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NHL Lockout XXV: New car caviar four star daydream, think I'll buy me a hockey team

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Old
12-10-2012, 04:10 PM
  #776
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StevensCakeBakerBacker View Post
The longer this Lockout goes on, the less correct you are. If the entire season is lost, and the players lose over a billion dollars, what exactly could they ever possibly gain?

The players position was flawed from the beginning. Why? Because they can't handle financial loss created by their hard nosed negotiating tactics (Fehr).
You're assuming that we are going to lose a season. I think it's pretty obvious from the owners side that they have been bluffing. We were going to see a lockout last until the last minute because they wanted to get all they could. 100% chance of hockey this season.

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Old
12-10-2012, 04:10 PM
  #777
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Originally Posted by isles31 View Post
difference is, as big a dbag as Jacobs is, hes smart enough not to do that.
Or the owners realize that no one is really interested in following them on twitter.
Mind you, I'm not interested in following Turco either but apparently some do.

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Old
12-10-2012, 04:13 PM
  #778
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Originally Posted by Butch 19 View Post
wha?... no comment re " - the owners treat their players very well."
There's no reason to comment. The players are not capable of striking without bringing a legal poopstorm down on their heads. They could be miserable and it wouldn't make a difference, especially since Bettman likes to throw lockouts around like candy. They don't even get a chance to strike.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Moe Mantha View Post
Imagine Jeremy Jacobs tweeting the same photo with similar hashtags...

I'm not offended by Turco doing this, but I don't think it was a wise thing to do.

Yeah, maybe it's just me, but I just can't bring myself to care. It's totally unrelated to the issue and has no bearing on whether or not the lockout gets solved. Does it mean some players are insensitive? Sure. Who cares though? It doesn't affect their ability to play.

If Jacobs posted a picture of himself mixing a Rob Roy with JW Blue Label and ice that he chipped up from the Bruins logo at center ice with the caption "lol not like I'm using this for anything else" I'd be equally unoffended; and I can't stand Jacobs. Actually, that would be pretty awesome. It just doesn't matter at all.

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12-10-2012, 04:13 PM
  #779
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Malholtra admitting that they are at the point of crossing the I's and crossing the Ts.

@benkuzma: Malhotra on owners not wanting Fehr in room to ink deal: "Another one of their tactics to discredit Don, to say he's standing in the way ...

@benkuzma: ... He's the pro. To think we'd be dotting the I's and crossing the Ts without him in the room is absurd."

https://twitter.com/benkuzma/status/278260073464205312

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12-10-2012, 04:14 PM
  #780
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Originally Posted by Crows View Post
Malholtra admitting that they are at the point of crossing the I's and crossing the Ts.

@benkuzma: Malhotra on owners not wanting Fehr in room to ink deal: "Another one of their tactics to discredit Don, to say he's standing in the way ...

@benkuzma: ... He's the pro. To think we'd be dotting the I's and crossing the Ts without him in the room is absurd."

https://twitter.com/benkuzma/status/278260073464205312
That's not what that means.

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Old
12-10-2012, 04:15 PM
  #781
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Originally Posted by Scurr View Post
You're assuming that we are going to lose a season. I think it's pretty obvious from the owners side that they have been bluffing. We were going to see a lockout last until the last minute because they wanted to get all they could. 100% chance of hockey this season.
wouldn't say 100% but definitely 80-90%

alot of factors starting to show that this will end soon even though the atmosphere is quite negative.

The PA is definitely starting to split(150-200 wanna take the NHL's deal right now most likely) The owners indeed do not want to lose a season over a year of contracts and a few % of variance.

We're coming to the end of this thing, one month, we'll see the final offers soon.

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12-10-2012, 04:15 PM
  #782
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boltsfan2029 View Post
Again...

What was the players' first offer and how far have they come off of it? IMO you simply can't point out what the owners have compromised on and call it an "ass kicking" without comparing it to what the players have compromised on. The degree of "ass kicking" by one side is tempered by the degree of "ass kicking" they've suffered, as well.
Again, I don't think their original offers have any meaning at all. They were not based on anything, just numbers. What we can determine for sure is that every "last, best offer" by the league has been bettered substantially by their next "last, best offer".

Quote:
Originally Posted by Boltsfan2029 View Post
And, as far as I can recall, I've never heard a single person say the players should have signed that first offer. I've heard a lot say they should have negotiated off of it and not taken a month to reply to it, but not a one that feels they should have accepted it.
I don't even know if you're serious about this? I've read over and over again how the PA will never make back the money they've been losing by not signing "the last, best offer".

The amount of bluffs the league has been called on is getting outrageous, they're being schooled.

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Old
12-10-2012, 04:16 PM
  #783
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Crows View Post
Malholtra admitting that they are at the point of crossing the I's and crossing the Ts.

@benkuzma: Malhotra on owners not wanting Fehr in room to ink deal: "Another one of their tactics to discredit Don, to say he's standing in the way ...

@benkuzma: ... He's the pro. To think we'd be dotting the I's and crossing the Ts without him in the room is absurd."

https://twitter.com/benkuzma/status/278260073464205312
That's not how I'm reading what he says, it's more along the lines of "We're not signing a deal without Don"

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Old
12-10-2012, 04:16 PM
  #784
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Crows View Post
Malholtra admitting that they are at the point of crossing the I's and crossing the Ts.

@benkuzma: Malhotra on owners not wanting Fehr in room to ink deal: "Another one of their tactics to discredit Don, to say he's standing in the way ...

@benkuzma: ... He's the pro. To think we'd be dotting the I's and crossing the Ts without him in the room is absurd."

https://twitter.com/benkuzma/status/278260073464205312
no wonder this process was screwed from jump street

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Old
12-10-2012, 04:17 PM
  #785
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Isn't Turco retired? Or won't get a contract anyways?

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Old
12-10-2012, 04:18 PM
  #786
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and the beat goes on...


Ben Kuzma ‏@benkuzma
Manny Malhotra on splitting differences to forge CBA deal: "It wouldn't in fact be splitting it. It would be us conceding more to them."

https://twitter.com/benkuzma/status/278257195504783361

Ben Kuzma ‏@benkuzma
More Malhotra on splitting CBA, contract length difference: "You'd love to think it would be that simple. We've conceded far too much ...

Ben Kuzma ‏@benkuzma
... and to give that much more would just be nonsense."

https://twitter.com/benkuzma/status/278258424851091457
https://twitter.com/benkuzma/status/278259850994122753

Ben Kuzma ‏@benkuzma
Malhotra on owners not wanting Fehr in room to ink deal: "Another one of their tactics to discredit Don, to say he's standing in the way ...

Ben Kuzma ‏@benkuzma
... He's the pro. To think we'd be dotting the I's and crossing the Ts without him in the room is absurd."

https://twitter.com/benkuzma/status/278259850994122753
https://twitter.com/benkuzma/status/278260073464205312

Ben Kuzma ‏@benkuzma
Malhotra on NHLPA resolve: "To have them (owners) reject it (proposal) and call everything off, I think it pissed a lot of guys off ...

Ben Kuzma ‏@benkuzma
... It's similar to their offer in the summer, it's made us more strong."

https://twitter.com/benkuzma/status/278261231868055553
https://twitter.com/benkuzma/status/278261522772406272

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Old
12-10-2012, 04:20 PM
  #787
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basically here is what i hope happens at this point. Due to the fact that weve already gone until December and theres no hockey, it doesnt matter anymore to me, i hope they cancel the season, and i hope the union implodes on itself. Thats all. Happy New Year, lets watch some world juniors!

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Old
12-10-2012, 04:22 PM
  #788
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Moe Mantha View Post
Imagine Jeremy Jacobs tweeting the same photo with similar hashtags...

I'm not offended by Turco doing this, but I don't think it was a wise thing to do.
Turco is essentially retired. Is he not allowed to enjoy himself?

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Old
12-10-2012, 04:23 PM
  #789
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Malhotra you should be glad that you are even getting paid. So shut the **** up.

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Old
12-10-2012, 04:23 PM
  #790
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Quote:
Originally Posted by indoor living View Post
I've noticed that just about every player that has done the whole #lockoutproblem are players that aren't major assests to their team, which is really comical. Mike Richards is maybe the only one I've seen do it that is actually an asset to his team.
Well, Richards is seeing his highest salary disappearing.
Code:
2008-09 $5,400,000 $5,400,000 $0  $5,750,000 
2009-10 $5,600,000 $5,600,000 $0  $5,750,000 
2010-11 $6,400,000 $6,400,000 $0  $5,750,000 
2011-12 $6,600,000 $6,600,000 $0  $5,750,000 
2012-13 $8,400,000 $8,400,000 $0  $5,750,000 
2013-14 $7,600,000 $7,600,000 $0  $5,750,000 
2014-15 $7,000,000 $7,000,000 $0  $5,750,000 
2015-16 $6,000,000 $6,000,000 $0  $5,750,000 
2016-17 $5,500,000 $5,500,000 $0  $5,750,000 
2017-18 $4,500,000 $4,500,000 $0  $5,750,000 
2018-19 $3,000,000 $3,000,000 $0  $5,750,000 
2019-20 $3,000,000 $3,000,000 $0  $5,750,000

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Old
12-10-2012, 04:24 PM
  #791
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I am so sick of hearing the high school drama about this stuff. Acting like a bunch of teen aged girls.

Really, as a 40 year fan of this game, it has become embarrassing. Why did I fall in love with this league?

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Old
12-10-2012, 04:24 PM
  #792
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See, one-eyed Manny isn't just a meme.
He actually does say stupid things!

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Old
12-10-2012, 04:25 PM
  #793
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stug View Post
Malhotra you should be glad that you are even getting paid. So shut the **** up.
Yes. The nerve of him speaking out.
Just another greedy player who may be in the last year of a lucrative contract that may very well be his last.

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Old
12-10-2012, 04:26 PM
  #794
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maplehawk View Post
Marty Turco the latest to slap every fan in the face.
Marty Turco ‏@mturco35 #lockout pic.twitter.com/yOqcYhyW

https://twitter.com/mturco35/status/278245260528865281
If EJ Hradek or Kelly Chase decide to post a pic from their favorite vacation spot, then I'm done. What a slap in the face to the fans.

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Old
12-10-2012, 04:27 PM
  #795
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Players need to accept the 5/7 years contract limits and add a 'superstar' deal where each team can sign/retain 1 'star player' with a max 10 year deal. Have previous long term deals grandfathered in. Accept 10 year CBA with some other small 'win' for the players.

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Old
12-10-2012, 04:27 PM
  #796
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MtlPenFan View Post
Just pointing out that teams are actually losing money, and are sustainable ONLY because they are able to funnel personal fortune gained through other business endeavors.
I don't disagree there. However, Wang isn't the best example. I don't believe he's entitled to much revenue sharing because they're in a large market, and therefore should have a large potential ticket-buying fanbase. That's an issue with revenue sharing on the owners' side.

At least...I think. I might have my facts mixed up or might be thinking of another league entirely, but I'm pretty sure I'm not wrong.

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Old
12-10-2012, 04:27 PM
  #797
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Originally Posted by UsernameWasTaken View Post
and the beat goes on...


Ben Kuzma ‏@benkuzma
Manny Malhotra on splitting differences to forge CBA deal: "It wouldn't in fact be splitting it. It would be us conceding more to them."

https://twitter.com/benkuzma/status/278257195504783361

Ben Kuzma ‏@benkuzma
More Malhotra on splitting CBA, contract length difference: "You'd love to think it would be that simple. We've conceded far too much ...

Ben Kuzma ‏@benkuzma
... and to give that much more would just be nonsense."

https://twitter.com/benkuzma/status/278258424851091457
https://twitter.com/benkuzma/status/278259850994122753

Ben Kuzma ‏@benkuzma
Malhotra on owners not wanting Fehr in room to ink deal: "Another one of their tactics to discredit Don, to say he's standing in the way ...

Ben Kuzma ‏@benkuzma
... He's the pro. To think we'd be dotting the I's and crossing the Ts without him in the room is absurd."

https://twitter.com/benkuzma/status/278259850994122753
https://twitter.com/benkuzma/status/278260073464205312

Ben Kuzma ‏@benkuzma
Malhotra on NHLPA resolve: "To have them (owners) reject it (proposal) and call everything off, I think it pissed a lot of guys off ...

Ben Kuzma ‏@benkuzma
... It's similar to their offer in the summer, it's made us more strong."

https://twitter.com/benkuzma/status/278261231868055553
https://twitter.com/benkuzma/status/278261522772406272
absolute garbage. He is so extreme it's not even funny.

People like him is why this has gone on so long!

Why do you care about contracts longer than 7 years(what the owners are offering for resigning own player) malhorta? you've probably never gotten one longer than 3 years!

everything else is so insignificant i dont know why they wouldnt just give it to the owners and end this.

You could argue variance, but what else is a big issue for the players? 20-30 players are on a contract longer than 7 years(ok 5 if you're a UFA, but you can still do sign and trades with this). Why are they fighting tooth and nail to get 8+ years?

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Old
12-10-2012, 04:28 PM
  #798
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scurr View Post
Again, I don't think their original offers have any meaning at all. They were not based on anything, just numbers. What we can determine for sure is that every "last, best offer" by the league has been bettered substantially by their next "last, best offer".



I don't even know if you're serious about this? I've read over and over again how the PA will never make back the money they've been losing by not signing "the last, best offer".

The amount of bluffs the league has been called on is getting outrageous, they're being schooled.
That's a matter of interpretation. Everything that the PA is now agreeing to or moving closer it is everything that came from that 50/50 offer back in October. Owners told them to call them if they wanted to talk more about the make whole. Everything the league has done so far, they've made the move that they expected the PA to make. I guess if you think being schooled is wasting your own time and money sitting on your hands while the other side moves closer to you with considerations that they most likely expected to make, then I guess the league is being schooled. I guess the PA can consider it a small victory that they made the league increase their own make whole offer - all the while ignoring that the reason the league has done so is because it's within the boundaries of what they'd do to get the season back on.

However, I don't consider the PA to be doing the schooling when they're now negotiating elements that were likely there to be had back in October and using an 82 game schedules as leverage to squeeze it out of the owners. Many of here predicted that the make whole would be increased, many of us here predicted that UFA, arbitration, ELC would all be left alone. Many of us here predicted that a linked 50/50 and contract lengths along with variation would be the sticking points and so far, we've been correct. An 82 game schedule wasn't to the benefit of the players, it was to the benefit of the owners and the PA missed their opportunity to negotiate everything they had gotten last week along with getting a full season's worth of pay.

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Old
12-10-2012, 04:28 PM
  #799
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I don't think make whole will be coming back. I think what support Bettman had for continuing to offer it is gone. Even needing a minority? I doubt Bettman could get enough owner votes to pass a CBA with make whole.

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Old
12-10-2012, 04:30 PM
  #800
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Originally Posted by Tra La La View Post
I don't think make whole will be coming back. I think what support Bettman had for continuing to offer it is gone. Even needing a minority? I doubt Bettman could get enough owner votes to pass a CBA with make whole.
If they come back this week it will be on the table, any longer and It's off guarenteed.

PA has to agree to the other stuff quick though.

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