sarnia, which is technically Canada, but is only a bridge away from the US. Frankly I think the reason he considers himself so American is that with his globe trotting as a child he probably never really was able to settle into a country on a continent where being accepted into society isn't as easy as it is in North America.

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12-09-2012, 02:17 AM
  #88
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Originally Posted by Bure View Post
I don't care, the guys not American and we all know it. Just listen to the kid talk.
I'm not sure you understand the requirements of being American, legally and culturally.

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12-09-2012, 02:24 AM
  #89
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Originally Posted by bluesfan94 View Post
Which is why Yakupov didn't go first overall, right?
Are you suggesting the Russian factor doesn't exist because Yakupov went first overall?

The factor added some trepidation to the Oilers' decision, but he is just so much better than Ryan Murray...

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12-09-2012, 02:24 AM
  #90
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Originally Posted by bluesfan94 View Post
Which is why Yakupov didn't go first overall, right?
Which is why you got Tarasenko, Washington got Kuznetsov and guys like Arzamastsev and Slepyshev were not even drafted.

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12-09-2012, 02:26 AM
  #91
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Originally Posted by Xokkeu View Post
I'm not sure you understand the requirements of being American, legally and culturally.
He knows. His point is simply that Galchenyuk acts more culturally Russian rather than coming off as a Westerner.

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12-09-2012, 02:29 AM
  #92
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Originally Posted by Xokkeu View Post
Hard to know what country he fits in to. He was born in the US, left as a child and grew up wandering around Europe with his father. Italy, Belarus, Russia and then back to the US at 14 or 15. Then to Sarnia, which is technically Canada, but is only a bridge away from the US. Frankly I think the reason he considers himself so American is that with his globe trotting as a child he probably never really was able to settle into a country on a continent where being accepted into society isn't as easy as it is in North America.
Guesswork. We'll never know why Galchenyuk chose the U.S. It might have been a purely pragmatic decision than a cultural one.

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12-09-2012, 02:32 AM
  #93
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Originally Posted by Fantomas View Post
Guesswork. We'll never know why Galchenyuk chose the U.S. It might have been a purely pragmatic decision than a cultural one.
He was not capped (to borrow the phrase from soccer) to the US after he was drafted. What more pragmatically could he gain?

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12-09-2012, 02:33 AM
  #94
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Originally Posted by Dynamo81 View Post
I thought he left America when he was four and returned three years ago after spending some years being developed by Dynamo Moscow?

Anyway he considers himself American, gave up Russian citizenship and I think none of this had to do with the Draft.
Well, I think it's a combination of factors, the biggest of which was probably Larionov telling him that it's the best decision for him going forward.
He has the high-end skill set to be a star for a national team that arguably lacks the same type of skill as other top countries at forward, so he should have the opportunity to play internationally many times over his career.
Plus, the American flag next to his name doesn't scare people like the Russian flag would.
If he hadn't made his intentions known and essentially cut ties with Russia prior to the draft, I don't know if he would have went third overall after missing almost a whole season of hockey.

Larionov will probably do it again with Dennis Yan, a 97 who grew up in the CSKA system.
Unlike all of the other Russian kids he imports as favors to his friends, Yan was born in the US (Alaska, IIRC) and was invited to the USAH Select 15 Development Camp this summer.
He played up a year last year, playing minor midget in Ontario with Lambton (Sarnia area, notice a connection?) and is now playing midget major with Belle Tire (MWEHL).

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12-09-2012, 02:37 AM
  #95
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Originally Posted by Xokkeu View Post
He was not capped (to borrow the phrase from soccer) to the US after he was drafted. What more pragmatically could he gain?
Everything the program would offer him. Whatever that would entail. I don't know; I'm not his agent.

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12-09-2012, 03:20 AM
  #96
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Oh you crazy Ruskies

Galcheniuk was the one who made the choice, saying you know better than him or questioning him is pretty damn arrogant to me.

Btw. how do you guys feel about all the Ukrainian hockey players representing Russia?

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12-09-2012, 03:25 AM
  #97
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Btw. how do you guys feel about all the Ukrainian hockey players representing Russia?
Little bit different situation.

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12-09-2012, 04:21 AM
  #98
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please stop all these nonsense about Galchenyuk in this thread.


Last edited by kp61c: 12-09-2012 at 04:43 AM.
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12-09-2012, 05:53 AM
  #99
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please stop all these nonsense about Galchenyuk in this thread.
Well said. It won't lead anywhere. Cut it out.

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12-09-2012, 03:54 PM
  #100
Yakushev72
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Originally Posted by StrappingYoungChad View Post
That too is what I was referring to.

Looking back at the last 15 drafts, you'd see a LOT more Russians drafted in the first round. I don't think too many played very long in the NHL so I can see why teams are careful.

Don't get me wrong, I actually prefer "big ice" hockey to North American hockey. I just wish the NHL would adopt it, but I know it'll never happen.
You make good points! I think the thing that Russian kids fear most is getting stuck in the AHL. The AHL plays more of a mucking and grinding style than the NHL itself, and that is not consistent with the skills that most Russian kids have developed. Somebody posted an article showing that Nugent-Hopkins makes about $65,000 in the AHL. Russian kids know that they can make 10 times that much or more, more or less tax-free, in the KHL. The Russian kids and their agents want to sign one-way contracts, and NHL clubs often aren't willing to do that. Also, the style of play in the KHL is the same as the kids grew up on.

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